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Fix for Ishtars online

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Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 300	Posted - 2015.01.30 05:05:59 - [1] - Quote Anhenka wrote: Pravius wrote: ishtars are a tad op... every 0.0 group uses them for obvious reasons...... limit sentry drones to battlecruiser and above... seems like a good idea. Any suggestions so that Ishtars, VNI's, and ordinary Vexors are not completely and totally **** afterwords? Or are you one of the "gut them into uselessness and let CCP never sort them out." crowd? -1 for a bare sketch of an idea, -1 for not searching to find the other 999 Ishtar threads, -1 for the "make them totally useless" suggestion. And -10 for laziness. -100 for idiocy. Use your brain, child. Ishtars have been overpowered for literally years. Them being balanced, or even gutted into uselessness, would not ruin this game. Eve would, in fact, go on. Try again.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 300	Posted - 2015.01.30 06:14:32 - [2] - Quote Altirius Saldiaro wrote: Pravius wrote: ishtars are a tad op... every 0.0 group uses them for obvious reasons...... limit sentry drones to battlecruiser and above... seems like a good idea. I would rather CCP make ewar hitting a ship affect the drones it has deployed. That way, its not a dumb nerf to one ship, its giving players an in game counter to use. Do not attempt logic, CCP will not take kindly to it.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 300	Posted - 2015.01.30 17:12:20 - [3] - Quote Aiyshimin wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: It's been said before and I still think it's the best option: Reduce Heavy Drone bandwidth to 20 M/bits/s Reduce Offending ships drone bandwidth to 100 Mbits/s Ishtar/VNI can only field 4 sentries then (20% dps nerf) but can still field 5 heavies if they want. Myrm gets a brawling buff so may need a rebalance. Remove Carrier ability to use sentry drones and introduce a new fighter type called "Lancer Fighters". Lancer fighters orbit the carrier very slowly and have Sniper weapons fitted. Would obviously struggle to track anything smaller than a BS but would leave the "Slow Cat" ability intact somewhat. This is the good solution, if we'd somehow reach the conclusion that there is a problem. However, this "Ishtar issue" is nothing more than another installment in the never-ending series of "what the other guy is flying is always OP, CCP hjalp". No. How can you not see how broken Ishtars are? It's been dissected and explained numerous times. You obviously don't PvP...or PvE as it's the go to ship for that as well. I really believe some people simply cannot grasp the concept of balance.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 300	Posted - 2015.01.30 18:47:01 - [4] - Quote Iain Cariaba wrote: Phaade wrote: No. How can you not see how broken Ishtars are? It's been dissected and explained numerous times. You obviously don't PvP...or PvE as it's the go to ship for that as well. I really believe some people simply cannot grasp the concept of balance. There are ships far, far more broken than what you claim the Ishtar to be. Most of them, however, are broken in the other direction. The Drake, for example, was nerfed so badly because of whiners like you that no one uses it anymore. Do us all a favor and post your lossmails so we can see why you're so hurt over the Ishtar. LOL. You are illustrating my point beautifully. The old Drake was utterly overpowered. Why do you think 80% of the BC's in space were Drakes? Why were 3% of the BC's in space Prophecy's before teiricide? Balance man. It's Really, really simple. The drake is not un-useable, it's simply more in line with the others. Heavy missiles were what's broken anyway. HAM drakes are still good, though predictable. And to Aiyshimin the fanboy (or woman, because you behave like a woman), there are literally hundreds of posts explaining exactly why the Ishtar is overpowered. I do not need to regurgitate information. So far I have not heard a single reasonable counter argument. I also have first hand experience. Judging by your killboard you do not. Do not offer your opinion on the matter; it is worthless.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.04 23:58:59 - [5] - Quote Anhenka wrote: Legetus Shmoof Metallii wrote: HACs: Cerberus/Eagle, Ishtar/Deimos, Munnin/Vagabond, Sacrilege/Zealot Battleship Weapons: Cruise Missiles, Torpedoes, Large Railguns/Blasters/Artillery, Cannons/Autocannons/, Pulse Lasers/Beam Lasers, Sentry Drones HACs that cannot use Battleship Weapon Systems: Cerberus/Eagle, Deimos, Munnin/Vagabond, Sacrilege/Zealot HACs that can use Battleship Weapon Systems: Ishtar I see a problem here HAC's that can project damage without Battleship Weapons: Cerberus/Eagle, Deimos, Munnin/Vagabond, Sacrilege/Zealot Hac's that cannot have their primary weapon system be destroyed by the enemy: Cerberus/Eagle, Deimos, Munnin/Vagabond, Sacrilege/Zealot HAC's that can have their weapon system destroyed by an enemy, and only have one size of effective weaponry: Ishtars. I too see a problem here. Lets not just gloss over all the downsides and pretend that removing sentries will somehow make them "balanced" You mean project less damage at less range? Then, can switch weapon sizes on the fly? Or can drop their DPS, and still deal it outside their engagement range, regardless of ewar? Can switch damage types on a whim? Yeah, must be that zealot.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.05 16:36:45 - [6] - Quote Iain Cariaba wrote: Phaade wrote: Iain Cariaba wrote: Phaade wrote: No. How can you not see how broken Ishtars are? It's been dissected and explained numerous times. You obviously don't PvP...or PvE as it's the go to ship for that as well. I really believe some people simply cannot grasp the concept of balance. There are ships far, far more broken than what you claim the Ishtar to be. Most of them, however, are broken in the other direction. The Drake, for example, was nerfed so badly because of whiners like you that no one uses it anymore. Do us all a favor and post your lossmails so we can see why you're so hurt over the Ishtar. LOL. You are illustrating my point beautifully. The old Drake was utterly overpowered. Why do you think 80% of the BC's in space were Drakes? Why were 3% of the BC's in space Prophecy's before teiricide? Balance man. It's Really, really simple. The drake is not un-useable, it's simply more in line with the others. Heavy missiles were what's broken anyway. HAM drakes are still good, though predictable. And to Aiyshimin the fanboy (or woman, because you behave like a woman), there are literally hundreds of posts explaining exactly why the Ishtar is overpowered. I do not need to regurgitate information. So far I have not heard a single reasonable counter argument. I also have first hand experience. Judging by your killboard you do not. Do not offer your opinion on the matter; it is worthless. Oh look, Ishtars are OP!!! There's no counter to be found!!! Enough said. Lol you continue to prove my point. Did you even read the article? A crap load of bombers wiped an Ishtar blob that wasn't moving.... Yes a bad FC can make Ishtars balanced.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.05 17:18:00 - [7] - Quote Nolak Ataru wrote: baltec1 wrote: elitatwo wrote: Nope they don't. There are quite a few battleships that strongly disagree with a sentry nerf. They wouldn't even mind a drone control range increase. Carrier blobs and massed domi fleets would not agree with you. At the very least the sentries need to go from sub battlrships, the ishtar itself requires no nerfs as it is the sentries that break it. I wonder what you'd have to say if CCP were to move to nerf large Railguns, or the Megathron hull..... I wonder what you'd say if CCP decided to allow eagles to fit large hybrid turrets...
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.05 23:29:41 - [8] - Quote Nolak Ataru wrote: It is also possible that you are wrong. However, the difference between me and you is that I don't run to mommy to get them to ban every FOTM until a reasonable amount of time has passed of people trying to find a counter. The counter requires very particular fleet setups and incredible amounts of coordination, planning and execution. The Ishtar's just have to be Ishtar's. This is not balance. Unbelievable how proponents of Ishtars don't see this. Self serving agendas and all that.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.06 16:02:10 - [9] - Quote Nolak Ataru wrote: Today I Learned: Advocating for sensible change instead of constant whining to mommy = angry. If you take sentries from sub-BS ships like Ishtars and Vexors, you'd better be willing to give them a buff to their other types of drones, and you'd better believe that they will swap instantly to those types. Gilas + Hammerheads already do 800+ DPS and can push 100k EHP, imagine if that becomes more mainstream. ....it would be more mainstream if it was more effective. You really think the Gila price tag is what stops Nullsec coalitions from using them? Or any well established group, really.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.06 16:04:28 - [10] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: Nolak Ataru wrote: Today I Learned: Advocating for sensible change instead of constant whining to mommy = angry. If you take sentries from sub-BS ships like Ishtars and Vexors, you'd better be willing to give them a buff to their other types of drones, and you'd better believe that they will swap instantly to those types. Gilas + Hammerheads already do 800+ DPS and can push 100k EHP, imagine if that becomes more mainstream. If the Ishtar is OP and needs a nerf I fully expect the Worm and Gila to get the same treatment. While they might need a slight toning down, sentries are really the problem. People can deal with drones that have to fly at you much better than drones that sit there and wreck you out to 100km+. Yeah, Bouncers are just insane. 100 kilometers of friggin falloff.

Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 306	Posted - 2015.02.07 00:22:23 - [11] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Nolak Ataru wrote: baltec1 wrote: Difference being that rails and the mega are not overpowered. (Holy **** a response!) Define "overpowered" please. I only skimmed the article on the "day of 1000 megathrons", but from what I've heard, the Baltec fleet is the new sub-cap meta for engagements. Your info is a tad out of date, we retired them some time ago. Ishtars do most of the leg work, domi fleet are the hammer and boot fleet is godmode. All of them use sentries because they are hilariously overpowered. This man speaks the truth!
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 307	Posted - 2015.02.07 16:16:10 - [12] - Quote Nolak Ataru wrote: Proliferation =/= overpowered. And CCP introduced a 50 assist drone limit for a reason. Over enough time I would argue the exact opposite. And it has been long enough...
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 308	Posted - 2015.02.08 16:08:04 - [13] - Quote Tiddle Jr wrote: What is the next 'flag' ship, cause i think ishtar's days are over soon. How's that? And no, Eagles do not counter Ishtars... That suggestion is honestly hilarious. Ishtar's do more damage at more range and its selectable. I want what you're smoking..
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 309	Posted - 2015.02.08 17:05:37 - [14] - Quote Asuka Solo wrote: Anhenka wrote: Pravius wrote: ishtars are a tad op... every 0.0 group uses them for obvious reasons...... limit sentry drones to battlecruiser and above... seems like a good idea. Any suggestions so that Ishtars, VNI's, and ordinary Vexors are not completely and totally **** afterwords? Or are you one of the "gut them into uselessness and let CCP never sort them out." crowd? -1 for a bare sketch of an idea, -1 for not searching to find the other 999 Ishtar threads, -1 for the "make them totally useless" suggestion. And -10 for laziness. Capital ships come to mind when reading that obviously emotional retort. Then again, I've sat back with tears in my eyes for the last 5 years while watching CCP gut our beautiful capital and super capital behemoths to nothingness all for the sake of these sh1tty sub caps that "must be worth something" in a cap fight. So I for one would welcome the lazy solution of nerfing Isthars into uselessness... or deleted even. Even if its just for trolling value. I think the game would actually improve if they were removed entirely
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 309	Posted - 2015.02.09 07:06:40 - [15] - Quote For the good of New Eden, this thread needs a bump.
Phaade Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF 311	Posted - 2015.02.09 19:41:14 - [16] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: Rapscallion Jones wrote: Pravius wrote: ishtars are a tad op... every 0.0 group uses them for obvious reasons...... limit sentry drones to battlecruiser and above... seems like a good idea. So instead of Ishtars online it will become Myrmidons online? Yes it would.....as I said earlier. Blob with any ship and it will appear to be OP. Umm... Myrmidon Is half the speed, with twice the Sig, no MWD bloom reduction, t1 resists, less bay, no tracking bonus, no added control range.... Sounds much closer to balance to me.