That's extremely myopic of you. This is not just your own personal gripe in a vacuum, you know.

If you don't have anythig constructive to say about the problem of AFK CLOAKERS then dont say anything

It's not a problem, first of all.

Second of all, the discussion touches on a number of different issues, local being chief among them.

So no, you don't get to try and smother discourse, nor silence opposition to your selfish imperatives.

i.e for those of you talking about POSes and locsl channels etc this is not the point of the tread.

guys closked up in a system AFK doing nothing but disrupting the activities going on in that system.

not about cloaky ships that are actievly been flown or gathering intel on systems or looking for a target to blops .


let me say it again AFK cloakers

You are correct in what you are saying, however some of those topics have bleed over to this topic as well. Intel gathering and targets are actually parts of the so called "AFK camper".

Well then, if circadian sleeper idea would be implemented, then the cloakers will have nothing to worry about since they're ACTIVELY gathering intel...right....right? Oh wait...

Try dropping the passive aggressive tone. It honestly works better for posting.

And it really isnt a lie. A cloaked player has subtantially more safety than a ratter. You have to remember, ratters are engaged with NPC ships. Of course its assumed they are well fitted to kill them but that isnt always the case, not everyone can drop a carrier in and go ratting while the drones kill things.

Not saying there isnt some truth in your statement but your own bias is effecting your point of view as well.

The intel deprivation counter to local argument is an insufficient argument in terms of weight to both encouraging players to login but not actually interact with the game, and the idea of assets in space being at risk.

intel deprivation as a counter to local < encouraging in-game afk activity (not part of any game design vision or rational behavior = illogical) + risk to assets in space (interaction)

AFK - Away From Keyboard = logged in, not playing or interacting with the game in anyway

If "intel deprivation as a counter to local" is truly the stated intention for keeping the cloaking mechanic the way it is (which it is clear and stated numerous times by multiple people that it is) then you are using your presence (AFK or not) to exert influence on your environment and those in it, specifically by using local to essentially plant a flag (if you argue this point you are simply not being honest and slow deathing us all). Regardless of whether this belongs in a "remove local" debate or not, it is clear that the AFK cloaker is intending to use their toon to influence others in the game.

It is perfectly legitimate to use your presence in local while in space SO LONG as the player is active and engaged in the actual game (i.e. PLAYING). If the user has no intention of interacting with the game while desiring to influence others ingame activity, and gain an advantage over time using this inactivity (i.e. desensitizing others to their presence so that once the AFK player eventually becomes active, can use that desensitized state to either gain intel, transmit intel, drop a cyno, or engage another player by surprise) then that player should be subject to the same consequences as any other player with an asset in space and not paying attention.

This can be done by simple mechanics that would encourage the user to maintain some form of reasonable vigilance that would require basic and normal interaction with the game. The most elegant and non-intrusive ways to achieve this would be to limit the amount of time a player can maintain a cloak through some form of resource consumption (simple module cycle using a charge that needs to be reloaded at some point like ammo) AND/OR be detectable in some way through some form of action or effort by another player beyond simple proximity to decloak (i.e. active scanning/probing).

In this way, the goal of achieving "intel deprivation" has remained unaffected and player interaction with both each other and the game have been supported and encouraged. CCP has stated numerous ways that they desire player driven content and mechanics that create emergent gameplay. This does both while achieving the objective of keeping players engaged in the actual game while their toons are logged in and undocked.

Any mechanic that encourages player inactivity (and I am not talking about ratters or miners) is a bad mechanic. Any argument that player inactivity should be encouraged or is a good thing is illogical. Arguing against local and then using local to show that local is no good in support of not altering the bad mechanic is also illogical and circular.

The local debate is that way ->

If local were gone tomorrow the arguments against perpetual cloaking at no cost or vulnerability remain valid.

If local were announced as never going away by CCP, mechanics encouraging inactivity would logically be designed away from in favor of active gameplay.

...and again, the local debate is that way ->

AFK Cloaking is by definition inactivity.

This is mainly where the players in system knows he is afk but cannot go about their daily activites because of it .

we are talking about AFK CLOAKERS

If you know they are afk then why cant you go about your daily activities?



Wrong.

Please read.

Accept that these topics should be dealt with as a whole, if at all. If Local, covert operations, intel, cyno's etc etc were off topic the ISD would be removing ALL of my posts.

Feel free to join the conversation the rest of us are having.

Please join the more direct and purposeful conversation; actual cloaking mechanics.

Problem with the seekers is they wont be around forever. least I dont think so

After a pilot has been cloaked and has not warped for 5 minutes, the following happens:
A) They disappear from local
B) They lose access to local intel (if people talk in local they can see it, but they don't have a list of pilots that are in local)

If the cloaked player drops cloak or initiates warp, they become visible in local again and their own local is restored. Moving around on grid does not affect their local status in any way, only warping.


+ Doesn't affect wormholes.
+ May give a small amount of warning to locals when a pilot stops being AFK, depending on where the cloaker decides to lie in wait.
+ Alternatively if a cloaker picks a good spot then they could surprise unsuspecting players who feel safe and aren't paying attention to/don't have access to earlier intel.


I have no clue whatsoever if this is possible from a programming standpoint.

direct as in tunnel visioned.

purposeful as in with the agenda of breaking game balance.

aka willful ignorance.

Jenn. What if sov space wasnt part of it. What if making isk wasnt part of it?

What if someones point was the simple fact that a person in space, camping a system shouldnt be 100% safe?

Nulbears better be careful when asking for a nerf. When i'm camping, i'm almost never AFK. I have an inconsistent sleep cycle. I will tackle you and cyno you all hours of the day. If you are counting on nonsense like "cloak fuel" to protect you, be careful what you ask for

Bet they're quaking in their boots.

Those What ifs don't make any sense. EVE is an interconnected game, everything affects everything else.

The "100% safe" thing is important, because it describes the jealousy and bias of the particular situation. You're basically saying "that guy can do something I disagree with and that I can't do anything about so the game must be changed". In addition to that, he isn't 'safe', he is concealed, not under 'cover' like some how is docked is. Cover is safety, concealment isn't.

I don't worry about what the afk cloaker is doing, I have neutralized him long before I undocked, the cloaker could be knitting a sweater with his grandma for all he can do to me. By being obsessing about afk cloakers, YOU LET THEM WIN.

Multiple people have tried to help you (by "you" I mean the anti-cloak crowd) figure out how to make cloakers a non-issue. You refuse to do so because you have that classic "my way or no way" attitude (topped off with a frosting of victim-hood).

Multiple people have tried to help you (by "you" I mean the anti-cloak crowd) figure out how to make cloakers a non-issue. You refuse to do so because you have that classic "my way or no way" attitude (topped off with a frosting of victim-hood).

I know you meant that sarcastically, but judging by the contents of this thread, it's not an unfair assumption when taken seriously.

After a pilot has been cloaked and has not warped for 5 minutes, the following happens:
A) They disappear from local
B) They lose access to local intel (if people talk in local they can see it, but they don't have a list of pilots that are in local)

If the cloaked player drops cloak or initiates warp, they become visible in local again and their own local is restored. Moving around on grid does not affect their local status in any way, only warping.


+ Doesn't affect wormholes.
+ May give a small amount of warning to locals when a pilot stops being AFK, depending on where the cloaker decides to lie in wait.
+ Alternatively if a cloaker picks a good spot then they could surprise unsuspecting players who feel safe and aren't paying attention to/don't have access to earlier intel.


I have no clue whatsoever if this is possible from a programming standpoint.

You are incorrect

Please Read

Please join the more direct and purposeful conversation; actual cloaking mechanics.

If you have even begun to read the last two days worth of commentary on this, you would know that none of that accurately reflects anything I have said on the subject.

Your statements are willful ignorance:
Example 1
Example 2
Example 3
Example 4

aka willful ignorance.