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Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
0
   |
Posted - 2011.11.30 15:52:00 -
[1] - Quote
I have a PI-bear since its inception. I actually enjoy the logistical challenges of setting up extractors and factory worlds. I also find myself RP'ing a bit, always placing my temperate cc's so I can have a nice ocean view.
This who POCO situation got me to thinking.
What if a 3 or 4 PI corps got together and formed an alliance, setting up shop in some backwater low-sec system (or wormhole) and plopping down their own POCO's with a very nominal tax rate?
With 3-4 corps working together, random attacks by small gangs could be prevented. Worse case, you lose a few POCO's to some blobs, but you can simply replace them with the tax you are receiving.
I haven't fleshed this whole idea out yet, but is this something anyone else would be interested in?
So let's sit in a circle and talk about it. Remember, only the person holding the transcranial microcontroller is allowed to talk... |
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
Une Pour Tous
8
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 16:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
Griefers in lowsec gonna blow all your POCOs, and big nullsec Alliances gonna lock their POCOs.
ALL PI just got pawned, better get used to it. |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.30 16:08:00 -
[3] - Quote
Esunisen wrote:Griefers in lowsec gonna blow all your POCOs, and big nullsec Alliances gonna lock their POCOs.
ALL PI just got pawned, better get used to it.
I am not that pessimistic.
Hek, why not diversify your corp with PI'ers and PVP'ers.
PI guys do their thing.
PVP guys hunt down gangs in/around the area. It's a win/win as your planet monkies get their low taxes and real pilots get their fights.
EDIT: I would tend to doubt that 0.0 alliances would have a CTA every time one of their low-sec POCO's gets attacked, if they even have any low-sec POCOs at all. There are literally thousands and thousands of planets out there. |
Borkers
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 00:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
I think it's a valid idea, good for the sort of "semi-casual" gamers that PI worked for previously. But you have fewer planet options than you might think. The bigger alliances may not care about POCOs specifically, but they care plenty about systems. If you're going to have enough people in and out to service the PI, some of them are going to want to put in POS's for convenience, some will set up a bunch of market orders, some will want to run freighters full of goods to Jita, and pretty soon you'll be visible to the big alliances. I don't know how many systems are isolated enough to get around that problem. |
Skorpynekomimi
E.A.D Alliance
Omega Vector
13
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 00:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Generally, all alliances need to do some PI to lower the costs of operating PoSes anyway. I produce fuels and sell them to my corp and alliance at a discount. |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 01:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
Nihlathak, you contacted me in game, but your CPSA charge is 100k, so be a gent and take it off... I mean, I could export 43 units of oxidized compound for that kind of scroll! |
Steveir
Hagukure
Empire Industry
17
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 03:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:I have a PI-bear since its inception. I actually enjoy the logistical challenges of setting up extractors and factory worlds. I also find myself RP'ing a bit, always placing my temperate cc's so I can have a nice ocean view.
This who POCO situation got me to thinking.
What if a 3 or 4 PI corps got together and formed an alliance, setting up shop in some backwater low-sec system (or wormhole) and plopping down their own POCO's with a very nominal tax rate?
With 3-4 corps working together, random attacks by small gangs could be prevented. Worse case, you lose a few POCO's to some blobs, but you can simply replace them with the tax you are receiving.
I haven't fleshed this whole idea out yet, but is this something anyone else would be interested in?
So let's sit in a circle and talk about it. Remember, only the person holding the transcranial microcontroller is allowed to talk...
Like you I'm fond of PI and like the fun of running losec PI. Drop me a mail with your plans/locations, this could be the start of a beautiful friendship :) |
wildfire2555
The Free Luna State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 06:52:00 -
[8] - Quote
The Free Luna State is willing to join, please shoot me a mail with the particulars and such, have a nice little spot in low sec but WH space would be great to. |
Billy Colorado
Agony Unleashed
19
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 14:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Oh, look. It's happening. Someone stepping up and creating a new player driven story.
+1 to the OP. |
Arana Mirelin
Te'Rava Industries
14
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 14:57:00 -
[10] - Quote
Not sure if you would be interested in a more general industry corp being a member, (If so, drop me a line in-game, I am currently evaluating potential lowsec homes) but I thought I would add to this a little.
I'm not sure that starting this in a wormhole would be a good idea, at least not for what seems a casual alliance. You would need at least one POS, potentially more if you didn't like living out of cans. This will cut into your PI taxes, either from having to buy fuel, or having to devote some of your PI production to it. You will still need to buy and haul in ice. It can be done, but this might be a better move later for alliance members should they decide that lowsec has too many other problems.
Just a thought. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
141
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 15:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
+1 for the OP's plan.
-2 for the idea that it'll be "casual". (sorry guys, alliance stuff is far from "casual" -- at least at the outset... breaking the "I'm a Chowabunga pilot, you're a Free Luna State pilot" mentality is annoying ... then again if you have more vets than rookies, you might not run into this so much)
+2 for seeing something other than QQ about the new POCO. |
Arana Mirelin
Te'Rava Industries
14
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 15:45:00 -
[12] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:
-2 for the idea that it'll be "casual". (sorry guys, alliance stuff is far from "casual" -- at least at the outset... breaking the "I'm a Chowabunga pilot, you're a Free Luna State pilot" mentality is annoying ... then again if you have more vets than rookies, you might not run into this so much)
It all depends. Are you trying to unite around identity, or are you trying to unite around purpose? Identity strongly requires the breaking of the "us vs them" issues of "I'm a x-corpie, you're a y-corpie". If you're uniting around some purpose, I wouldn't expect that to matter as much. I could always be wrong though.
I also wonder if a lot of the "alliance stuff" has more to do with the larger alliances which have some (rather masochistic IMHO) desires to hold sov in null sec. Had a character which was part of a small research alliance to try to handle the lack of ME research slots in high sec. It worked out rather well, without a lot of the "anything-but-casual" drama you normally hear about.
Quote:
+2 for seeing something other than QQ about the new POCO.
Agreed. |
Alberio
Lone Star Exploration
Lone Star Partners
22
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 16:06:00 -
[13] - Quote
OP: Love the idea, you should do it. The idea of becoming a POCO slum lord was something I thought about as well, but unfortunately I'm not really in a position to do it myself. I think it's awesome if you're thinking of stepping up and filling the void.
Make it happen, dude. |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 16:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:+1 for the OP's plan.
-2 for the idea that it'll be "casual". (sorry guys, alliance stuff is far from "casual" -- at least at the outset... breaking the "I'm a Chowabunga pilot, you're a Free Luna State pilot" mentality is annoying ... then again if you have more vets than rookies, you might not run into this so much)
+2 for seeing something other than QQ about the new POCO.
To address the whole "casual-ness" of the idea, I feel as though my word choice may have been a little off.
The alliance would work toward the following:
-Setting up POCOs and agreeing on a uniform tax rate.
-Utilizing alliance planets that have POCOs set up.
-Defending POCOs when attacked.
Beyond that, I feel as though there really isn't a need to form an identity, rather it's all about purpose as one post put it.
2-4 corporations can exist in a system or two, PI together, not shoot each other, and form up gangs when the need arises. Any other cooperation (research POS, etc) would be icing on the cake.
If a POCO gets popped, the corp that lost it puts it back up, with the small taxes helping to defray the costs.
In a WH is works out much better I believe, as alliance pilots can run anomalies and other sites when the going gets bored.
In fact, I just may have a nice C3 ready to go.... ;)
***I am going to set up a channel perhaps today or tomorrow for all of us to get together to chat about this. I will post it here when I do. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
141
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 16:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
I suppose I was a bit blunt too...
I've been in the big alliances ... I've also been in smaller "just getting off the ground" ones (not necessarily all on this toon).
In my experience, the "getting off the ground" ones usually have good plans ... and form behind a common goal, but utterly fail in making people feel like part of a bigger group. The same thing goes for many of the hi-sec corps that I've been in.
Essentially what happens is that the players will either:
1. go off and do their own thing. E.G. mission run or mine or whatever. The miners never wanna fly with the missioners, or vice versa.
2. stick to their corporations. Kind of like (1), but in this instance, you could have corp A mining in system W, and corp B mining next door, rather than everyone working together and killing one of the systems (or both, depending  ).
Don't get me wrong, purpose is great, it's a great thing to get things moving... but at the end of the day, no one should be thinking "well, I'm x-corp, and you're Te'rava, and he's Chowabunga, and she's Open Designs, and they're Luna State" ... we should all be thinking "we are $ALLIANCE"
|
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 19:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:I suppose I was a bit blunt too...
Don't get me wrong, purpose is great, it's a great thing to get things moving... but at the end of the day, no one should be thinking "well, I'm x-corp, and you're Te'rava, and he's Chowabunga, and she's Open Designs, and they're Luna State" ... we should all be thinking "we are $ALLIANCE"
ed... sent mail...
Velicitia, I hear you, I have been part of many, many start-ups in my many years playing EVE, and more often than not they fizzle out once the honeymoon period is over.
What I think is great about a PI alliance is that you can still retain your corp's identity. Miners can mine, ratters can rat, Ship spinners can google "wayne gretsky daughter pics" while still flying under the same alliance since at its root all the alliance is for is shared use of POCOs. PI'ing is still an inidividual player's game, so as long as everyone is getting the same small tax rate and hopping in gangs, everyone wins. If I am in the WH and people are running anoms while I grab my P4s, awesome. If some baddies are spotted on directional scan and the call goes out in alliance chat, even better.
I have a dream, where all corps would have their own POS in a wh, a dream where the planets were split up evenly for POCO building, a dream where I can see my daughter, the daughter of a Minmatar slave, be the first in her family to get through Pator Tech School because her father doesn't have to pay 17% of his earnings to Interbus. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
143
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 19:14:00 -
[17] - Quote
You're assuming ofc that the people who're mining or missioning or watching **** whilst ship spinning will heed the CTA (some may, though I think you'll be disappoint at the ratio).
It sounds great on paper, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't try it ... but you'll need something "more" than the POCO to hold people together... |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 19:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:You're assuming ofc that the people who're mining or missioning or watching **** whilst ship spinning will heed the CTA (some may, though I think you'll be disappoint at the ratio).
It sounds great on paper, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't try it ... but you'll need something "more" than the POCO to hold people together...
But that's the point. You DON'T have to hold anyone together. If you are part of a corp in the alliance, you get cheap PI. We are not claiming sov, we are not fighting off other alliances...perhaps a good way to think of it is a hippie commune. If Sunshine and Sparkle don't grow their stuff, no one gets high at the drum cirlce. If they keep forgetting, you send them on their way, acoustic guitars in hand.
If a CTA goes out and no one shows up, no one gets cheap PI and you are back to square one or corps start giving the boot to those who wouldn't fight. I suppose the important thing is to get people in your corp who will show up and fight when needed.
I suppose that is why I am leaning more and more toward a WH. The incursions will be far less, there is stuff to do between resetting extractors, and POSs offer good defense against gangs in a worse case scenario. My initial thought is that WORST CASE you lose a few POCOs in your hole, but then again, if the reinforce timer is set up in your favor, the baddies would have to either stay in the WH or somehow find their way back. |
Arana Mirelin
Te'Rava Industries
14
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 19:47:00 -
[19] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:
But that's the point. You DON'T have to hold anyone together. If you are part of a corp in the alliance, you get cheap PI. We are not claiming sov, we are not fighting off other alliances...perhaps a good way to think of it is a hippie commune. If Sunshine and Sparkle don't grow their stuff, no one gets high at the drum cirlce. If they keep forgetting, you send them on their way, acoustic guitars in hand.
If a CTA goes out and no one shows up, no one gets cheap PI and you are back to square one or corps start giving the boot to those who wouldn't fight. I suppose the important thing is to get people in your corp who will show up and fight when needed.
I suppose that is why I am leaning more and more toward a WH. The incursions will be far less, there is stuff to do between resetting extractors, and POSs offer good defense against gangs in a worse case scenario. My initial thought is that WORST CASE you lose a few POCOs in your hole, but then again, if the reinforce timer is set up in your favor, the baddies would have to either stay in the WH or somehow find their way back.
If you do, then I'll be out. Not that I want you to decide based on me, just my other char is already in a WH corp, and don't want any conflicts of interest. In general, it's probably not such a bad idea. You may want to consider a C2 wormhole though, since after a while, you run out of anomalies / etc to run in your home system. (We seem to get < 5 / week now.) C2, you can have the high sec static to make it easy to get goods out, and a WH static so you have different systems to run anoms in if you want. Might have some trouble finding an empty one though.
I'd say you're probably right on the likelihood of losing POCOs in wormholes, unless you manage to really **** someone off. Staying around through a >24 hour reinf cycle, requiring that I scan a new way out when done is not something I'm likely to do just for fun. Some WH dwellers out there may do it, (there are a few guys who live out of a can and like to SB harass WH residents) but I doubt it will be as much of a passing thing as lowsec is, where it's easy to go home and come back the next day. |
Rykuss
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
9
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 20:16:00 -
[20] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:Nihlathak, you contacted me in game, but your CPSA charge is 100k, so be a gent and take it off... I mean, I could export 43 units of oxidized compound for that kind of scroll!
I wouldn't trust him after what he did to poor Anya. Conspiring with Baal might also paint him in a negative light. 
Can I have your vindicator? |
Velicitia
Open Designs
145
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 20:17:00 -
[21] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:Velicitia wrote:You're assuming ofc that the people who're mining or missioning or watching **** whilst ship spinning will heed the CTA (some may, though I think you'll be disappoint at the ratio).
It sounds great on paper, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't try it ... but you'll need something "more" than the POCO to hold people together... But that's the point. You DON'T have to hold anyone together. If you are part of a corp in the alliance, you get cheap PI. We are not claiming sov, we are not fighting off other alliances...perhaps a good way to think of it is a hippie commune. If Sunshine and Sparkle don't grow their stuff, no one gets high at the drum cirlce. If they keep forgetting, you send them on their way, acoustic guitars in hand.
Actually, you really do. You need something that makes the "elite Pee Vee Pee" types want to work with the "lol, yeah right, risk 100m isk in combat?" types. Otherwise, what you have is 1 billion ISK down the drain for whoever set up the alliance, and an additional 2 million ISK per corp per month fee that you have to deal with.
seems a bit much if you don't intend to coalesce from "corp-a, ... , corp-n" into "PI Alliance". You'd be better off by just setting standings and working together that way ...
Bruno Chowson wrote:
If a CTA goes out and no one shows up, no one gets cheap PI and you are back to square one or corps start giving the boot to those who wouldn't fight. I suppose the important thing is to get people in your corp who will show up and fight when needed.
Look, I like cheap PI and all ... but if I'm just there as a pilot from Open Designs, the question is "do I care enough about the PI to risk 2-300m in ships in there's a CTA?". Depending on the day, that might be pretty easy to say "no" to.
Now, if there's a real feeling of camaraderie, the question becomes "what to do with these assholes who showed up today?". The answer to that question will nearly always be "X" quickly followed with "where are we forming up?".
|
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.01 21:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Velicitia wrote:
Now, if there's a real feeling of camaraderie, the question becomes "what to do with these assholes who showed up today?". The answer to that question will nearly always be "X" quickly followed with "where are we forming up?".
That just brings us back to my point: I am not going to keep a guy in my corp that doesn't have this feeling of comraderie. If our corp's POCO is attacked, and there are 4-5 pilots in system that say "ah, screw it, I am not risking my ship" then they get the boot. |
Baraka Saibot
Wobbling Frog Inc
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 03:53:00 -
[23] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:Velicitia wrote:
Now, if there's a real feeling of camaraderie, the question becomes "what to do with these assholes who showed up today?". The answer to that question will nearly always be "X" quickly followed with "where are we forming up?".
That just brings us back to my point: I am not going to keep a guy in my corp that doesn't have this feeling of comraderie. If our corp's POCO is attacked, and there are 4-5 pilots in system that say "ah, screw it, I am not risking my ship" then they get the boot.
So... Reinforcing one of your POCO's is guarantee for a fight?
|
pmchem
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
131
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 05:45:00 -
[24] - Quote
hey yall I just wanted to say this sort of thing is pretty cool, new corps/alliances or partnerships between industrialists and pirates because of POCOs. It's the exactly correct, profit-making response for lowsec gameplay with respect to the change in PI taxes.
Make friends, own your turf. |
wildfire2555
The Free Luna State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 11:10:00 -
[25] - Quote
I like the idea of a worm hole but my guys couldnt handle a c3, I have a grouping of 8 systems in low sec, one way in, one way out. There are plasma planets and the like. I will not be able to log in until Sunday night but I check my mail on eve gate regularly, lemme know how things are shaping up please. I have a total of 8 characters relocating to this low sec home with a few high sec islands near by. There are stations and free moons for control towers as well. All systems are .2 and .1 sec status. |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 15:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
Update!
After some VERY serious discussions, like, discussing which Beiber haircut you like best serious, plans have begun to make real this whole PI Alliance idea.
Here are some basics, and if you are interested in taking part, please drop me a line as I know I have spoken with some of you, but not all of you (I got a lot of messages).
*Alliance based in a wormhole. C3 w/low-sec or high-sec static
*Planets split evenly among the corps involved.
*Nominal tax rate <5% to help pay for POS fuel costs and CEO's all-you-can-eat nacho cheese fountain station (6 kinds of cheese!)
*Other rules such as POCO defense, rights to anomalies, what do to if someone goes rogue, etc. still are being hashed out.
*With only 1 system, corp size is a factor so there MAY be limitations as not to over-mine. |
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
Une Pour Tous
14
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 15:47:00 -
[27] - Quote
I think 5% taxes is too much.
I may buy a lot of P1 if you sell some, but first the price of P4 at trade hubs needs to raise more. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
149
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 16:17:00 -
[28] - Quote
Bruno Chowson wrote:Velicitia wrote:
Now, if there's a real feeling of camaraderie, the question becomes "what to do with these assholes who showed up today?". The answer to that question will nearly always be "X" quickly followed with "where are we forming up?".
That just brings us back to my point: I am not going to keep a guy in my corp that doesn't have this feeling of comraderie. If our corp's POCO is attacked, and there are 4-5 pilots in system that say "ah, screw it, I am not risking my ship" then they get the boot.
I'm talking at the alliance level here, rather than corp level (suppose I wasn't clear enough in that regard).
Sure, there *might* be more of a pull to defend a PCO (hey, I might have stuff in it) ... but if it's not my corp's, and I don't have anything on that planet ... the question becomes "ok, this is the third time this week that Bruno_Corp has been getting their PCOs shot at... and I had planned on doing stuff with Vel_Corp tonight..."
Let's say I'm not a CEO/director of Vel_Corp ... so yeah, you could ask my CEO/directors kick me from the corp because I didn't want to deal with your third PCO getting RF'd this week ... but if I'm useful to them, they might be opposed to it. You could threaten kicking the corp from the alliance (which would probably be "bad" overall)
That's where the "I'm a pilot of Vel_Corp ... why should I waste time/effort to defend Bruno_Corp's stuff that I don't get benefit from?" trouble can occur, and the bonds of camaraderie to the alliance will matter. Obviously, the directors (and/or CEO) of the corp I'm in will have some choice words for me if I start slipping too much ...
|
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 16:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
Esunisen wrote:I think 5% taxes is too much.
I may buy a lot of P1 if you sell some, but first the price of P4 at trade hubs needs to raise more.
<5% means LESS than 5%. |
Alberio
Lone Star Exploration
Lone Star Partners
23
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 17:39:00 -
[30] - Quote
I think it's odd that you're doing this in a WH, rather than in Lowsec (or Null):
1) PI in Wormholes, while you get the benefit of fairly large systems with good resources, is limited to one system. Unless you can get good at holding multiple WH systems while splitting your main alliance, it seems counter-intuitive to me. Just make a generic WH Alliance, and go to town doing "Wormhole stuff", rather than basing it around a "POCO Slumlord" model.
2) Taking over systems in Known Space allows you the ability to expand as your alliance grows. IF the model is "take advantage of POCO tax rates and be the slum lords of EVE", then real estate is your key asset. Take over system 1. Jump to the next system. Rinse/Repeat. This would allow you to manage the growth/expansion of your Alliance/POCO infrastructure with your ability to defend it, and I imagine you would see growth in returns. Make money off of the aggregate, rather than in large chunks all at once.
3) Logistics into and out of WH (human resources, equipment, supplies) is a tough undertaking. Finding a lowsec static might make this much easier, but it can still be rough. Get podded in a WH, and you may have lost your system. Get podded in Lowsec, and you can fly right back and pick up where you left off (usually to get podded again). Retaking a lowsec is MUCH easier than trying to retake a WH system.
As stated above: WH space doesn't really allow you to expand. Statics change daily. Or More often. Don't get me wrong: jumping into a WH is a *great* idea for an alliance, but I feel that it's deviating from the original intent of your original proposal. Not that it's wrong: ideas change and evolve and maybe a lowsec POCO slumlord isn't the best for you.
Anyway: the idea is more charming to me as a lowsec alliance trying to take over real estate and entice people into fights. I'm not trying to dissuade you from WH space at all: please come on in. However, for a strictly POCO-based alliance, it might not be the best idea. If it was me putting it together, I might try something like the following:
1) Lowsec POCO alliance. Longterm goal: cover the universe in our POCOs. Lots of POCOs. Low Taxes.
2) Recruit at least 1 FW corp. Perhaps base the POCOs around FW systems.
3) Recruit at least 1 Pirate corp.
4) Start with 1 system. Your goal is to take it over and keep it. Expand from there.
5) Keep tax rates for everyone (even reds) <15%. I might go under 10%. It's critical people would rather use your POCOs than Interbus ones. You want to strike a balance in tax rates where it's more cost effective for tenants to put up with the taxes than try and blow up a POCO and replace it with their own.
6) ???
7) Profit!
All of that said, I've never tried to put together an alliance, much less attempt one with an idea like this. To be fair: I'm not sure anybody has done it (yet). SO...who knows? I think that makes it interesting. You may loose billions of ISK, but at least you'll have done something - and that's what the game is about. |
Bruno Chowson
Chowabunga Inc.
8
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 22:23:00 -
[31] - Quote
Alberio wrote:I think it's odd that you're doing this in a WH, rather than in Lowsec (or Null):
All of that said, I've never tried to put together an alliance, much less attempt one with an idea like this. To be fair: I'm not sure anybody has done it (yet). SO...who knows? I think that makes it interesting. You may loose billions of ISK, but at least you'll have done something - and that's what the game is about.
This is a great point, I am definitely going to give it some thought.
That being said, I am not sure that PI'ing and bringing attention to oneself go hand in hand. The relative safety of the WH, in my humble opinion, out-weights the need to expand at this point. As the alliance grows, and space becomes an issue, obviously being limited to one system is not the best thing in the world.
Also, if you go around POCOing (did I just invent a verb?) neighboring systems, you will CONSTANTLY have pirates in the area as they will catch the scent of fresh meat in the form of PI bears hauling back and forth. |
Borun Tal
One More Corp
13
|
Posted - 2011.12.02 22:53:00 -
[32] - Quote
Bruno, mail headed your way... |
Claire Raynor
NovaGear
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:34:00 -
[33] - Quote
Esunisen wrote:Griefers in lowsec gonna blow all your POCOs, and big nullsec Alliances gonna lock their POCOs.
ALL PI just got pawned, better get used to it.
This IS what's happening. I'd love to see the stats - but is the increased cost of PI produce due to the tax rates going balistic OR the fact lots of people simply aren't doing it anymore and supply is drying up? Who's gonna pay for a a POCO that's just gonna get griefed dead before you ever even get close to breaking even on that expenditure? I'm just never going to take that risk. Remember - you are going to have to keep your POCO alive for 5 months to get your investment back.
I love the new patch BTW - the graphics are ace and I love the new Warp effects. |
Cavilha
Tupy Industries
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.07 21:18:00 -
[34] - Quote
I'm thinking of something like the idea of you. It May be an option
complementary.
Look at the forum That you posted.
[url = https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=476188 & # post476188] My forum post [/ url]
[quote]
Hi
I live in Wh with the static to high sec. I would like the opinion of you
about how much to charge for permission to use the system's planets.
I was thinking about 30 million per month + 5% rate per character.
Only access to the planets.
Contract will be Delivered via the BMs of the input and output
system via the contract at the station nearest the entrance.
Anchor POS, PVE and mining Can be traded separately.
What do you think?
[/ quote] |
Wolodymyr
Mando'a Navy
Controlled Chaos
11
|
Posted - 2011.12.07 21:37:00 -
[35] - Quote
So let me get this straight......
A bunch of highsec carebears are going to move into lowsec and live there.
YES!!! Where do you guys live!
Bruno Chowson wrote:PVP guys hunt down gangs in/around the area. It's a win/win as your planet monkies get their low taxes and real pilots get their fights.
I just realized something. The people who want to do only PI probably have no combat skills. It takes combat skills to take and hold a lowsec PI office.
I have a better idea. Why don't I just fly into lowsec, blow up all the PI offices I see, set up my own with slightly lower taxes than empire to encourage people to use my offices rather than Concord's, and live off the taxes. |
massajido
Banda del Norte
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 09:15:00 -
[36] - Quote
Wolodymyr wrote:
The people who want to do only PI probably have no combat skills.
Yeah...because after I spent those two months or so with my P.I. skills I just stopped training anything else. PI is a side gig to bring in a little isk every few days.
Great idea, not sure about using WH space, but I do hope that it does come together.
|
Velicitia
Open Designs
175
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 11:13:00 -
[37] - Quote
massajido wrote:Wolodymyr wrote:
The people who want to do only PI probably have no combat skills.
Yeah...because after I spent those two months or so with my P.I. skills I just stopped training anything else. PI is a side gig to bring in a little isk every few days. Great idea, not sure about using WH space, but I do hope that it does come together.
I think the implications is that "pro PI" guys probably went from PI to mining/industry, and have some complex that makes them completely afraid of risking even a frigate in combat (i.e. they're hisec carebears through and through). |
massajido
Banda del Norte
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 18:10:00 -
[38] - Quote
I understand what was implied about PI players, but it's a rep that needs to be broken for a PI alliance to succeed. Otherwise people would think they could just come by and pop a POCO without fear. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
176
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 18:32:00 -
[39] - Quote
massajido wrote:I understand what was implied about PI players, but it's a rep that needs to be broken for a PI alliance to succeed. Otherwise people would think they could just come by and pop a POCO without fear.
or you let the people *think* they can just come and pop the PCO without fear ... and OMGWTFBBQ them  |
Wolodymyr
Mando'a Navy
Controlled Chaos
12
|
Posted - 2011.12.08 20:54:00 -
[40] - Quote
massajido wrote:I understand what was implied about PI players, but it's a rep that needs to be broken for a PI alliance to succeed. Otherwise people would think they could just come by and pop a POCO without fear.
Well the only way to see if industrialists are any good at combat is to start shooting at them..... which is what i was planning on doing anyway. |
bilingi
Ghosts of the Storm
11
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 09:48:00 -
[41] - Quote
which is the only reason PI was changed,Because the so called PVpers are scared to shoot at each other, if they arent out numbering the other group 10 to 1. |
Ubarro
Special Retrieval Service
1
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 00:38:00 -
[42] - Quote
This is an awesome idea. I would also prefer Lowsec to begin with.
I'll get in touch in game!
Ubarro |
Father Touchee
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 02:09:00 -
[43] - Quote
You're approaching this from the wrong angle.
Everyone operating in space outside highsec is absolutely reliant on having a pvp backbone or the funds to call down good mercs on request. I don't know your projected tax income, but I doubt that it would be sufficient enough to pay off enough pirates or bored nullsec roaming folk to keep your operation profitable in the long run.
What you want to do is guise your operation as a collection of roaming pvp corps. Set them up with a few fc's, keep them busy shooting the local pirates/fw types in your lowsec pipe and then have your PI alts in another member corp reap the protection provided. If anyone gets wind that your alliance is first and foremost about carebearing, you will be an immediate target. |
Jarimus
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 03:24:00 -
[44] - Quote
Hey guys I did not know there are PI corps!  Anyway I got into PI when it came out and had no idea what I was doing so I failed at it, and now I know there are some corps I was wondering who would like to add on to their workforce? |
Cloora
APEX Unlimited
APEX Conglomerate
44
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:49:00 -
[45] - Quote
Any of you carebears that want access to POCOs please contact me. We have a healthy group of carebears and a very competant group of PvPers. Check BC for proof of that. We have already put up POCOs and are going to put up more.
Pirates have Reinforced one of our more profitable POCOs three times now when we are not online. (we are mostly US and NZ and Japan heavy in our TZ) and they never show when it comes out of RF. However we did manage to kill a couple BSes that came to try and shoot at the same PoCO. We love PvP and love the fact POCOs bring PVP opportunities.
We use dreads to take em down and carriers to rep em up.
We could always use more people to help and pay for more PoCOs.
Let me know
CEO and Major ShareholderAPEX ConglomerateMaker of Starsi softdrinks and Torped-Os! Cereal
http://www.altaholics.blogspot.com
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Milonia
APEX Unlimited
APEX Conglomerate
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.12 22:47:00 -
[46] - Quote
Becasue of this post we have already got another corp of PI enthusiests that has joined. We can always use mroe people that can offer some help with protection for the benefit of low tax. |
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