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Capacitor Flux Coils vs Capacitor Power Relay

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Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:18:00 - [1] - Quote I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance?
Doc Fury Furious Enterprises 6996	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:20:47 - [2] - Quote Gû¼Gû¼Gû¦ Ships & Modules Gûü Gûé Gûä Gûà Gûå Gûç Gûê GôòGôñGôíGô¿GôæGôPGôúGäó - GôPGôPGôù.89 Gûê Gûç Gûå Gûà Gûä Gûé Gûü Gÿ+ The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'.
Abrazzar Vardaugas Family 5020	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:30:34 - [3] - Quote Ignore capacitor, acquire damage mods. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics
Paranoid Loyd 2468	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:38:25 - [4] - Quote Abrazzar wrote: Ignore capacitor, acquire damage mods. ^This. Killing all the things before cap even becomes an issue is the best way. "PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite
Unsuccessful At Everything The Troll Bridge 17450	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:46:52 - [5] - Quote Paranoid Loyd wrote: Abrazzar wrote: Ignore capacitor, acquire damage mods. ^This. Killing all the things before cap even becomes an issue is the best way. What I thought about when you guys said this. *Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?*
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.10.31 16:58:54 - [6] - Quote Doc Fury wrote: Gû¼Gû¼Gû¦ Ships & Modules Gûü Gûé Gûä Gûà Gûå Gûç Gûê GôòGôñGôíGô¿GôæGôPGôúGäó - GôPGôPGôù.89 Gûê Gûç Gûå Gûà Gûä Gûé Gûü Yes, I found that section after creating the post. There was no way for me to move this question, other than to edit and remove all content and repost. Perhaps a mod will move it for me.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.10.31 17:04:00 - [7] - Quote Paranoid Loyd wrote: Abrazzar wrote: Ignore capacitor, acquire damage mods. ^This. Killing all the things before cap even becomes an issue is the best way. This certainly makes sense, though this character has primarily been my industry alt and does not have the skills yet to pack a hefty punch. I have fit as many damage mods as possible, with only one low slot open for something to hold me over. It will be a year before I have the drone and missile skills up to where I want on this character. I have fit an afterburner to mitigate damage, but I do need some defense. It takes me a little less than 30 seconds to kill a 1mil bounty BS at this point.
Paranoid Loyd 2468	Posted - 2014.10.31 17:11:57 - [8] - Quote Running missions? Stick to level 3s until your skills are better, you will make more. "PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite
Serene Repose 1585	Posted - 2014.11.01 00:11:03 - [9] - Quote The best D-fense is a good O-fense. That is, until you run into someone who thinks the same way x2. THEN of course... If I wrap my ship totally in duct tape do you think.... I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility toward every form of tyranny over the mind of man.-á
Arronicus Bitter Lemons Brothers of Tangra 1209	Posted - 2014.11.01 02:01:27 - [10] - Quote Given that the CSM summer minutes just came out the other day, and that they specifically mentioned Capacitor Flux Coils being rebalanced to give the same Capacitor Regen as Capacitor Power Relays, the choice is pretty obvious: You'd go with a CFC if you dont want to nerf your boost, and a CPR if you arent cap stable or are worried about neuts. There will be no tradeoff in cap regen.

Jacob Holland Weyland-Vulcan Industries 324	Posted - 2014.11.01 02:21:05 - [11] - Quote Depending on the slots available the penalty may be negligable... Although CFCs were recently tweaked (first pass of module tiericide) there is an interesting property with CPRs in that (as I recall) the shield boost penalty is stacking penalised... or bonused. In other words, if you fit a lot of CPRs and a couple of boost amps you pretty quickly cancel the penalty while gaining a significant cap recharge. I will say that I am going from older, half remembered stuff here - I may be misremembering or they may have changed since... I would counter the "moar damage" crew here though: When you have good skills and you're confident in your ship then damage mods, reducing the incoming damage by killing it, is a very solid position to take. When you're an inexperienced pilot with poor skills however the damage mods are going to have a correspondingly low effect, and when fitting four damage mods means that you kill a rat in eleven volleys rather than twelve you may well find that there are better ways to use your slots. Loading up on damage mods which bring your kill down to three volleys rather than four is a very valuable investment but it is dependent on a couple of things other than the number of lowslots and BCUs you fit (where are the 7 Heat Sink, shield buffer PvE Abaddons?) Cap Stability may not be the ultimate strategy but if you're missioning for hours and a mistake is going to cost more than you've earned then there is value in a slightly more circumspect route.
LUMINOUS SPIRIT The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People 607	Posted - 2014.11.01 06:38:07 - [12] - Quote Macker Momo wrote: I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance? imperial navy power relay on a armor marauder makes a big difference. Flux coils.... meh, situational. Use flux coils when your primary threat is neuts rather then dps. In wormholes everything neuts but dps is comparatively light (for a marauder anyways, c6 sites excepted). Sometimes a flux coil works on something like a golem. depends on the fit and tank output. Personally i use armor, and 1-2 power relays on my paladin.
stoicfaux 5371	Posted - 2014.11.01 07:16:24 - [13] - Quote Macker Momo wrote: I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance? You're probably trying to use a "perma-boosted" setup, i.e. have the shield booster always running while being cap stable. In general, this is unnecessary in the context of PvE mission running. Instead you could invest in a Capacitor Booster, e.g. Heavy Capacitor Booster II. The benefits of a cap booster are that instead of fitting multiple cap enhancing modules (CFCs, Cap Rechargers, etc.) you can use a single slot for a Cap Booster and use the now free slots for offensive or defensive modules. The downside is that Cap Boosters use ammo (which takes up a lot of cargo space) and have non-trivial fitting requirements. The general problem with a perma-boosted setup is that you spend so many fitting slots on cap recharging that your tank suffers due to a lack of shield hardeners which means you need to use a bigger shield booster which requires more cap mods..., and that your gank (offense) suffers which means the NPCs spend more time shooting at you which means you need more tank and/or a bigger shield booster. So perma-boosted setups can be a bit self-defeating. OTOH, if you need to walk away from the keyboard at a moment's notice, perma-boosted setups can work for certain battleships. WASABI: Warp Acceleration System Ancillary Boost Injected(Gäó)
baltec1 Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 13740	Posted - 2014.11.01 08:22:18 - [14] - Quote Macker Momo wrote: I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance? Use neither. Go with a cap booster and use those low slots for damage/tracking as it will provide you with a much more efficient PVE boat. You can get away with a med cap booster and use cap booster 400 charges on near all pve battleship fits. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
Hal Morsh Exodus Mining Corp 175	Posted - 2014.11.02 00:59:10 - [15] - Quote You said CFC. YOU SAID CFC!!!! BURN HIM! *I enjoy a good session of mining.*
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:38:59 - [16] - Quote Arronicus wrote: Given that the CSM summer minutes just came out the other day, and that they specifically mentioned Capacitor Flux Coils being rebalanced to give the same Capacitor Regen as Capacitor Power Relays, the choice is pretty obvious: You'd go with a CFC if you dont want to nerf your boost, and a CPR if you arent cap stable or are worried about neuts. There will be no tradeoff in cap regen. I'll be watching to see if that comes to pass. As it stands right now, the CPR provides more cap regen than the CFC. Thanks for the "heads up." Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:45:33 - [17] - Quote stoicfaux wrote: Macker Momo wrote: I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance? You're probably trying to use a "perma-boosted" setup, i.e. have the shield booster always running while being cap stable. In general, this is unnecessary in the context of PvE mission running. Instead you could invest in a Capacitor Booster, e.g. Heavy Capacitor Booster II. The benefits of a cap booster are that instead of fitting multiple cap enhancing modules (CFCs, Cap Rechargers, etc.) you can use a single slot for a Cap Booster and use the now free slots for offensive or defensive modules. The downside is that Cap Boosters use ammo (which takes up a lot of cargo space) and have non-trivial fitting requirements. The general problem with a perma-boosted setup is that you spend so many fitting slots on cap recharging that your tank suffers due to a lack of shield hardeners which means you need to use a bigger shield booster which requires more cap mods..., and that your gank (offense) suffers which means the NPCs spend more time shooting at you which means you need more tank and/or a bigger shield booster. So perma-boosted setups can be a bit self-defeating. OTOH, if you need to walk away from the keyboard at a moment's notice, perma-boosted setups can work for certain battleships. Yes, I see your point. I'm really trying to scoot around and avoid as much damage as I can with a nice 100MN AB, but as others have noted I'm still at the point where it takes quite a few volleys to kill a good NPC BS, so I can take some damage. I think I'll play around with things a bit this weekend if I have the time. Thanks! Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:49:28 - [18] - Quote Great info, everyone. Thanks for your opinions. I get the feeling that a marauder is a good way to go if missions are your thing. Might be a better ship all around, but it will certainly take some time to get there. I'm training this character for more damage, T2 missiles and missile skills and we'll see if I can get my DPS up a bit. I'll also play around a bit with perhaps one cap slot and see if that meets the need until my DPS increases. I've also considered sticking with the level IIIs and training up heavy or heavy assault missiles to T2, first. Hmmm. Perhaps some trial and error. Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Alara IonStorm 5471	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:56:48 - [19] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Use neither. Go with a cap booster and use those low slots for damage/tracking as it will provide you with a much more efficient PVE boat. Seconding this. Years ago when I was running a Raven with T4 launchers it was a vital part of PVE. I rarely use my cap booster now days but its a handy back up thats saved me from having to warp out (or explode when scrammed) on real high DPS areas or after I've gone AFK for a minute. I think of it as my emergency back up.
ISD Ezwal ISD Community Communications Liaisons 2632	Posted - 2014.11.07 19:50:05 - [20] - Quote Thread has been moved to Ships & Modules. ISD Ezwal Vice Admiral Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department

Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.07 22:38:14 - [21] - Quote Alara IonStorm wrote: baltec1 wrote: Use neither. Go with a cap booster and use those low slots for damage/tracking as it will provide you with a much more efficient PVE boat. Seconding this. Years ago when I was running a Raven with T4 launchers it was a vital part of PVE. I rarely use my cap booster now days but its a handy back up thats saved me from having to warp out (or explode when scrammed) on real high DPS areas or after I've gone AFK for a minute. I think of it as my emergency back up. Good idea. Will try it! Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.07 22:41:12 - [22] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Macker Momo wrote: I wonder if anyone had an opinion on the capacitor flux coil vs capacitor power relay for a shield boosting BS. Obviously, the CPR decreases shield boost, and the CFC decreases cap capacity. In EFT, the difference in cap recharge is only marginally better with the CPR (0.8), though I lose 65 shield boosting HP a cycle. The real question in my mind is how a smaller cap capacity from the CFC will affect sustained PVE play. Anyone have experience with both the CFC and CPR on a shield boosting BS since the Oceanus rebalance? Use neither. Go with a cap booster and use those low slots for damage/tracking as it will provide you with a much more efficient PVE boat. You can get away with a med cap booster and use cap booster 400 charges on near all pve battleship fits but if you have the room always go for the large. The trick is to only use the shield booster/armour repper when you need it so you can manage your cap. Thank you. Don't know how I missed your response. Is it common to allow shields to drop to 30% or so, then boost them all the way back to 100%? If so, how about an ancillary shield booster which would take care of both cap and shield boost issues? Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Caldari 5 D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S Northern Associates. 351	Posted - 2014.11.07 23:44:10 - [23] - Quote Just to throw and extra option into the mix, consider using a Power Diagnostic System, sometimes you don't need the high cap recharge of the CPR/CFC modules. A PDS will give you a broad amount of useful bonuses on a ship, especially a shield tanked one. Additional Shield HP, Shield recharge, Cap Amount, and Cap Recharge, Powergrid. Considering that recharge rate actually increases when you have more the recharge bonus is actually more than stated effectively.
elitatwo Eve Minions Poopstain Removal Team 437	Posted - 2014.11.08 00:08:22 - [24] - Quote Caldari 5 wrote: Just to throw and extra option into the mix, consider using a Power Diagnostic System, sometimes you don't need the high cap recharge of the CPR/CFC modules. A PDS will give you a broad amount of useful bonuses on a ship, especially a shield tanked one. Additional Shield HP, Shield recharge, Cap Amount, and Cap Recharge, Powergrid. Considering that recharge rate actually increases when you have more the recharge bonus is actually more than stated effectively. Shhhhuuush!!! They are supposed to figure this out on their own at some point.. Oh and the CFC is a no-no! Don't join the blobb. signature
Mike Adoulin Adolescent Radioactive Pirate Hamsters 977	Posted - 2014.11.08 02:03:12 - [25] - Quote Capacitor flux coils are The Devil. THE DEVIL. Everything in EVE is a trap. And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:) You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg. Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 22	Posted - 2014.11.08 14:14:02 - [26] - Quote There have certainly been some excellent replies on this thread. I ran several level 4 missions, yesterday and took advantage of the advice offered. 1. I fit all damage mods, which took my DPS up to almost 1100 with meta 4 launchers. As many of you predicted, the NPCs died rather quickly. 2. With all the damage mods taking up my lows, I fit neither a capacitor flux coil nor a capacitor power relay. Instead I went with a Meta 4 version of the Heavy Nosferatu, as I had an extra high slot and all possible launchers were already fit. 3. I sent in a petition requesting info on NPC cap usage, and learned that at this time NPCs have unlimited cap. 4. I decided to target the first NPC BS, orbit it at 10 km with my 100mn afterburner going and set the Heavy Nos to work. Then I took out the rest of the NPCs, saving my "capacitor anchor" for last. Amazingly, even with 6 BS targeting me at the same time, I had plenty of cap and took very little damage. This looks like a winning strategy until I have T2 missiles and more skills. At that time, I'll look into a cap booster and perhaps explore with some other types of BS. Great advice, all. Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
Bronson Hughes The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration 716	Posted - 2014.11.09 12:15:21 - [27] - Quote The only circumstances under which you would ever want to realistically consider using a CFC are: 1. You are in almost no danger of getting neuted as any amount capacitor warfare will cripple you immediately. 2. Cap stability is your absolute highest priority. (Missions do not count here.) 3. You are running a local shield booster. (If you're not, a CPR is always a better choice.) If you can find any activity that meets all three criteria, CFCs may be for you. I have yet to find any. CCP Falcon's thoughts on suicide ganking. Reading Comprehension: so important it deserves it's own skillbook. I want to create content, not become content.
Macker Momo The Big Moe Eternal Pretorian Alliance 23	Posted - 2014.11.09 14:49:18 - [28] - Quote Bronson Hughes wrote: The only circumstances under which you would ever want to realistically consider using a CFC are: 1. You are in almost no danger of getting neuted as any amount capacitor warfare will cripple you immediately. 2. Cap stability is your absolute highest priority. (Missions do not count here.) 3. You are running a local shield booster. (If you're not, a CPR is always a better choice.) If you can find any activity that meets all three criteria, CFCs may be for you. I have yet to find any. After experimenting a bit, I can certainly see your point. I had thought that after the CFC rebalance I might find a use for it. Nope. Good to have all the advice, though. Eve releases are coming so quickly, I had to start wearing a seat belt.
13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 45	Posted - 2014.11.11 09:38:09 - [29] - Quote There's a huge problem with the game balance due to the fact that most modules or rigs are obsolete in PvP. Maybe its because tank or gank mods are too powerful, or because other mods like power helpers are too weak, or maybe its because midslot modules and guns dont take up enough cap making power modules worthless in PvP. Taking a dualistic approach to balancing PvP vs PvE is a fail approach that can never be balanced. Solve ONE of them and then work on the other in relation. [quote] So 50 retreivers and 1 ganker walk into a bar, and the ganker turns to all the retreivers and says "I know how to play this game, you're wrong, now give me your money and then let me blow you up". That's the joke. [/quote]


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