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dethnel
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Posted - 2003.10.24 00:43:00 -
[31]
at least i think the goods do flow a little in the 'outward' direction in the form of battleships/indis/miner2's which go to mine in 0.0 space and then get destroyed by pirates,npc's,warring corps-- THEN they need replacement from supplies in the the core.
the finished goods that go back out are in the form of replacement ships. true, it would be better if there was something more than this- i believe that player built stations out in 0.0 will create a large demand for supplies to be sent out from the core so the sooner those appear the better.
also imho mega corps already have suply lines extablished for getting minerals, or they just buy them off the market from middlemen. so removing stations from the fringe shouldn't have any effect on them. it would greatly effect the middlemen tho.
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Noriko Sakai
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Posted - 2003.10.24 00:48:00 -
[32]
the problem is that the Megacorp out inthe fringe doesn't need a supply chain, all they need is factory slot close by and some BPs and they can rebuild resupply and be an mini empire in itself.
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Luther Pendragon
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Posted - 2003.10.24 05:50:00 -
[33]
Why do you say that? They come back to empire space to sell.
____________________________________
Taggart wants YOU. Join TTi!
*waves his hand in your face in the jedi way* |
Fred0
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Posted - 2003.10.24 07:37:00 -
[34]
I gotta agree with luther. Stupidest thing would be to throw out the need to go into unregulated space to make more bucks in a more dangerous environment.
Quit the RL analogies because they don't apply just think about what kind of game you want this to be.
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Fred0
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Posted - 2003.10.24 07:38:00 -
[35]
 Quote:
the problem is that the Megacorp out inthe fringe doesn't need a supply chain, all they need is factory slot close by and some BPs and they can rebuild resupply and be an mini empire in itself.
And tell me. Isn't that the coolest thing and something that makes this game worth playing?
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Deneba Zaavi
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Posted - 2003.10.24 09:07:00 -
[36]
Hi.
The whole "components" system, built by players with sufficient skills, you are suggesting is basically how Earth and Beyond building system worked. In fact it was one of the few good things in the game.
Reverse engineering was already present in this game, and it was tied to your building skills. YOu could also destry a modules reverse engineering it if your skills were too low.
In fact there was very skilled players who were manufacturing high quality items, via high skills and good quality basic items. These player were very sought after and they were making gobbles of cash.
Still, you were able to buy "150% quality items" instead of 200% ones at a good price, and these were far superior to the normal 100% quality ones available from NPC.
Applying this system, or part of it, to the EVE building/marjet opening other areas of gameplay.
Good ideas
Deneba Zaavi
"The world is perfect as it is: a complete mess" - Joseph Campbell |
Lake
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Posted - 2003.10.24 09:09:00 -
[37]
You keep suggesting methods for driving more business back into the core systems, empire space. Has it occurred to you that perhaps CCP does not want that to happen? I seem to recall from all relevant documentation of EVE (from the early pre-alpha FAQs to all dev chats and CSMs) that the 'real money' is to be made on the fringes, outside of the protection of empire space where the risk is the greatest.
Your remaining complaint seems to be that there is no way for you personally to take advantage of the profits available in the fringe systems. I believe you're quite simply wrong on that count. You could join one of many alliances, or if that doesn't suit you, go to the JK-FIX region which is protected by the CFS which allows completely unfettered trade by all non-hostile corps.
In summary: While I don't believe the economics of EVE are perfect, having my own gripes and suggestions for improvement, I think your particular complaints are not in keeping with the intended design of EVE.
~Lake
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Jake Solnich
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Posted - 2003.10.24 09:30:00 -
[38]
No need to make this issue complicated by discussing economics 101 in a full blown discussion.
The problem here is that the current game mechanics for the Eve economy are flawed! Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Eve economy is broken, but it sure is close to it.
I don't know what the exact answer is but a good start would be by fixing the asteroid balance bug that has been plaguing the Eve universe for months now. This alone would make a big difference in the Eve economy
I would rather die a free man than live as a slave. |
Anacrit Mc'Sinister
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Posted - 2007.09.12 20:07:00 -
[39]
ok, to answer some of the earlier things - the comparison to the 3rd world (and i mean the poor countries and not the once with unfavorable governments) is bad - they are poor becouse they have no natural resourses. So thats not really a good comparison... early colonisation of gold rich south america makes more sense.
and as far as the economy goes - the problem is that all high end resourses are available throughout 0.0 and low end tritanium is awalable eveywhere.
*Take low end products out of anywhere with security below 0.5. those empire miners will increes their income tremendosly , while not becoming rich easily, or in a particularly interesting way. large alliances spending their money in the empire.
* the high end materials are a bit trickier. make some regions exlusive in some resources ( like "in real space empire") other regions in others,
*separate those resources well, so that you can not control all of them at once.
*make all of them vital for the alliance function, for example you ll need a mixture of 4- 5 materials to power up capital ships.
* make them important for certain empire produce too so that money flows back to the alliances.
= they will have to trade in empire to exchange the materials that they have into those they dont.
that is my solution to eve!
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DubanFP
Caldari
Four Rings
D-L
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Posted - 2007.09.12 20:09:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Anacrit Mc'Sinister
ok, to answer some of the earlier things - the comparison to the 3rd world (and i mean the poor countries and not the once with unfavorable governments) is bad - they are poor becouse they have no natural resourses. So thats not really a good comparison... early colonisation of gold rich south america makes more sense.
and as far as the economy goes - the problem is that all high end resourses are available throughout 0.0 and low end tritanium is awalable eveywhere.
*Take low end products out of anywhere with security below 0.5. those empire miners will increes their income tremendosly , while not becoming rich easily, or in a particularly interesting way. large alliances spending their money in the empire.
* the high end materials are a bit trickier. make some regions exlusive in some resources ( like "in real space empire") other regions in others,
*separate those resources well, so that you can not control all of them at once.
*make all of them vital for the alliance function, for example you ll need a mixture of 4- 5 materials to power up capital ships.
* make them important for certain empire produce too so that money flows back to the alliances.
= they will have to trade in empire to exchange the materials that they have into those they dont.
that is my solution to eve!
You just necroed a thread that is over 4 years old...
___________
Desolacer> Who the heck gives YOU the right to ruin it for others buy blowing them up.
Zaqar> CCP |
Thanos Draicon
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Posted - 2007.09.12 20:15:00 -
[41]
Necro bad. 
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Kwint Sommer
Incoherent Inc
Otaku Invasion
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Posted - 2007.09.12 20:21:00 -
[42]
Sounds good except Alliances should still be able to produce the super factories on the fringes, just at insane costs in minerals, ISK (we need more sinks) and time to construct. They should be so costly -and accordingly valuable- that they will be the focus of 0.0 wars.
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Lanu
Caldari
The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2007.09.12 20:42:00 -
[43]
Necro = bad M'kay
__________________
I'm not obsessing. I'm just curious. |
Anacrit Mc'Sinister
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Posted - 2007.09.24 13:42:00 -
[44]
ah well, it old so thats ok, eve economy is perfectly fine now, no problem ther at all
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Stakhanov
Katana's Edge
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Posted - 2007.09.24 13:51:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Stakhanov on 24/09/2007 13:51:10
Funny necro , I had an irrepressible urge to call the OP a noob before I saw the date.
Originally by: F'nog
One does not simply log into Jita.
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Sleepkevert
Paradox v2.0
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.09.24 14:00:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
1: Remove all factory and Labs functions from stations in the fringe sector but make sure some of the basic items (low lvl ammo, basic ship system and low lvl weapons) are always available in stations with market access, In fact, remove all factory from system with under a certain sec rating. This will force the all major manufacturing back into the core sector and provide a healthy export trade back towards the fringe and it will also take care of the mini empire problem.
Wait wut? Make Jita even larger?
I know it sounds good, great even, but real life != internet spaceships and vice versa. Doing this is forcing a lot of people to move back to (already crouded) high sec systems. And make the lag even worse in major trade hubs... Ever been to Jita in the weekend? It's bad enough as it is...
Sign my sig |
Valrandir
Gallente
Slacker Industries
Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.09.24 14:11:00 -
[47]
FU***NG TROLL
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This has surpassed the Yarrdware specification and has been dubbed Uberware
- Oveur
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cal nereus
Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion
Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.09.24 22:17:00 -
[48]
Edited by: cal nereus on 24/09/2007 22:17:36
Necro... dammit. 
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Join BH-DL |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar
Republic University
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Posted - 2007.09.24 22:25:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Stakhanov
Edited by: Stakhanov on 24/09/2007 13:51:10
Funny necro , I had an irrepressible urge to call the OP a noob before I saw the date.
Same here. 
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Dietric Kalarn
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Posted - 2007.09.24 22:44:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Dietric Kalarn on 24/09/2007 22:45:48
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
stuff
Originally by: Marianna
Awesome suggestion!
Originally by: babyblue
I agree - excellent idea.
same person, painfully obvious
just so you all know... alts ruled to forums 4 years ago too
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Paulo Damarr
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Posted - 2007.09.24 22:57:00 -
[51]
The reason the markets suck in 0.0 is because of the gank everything on sight culture, and I'm not referring to "piracy" either. If the alliances allowed neutral tradesman through instead of just killing everything the state of the markets would improve because undoubtedly some plucky entrepreneurs would take the chance of moving goods out there in view of the profits that can be made and then their only concern is getting past the pirates.
EVE is a sandbox and the game is what we make it just dont complain that it stinks when you treat it like a cat litter tray.
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Jevnikar
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Posted - 2007.09.25 11:36:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
1: Remove all factory and Labs functions from stations in the fringe sector but make sure some of the basic items (low lvl ammo, basic ship system and low lvl weapons) are always available in stations with market access, In fact, remove all factory from system with under a certain sec rating. This will force the all major manufacturing back into the core sector and provide a healthy export trade back towards the fringe and it will also take care of the mini empire problem.
So you actualy like Jita... prhaps you should open map and see where mayority hangs out and then make a proposal. Anothere thing m8, dunno where ya live but how would you feal if you`r nearest park got replaced by a nice nuclear factory so you had enough power to run all the industry in 1 place ? that`d be awsome in your eyes eh!!! Having entire car made from scratch in two square kilometers.
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heheheh
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.09.25 12:42:00 -
[53]
Quote:
You have mis-identified the problem, thus, your solution is mis-guided as well.
/sign
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Jaikar Isillia
Blue Labs
Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.09.25 13:10:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
Originally by: Stakhanov
Edited by: Stakhanov on 24/09/2007 13:51:10
Funny necro , I had an irrepressible urge to call the OP a noob before I saw the date.
Same here.
lol /raises hand
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Laboratus
Gallente
BGG
League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.09.25 13:52:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
Economy in EVE is foundamentally flawed.
In the "Real Space Empre". Income would be a two-way traffic. Raw material would come in from the fringe and finished goods/advanced product will go back out to support the smaller outposts and mining colonies.
This essentially is like this at the moment.
Raw materials, such as Ice products, moon minerals, reaction materials, advanced materials, high end minerals, high end exploration materials etc etc etc. are coming "from the fringes to empire" where it is more profitable to gather low end materials, that are gathered in mass volume, minimal risk....
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
In EVE, Since everthing is based on mineral and manufacturing can happen on any station with a factory. There is no 2 way traffic. With the Megacorps and Alliances controlling the fringe sectors, there is no way for any corporation operating in the core sector to compete. This flys against every notion of a "real space empire" where the core sector is rich and the fringe sector are tough to make a living on.
You can run a high volume low end mineral operation, set up high sell orders to 0.0 portals, and low buy orders of high end minerals. If you have sufficient volumes that 0.0 dwellers don't have to bother to go to jita (saving hours of freighter travel) you can get your high ends cheap, and get better isk for your low ends than in jita.
Certain things (such as T2 production) are done in empire only, because of better security. Add into that the impossibility of transporting large volumes of large items to deep no-sec, it becomes more profitable to haul the low end materials to the fringe, than the actual ships. In general you can compete by selling products that are not native to the region you live in, and buying native products there...
A word on empires. An empire is an organisation that lives, or leaches off the other organisations in it's sphere of infulence.
Originally by: Noriko Sakai
...
From a roleplaying perspective.
With the introduction of pod pilots and cybernetic learning systems, many pod pilots have the scientific and engineering skills , and also know how to manage and design such factories, production systems and know how to finance them. There is no possible explanation why they would not have created such systems on stations they control. If they do not know it, they can aquire the level of understanding available on planet to only a few elite in a matter of days or weeks.
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P.S.
Post with your main.
Mind control and tin hats |
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