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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:09:00 - [91] No change on my case yet. I'd hate to have to quit this game out of principle, I enjoy it alot. bah.
Ikarushka A.O.U. Corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:09:00 - [92] Edited by: Ikarushka on 01/10/2006 01:09:56 While something might or might not be in the user agreement it's a choice to subscribe to a game, and bad service might cause someone to change their mind. I understand that petitions can not be answreed right away, but allowing a bit more time to reply for a petition would be nice. I really have nothing to complain about; all of my few petitions were answered timely and I was very much happy with the service. However, it seems rather fair to allow at least 3 days if not a week for a player to reply to their petition. Sure number of open petitions will be a bit higher, but it's not like you have to pay attention to thos petitions... ie they would be closed by an automatic rule as they are now(?)... just in 3 days instead of 1. Or at least have another automatic rule which in 1 day sends another message to the customer saying somethign like "we didn't hear from your an would like to confirm that your issue has been resolved". well, my $.02 at least
Exiled One Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:11:00 - [93] Originally by: stingy CEO No change on my case yet. I'd hate to have to quit this game out of principle, I enjoy it alot. bah. You'd be an idiot then. If you truly love the game, you play it instead of treating it as a product. This seems to apply to a lot of US guys. CCP is not from the US.
Gungankllr Caldari Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:12:00 - [94] I love Eve. Most days I love the guys at CCP too. The only two problems I have, is that Eve is outgrowing the ability of CCP to properly maintain control of it. The userbase has grown massively, and they have added some GM's to help with the petition load. Only problem with this is it isn't enough. CCP needs to take a page out of some of the other MMORPG that are out there, and create a "Player-helper" category in which problems not falling under reimbursement or punitive actions (i.e. somebody swore at me in local) can be handled by a class of volunteer players. The categories of petitions those players are able to act on would have to be carefully controlled by CCP to ensure no cheating or exploiting took place. Next would be to splurge yet again on computer hardware. In this ever increasing in size online world, the battles are getting bigger, and while CCP is adding hardware on a pretty regular basis, it's not enough to keep up with the massive influx of players we have seen join our online world. Yes, of course I know there is a cost versus reward mentality in any business, but if you intend to keep the single shard active, you're going to have to take some big steps in order to keep that a reality. Players are always going to do whatever it takes to win, it's pretty much human nature. If they've got 600 players, they will bring 600 players. The only way to mitigate that is find an incentive for people to run with smaller gangs, or increase the power of the servers to handle the increased load these massive fights will create. Tons of these petitions floating around are due to node deaths or system crashes due to everyone trying to fit 40 pounds of crap into a 4 pound paper sack. Then lighting it on fire. And petitioning when the bag breaks and you lose your crap. Hidden in this signature is a secret message. I like pie.
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:17:00 - [95] Quote: If you truly love the game, you play it instead of treating it as a product. This seems to apply to a lot of US guys. It is a product. I pay alot of real life iskies to play it. I'm not from the US. But I don't have my dad's credit card to pay for it either. tbh I think they have more serious matters to attend to than my petition. It's just so ridiculous the way this unfolded that i can't sit by and go 'jolly good show chaps, jolly good show'.
Exiled One Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:19:00 - [96] Originally by: stingy CEO Quote: If you truly love the game, you play it instead of treating it as a product. This seems to apply to a lot of US guys. It is a product. I pay alot of real life iskies to play it. I'm not from the US. But I don't have my dad's credit card to pay for it either. tbh I think they have more serious matters to attend to than my petition. It's just so ridiculous the way this unfolded that i can't sit by and go 'jolly good show chaps, jolly good show'. 15euro/$ a month is a lot? You tell me you pay less for you internet connection?
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:23:00 - [97] Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 01:24:03 I have three accounts, that makes it more than my internet connection. Go away troll.
Alessar Kaldorei Caldari Astral Wolves	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:33:00 - [98] Originally by: Namarus You don't know very much about Eve's growth do you? Most of Eve's increase in customers has been by word of mouth. It does not take much for that same word of mouth to result in an increase in "churn". Right now the average account life span is just 7 months. That is the turn around time for a petition or two at most. If people have a bad experience in their 7 months, they don't come back and don't tell others about it. If you honestly believe that the customer is not right, you really do not have a clue on how to run a "service" business. Customer satisfaction is what keeps customers paying for the product. There are a number of mmorpgs out there that failed to keep the customers happy. The result? ... they went belly up and closed down. So no matter what the EULA says, companies should aim to keep their customer's happy. Companies should aim to keep their customers happy, if that is what leads the company in the direction the directors or CEO want to take it. For the most part, this involves keeping customers happy. However, keeping the customers happy isn't the only thing a company has to do to be successful. CCP has decided they can afford to lose an x% of the eve population, or slow down their growth, because they can't afford to put the amount of customer support people it would take to keep the petition queue short. This in itself informs an observant cutomer of just how valuable his subscription is. You're a valued customer so long as you have enough patience to wait in the queue for as long as it will take. If you can't wait that long, you're not valuable to them, because they can't offer what you want, or offering what you want isn't economical to them. I'm pretty sure they have people monitoring their growth, and are taking the precautions to keep their company working the way they want it to. They certainly don't need people on the forum to tell them how to run their company. And no, the customer is not always right, nor is he the most precious commodity in the universe. Or more accuratly, not all customers are equally valuable. A customer that doesn't care about customer support, for instance, is more valuable to a company than one that does. This is because that customer pays the same, but has a lower upkeep cost. Similarly, a customer that has ridiculous expectations or that doesn't use the service as intended is less valuable. Customers that exploit the game, for instance, are not valuable at all, despite paying theur sub the same as everyone else. In these cases, the company can even decide to deny the service. That's how worthless these customers can be. Value is completly subjective, always. A valued customer is only as valuable as the company thinks he is, not as valuable as he thinks he is.
Exiled One Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.01 01:34:00 - [99] Edited by: Exiled One on 01/10/2006 01:34:08 Originally by: stingy CEO Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 01:24:03 I have three accounts, that makes it more than my internet connection. Go away troll. Your problem, your decision to have 3 accounts, be unsatisfied with whatever your current status is and still pay.
Lugz	Posted - 2006.10.01 03:01:00 - [100] Originally by: Alessar Kaldorei Originally by: Namarus You don't know very much about Eve's growth do you? Most of Eve's increase in customers has been by word of mouth. It does not take much for that same word of mouth to result in an increase in "churn". Right now the average account life span is just 7 months. That is the turn around time for a petition or two at most. If people have a bad experience in their 7 months, they don't come back and don't tell others about it. If you honestly believe that the customer is not right, you really do not have a clue on how to run a "service" business. Customer satisfaction is what keeps customers paying for the product. There are a number of mmorpgs out there that failed to keep the customers happy. The result? ... they went belly up and closed down. So no matter what the EULA says, companies should aim to keep their customer's happy. Companies should aim to keep their customers happy, if that is what leads the company in the direction the directors or CEO want to take it. For the most part, this involves keeping customers happy. However, keeping the customers happy isn't the only thing a company has to do to be successful. CCP has decided they can afford to lose an x% of the eve population, or slow down their growth, because they can't afford to put the amount of customer support people it would take to keep the petition queue short. This in itself informs an observant cutomer of just how valuable his subscription is. You're a valued customer so long as you have enough patience to wait in the queue for as long as it will take. If you can't wait that long, you're not valuable to them, because they can't offer what you want, or offering what you want isn't economical to them. I'm pretty sure they have people monitoring their growth, and are taking the precautions to keep their company working the way they want it to. They certainly don't need people on the forum to tell them how to run their company. And no, the customer is not always right, nor is he the most precious commodity in the universe. Or more accuratly, not all customers are equally valuable. A customer that doesn't care about customer support, for instance, is more valuable to a company than one that does. This is because that customer pays the same, but has a lower upkeep cost. Similarly, a customer that has ridiculous expectations or that doesn't use the service as intended is less valuable. Customers that exploit the game, for instance, are not valuable at all, despite paying theur sub the same as everyone else. In these cases, the company can even decide to deny the service. That's how worthless these customers can be. Value is completly subjective, always. A valued customer is only as valuable as the company thinks he is, not as valuable as he thinks he is. I think you are missing our point here. There are a few players such as yourself thinking the game is fine. And a lot more with issues. Just look at the number of posts. If there are this many people willing to post about the issues how many more out there are there that don't visit the forums? The fact is this is an epidemic and it should be fixed, I'd hope CCP values this and does something about it.

Quin Tal Expeto Libertas	Posted - 2006.10.01 03:06:00 - [101] Petitions were solved quickly for 1 reason. Small player base. The days of 1 hour petition responces are over. If you remember, Eve at one time has a news posting of 8,000 player limit broken, which was a milestone. Now we are over 30,000. Do the math my friends.
cinderette	Posted - 2006.10.01 03:21:00 - [102] its sucky but what else can u do but wait :/
Exiled One Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.01 03:21:00 - [103] Originally by: Quin Tal Petitions were solved quickly for 1 reason. Small player base. The days of 1 hour petition responces are over. If you remember, Eve at one time has a news posting of 8,000 player limit broken, which was a milestone. Now we are over 30,000. Do the math my friends. The thing that they don't understand is - 250K accounts and 30K people on the server at the same time is A LOT. Reason for that being - wow and 6 million farmers.
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.10.01 04:38:00 - [104] Originally by: stingy CEO No change on my case yet. I'd hate to have to quit this game out of principle, I enjoy it alot. bah. I'd hate for people like you to think they can come on the forums ***ing about something and get special treatment. And when you quit, you can just send me your isk. I prefer having ISK to assests that take hours to get moved to my main hangar areas. Originally by:** kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.10.01 04:39:00 - [105] Originally by: stingy CEO Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 01:24:03 I have three accounts, that makes it more than my internet connection. Go away troll. That's still not alot of money. Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Lugz	Posted - 2006.10.01 05:28:00 - [106] Originally by: Telescopi warning - ppb (post pub post) I feel wranglers pain - he doesn't want to provide bad service, but sometimes it is not possible - business goes up, staff stay static. I work for a uk e-tailer who has had massive growth spurts, equally as huge as CP has had with eve, and it hurts. You simply cannot hire staff and train them in the time scales customers expect - it takes months, probably more in iceland and in a much more specialised area than 'where is my order'. I will say this though - and I hope wrangler reads it - employ at least 25% more GM's than you need, because you will need them before you can employ more, and not planning for growth will kill repeat sales (and in a subscription business you are particularly sensitive). And if the petitions slow down, please god don't sack people, people are your life blood. The biggest problems I have seen are due to not employing for the future and cutting back as soon as the crisis is over. Have you read the EULA? It doesn't list all the features and uses in the game. Just like Microsoft Office doesn't state what various things it offers. The EULA is a licensing agreement, not a definition of features. The whole website minus the forums list the features that we as customers pay for. If we weren't paying CCP the website wouldn't exist.
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2006.10.01 05:37:00 - [107] Originally by: Drone Hivemistress Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Acutally, it's known for being some of the best in the MMO industry, if not the best. Heh, just because fanbois cream themselves over it doesn't make it the best. People spend more time waiting for a SINGLE petition then I think I've waited for all petitions I've ever filled out in all other MMO combined. AND if they are not hanging on the game, they have to start over? Way to go! Well, to tell a short story. Rifle(wo)man correspondent Ackehece wrote a petition in SWG beta. It weas replied to 2 1/2 years later..... What's worse is that it was totaly irelivent, becuase it said that flamecone 2 was being tweaked to what it becuase approx pub 7.... to bad this was after the Combat Upgrade, and that the skill no longer existed
Taran Blake ANZAC ALLIANCE Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.01 05:37:00 - [108] Originally by: Alessar Kaldorei Furthermore, you are exactly correct. You are paying them for a service. That service is access to Eve online. You're not paying them for excellent customer support. I don't know who invented the "The customer is always right" line, but he was a moron. And people who actualy believe they should be treated as gods just because they're paying for a service are really annoying. I'll trade you another one. "The customer may not always be right, but the customer is always the customer." It doesn't matter if the customer isn't always right. If you aggravate them enough, they stop being a customer.
Kor Loshman Amarr Blizzard Industries inc.	Posted - 2006.10.01 05:59:00 - [109] I've always wondered if the GM's actually took the in-game politics seriously, as in if they would favour one alliance over the next.... but picture this, what would they gain from it? First of all, they are hired and payed by CCP. Why would they show such unproffesionalism as to favour one person from the next. I think we can all agree upon that CCP is still a company, and they will not be tolerating that the GM's or anyone else is showing favourism to any person, corp or alliance. I thankfully have not beeen pressured by those long waiting time for responce from the GM's. But however, we live in a realistic world, and we have to give them time to respond to each petition they recieve. I don't think anyone here would be glad if they would just go around and say "hey guys, we are just not going to accept petitions. OMGWTF!" I mean honestly. They are going to have to prioritize their things, just as much as we do with our real life jobs. And prioritizising is the one thing makes all our mundane jobs similar. It's something we all have to do. And expecting anything else from the GM's or anyone else is just ignorant. So to the GM's: Answer each petition when you get around to it and do it well and with integrity. I'd rather wait for a good reply and with solid investigation behind it, rather than being brushed off by paper pushers. TI'd rather talk to the CCP GM's than any other customer support people.
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 09:25:00 - [110] What i don't understand is these invertebreates flaming me for making a stand here. What do you guys do in RL when you are faced with screwups/very poor administrative processes ? You just shrug and say 'oh well tomorrow i'll wait another day and stand five hours in line for getting my kid inscribed in the communal register with the same chance of being brushed of because the tart at the desk feels like getting a coffee break?' errr No, Didn't think so.

Boliknar	Posted - 2006.10.01 11:46:00 - [111] Edited by: Boliknar on 01/10/2006 11:48:23 Edited by: Boliknar on 01/10/2006 11:46:53 Originally by: Quin Tal Petitions were solved quickly for 1 reason. Small player base. The days of 1 hour petition responces are over. If you remember, Eve at one time has a news posting of 8,000 player limit broken, which was a milestone. Now we are over 30,000. Do the math my friends. Unless of course you are petitioning an Exploit in the TDE4 area then the GM will answer in about 60 seconds and get all mad at you because everyone involved petitioned. Incompetence, I can tolerate out and out rudeness or favoritism needs to have something done about it. -B-

Wrangler	Posted - 2006.10.01 11:57:00 - [112] stingy, which petition are you refering to? I've been checking it, but the only petition I can find from June was closed about 3-4 weeks later in July. Also, there doesn't appear to be any further petitions regarding your closed petition. And I checked all three of your accounts. Wrangler Assistant Community Manager EVE Online Contact Support - Contact Moderators - Report Bug - Submit News Leads Knowledge Base - Player Guide - Policies - Join ISD - Fan Submissions

stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:08:00 - [113] Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:13:52 Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:12:06 Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:08:38 Wrangler .... if you give me your contact details I will send you my email logs from my correspondence with the Gm's that treated the petition. it is odd since when I see the petitio n links now it looks like my petition was closed already in July 13th... But if that is the case, how come I have emails from GM Zworm and GM nova saying they are gonna investigate it half a week ago + the automated 'petition timed- out' mail that I received at 28 september ? just tell me who to mail to get you all the info, and I will do so.
Mikal Drey Angels and Demons	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:12:00 - [114] hey hey Firstly im not a fanboy at all . . 1) i guarantee theres a hell of alot of pettition happy people. eg. loose ship. Argghhhhh WTF lag - pettition 2) yeah the game is bugged to crap - file a bug report and move on 3) customers are NOT always right 4) patience 5) be POLITE. again im sure there alot of peeps out there screaming at everything they dont like and whine like babies when things dont go their way. 6) theres a huge playerbase and that should be taken into account when pettitioning stuff. 7) when your pettition doesnt get answered in the way your happy with it doesnt mean GM/DEv's dont care or havent noted the problem. i think my ONLY issues with pettitions is sometime the replies you get are clearly generic and certainly feel like your being brushed off. the 48hr thing is ok and if i was pettitioning something in RL or in EVE if i didnt get somekind of response after 48hrs Id certainly say at least something. out of every pettition ive filed only 2 have come back not in my favor. both were agent related and I will hope that the GMS involved were forthright and something will actually get done to rectify the agents i had troubles with. i will however place my faith in the system regardless of how bugged to crap it can be. remember people please THINK before hitting that red and white pretty circle.
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:26:00 - [115] Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:26:47 Quote: remember people please THINK before hitting that red and white pretty circle. think I've done maybe three petitions in total since I started playing over a year ago or so... two of them when I was a newb. Third one is this one =p it's really nice that you want to teach people how to not overload the CCP petition system, I believe that's a valid point. It's a bit off-topic though. the procdeure of making people 3 months wait and then giving them only 48 hrs to respond is what is making this thread hit 5000 views in the next half hour.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:33:00 - [116] Originally by: Wrangler This is not something new, you were always required to answer within about 48 hours, or the petition times out. So, in all fairness, players petitions should be reimbursed automatically if not resolved in 48hrs, non? Of course not, it would be dumb, but that is the standard you are applying to your customers. If I waited 3 months for a petition, and then had it sent to the back of the queue because I was on holiday or something similar, I would be mighty annoyed. At the very least the petition should be considered pending, rather than being closed, and resumed once a response was recieved. It doesn't look like the OP is asking for any special consideration, just some consideration. I know you have to tow the party line Wrangler, but surely you can't endorse the situation the OP describes? Surely it is unfair to expect the paying customer to provide a more responsive level of service than CCP can manage, and then punishing them when they fail to do so? The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur

Wrangler	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:38:00 - [117] Originally by: stingy CEO Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:13:52 Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:12:06 Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 14:08:38 Wrangler .... if you give me your contact details I will send you my email logs from my correspondence with the Gm's that treated the petition. it is odd since when I see the petitio n links now it looks like my petition was closed already in July 13th... But if that is the case, how come I have emails from GM Zworm and GM nova saying they are gonna investigate it half a week ago + the automated 'petition timed- out' mail that I received at 28 september ? just tell me who to mail to get you all the info, and I will do so. Ah, now I found it. You petitioned the first time in game and the rest were email petitions, which is why i didn't see them at first. The first petition was June 15th, you got a reply July 11th asking if the petition was valid, this must have been when it was really bad, i remember those mass replies. It timed out two days later, on the 13th. Then you sent a reply September 22nd, and a few days after that they asked for additional information, and then it timed out again. And now we have two new petitions on September 29th. My email is in the signature, a mailto link ([email protected]). Wrangler Assistant Community Manager EVE Online Contact Support - Contact Moderators - Report Bug - Submit News Leads Knowledge Base - Player Guide - Policies - Join ISD - Fan Submissions

Jimmy Morrison	Posted - 2006.10.01 15:03:00 - [118] Originally by: Wrangler The first petition was June 15th, you got a reply July 11th asking if the petition was valid, this must have been when it was really bad, i remember those mass replies. It timed out two days later, on the 13th. Then you sent a reply September 22nd, and a few days after that they asked for additional information, and then it timed out again. And now we have two new petitions on September 29th. My email is in the signature, a mailto link ([email protected]). So it seems that the whole fuzz is simply because Stingy can't reply in time and didn't know that a reply had been sent three months earlier. Speaks more about the complaintant than customer service me thinks . /Sarcasm mode on Oh well, perhaps Stingy will have learnt something from this whole endeavour. It's good to check your mailbox once in a while you know. /Sarcasm mode off
Ranger 1 Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.10.01 15:05:00 - [119] And so... Much ado about nothing...
stingy CEO High roller corp	Posted - 2006.10.01 15:07:00 - [120] Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 15:08:28 Edited by: stingy CEO on 01/10/2006 15:07:55 Quote: So it seems that the whole fuzz is simply because Stingy can't reply in time and didn't know that a reply had been sent three months earlier. Speaks more about the complaintant than customer service me thinks . this was in July. I don't think I was even in the country in that period. Keep in mind the petition was already a month old at that time. Besides they followed through later in september. I had given up all hopes of getting any response back at all. Wrangler : sent you everything I have. Hope I didn't overlook anything.



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