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Vista gaming will be slower than XP ...

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Pan Crastus	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:09:00 - [1] Oh well ... The price of eye candy: Linkage
luisa illiat	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:15:00 - [2] lol a serious article on the inquirer.. ! pigs do fly !
Cadadon Amarr terra firma team Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:27:00 - [3] HA!! /me isn't surprised --- They're -- They are Their -- The Smith's are selling their house There -- Look over there
Sevarus James Minmatar Meridian Dynamics	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:29:00 - [4] That article didn't even get into the problems for EAX based cards and Vista or the new licensing schemes which will effect not only the operating system but the software installed or that hollywood induced DRM cylon scheme that will smack ya if you dare want to do something with YOUR stuff. shrugs. Yet another reason I made a switch a year and a half ago to something else. :) Thank goodness for Transgaming! ----- ------------ Updated Linux Desktop+EVE+EVE-TV
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:33:00 - [5] I've run the beta for Vista on one of my machines for a while, and I can honestly say that I'm sticking with XP for a long time after Vista is released. I'll only upgrade once it's been out for a while (less bugs/holes) and is actually needed for stuff. I like XP a lot: it's an excellent operating system (first windows OS I'd choose over the competition if they were equally compatible). I don't feel Vista improves on it seriously. RAWR!111 Sig Hijackz0r!!11 - Immy
robacz Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:38:00 - [6] Hm, thats strange. I would understand performance drop if you were playing in windowed mode, but if your game is running in full screen, how could desktop, which is running, but not rendering anything (as another application is running in full screen mode), could affect performance? Me thinks its just another "omg [enter new Microsoft OS name here] is gonna be end of the world!" type hype, which we can always see before every major MS OS release. ___________ Buying/Selling: Implants, Cargo Expanders and more Producing/BPCs: Mining Barges, BCs, Cruisers
Quin Tal Expeto Libertas	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:40:00 - [7] A call to arms, EVE Online LINUX! PLEASE!
Directive	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:42:00 - [8] I'm more worried about the license-checking, since it'll keep checking your license even after activation :(
Claude Leon Gallente Ixion Defence Systems The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:49:00 - [9] Originally by: Verus Potestas I've run the beta for Vista on one of my machines for a while, and I can honestly say that I'm sticking with XP for a long time after Vista is released. I'll only upgrade once it's been out for a while (less bugs/holes) and is actually needed for stuff. I like XP a lot: it's an excellent operating system (first windows OS I'd choose over the competition if they were equally compatible). I don't feel Vista improves on it seriously. That's why it is called a Beta. Only ones concerned about liscense issues are the ones who have pirated copies. Anyway, why is this even here?
Bombcrater DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:55:00 - [10] Originally by: robacz Hm, thats strange. I would understand performance drop if you were playing in windowed mode, but if your game is running in full screen, how could desktop, which is running, but not rendering anything (as another application is running in full screen mode), could affect performance? Because the desktop is using up video memory - possibly quite a lot of it, given that each window is actually a texture stored in video memory (in 32-bit colour a double-buffered 1280x1024 window will take at least 10MB of video mem). So there's a lot less memory available for a game, which means loading textures from system memory more often. 128MB cards are going to get hit very hard by this, but on 256MB and 512MB ones it should be much less of an issue. I've been running Vista RC1 on one of my systems since it came out and I like it a lot. It's much, much better than the earlier versions. With the launch date so close I suspect it'll still need a service pack before most people can safely switch, but 2000 and XP were like that too
Nerf Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.07 07:56:00 - [11] Egh, doesn't it just give you the option to turn off the 3d desktop? I did hear something about OpenGL working differently with Vista or some such like that, though. Signature graphic removed - please email us to find out why (include a link to the graphic in question) - Jacques([email protected])
robacz Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.07 08:03:00 - [12] Originally by: Bombcrater Originally by: robacz Hm, thats strange. I would understand performance drop if you were playing in windowed mode, but if your game is running in full screen, how could desktop, which is running, but not rendering anything (as another application is running in full screen mode), could affect performance? Because the desktop is using up video memory - possibly quite a lot of it, given that each window is actually a texture stored in video memory (in 32-bit colour a double-buffered 1280x1024 window will take at least 10MB of video mem). So there's a lot less memory available for a game, which means loading textures from system memory more often. 128MB cards are going to get hit very hard by this, but on 256MB and 512MB ones it should be much less of an issue. I've been running Vista RC1 on one of my systems since it came out and I like it a lot. It's much, much better than the earlier versions. With the launch date so close I suspect it'll still need a service pack before most people can safely switch, but 2000 and XP were like that too I see, but can't desktop release gfx memory when another application goes in full screen mode? Would it take too long to load it all when user want to switch back to desktop? Also new cards often have 512MB of video ram, I doubt many games will be able to use that much memory for long time, so I think Vista'ers will be ok. ___________ Buying/Selling: Implants, Cargo Expanders and more Producing/BPCs: Mining Barges, BCs, Cruisers
Aodha Khan Minmatar Blood Inquisition	Posted - 2006.10.07 08:28:00 - [13] Edited by: Aodha Khan on 07/10/2006 08:28:58 Let's just wait and see the outcome. Every time MS released an OS we get this sort of panic/hype. There are also no quotes from Microsoft so the article may be taking the 10% slowdown out of context which is not unusual for a mag seeking attention. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Miss Overlord Gallente BongBrothers Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.07 08:33:00 - [14] aye tho by the tiem eve is ready and vista is upgraded and peeps have 3 GB of memory shouldnt be a hassle
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.07 08:38:00 - [15] I think Vista will be fine once you've downloaded some of the piracy patches to remove protection, spying and that sort of stuff, and disabled all the default non-needed services. Its always like this when a new OS comes out... people said the same about XP when it arrived. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Roxanna Kell Holy Jihad	Posted - 2006.10.07 08:58:00 - [16] This is common though, Better GFX = Slower Frame rates. Besides whats 10-15% so you go from 10 frames to 90 or from 50 to 45. anything over 40 is playable. Quote: "Don't touch the red button!"
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:11:00 - [17] Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. CCP, you seriously expects us to run EVE in Vista? Its not all bad, the EU is closely monitoring MS and says it will continue to fight MS monopoly. N=R* x fp x ne x fl x Fi x fc x L
Sevarus James Minmatar Meridian Dynamics	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:19:00 - [18] Edited by: Sevarus James on 07/10/2006 09:20:25 Originally by: Death Kill Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. CCP, you seriously expects us to run EVE in Vista? Its not all bad, the EU is closely monitoring MS and says it will continue to fight MS monopoly. Actually CCP does NOT expect us to run EVE under Vista. They are keeping two clients for the forseeable future simply because Vista ONLY would kill a ton of subs. The vista client will have additional visual 'bling', but a dx9 XP/other client will not be shabby and it is ALSO getting the gfx upgrades. CCP is actually looking to EXPAND its client/operating system lists. Vista (beta) -dx9 emulation XP Win2k Linux -cedega dx9 > opengl MAC -(intel) via bootcamp are currently capable of playing EVE right now. They have mentioned MAC as well in posts. Vista issues for the end user are still a little 'vague' as its not on the market yet. What is known is that it is going to require more 'oomph' than a lot of people are currently running. The sky ain't falling. CCP wants MORE users not LESS. ----- ------------ Updated Linux Desktop+EVE+EVE-TV
Callistus Gallente Coreli Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:21:00 - [19] Originally by: Death Kill Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. Please, show me some evidence for this statement. -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainfrane]
ToxicFire Warlords Corp The Core Collective	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:21:00 - [20] The new intel based mac's are looking more intising every day especially now that we know people have got eve working on them Join the save Stargate SG1 Campaign Today! http://savestargatesg1.com/
Enakaji	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:28:00 - [21] Well, the German Magazine Gamestar tested the Vista Gaming Performance with the current rc1 and it was quite a considerable bit slower than Windows XP. They benchmarked two games, both beeing slower on Vista(yes I know two games is not much, but it's showing a trend). The Testingsystem was a Core 2 Extreme X6800, 2 Gig DDR2 800, Intel 975X witha Geforce 7900 GTX and a X1900 XT. They tested in two settings, stetting one beeing 1280x960, Full Detail, no AA and no AF. Setting two was 1280x960, Full Detail with 4xAA and 8xAF(For HL2 LC they used 1280x1024). The first game was FEAR. On XP the 7900 GTX scored 108 FPS in Setting 1 and 66 FPS in setting 2. Under Vista this dropped to 96 FPS in Setting 1 and 48 FPS in Setting 2. For the Radeon, it was much worse. On XP it scored 101 FPS on setting 1 and a nice 75 FPS on setting 2. Under Vista this dropped to 59 FPS(Thats a 42% drop!) on setting 1 and 43 FPS on setting 2. The second game was Halflife 2 Lost Coast. On XP the Geforce got 171 FPS on setting 1 and 124 FPS on setting 2. With Vista it's 148 FPS on setting 1 and 108 FPS on setting 2. The radeon isn't hit as hard in HL2 as it was in FEAR. On XP it scored 180 FPS on setting 1 and 131 FPS on setting 2. In Vista this dropped to 157 FPS on setting 1 and 118 fps on setting 2. So, currently the performance drop from XP to Vista is still quite considerable. One can just hope that this is mainly becaus the Vista RC1 is still not completely final(same for the drivers) and that it will improve when it hits the stores(though I personaly wouldn't get my hopes up high on that).
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:44:00 - [22] Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Death Kill Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. Please, show me some evidence for this statement. It was all over Euronews last week. I'll see what I can find. N=R* x fp x ne x fl x Fi x fc x L
FFGR Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:45:00 - [23] Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Death Kill Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. Please, show me some evidence for this statement. here you go. _____________________________ siggys v. 0.5
Sevarus James Minmatar Meridian Dynamics	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:49:00 - [24] Remember that hardware audio support is no longer being supported under Vista, and this will have an adverse effect on frame rate testing. Best solution is to offload audio to a usb solution under that platform. directplay/sound are being maintained but EAX is not. (software emulation only.) That said, the Aero desktop will cause a performance hit on FS AND windowed gaming as it is always loaded. ----- ------------ Updated Linux Desktop+EVE+EVE-TV
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2006.10.07 09:50:00 - [25] Originally by: Sevarus James Actually CCP does NOT expect us to run EVE under Vista. They are keeping two clients for the forseeable future simply because Vista ONLY would kill a ton of subs. The vista client will have additional visual 'bling', but a dx9 XP/other client will not be shabby and it is ALSO getting the gfx upgrades. CCP is actually looking to EXPAND its client/operating system lists. Vista (beta) -dx9 emulation XP Win2k Linux -cedega dx9 > opengl MAC -(intel) via bootcamp are currently capable of playing EVE right now. They have mentioned MAC as well in posts. Vista issues for the end user are still a little 'vague' as its not on the market yet. What is known is that it is going to require more 'oomph' than a lot of people are currently running. The sky ain't falling. CCP wants MORE users not LESS. Ahhh. I thought the new grahpics uppdates were only availble via Vista. N=R* x fp x ne x fl x Fi x fc x L
Callistus Gallente Coreli Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.07 10:06:00 - [26] Originally by: FFGR Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Death Kill Edited by: Death Kill on 07/10/2006 09:11:35 Mcafe (spelling) is furious because Vista wont allow ANY 3rd party anti virus client apperently. Microsoft claims its protection system is good enough. Please, show me some evidence for this statement. here you go. Yeah, that I knew about. Hardly ammounts to MS refusing to "allow ANY 3rd party anti virus clients" though. Especially seeing as other vendors have said they haven't had any problems other than those associated with developing software for a beta OS. -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainfrane]
Necrosmith Gallente Wife lets me play corp	Posted - 2006.10.07 10:13:00 - [27] A rule of thumb I always live by is to never be the first to adopt a new OS. Let other people go through the pain of beta testing it after release. I'll probably be on XP for 2 years after Vista's launch. Best Regards, --Necro ------------- "Isk is cheap. Life is cheaper. This week, they're having a sale on both."
Dante Chusuk Golden Aardvark Society	Posted - 2006.10.07 10:22:00 - [28] Originally by: Sevarus James Remember that hardware audio support is no longer being supported under Vista, and this will have an adverse effect on frame rate testing. Best solution is to offload audio to a usb solution under that platform. directplay/sound are being maintained but EAX is not. (software emulation only.) Actually it is just DirectSound 3D that seems to be getting "killed" here. Anything with Open AL will still be fine. But how many developers are going to port their old games to Open AL? Possibly some of the MMORPG devs (and hopefully this is an aspect of the new client CCP are working on, anyone seen anything about a switch to OpenAL or working with their people?). More info can be found here
BustyBounty Caldari Vengeance of the Fallen Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.07 10:38:00 - [29] Quote: That's why it is called a Beta. Only ones concerned about liscense issues are the ones who have pirated copies. Anyway, why is this even here? what crap people who build comps hate the licensing aswell, must be great building a new comp and having to phone ms because your hardware has changed ------------------------------------------ My opinions are my own and not that of the alliance I belong to.
Hoshi DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.07 10:46:00 - [30] Originally by: Claude Leon That's why it is called a Beta. Only ones concerned about liscense issues are the ones who have pirated copies. Anyway, why is this even here? Most pirates are not concerned about licensing issues, they just use *****s etc to go around them. A usual it's the people that actuly payed that end up having the worst problems. There was a good example not long ago where a bug in MS database made lots of authentic corp client identify as illegal. Because Vista keep check all the time even after activation this will happen much more often, already been several reports of legal Vista beta clients suddenly identifyng as illegal. On XP this is not too much a problem as only thing that happens is that you get lots of popups and can't download some updates from MS until it's fixed. On Vista on the other hand it will completly cripple the OS. Turns off everything other than webbrowsing which it limits to 1 hour sessions. It's been a long known fact that anti-piracy efforts always hits the legal users harder than the pirates.

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