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People saying homophobic slurs in chat. Will they be dealt with?

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Herateis Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 4	Posted - 2014.10.23 19:02:10 - [1] - Quote Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.
Viktor Fel Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 64	Posted - 2014.10.23 19:36:32 - [2] - Quote I believe this is what you were looking for, and yes, GMs do stuff about these things. Just be careful that you are not using feigned offense to try to get back at some one, that can backfire and you could find yourself in a lot of trouble for it. Section 3 Quote: Severe offences may result in an immediate ban without warning; however, warnings may be given for first time offenses, followed by account suspensions of varying degree and ultimately a permanent ban if a player: a. Is abusive, obscene, offensive, sexually explicit, ethnically or racially offensive, or threatening to another player or an official EVE Online representative. b. Uses role-playing as an excuse for violating the guidelines regarding fair play with others. c. Sends excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or support tickets, files support tickets with false information or repeatedly under the wrong category in an effort to circumvent the customer support queue. Section 7, para. K and para. L Quote: k. Advertises or promotes a site that features content that is defamatory, ethnically or racially offensive, obscene, offensive, depicts graphic violence, is excessively gruesome, sexually explicit or vulgar, or promotes anti-gay sentiments or hate groups. l. Spams official communication channels, both in or out of game. #NCDocked
Herateis Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 4	Posted - 2014.10.23 19:46:08 - [3] - Quote Thank you. I hope that irregardless of a person's motives, a person that chooses to break the code of conduct receives due penalty for such things.
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 4731	Posted - 2014.10.23 20:27:36 - [4] - Quote Also, keep in mind that this is different from channel to channel. If it is in local...yes, reporting will likely mean actions are taken. If it is a player made channel that you joined...It is possible that a GM won't intervene, as it is an un-official channel (hence why they got rid of all the language channels) and you can just leave it. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance 6376	Posted - 2014.10.23 20:41:03 - [5] - Quote Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. "How did you veterans start?"
Syssitia Nikostratos Viziam Amarr Empire 9	Posted - 2014.10.23 20:56:55 - [6] - Quote I've found it's just easier to block people using sexist, racial or homophobic slurs in chats. I guess I'm not very optimistic that anything would actually be done if it were reported. I've been somewhat pleasantly surprised, though, in finding a good handful of people who will call people out on it and are open-minded and accepting. The creeps are loud, so I prefer to simply silence them with block and focus on the nicer people in game rather than spending my game time reporting every idiotic twelve in local. "I thought I had a great idea today, but it never really took off. In fact, it didn't even get on the runway. I guess you could say it exploded in the hangar."
Mr Epeen It's All About Me 6539	Posted - 2014.10.23 21:08:02 - [7] - Quote Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? Not really. CCP just doesn't have the manpower (or the inclination, it seems) to keep a handle on all the filth spewed in chats. The new player chat is about the only one policed on a regular basis. I've seen some pretty vile stuff even in Jita local that must have been flagged by multiple people yet went on and on. Mr Epeen There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
ISD Decoy ISD Community Communications Liaisons 202	Posted - 2014.10.23 21:11:39 - [8] - Quote In addition to reporting sexist, racist, etc language in-game, you may also report questionable posts via the EVE Forums by clicking on the small orange flag at the top of a post. Once you complete the report, someone from our ISD CCL team will review it and deal with it or escalate accordingly. A list of all policies that govern EVE Online (including the forums) can be found here. Hope this helps! ISD Decoy Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 4731	Posted - 2014.10.23 21:26:23 - [9] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). Hmz, if you are already offended by the F-word, as Shah said, it might be better to close all chats in EVE. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 4731	Posted - 2014.10.23 21:28:33 - [10] - Quote Syssitia Nikostratos wrote: I've found it's just easier to block people using sexist, racial or homophobic slurs in chats. I guess I'm not very optimistic that anything would actually be done if it were reported. I've been somewhat pleasantly surprised, though, in finding a good handful of people who will call people out on it and are open-minded and accepting. The creeps are loud, so I prefer to simply silence them with block and focus on the nicer people in game rather than spending my game time reporting every idiotic twelve in local. Above advice is great in "border line" cases (where it is likely you are offended but CCP doesn't see it as rule breaking). It stops said persons from annoying you. For real obvious rule breaking, just first report them...then block them. A. You won't see it anymore. B. If CCP agrees, they will solve it so that others won't see it anymore too. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar
Derrick Miles EVENumbers 10511	Posted - 2014.10.24 00:02:13 - [11] - Quote J'Poll wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). Hmz, if you are already offended by the F-word, as Shah said, it might be better to close all chats in EVE. I'd say that's more of a sign of how bad CCP's enforcement of their rules is rather than being easily offended.
Morwen Lagann Tyrathlion Interstellar 1412	Posted - 2014.10.24 01:52:11 - [12] - Quote J'Poll wrote: Also, keep in mind that this is different from channel to channel. If it is in local...yes, reporting will likely mean actions are taken. If it is a player made channel that you joined...It is possible that a GM won't intervene, as it is an un-official channel (hence why they got rid of all the language channels) and you can just leave it. Nah, they'll warn people for swearing in player-owned channels. It's pretty stupid, given what game this is and how the game sells itself on it being perfectly possible (and legitimately so) to **** people off for fun and profit. Morwen Lagann CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar Owner, The Golden Masque
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance 6380	Posted - 2014.10.24 02:18:14 - [13] - Quote Derrick Miles wrote: J'Poll wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). Hmz, if you are already offended by the F-word, as Shah said, it might be better to close all chats in EVE. I'd say that's more of a sign of how bad CCP's enforcement of their rules is rather than being easily offended. It goes both ways. On one hand, you have a company of 500 to 700 people trying to moderate the language of 400,000 people (with 10,000 to 25,000 on at any given time). It is nearly impossible to get to every possible report as it is happening. At the same time, different people have different levels of tolerance. One person can be mightily offended by being called "prepubescent child" and file a report for that. And then another can file a report because someone called them a "mentally challenged." Now add up dozens of those petitions with one or two actual real cases of offensive content. Then there is the fact that each case has to be investigated and reviewed (because just clicking the gag or ban button without knowing the context of the situation is just bad practice) and you have a system that is slow to act. Oh... and you can't hire too many more people. It's a small company with only so many resources. And you can't hire too many volunteers without putting them through a strict screening and training process (because you don't want someone on a "crusade" to just get the power and then start gagging/banning anything he/she personally doesn't like). You could add automatic filters into the game... but that would not stop .gifs from being posted. And it's a little hippocritical to censor certain language when the lore is full of it and MUCH worse. Hell, even some mission text has swearing. And I've seen the DEVs themselves drop a couple loaded words here or there. All that said... there are lines that should not be crossed. But you need context to know for certain if that "line" was tongue and cheek or actual malignant material. tldr; don't be so serious. If you don't like it, ignore it. If you see something REALLY bad, you'll know it. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. "How did you veterans start?"
Derrick Miles EVENumbers 10587	Posted - 2014.10.24 03:26:31 - [14] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: It goes both ways. On one hand, you have a company of 500 to 700 people trying to moderate the language of 400,000 people (with 10,000 to 25,000 on at any given time). It is nearly impossible to get to every possible report as it is happening. At the same time, different people have different levels of tolerance. One person can be mightily offended by being called "prepubescent child" and file a report for that. And then another can file a report because someone called them a "mentally challenged." Now add up dozens of those petitions with one or two actual real cases of offensive content. Then there is the fact that each case has to be investigated and reviewed (because just clicking the gag or ban button without knowing the context of the situation is just bad practice) and you have a system that is slow to act. Oh... and you can't hire too many more people. It's a small company with only so many resources. And you can't hire too many volunteers without putting them through a strict screening and training process (because you don't want someone on a "crusade" to just get the power and then start gagging/banning anything he/she personally doesn't like). You could add automatic filters into the game... but that would not stop .gifs from being posted. And it's a little hippocritical to censor certain language when the lore is full of it and MUCH worse. Hell, even some mission text has swearing. And I've seen the DEVs themselves drop a couple loaded words here or there. All that said... there are lines that should not be crossed. But you need context to know for certain if that "line" was tongue and cheek or actual malignant material. tldr; don't be so serious. If you don't like it, ignore it. If you see something REALLY bad, you'll know it. I agree with you but, in my experience at least, CCP has the worst Customer Service of any company I have ever seen. I'm not confident they would do anything but lip service to the rules and the very basics of enforcement. Having said that, it is good to have a thick skin if only because you need it to play this game.
Skurja Volpar Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 127	Posted - 2014.10.24 08:55:29 - [15] - Quote The real slur here is against Mr Brain's delicious low budget meal for 2.
Ralph King-Griffin Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance 6053	Posted - 2014.10.24 09:39:54 - [16] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Derrick Miles wrote: J'Poll wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). Hmz, if you are already offended by the F-word, as Shah said, it might be better to close all chats in EVE. I'd say that's more of a sign of how bad CCP's enforcement of their rules is rather than being easily offended. It goes both ways. On one hand, you have a company of 500 to 700 people trying to moderate the language of 400,000 people (with 10,000 to 25,000 on at any given time). It is nearly impossible to get to every possible report as it is happening. At the same time, different people have different levels of tolerance. One person can be mightily offended by being called "prepubescent child" and file a report for that. And then another can file a report because someone called them a "mentally challenged." Now add up dozens of those petitions with one or two actual real cases of offensive content. Then there is the fact that each case has to be investigated and reviewed (because just clicking the gag or ban button without knowing the context of the situation is just bad practice) and you have a system that is slow to act. Oh... and you can't hire too many more people. It's a small company with only so many resources. And you can't hire too many volunteers without putting them through a strict screening and training process (because you don't want someone on a "crusade" to just get the power and then start gagging/banning anything he/she personally doesn't like). You could add automatic filters into the game... but that would not stop .gifs from being posted. And it's a little hippocritical to censor certain language when the lore is full of it and MUCH worse. Hell, even some mission text has swearing. And I've seen the DEVs themselves drop a couple loaded words here or there. All that said... there are lines that should not be crossed. But you need context to know for certain if that "line" was tongue and cheek or actual malignant material. tldr; don't be so serious. If you don't like it, ignore it. If you see something REALLY bad, you'll know it. I agree completely. Strong adult language =/= offensive language imo. iv been told to ***off by a dev before (Ccp whitenoise trash o7) I thought it was uproariously hilarious. my experience of it though has been anything actually* Inappropriate getting dealt with within an hour or so "I'm also quite confident that you are laughing and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers." =]I[=
Gregor Parud 724	Posted - 2014.10.24 09:52:55 - [17] - Quote It gets dealt with just as much as trolling in newbie Q&A, like the OP has done with this thread.
Bastion Arzi Mortis Angelus The Kadeshi 134	Posted - 2014.10.24 10:14:44 - [18] - Quote u think thats bad. i tried tera the other day cos it was free was having a good time until i tried to join a guild. i asked in global chat if i could join a guild i got a message from someone saying are you black? i said yes he said no blackies in our guild. i stopped playing tera
Vol Arm'OOO Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 306	Posted - 2014.10.24 14:37:34 - [19] - Quote Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. unfortunately asshats are a problem in most mmos. People (especially gammer geeks) sometimes say things that they wouldnt say in person because of the anonymity of being behind a computer. If the slurs are on teamspeak or something like that - it is highly unlikely ccp will do anything. As for the in game chat - it is prohibited by the end user agreement to make such slurs, but I have yet to have seen someone banned or suspended or even warned because of it (doesnt mean it doesnt happen - just that im unaware of it happening). I have seen folk get their names changed through for using offensive names. BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Summer Isle Autumn Industrial Enterprises 133	Posted - 2014.10.24 16:18:30 - [20] - Quote I still think having a preemptive blocking feature would be incredibly useful, but most others seem to disagree with me. As much as I don't consider cursing and swearing to be offensive, others do and might find this sort of feature useful, as well. -áTalk is cheap, but Void S and Quake L are cheaper.
Baneken Arctic Light Inc. Arctic Light 338	Posted - 2014.10.25 07:33:38 - [21] - Quote Vol Arm'OOO wrote: Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo. They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game. So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used.
Derrick Miles EVENumbers 10793	Posted - 2014.10.25 07:38:44 - [22] - Quote Baneken wrote: Vol Arm'OOO wrote: Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo. They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game. So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used. Some people don't think it's funny to spread bigotry and hate speech.
Syssitia Nikostratos Viziam Amarr Empire 13	Posted - 2014.10.25 07:51:32 - [23] - Quote Baneken wrote: Vol Arm'OOO wrote: Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo. They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game. So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used. I don't really think anyone's talking about foul language, like curse words. They're talking about hate speech and sexist/racist/homophobic slurs. That's a different thing. Casually using the N word or the F (homophobic) word or being sexist to a female player is not ever funny. It's cruel and hurtful. Be as ruthless as you like in game, blow people up and laugh and mock them for having poor fits and poor skills that is completely fine and anyone whining about it needs to get over it...but using hatefully-charged language isn't okay. Whether or not CCP will penalize a player for doing it is beside the point. It's not okay, not ever. This is not 'think of the children'. It's 'think of a fellow human being'. People of color, women, LGBT people have been beaten/raped/murdered with those words in their ears as the last thing they hear...throwing them around for lols is an exceptional level of disgusting. "I thought I had a great idea today, but it never really took off. In fact, it didn't even get on the runway. I guess you could say it exploded in the hangar."
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn Department 10 192	Posted - 2014.10.25 16:05:11 - [24] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum. " They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. "-áRick. " Find out what ? "-áAbraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. "-áRick. Season four.-á-á ' The Walking Dead. ' .
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance 6396	Posted - 2014.10.25 18:22:25 - [25] - Quote Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum. My points (and various chat channels with that term as a name) still stand. Different people have different levels of tolerance, the GMs/DEVs can only get around to so many reports at any given time, the GMs/DEVs generally punish based on context rather than absolute usage, you can't reliably stop players from being 'tards in a game, and the lore of the game is based on murder/slavery/warfare/(insert other dystopian stuff here) which can often be more offensive than any mere word. Believe me... I get the point that the other side is making about how we shouldn't tolerate this kind of stuff... but it isn't a one way street. Language and culture has a funny thing where it (over time) can take benign or offensive words/sayings and turn it on their head to mean something completely different. And if efforts are made to stamp it out, you just make the change happen faster (Streisand Effect)... or make it worse for purely "ironic reasons" because some people find it funny how other people can get SO MAD over mere words when words themselves have no real meaning except those we willingly attach to them. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. "How did you veterans start?"
Bagatur I School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 15	Posted - 2014.10.25 19:19:03 - [26] - Quote the game already has a way to deal with it - if his language offends you, then block him and never hear from him another word. why does CCP have to fix everything?
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 723	Posted - 2014.10.26 05:40:48 - [27] - Quote Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote: I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum. the Brits are just going out for a smoke break. anyways if it is highly offensive and/or sustained then sure I don't mind CCP going after someone, but for the most part I think it is quite easy enough to ignore someone. personally I have a no ignore policy as who knows maybe they will do something useful in the future (aside from people like "adfklasdlkf" who are just isk spammers, who I luckily haven't seen in ages). I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me! In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod - Mara Rinn
Kalishka Ashkulf BUMP POW 53	Posted - 2014.10.26 13:33:22 - [28] - Quote Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. Simply report them to the powers that be. Assuming the "F-word" rhymes with maggot, I personally would see that as a homophobic slur. However, I'm not part of the powers that be haha. Open a ticket, explain the situation methodically (don't get emotional in your ticket) and carry on with your game. I agree, it shouldn't be tolerated, but unless you report it, it will go unchecked. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for insults and animal puffiness when it comes to words and slagging each other off. However, there is a line in the sand and it's explained in the ToS. As said, simply report and move on. Don't continue communicating with said fellow players. If you do, you may run the risk of enlisting yourself for a complaint as well.
Nariya Kentaya Ministry of War Amarr Empire 1614	Posted - 2014.10.27 01:32:28 - [29] - Quote Summer Isle wrote: I still think having a preemptive blocking feature would be incredibly useful, but most others seem to disagree with me. As much as I don't consider cursing and swearing to be offensive, others do and might find this sort of feature useful, as well. its a game populated by majority 28-32 year old players, if you find "foul language" offensive, then seriously, your living a cloistered life, because EVE will never be as bad as simply walking down the street within +/- 8 hours of the pub closing
Vol Arm'OOO Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 307	Posted - 2014.10.27 01:50:31 - [30] - Quote Baneken wrote: Vol Arm'OOO wrote: Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo. They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game. So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used. What is funny is when apologists for idiots come out to excuse stupidity. And no I dont go ballistic about these sorts of things - but the op seems to be concerned about it and thus I am sure would appreciate knowing of these things without having to truck all the way out there to find only that he doesnt fit in. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Vol Arm'OOO Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 307	Posted - 2014.10.27 01:53:17 - [31] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum. My points (and various chat channels of mine with that term as a name) still stand. Different people have different levels of tolerance, the GMs/DEVs can only get around to so many reports at any given time, the GMs/DEVs generally punish based on context rather than absolute usage, you can't reliably stop players from being 'tards in a game, and the lore of the game is based on murder/slavery/warfare/(insert other dystopian stuff here) which can often be more offensive than any mere word. Believe me... I get the point that the other side is making about how we shouldn't tolerate this kind of stuff... but it isn't a one way street. Language and culture has a funny thing where (over time) it can take benign or offensive words/sayings and turn them on their head to mean something completely different. And if efforts are made to stamp it out, you just make the change happen faster (Streisand Effect)... or make it worse for purely "ironic reasons" because some people find it funny how other people can get SO MAD over mere words when words themselves have no real meaning except those we willingly attach to them. Its funny how people make your very argument only from behind the anominity of a computer terminal. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Ireland VonVicious Vicious Trading Company 402	Posted - 2014.10.27 02:44:30 - [32] - Quote It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech. It's not engineered opinion at all. Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain. Remember remember the 5th of November.
Vol Arm'OOO Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 307	Posted - 2014.10.27 13:29:47 - [33] - Quote Ireland VonVicious wrote: It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech. It's not engineered opinion at all. Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain. Remember remember the 5th of November. BS. Its a question of common courtesy. Some folk think its ok to be rude and spout whatever nonsense pops into their heads at any time. Other folk think that society functions best when you are conscious of your fellow societymates, their feelings, etc. . . . Sure you have a right to think and say what you want, but if you are a rude asshat, everyone else has an equal right to call you out as a rude asshat. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 17	Posted - 2014.10.27 17:56:47 - [34] - Quote Nariya Kentaya wrote: Summer Isle wrote: I still think having a preemptive blocking feature would be incredibly useful, but most others seem to disagree with me. As much as I don't consider cursing and swearing to be offensive, others do and might find this sort of feature useful, as well. its a game populated by majority 28-32 year old players, if you find "foul language" offensive, then seriously, your living a cloistered life, because EVE will never be as bad as simply walking down the street within +/- 8 hours of the pub closing And if you don't like that, you don't have to walk down those alleys at night. It's a choice, just like it's a choice to block people using foul language in the game. Ireland VonVicious wrote: It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech. It's not engineered opinion at all. Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain. Remember remember the 5th of November. The game has word filters and the game has block options, just like World of Warcraft or any other MMO. That doesn't suddenly mean it's okay to use that language. In any other MMO with similar functions, you can still be reported for language that is "offensive" and "foul" and "sexual", etc, and receive a mute all the way up to perma ban for repeated infractions. Remember that, extra rules and abilities to avoid foul language do NOT make foul language suddenly okay. If there's rules in place against that foul language, you're the one taking the risk using such language in chat channels, regardless of any block or filter functions. You kinds of people would sound no different if you said "hey, we have legal options to deal with murder, therefore murder's okay and if you can't handle it, lighten up or dont leave your home". Eve or any other MMO is supposed to be a space accesible to all users, regardless of age or personal beliefs. If YOU dont like THAT, continue to use foul language and accumulate reports until they do hit you with a penalty.
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance 6418	Posted - 2014.10.27 22:08:20 - [35] - Quote 13kr1d1 wrote: Remember that, extra rules and abilities to avoid foul language do NOT make foul language suddenly okay. If there's rules in place against that foul language, you're the one taking the risk using such language in chat channels, regardless of any block or filter functions. Perspective is a funny thing. What is not foul to me can be foul to someone else and vice versa. Who is right and who is wrong? Not everyone sees the world in quite the same way. 13kr1d1 wrote: You kinds of people would sound no different if you said "hey, we have legal options to deal with murder, therefore murder's okay and if you can't handle it, lighten up or dont leave your home". Except language isn't a zero-sum thing the same way life and death is. Language changes and is processed different for everyone (again, perspective). It's a giant grey area where meaning can only be derived from context rather than absolute usage (though, there are people out there who can only think in literal/superficial terms). 13kr1d1 wrote: Eve or any other MMO is supposed to be a space accesible to all users, regardless of age or personal beliefs. If YOU dont like THAT, continue to use foul language and accumulate reports until they do hit you with a penalty. I find your words hateful and intolerant. For that I will report you. (see what I did there?) Anyways... as much as I would like to beat this horse a few more times (mostly because it rials people up) I think it detracts from the whole point behind the New Citizens forum here... so I'll stop. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. "How did you veterans start?"
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 4741	Posted - 2014.10.27 23:31:43 - [36] - Quote I do agree that there should be a line that you can't cross. However, keep in mind that EVE is global MMO. You are playing with thousands of people from all over the globe, this also means you have people from all ethnic backgrounds, different religions and different cultures. Because of this it's very hard to say that word "x" is forbidden, because due to the above, for some reason it can be offensive to one person while the another doesn't see any harm into it. Any of the vets remember the "Mate incident" that haunted YT and the forums for a while I found out this is ever so true in RL when on my internship in the States. Where it is frowned upon to use "the N-word" for people from African decent...while here in Holland (the Dutch translation of said word) is the normal way to refer to someone who comes from or is decendant from an African country. So while it is a big no-go in one country to use a single word, it's normal in another. This will just aswel reflect in game with chat channels, what is deemed "normal" to some people, others find very offensive. Hence why CCP will judge reports in a case-by-case situation and wants to know in which context it was used. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Ireland VonVicious Vicious Trading Company 403	Posted - 2014.10.27 23:33:30 - [37] - Quote I see people missing the point. It doesn't matter what you believe or think if one side gets to frame the debate ahead of time. You can't be proven right if you are forced to be silent. It's the tactic that has ruined the U.S. Opinions are engineered based on this practice. Freedom above all else. Lawful good is a myth.
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 4741	Posted - 2014.10.27 23:45:13 - [38] - Quote Ireland VonVicious wrote: I see people missing the point. It doesn't matter what you believe or think if one side gets to frame the debate ahead of time. You can't be proven right if you are forced to be silent. It's the tactic that has ruined the U.S. Opinions are engineered based on this practice. Freedom above all else. Lawful good is a myth. I'm not saying that you should not speak up. But if CCP is going to ban every player for saying some word that someone else is offended by...This game will quickly be without any players. Throw 25.000 logged in characters together, and you are will ALWAYS find someone offending someone else...period. Hell, as said before, look up the "Mate incident" that happened a couple of years back. Some guy was offended because someone called him mate, as it was an insult in his country where as the for the other party it was just a word they use for friends / other people. You can petition it...sure, but don't get your hopes up too much, unles it's something really really bad the person said. Or You can just block the guy. It's dealt with it as YOU no longer can be offended by him. If everybody that find him offensive does the same....job done, problem solved, nobody sees what that guy throws in chats, let the asshat throw his ridiculous stuff in chats that nobody sees. A little bit of a thick skin is required in EVE, but this doesn't mean that you should take all the crap thrown at you. As suggested before. If you find it offensive, just report the person and then block him. A. It will solve the issue as you will no longer see what he says in chats. B. If CCP backs you up, he will be punished. If not, no big deal, you already have blocked him, so you can't be bothered by him anymore. Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Lady Areola Fappington 2311	Posted - 2014.10.28 00:56:06 - [39] - Quote I just report the slur users, then block them. Best of both worlds. I can deal with cursing, but when you start whipping out slurs, well... I will say though, the Eve community can be pretty awesome. I'm a outspoken LGBT type person, so people love flinging assorted slurs about sexuality towards me. I was impressed when an anti-ganker called out some dude whipping out LGBT slurs in local. The quote went something like: "Really dude, it's 2014. Calling someone a *** is saying they like the color green." It isn't really hard, but I think there are customers that you can lose in a good way and there's customers that you can lose in a bad way. If people come in and fundamentally don't like EVE Online, then I think that might be a good way of losing customers. . -á--CCP Soundwave
Clavain Conjoined Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.10.28 03:18:39 - [40] - Quote Also, keep in mind that it has a lot to do with how the word is used. Saying a word has multiple meanings around the word could be true and is all well and good in a sterile academic argument, but when it's used to say something like "I'm glad that F will burn in hell" well, it's clear that's hate and the multiple meanings are moot. Now, if someone says "I'm going out to light a F", then you have to use context clues. This has even more impact with you know the link between the British use (small stick, not cigarette) and the slur.
Tyler Hail University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2014.10.28 04:02:28 - [41] - Quote Clavain Conjoined wrote: Also, keep in mind that it has a lot to do with how the word is used. Saying a word has multiple meanings around the world could be true and is all well and good in a sterile academic argument, but when it's used to say something like "I'm glad that F will burn in hell" well, it's clear that's hate and the multiple meanings are moot. This very much. As a genderqueer lgbt player, there's a vast difference between my reaction to someone saying "God, that was so gay" and someone saying "Fa**ots will burn in hell" or something similar regarding any minority. The first is most likely ignorance and I can brush that off, block the person if they keep doing it and move on. But people bashing gays or women or people of color...it's obvious when the meaning behind it is more than just ignorance or an immature attempt at riling someone up and any excuse of 'cultural differences' is a total strawman. Hate is hate and if hate is motivating the use of the word, it's offensive and deserves reporting. Ignorance is something else and bears, imo, a little leeway.
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2014.10.28 04:35:10 - [42] - Quote How hard is it for people to moderate their own language in game? Assume everyone you're playing with is 10-12 years old and speak how you would speak if you were with friends or family around people of that age. Then you don't have a problem with offending anyone. I don't get how the thought of having self control upsets "some people".
Yolandar Estrogen Industrial Enterprises 22	Posted - 2014.10.28 07:03:57 - [43] - Quote Id have to say that you should let the person know you find what they say offensive. Same for harassment too. Not doing that kinda gives implied acceptance sometimes. It goes a long way with moderators too. "STOP" is a pretty clear mssg.
Kalishka Ashkulf BUMP POW 59	Posted - 2014.10.28 08:10:52 - [44] - Quote Ireland VonVicious wrote: I see people missing the point. It doesn't matter what you believe or think if one side gets to frame the debate ahead of time. You can't be proven right if you are forced to be silent. It's the tactic that has ruined the U.S. Opinions are engineered based on this practice. Freedom above all else. Lawful good is a myth. Would you extend said freedom to (for example) the K-K-K? After all according to you, it's all good. Freedom of speech does not equal freedom from consequence.
Morwen Lagann Tyrathlion Interstellar 1427	Posted - 2014.10.28 10:49:51 - [45] - Quote 13kr1d1 wrote: How hard is it for people to moderate their own language in game? Assume everyone you're playing with is 10-12 years old and speak how you would speak if you were with friends or family around people of that age. Then you don't have a problem with offending anyone. I don't get how the thought of having self control upsets "some people". Have you been around kids in the 10-12 range lately? Damn things swear more than I do. Morwen Lagann CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar Owner, The Golden Masque
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 20	Posted - 2014.10.28 15:57:48 - [46] - Quote Morwen Lagann wrote: 13kr1d1 wrote: How hard is it for people to moderate their own language in game? Assume everyone you're playing with is 10-12 years old and speak how you would speak if you were with friends or family around people of that age. Then you don't have a problem with offending anyone. I don't get how the thought of having self control upsets "some people". Have you been around kids in the 10-12 range lately? Damn things swear more than I do. In terrible, low brow communities, yes. I've been around decent society myself.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance 1506	Posted - 2014.10.28 16:42:36 - [47] - Quote Herateis wrote: Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all. Would it be ok for me to call the OP a pansy, if I was clear up front I am not insinuating an actual preference for gobbling dix, but more a generalized reference to his lack of just hardening the frak up? F Would you like to know more?
Cara Forelli Green Skull LLC 672	Posted - 2014.10.28 17:23:38 - [48] - Quote 13kr1d1 wrote: In terrible, low brow communities, yes. I've been around decent society myself. Look again. "Princesses with potty-mouths" comes to mind. Swearing excessively is becoming the "norm" for that age group. (And in that specific video they are actually encouraged by adults!) Which is irrelevant. Parents shouldn't be letting their 10-12 year olds play EvE, just like they should't let them hang out at bars. It is a parent's job to regulate what their child is exposed to. You cannot expect the entire internet to bend to your ideals. And this coming from someone that has not uttered a swear-word in my life. I find it rather undermines your apparent intelligence. But it would be absurd for me to expect the same conduct from others. Everyone has different values. Slurs are somewhat of a different of story. For me ignoring/blocking works just fine. Others are offended more easily. To them, I would say not "man up!", but "why do you let what people say affect you so much?" Words are just words. I'm not condoning their use, but you make a conscious decision whether or not to affected. Choose not to be affected. www.ensignyooch.wordpress.com New player with questions? Just want to chat? Join my public channel in game: House Forelli
Shiloh Templeton Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 185	Posted - 2014.10.28 19:00:32 - [49] - Quote "sticks and stones" ... The only power words in a video game have is the power you give them.
Kalwas Denitas 3	Posted - 2014.10.28 19:39:20 - [50] - Quote Typical. Rather than ignoring or blocking something lets get on a soapbox and demand change for the injustice! After this we can get together and save the polar bears, stop global warming, and give out free 1st place ribbons to all the people who want to play EVE but cant because they are poor. Activists unite!
Ronand deReide Taurus Quantum Technologies Taurus Quantum Dynamics 2	Posted - 2014.10.28 20:06:29 - [51] - Quote Shiloh Templeton wrote: "sticks and stones" ... The only power words in a video game have is the power you give them. This.
Clavain Conjoined Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.10.28 20:33:43 - [52] - Quote Kalwas Denitas wrote: Typical. Rather than ignoring or blocking something lets get on a soapbox and demand change for the injustice! After this we can get together and save the polar bears, stop global warming, and give out free 1st place ribbons to all the people who want to play EVE but cant because they are poor. Activists unite! Typical? I don't get it. You make a sarcastic remark, but then include actual, real problems. Not sure what you're going for here. Seems like you're suggesting that global warming, melting ice caps and the loss of natural environment for polar bears are what... not real problems? Not deserving of attention? You know that we did land on the moon, right?
Butts Alad Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.10.28 20:33:43 - [53] - Quote Kalwas Denitas wrote: Typical. Rather than ignoring or blocking something lets get on a soapbox and demand change for the injustice! After this we can get together and save the polar bears, stop global warming, and give out free 1st place ribbons to all the people who want to play EVE but cant because they are poor. Activists unite! Typical? I don't get it. You make a sarcastic remark, but then include actual, real problems. Not sure what you're going for here. Seems like you're suggesting that global warming, melting ice caps and the loss of natural environment for polar bears are what... not real problems? Not deserving of attention? You know that we did land on the moon, right?
Kalwas Denitas 4	Posted - 2014.10.28 21:04:15 - [54] - Quote Clavain Conjoined wrote: Kalwas Denitas wrote: Typical. Rather than ignoring or blocking something lets get on a soapbox and demand change for the injustice! After this we can get together and save the polar bears, stop global warming, and give out free 1st place ribbons to all the people who want to play EVE but cant because they are poor. Activists unite! Typical? I don't get it. You make a sarcastic remark, but then include actual, real problems. Not sure what you're going for here. Seems like you're suggesting that global warming, melting ice caps and the loss of natural environment for polar bears are what... not real problems? Not deserving of attention? You know that we did land on the moon, right? I just said.. Typical. And none of my post was meant to be sarcastic. I really think that we should all band together to FIX all of the problems in the world. After world hunger, lets end all war, FOREVER. To get warmed up, we can start with people saying mean things because it hurts our feelings and its not enough to ignore them. We must convert and punish those who do not agree with our vision. 100% serious.
Clavain Conjoined Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.10.28 21:27:22 - [55] - Quote Kalwas Denitas wrote: Im already giving the Polar Bears $$ every month and all I get is a picture of him on some ice and he always looks the same age.. Kalwas Denitas wrote: All of this discussion is very important. We need to stamp out profanity in EVE. Nice edits... your post needed them.
Butts Alad Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.10.28 21:27:22 - [56] - Quote Kalwas Denitas wrote: Im already giving the Polar Bears $$ every month and all I get is a picture of him on some ice and he always looks the same age.. Kalwas Denitas wrote: All of this discussion is very important. We need to stamp out profanity in EVE. Nice edits... your post needed them.
Kalwas Denitas 4	Posted - 2014.10.28 21:30:08 - [57] - Quote Clavain Conjoined wrote: Kalwas Denitas wrote: Im already giving the Polar Bears $$ every month and all I get is a picture of him on some ice and he always looks the same age.. Kalwas Denitas wrote: All of this discussion is very important. We need to stamp out profanity in EVE. Nice edits... your post needed them. Im cooking and on a mobile, thanks. Glad to know you got the point.
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 21	Posted - 2014.10.28 23:10:28 - [58] - Quote Kalwas Denitas wrote: Typical. Rather than ignoring or blocking something lets get on a soapbox and demand change for the injustice! After this we can get together and save the polar bears, stop global warming, and give out free 1st place ribbons to all the people who want to play EVE but cant because they are poor. Activists unite! Hey, there's no problem with the report function if someone offends you. Nothing has to be changed.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 726	Posted - 2014.10.29 04:27:33 - [59] - Quote Tyler Hail wrote: Clavain Conjoined wrote: Also, keep in mind that it has a lot to do with how the word is used. Saying a word has multiple meanings around the world could be true and is all well and good in a sterile academic argument, but when it's used to say something like "I'm glad that F will burn in hell" well, it's clear that's hate and the multiple meanings are moot. This very much. As a genderqueer lgbt player, there's a vast difference between my reaction to someone saying "God, that was so gay" and someone saying "Fa**ots will burn in hell" or something similar regarding any minority. The first is most likely ignorance and I can brush that off, block the person if they keep doing it and move on. But people bashing gays or women or people of color...it's obvious when the meaning behind it is more than just ignorance or an immature attempt at riling someone up and any excuse of 'cultural differences' is a total strawman. Hate is hate and if hate is motivating the use of the word, it's offensive and deserves reporting. Ignorance is something else and bears, imo, a little leeway. the first was something I picked up around 7 years old, and quite literally couldn't have known better (and used for years). The second I learned some number of years later and more or less went along for a while, then pretty much realized it was quite wrong sometime in my teens. Now I try to not use either. Luckily in all my time in eve I haven't had to deal with anyone who has made anything like this an issue, and I will say corp/alliance TS did get quite raunchy at times. I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me! In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod - Mara Rinn
Sol Project Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 46	Posted - 2014.10.29 11:58:36 - [60] - Quote "Kind Sir, you have destroyed my vessel and put my pod back into the clonevat. I have to tell you that I am very angry about this. You should know that my feelings towards you are very negative right now." - "Thank you for your message. I will feast on your words and anger like a Lord, which was the whole purpose of my activity in the first place. If you have anything more to say to me, please do not hesitate." "Yes, I actually do. It is beyond my understanding why you would destroy my ship and capsule. I am thinking lots of angry words about you and close relatives of yours." - "Dear Sir. The pleasure is fully on my side. I am always happy when people inform me about their feelings, especially when it comes to close relatives of mine." "Please go enjoy yourself. It would please me most, if you did so with your father. Please have a nice day." - "I will do so, of course. You too, my friend" What bothers me most is the hypocrisy of people who are easily offended. Their emotional shallowness can be overcome by proper actions. Easily. Blocking does not protect anyone from gunfire. You all who believe that you have a right in demanding that others live and behave how you want them to, need to remember that there is nothing you can say that will protect you from someone who believes the same as you do, but rather lets actions speak for him.
Steve Wingyip Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2014.10.29 15:37:09 - [61] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street. But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad). From the LGBT community, most people really can't be assed to hear that sort of talk with everything else that have to go through. This game is supposed to be fun and people should not be talking like that at all.
Sphinkterpopper Azsbebustin Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2014.10.29 15:40:08 - [62] - Quote people who make homophobic slurrs are gay why is the tattoo under my right eye that of a dog doing a flaming fart?

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