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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Francis Inch
Kador Defence Initiative
21
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Posted - 2014.12.23 15:52:09 -
[31] - Quote
Leia Stellate wrote:La Rynx wrote:Leia Stellate wrote:handige harrie wrote:VaIefar Drekavac wrote:So much for player driven economy. ? Plex are still sold and bought by players, this thought experiment would change nothing about that. but that can prevent speculate, let the plex stay in some normal price. because plex is for using, not for speculation. BS! PLEX where created for the market. The use for speculation is expected and intended. , But the more you Post, the more it gets obvious, that you are One of the typical plex-price-is-to-high whiner. But PLEX is created by real money, not redeem from LP or manufactured in stations. It should be controled because it is equal to RMT. The only difference is the seller is CCP itself.
It is controlled. CCP set the price in real currency and its value is constant - one month's worth of game time. How players choose to value that remains a matter of personal choice - no one is forced to use them and no one has the right to deserve or demand them.
Fundamentally EVE is not a Free 2 Play game and any argument otherwise will not change PLEX only encourage their removal. |
Sol Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
844
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Posted - 2014.12.23 15:53:25 -
[32] - Quote
Why can't people just link to all the other threads with ... ... EXACTLY THE SAME QUESTIONS ... ... with the exact SAME RESPONSES!
This way trolls like the OP would have no ground playing you people ... ... but I know, you lot want to be played anyway.
Any ets on how many pages this will reach?
"Babies scream all the time, for no good reason" post
"This is hilarious. Watch it" post https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9yugcNW_xI ("Fuck EVE!")
-- Sabriz Adoud
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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
154
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Posted - 2014.12.23 15:58:06 -
[33] - Quote
Noticed?
CCP knows who owns all the PLEX in game and how much they are worth in ISK and RM. It is a risk to make such deals possible. If i am not wrong CCP hired a market specialist extra for the markets. If PLEX cost to much isk, CCP sell more PLEX for real money. If PLEX cost not much ISK, PLEX will be bought ingame. The amount of availlable PLEX would sink and ISK price would rise again...
The ones that could be hurt alot? The ingame PLEX speculators.
Forum Main
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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
154
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:01:34 -
[34] - Quote
Sol Project wrote:Why can't people just link to all the other threads with ... ... EXACTLY THE SAME QUESTIONS ... ... with the exact SAME RESPONSES!
This way trolls like the OP would have no ground playing you people ... ... but I know, you lot want to be played anyway.
Any ets on how many pages this will reach?
No, no idea, but he sounds like another guy coming from serenity.
A lock would be more than OK.
Forum Main
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Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
7743
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:02:29 -
[35] - Quote
Internet Economists are coming out..
Again.
Gÿ+
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'.
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
5673
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:13:46 -
[36] - Quote
Abyss Azizora wrote:It's a smart choice to change it to only be traded once. While it would in fact cause the price to increase at first, it would quickly cause the price to drop sharply thereafter, as the mega-rich who hoard PLEX to keep their isk immune to inflation, can no longer hoard them. (And even the non-mega-rich, hell even I keep about 20b in PLEX, and that's pocket change compared to the hoarders.)
The result is that people who actually "USE" the PLEX will be the ones buying them, and not isk hoarders. Resulting in better supply, and hence lower prices.
Why not make every item in the game follow this rule?
The only people who buy ships will be the ones who use them. The only people who buy Damage Control IIs are the ones who use them.
No more market trading for anything, because buying and selling is obviously bad and we need to remove this ultra-important cornerstone of the Eve economy.
Why? Because the OP and this guy are worried that prices might actually go up and down in an open market.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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knowsitall
Adeptus iNdustry and Logistics Silent Eviction
25
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:18:53 -
[37] - Quote
Leia Stellate wrote:Clever than CCP If each PLEX could be traded only one time. What would happen next? Maybe it could stop the rising price of PLEX. I think the biggest failure of the design of EVE Online is that PLEX can be traded unlimited, this makes PLEX has unparalleled speculation value
PLEX can never be too high. They have an infinite non time bound supply (as far as in game is concerned). The only people that think PLEX is too high is the buyers. Im sure the sellers are happy with high PLEX prices. If PLEX gets too high FOR YOU don't buy them, then the price will fall as demand falls. Eve is not and never has been a free to play game. It is just some players trade subscription time to buy in game isk grinding time. Others trade in game isk grinding time for subscription time. The price you pay for that conversion is set by what PLAYERS are prepared to pay. As with everything in Eve (and in general), its worth is what someone will pay, not what it cost.
KIA |
Sam am
I'll wait for muh friends
0
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:20:16 -
[38] - Quote
At first i thought it was a good idea. Then i realized,that less availibility means higher prices. No,bc no. |
Signal11th
1586
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:20:49 -
[39] - Quote
pretty simple answer to be honest just put a time limit on plex, say 30/60 days then no one can hold onto it.it either gets used or it expires.
Personally I couldnt care if they go up or goes down as I don't use enough to worry about it.
God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!" I came fifth and won a toaster!
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Nalelmir Ahashion
Omegon 42nd Core
613
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:28:28 -
[40] - Quote
Buyers wish to pay less. Seller wishes to be payed more.
I think that sums it up?
"What's worse than a foul-mouthed eight-year-old constantly claiming he's had relations with your mother? A foul-mouthed eight-year-old constantly claiming he's had relations with your mother who thinks he's a gangser, that's what."
- Aaron Birch
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Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
2190
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:29:28 -
[41] - Quote
Only people who shouldn't be playing EVE complain about the price of PLEX.
A professional astro-bastard was not available so they sent me.
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Lucas Kell
Internet Terrorists SpaceMonkey's Alliance
4819
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Posted - 2014.12.23 16:34:54 -
[42] - Quote
Leia Stellate wrote:If you think 800mil isk is a Ferrari, what will happen while PLEX rise to 8billion. I'm not talking about buying plex or selling plex. I'm worried about if plex keep rising (some businessman have huge amount of isk, what if they do some malicious speculation make the plex to a very high price, for example 8billion) , then economic crisis break out. This is not good signal to this game. Plex prices will continue to rise, and yes, one day they will be worth 8b isk. Next year they will be breaking the 1b mark. At no point will an economic crisis break out because PLEX is expensive. You're issue is you don't like PLEX price because to you it's too high. Too bad, get over it. They system shouldn't be changed to make PLEX the first non-tradeable commodity just because you don;t like the price of them.
The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.
Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
75
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Posted - 2014.12.23 17:32:26 -
[43] - Quote
Leia Stellate wrote:Clever than CCP If each PLEX could be traded only one time. What would happen next? Maybe it could stop the rising price of PLEX. I think the biggest failure of the design of EVE Online is that PLEX can be traded unlimited, this makes PLEX has unparalleled speculation value
bad idea. please don't mess with my main source of isk. thank you
Just Add Water
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Barakach
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
209
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Posted - 2014.12.23 17:41:49 -
[44] - Quote
Watch buy and sell orders disappear over night. Buy a plex now, wait a month to sell it. People trading plex smooths out the market by allowing buying and selling to happen even when there is no production or demand.
Without traders, the only way to buy or sell is when there is a buyer or seller *right now*. Might as well remove Plex from the market, you'll get the same effect without changes to how Eve works. |
SECOND ASSAUIT
23rd Tier Overseer's Personal Effects Pangu Coalition
0
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Posted - 2014.12.23 19:13:17 -
[45] - Quote
http://tieba.baidu.com/photo/p?kw=tamakomarket&flux=1&tid=3484636728&pic_id=7c8c3e66d0160924311b9ba1d70735fae6cd343b&pn=1&fp=2&see_lz=1
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DaReaper
Net 7
1560
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Posted - 2014.12.23 20:23:04 -
[46] - Quote
Ok lets work this idea through to its natural conclusion.
I want to sell a plex but I am limited to selling it only once. So I would check the market, and decide if it was worth it to me to put it on the market. If its not, I then either 1) decide to horde it. or two) sell it a different way to try and get around the market.
Now I can horde and hope the price rises, as in theory if I am hording, others who want a plex will start offering more. eventually I will hit a point where I will say 'yea that's good' and sell my plex.
Guy who just bought my plex is now locked with it. He can't trade it and has to use it. But he doesn't want to, he wants to make money. He knows there is a way to do this... so, he chekcs the market, then decided to go to the forums and offers the plex there, but he offers it as gifted time, so someone who wants it has to want it for time. He gets offers, and then give it via the new give game time to the new guy.
Congrads, you have just created an out of game black market. So now instead of just selling for isk, if I bought 500, all locked, I can offer a service to sell my gifted time for a cheaper fee then ccp charges. "don't like paying $15 a month? i'll sell you 30 days of time right now for $5"
This limitiation fixes nothing. I found a way t increase RMT, and increase the plex price astronomically in one stroke.
locking it reduces suppy. with reduced supply people will want there plex. they don't want to pay $20, however, if billy bob says get time for $5... well... that's different. What stops this now is tons of supply. shrugs
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Marsha Mallow
1795
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Posted - 2014.12.23 20:38:54 -
[47] - Quote
I know it's an unpopular stance but I agree with the OP, although I'm not sure making Plex tradable once is the only possible solution. Plex aren't a purely ingame item the way that ships or mods are, and I think player speculation and profiteering needs to be decoupled from impacting subs. It's not about stopping the players who sell plex from profiting due to ingame inflation, it's more about minimising the ability of speculators to manipulate the market to a degree that it affects retention rates. If you don't care about retention rates in the slightest, don't bother reading the rest.
I've seen a lot of remarks that people who can't afford to play have their priorities wrong and should sort their lives out. It strikes me as a massively hypocritical attitude when on the same forum people encourage each other to "Broadcast for Reps" if they are feeling suicidal. Spend some time talking to players ingame and you'll find a % who are unemployed (made redundant or struggling due to their local economy), or students*, or suffering from a host of real life issues. They might be playing Eve as an outlet or as their main hobby. A lot have been suckered into running multiple accounts, which is not -ú10/$10 a month, so stop trotting that out. When they start seeing Plex prices spike it just adds to a spiral of misery they are already in. I find the attitude of "well, tough luck" from some of the forum shitbirds disgusting tbh in this context. You'd have to be a complete ******** to actually say this to someone ingame who is already down and is getting worked up over not having the time to grind to keep their accounts up. Fair enough, some people are whiners, but some are genuinely struggling. There's no counter argument when they threaten to quit and go play something cheaper that isn't such a massive timesink, and I personally resent seeing people I like unsub over this.
Something that might be more dynamic would be to set a timer on a Plex from the moment it is issued ingame (say 90 days). That way they can still be traded, but as the timer degrades it becomes more pressing to get them sold. Allowing a few greedy gits to affect so many is not healthy for the wider playerbase and needs to be curbed.
* Not talking about myself here, I stay subbed via passive ISK generation. But not everyone can be taught (or wants to learn) and if I was forced to PVE-grind to stay subbed, I'd probably be bawwing too.
DON'T BE RIDICULOUS!
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Nemah Xadi
Hedion University Amarr Empire
18
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Posted - 2014.12.23 20:40:47 -
[48] - Quote
No.
The ability of people with too much ISK to screw over the general population by artifically inflating the price of basic goods that (some) people need in order to play the game is an integral part of any free market. Removing it would make Eve much less real.
Also, I'm not buying plexes at these prices either and my accounts will be unsubbed once they expire in a month. But who cares. And no you can't have my stuff. |
DaReaper
Net 7
1562
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Posted - 2014.12.23 20:43:03 -
[49] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:I know it's an unpopular stance but I agree with the OP, although I'm not sure making Plex tradable once is the only possible solution. Plex aren't a purely ingame item the way that ships or mods are, and I think player speculation and profiteering needs to be decoupled from impacting subs. It's not about stopping the players who sell plex from profiting due to ingame inflation, it's more about minimising the ability of speculators to manipulate the market to a degree that it affects retention rates. If you don't care about retention rates in the slightest, don't bother reading the rest.
I've seen a lot of remarks that people who can't afford to play have their priorities wrong and should sort their lives out. It strikes me as a massively hypocritical attitude when on the same forum people encourage each other to "Broadcast for Reps" if they are feeling suicidal. Spend some time talking to players ingame and you'll find a % who are unemployed (made redundant or struggling due to their local economy), or students*, or suffering from a host of real life issues. They might be playing Eve as an outlet or as their main hobby. A lot have been suckered into running multiple accounts, which is not -ú10/$10 a month, so stop trotting that out. When they start seeing Plex prices spike it just adds to a spiral of misery they are already in. I find the attitude of "well, tough luck" from some of the forum shitbirds disgusting tbh in this context. You'd have to be a complete ******** to actually say this to someone ingame who is already down and is getting worked up over not having the time to grind to keep their accounts up. Fair enough, some people are whiners, but some are genuinely struggling. There's no counter argument when they threaten to quit and go play something cheaper that isn't such a massive timesink, and I personally resent seeing people I like unsub over this.
Something that might be more dynamic would be to set a timer on a Plex from the moment it is issued ingame (say 90 days). That way they can still be traded, but as the timer degrades it becomes more pressing to get them sold. Allowing a few greedy gits to affect so many is not healthy for the wider playerbase and needs to be curbed.
* Not talking about myself here, I stay subbed via passive ISK generation. But not everyone can be taught (or wants to learn) and if I was forced to PVE-grind to stay subbed, I'd probably be bawwing too.
I agree with part of this. Plex needs to be decoupled from everything except game time. It needs to be that you can ONLY use plex for game time, that's it. can't buy Iceland tickets, cant use it in the AT, can't use it to buy stuff from eve store, can't resculpt, JUST game time.
They have Aurum, this si what Aurum should be, you buy and sell tokens. they are used for all the extra crap. Plex is just for game time. This would reduce a lot of the demand for plex, cause Aurum to rise and people will shift to Aurum.
Wait.. then we would have Aurum whine threads... yea.. never mind lol
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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FunGu Arsten
Fungu .Inc
58
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Posted - 2014.12.23 20:56:04 -
[50] - Quote
OP please shutup... i'm making billions |
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Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere Republic of the 5phere
874
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Posted - 2014.12.23 21:14:36 -
[51] - Quote
You'd be better off arguing that CCP should reduce the cash value to buy a PLEX. More PLEX on the market, less value. You're suggestion would do the opposite. They won't do that, of course. Bet they're making absolute bank off of PLEX's.
The in-game value of a PLEX is going to continue to rise as long as there is a demand. People that play the game for free by earning isk for PLEX are continuing to be able to afford them, even at their higher prices. Christ, I can remember when they were worth 200mill! There's only so much market manipulation that can be done here. It's the people that use and absorb the PLEX to add game-time that ultimately create the demand.
As far as people using their wealth to play the market and make loads of cash: Welcome to EvE Online! Anything that reduces the player-driven economy is just wrong!
Post with your main, like a BOSS!
And no, i don't live in highsec. -áAs if that would make your opinion any less wrong. -á
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Dmitri Dracov
Deep Space Trade and Prospect
17
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Posted - 2014.12.23 21:28:03 -
[52] - Quote
I don't like plex prices being so high because I sub an alt account that way, but no way should CCP start interfering with the market.
I've got a 'top price' I'm willing to pay and that's a billion - we already passed it once and if it gets there again I just shut down my plexed account till prices fall because I can't be bothered to grind for the luxury of the extra account.
If it ever comes to a situation that I couldn't afford to pay real money to play EVE I'd just stop playing, no way would I do any tedious PvE for isk just to play, it's bad enough having to do it to buy ships! |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
7159
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Posted - 2014.12.23 21:34:20 -
[53] - Quote
I agree with the OP.
PLEX is the one single (out of how many thousands?) tradable item that is used as the only legitimate source of RMT.
It is a unique item in the game and should be treated as such with restrictions on it's use and specific rules governing how it can be used.
Not hatin'. Just sayin'.
Mr Epeen
There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
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Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
2898
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Posted - 2014.12.23 22:22:50 -
[54] - Quote
Consider that PLEX demand is good for the company that is selling them for 20$ a pop.
Demand = Immediate Consumption (game time) + Delayed Consumption (you buy a few PLEX at a price you're happy about, to get game time later on) + I Wanna Play Internet Space Warren Buffet (you buy PLEX exclusively to keep it or trade it).
OP's suggestion (which I like, ideologically) would kill the 3rd and maybe reduce the 2nd.
That's not good for business, so I doubt it'll ever happen.
Make space glamorous!
Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
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Toad The Hitchhiker
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2014.12.23 23:32:04 -
[55] - Quote
Plex currently average a sales volume average of 4000 per day, or 120k per month.
Seeing as there is less than 350k active accounts left in Eve give or take a few dozen thousand, the idea that Plex is not traded several times before being consumed has to be a reality.
Judging on the principle that you buy plex to use, to hold or to sell, and if you sell one you are probably subbing your account as well for every one of the 120k sold her month if all were consumed each month then 240k accounts would be taken care of.
Now we don't have a clue what the numbers are for subscription types because Plex is the single most secretive item in the game, but we do know that 66% of Eve is not plexing, therefore someone is sitting on a ton of them (many people sitting on many tons).
Therefore Plex is only as worthwhile as the artificial demand can outstrip the supply. Wait until January and tell me how that is working out, we are already seeing 100 plex dump orders in Sinq and Lonetrek last night, it is only getting worse for holders coming soon. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
The Volition Cult
639
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Posted - 2014.12.23 23:52:01 -
[56] - Quote
La Rynx wrote:I agree its a PLEX whine thread.
One assumption was bann isboxer and PLEX prices would drop. They did, but they recovered to a certain grade.
So, OP, thats a completly stupid idea.
That ban hasn't started yet.
CSM Ten movement for change.
EVE - the only MMO that not so subtly serves up victims.
Status: Rabid carebear
Blog
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Marsha Mallow
1799
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Posted - 2014.12.24 00:12:19 -
[57] - Quote
Toad The Hitchhiker wrote:Plex currently average a sales volume average of 4000 per day, or 120k per month. Source please
DON'T BE RIDICULOUS!
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Toad The Hitchhiker
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2014.12.24 00:15:06 -
[58] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:Toad The Hitchhiker wrote:Plex currently average a sales volume average of 4000 per day, or 120k per month. Source please
http://eve-marketdata.com/price_check.php?type_id=29668 https://eve-central.com/home/quicklook.html?typeid=29668 http://www.eve-markets.net/detail?typeid=29668
You know there is more market data on Eve than there is on Brent Crude right?! |
Jenshae Chiroptera
The Volition Cult
639
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Posted - 2014.12.24 00:26:10 -
[59] - Quote
La Rynx wrote: BS! PLEX where created for the market. The use for speculation is expected and intended.
PLEX exists to make CCP money.
They need people to buy PLEX with RL $ that helps to fuel the company. What happens from there on the market you would think would not matter.
However, you need people to buy them and use them at a good rate to keep the turn over going.
The prices were getting to a point that people just drop the extra accounts and that drops demand and from there that goes back to the $ that CCP want and by now probably need. **
It was probably a bonus but now PLEX is probably counted as a monthly and annual income used for general expenditure and paying salaries.
** which is precisely what some players are banking on. There is a group with a core that believe they win the game when CCP has to shut it down. So, they are doing all they can to buy up PLEX, drive other players out, increase their own players with the profit, extra PLEX and ruin the game.
CSM Ten movement for change.
EVE - the only MMO that not so subtly serves up victims.
Status: Rabid carebear
Blog
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Marsha Mallow
1800
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Posted - 2014.12.24 00:29:20 -
[60] - Quote
Toad The Hitchhiker wrote:You know there is more market data on Eve than there is on Brent Crude right?! Indeed. I just wanted to check where you were getting those numbers, cheers for the reply.
DON'T BE RIDICULOUS!
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