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Karash Amerius Amarr O.E.C	Posted - 2006.10.09 20:10:00 - [1] Well...there has been numerous threads on this forum stating that several patches ago, Eve started to randomly crash to desktop for quite a few players. So far there has not been (as far as I can tell) any Dev response, or updating of known issues regarding this. From my own reading and following threads related to this issue, a vast majority of common system traits include AMD dual core processors. While some reports have also been centered around Intel dual core processors. While some cases can be attributed to specific player's system flaws or problems...the sample size we have clearly indicates a real problem with the Eve Client. I think its time for some sort of Dev input here, in the form of a blog or comment here on this thread. Reading some of the Tech Support suggestions given by GMs to players is laughable. Reseating memory, video cards, playing with sound off...all have not worked. My guess is that the GMs have to give some sort of advise, as it is their job. However, I think the problem is generally accepted that somewhere along the patching process CCP introduced some sort of memory leak or video glitch to crash the client. What I would like to see is for players to simply "/sign" this thread and add their system specs they play EVE on. Many bug reports and logfiles have already been uploaded on this issue. Now is the time for some feedback from the Devs if at all possible. Problem: Seemingly random crash to desktop when using gates, stations, or any other "session change". Rarely, if ever, happens when just sitting in station. Sys Specs: AMD 64 X2 3800+ Manchester 2.0 Gig Processor ASUS A8N32-SLI Motherboard Corsair XMS 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR 433 RAM eVGA GeForce 7800GTX 256mb Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10k RPM SATA150 HD Creative X-Fi XtremeMusic 7.1 Sound Card Plextor Slot Load 16x DVD-R Enermax Liberty 620W Power Supply No other games have this problem. No system memory leaks, and all chipset and other drivers, patches, and AMD optimizer installed. Merc Blog
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.09 21:48:00 - [2] Edited by: Grez on 09/10/2006 21:48:57 The issue was server side and it was fixed a few patches ago. The last CTD's are normaly because of incorrectly setup systems, or a non-supported OS. Clear your cache, install all the Windows XP updates, and disable ingame sound. --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Karash Amerius Amarr O.E.C	Posted - 2006.10.09 21:55:00 - [3] Yup you sound just like a GM (please no offense to you) :) I have done all that...same problem with CTDs. This is not a system problem I can almost promise you. I am glad your CTDs seem to have been "fixed". Could you link to where you got the information where clientside CTDs were fixed? Thanks. Merc Blog
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.09 22:13:00 - [4] It was in one of the posts, also the sticky was taken down in this very forum section, meaning it's most probably fixed. Also I was one of the few suffering from them, and they stopped randomly, just like they randomly started. It was a server side error, and they fixed it. Almost 100% of the CTD's in EVE are due to system related errors. You might think you've tried everything, chances are you havn't. Have you tried tweaking driver options? Deleting your entire cache? Playing in windowed mode only, fullscreen only? Lower resolution? Higher resolution? Underclocking your GFX card / CPU? --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Oneye Zheng Amarr Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2006.10.09 23:19:00 - [5] I also run a AMD 64 X2 3800+ and I have only been playing for a few weeks, and have had consistent crashes to the desktop when I try to undock, or use a stargate. I'm running a very fresh install of XP all patched up, with the latest Nvidia drivers for my 6800gs. I have just tried EVE Launcher and sadly have the same problem. I do know that there is some flakyness with XP, and some software with the AMD x2's. For instance, you can take a look at the tech support posts and fix methods for Everquest 2, which has almost the same crash problems. They recommend installing a patch from AMD to address this issue, and mention turning off 'cool n' quiet' operation in the BIOS, lastly there is a REG adjustment you can make to try and solve the issue. I have no desire to play this game without sound as that wouldn't be any fun at all. Nor will I consider underclocking my CPU, or Video card.. However I'm still hopeful I might find a workaround for this. I'll poke around teh internets and see if I can't find out some other possible fixes, or ideas So far the basic things like clearing the cache, and windowed mode haven't helped. I'm only running at 1280x1024, id hate to drop down to 1024x768, but I guess I'll give that a try.. If anyone had any other specific idea, or links to any info on this please post em up!
Bombcrater DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.10 00:14:00 - [6] Whatever is causing these problems, it's not the processor. I run a dual-core AMD system (X2 4600, Asus A8N SLI-SE, 2GB DDR400) with XP SP2 and the MS/AMD patches, and Eve works just fine. I can't even remember the last time I had a CTD.
Siveron	Posted - 2006.10.10 02:05:00 - [7] I get the occasional CTD while using jumpgates. Though I havn't had a single CTD after I installed Omega drivers. Dell E1705 Intel Core Duo 2Ghz 1 GB RAM Nvidia GO 7900 256MB XP Media Center Ed. usually play windowed
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.10 09:08:00 - [8] Originally by: Oneye Zheng I have no desire to play this game without sound as that wouldn't be any fun at all. Nor will I consider underclocking my CPU, or Video card.. If you have a creative card and do not want to, then I suggest you get used to the crashing. Creative drivers are rubbish, and 90% of crash cases where a creative card was involved, said creative card caused the crash. --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Oneye Zheng Amarr Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2006.10.10 12:46:00 - [9] Yeah, I guess I was being a bit cranky about the problem last night. I never ment that I wouldn't 'try' disableing the device as a test to see if that helps. ;) I did continue to do some digging, and I after some driver tweaking, and a very odd thing a refresh rate change, it appears to be stable so far. :)
BBQ Gallente Suicidal Tendencies Ltd	Posted - 2006.10.10 15:03:00 - [10] No problems here on any of the systems I have run eve on 1st, new system, 4 days old and used eve to stress test it with dual clients for 10h Windows XP32 with all patches (including 1 unreleased one for dual core fix) AMD AM2 x2 4200 (overclocked to 2.6GHz or x2 5000 speed) 1GB dual channel Corsair DDR2 PC6400 5-5-5-12 (2GB pack on order) ATi x1900GT 256MB Onboard SoundMax Soundcard 500GB Seagate 7200.10 SATAII HDD 500GB Seagate 7200.10 IDE HDD Needed to install windows dual core fix (not available from microsoft without paying, look in "increase framerate" thread for the free one) and the 2 dual core drivers on AMD's site. Playing with sound on currently. 2nd, old laptop XP32 & XP64 with all patches AMD64m 3000 1GB PC2700 DDR ATi 9600m 64M AC97 VIA sound chip 60GB 7200 HDD No problems, rock solid. Play with sound off as it lags the graphics. Sound on though works fine using newest sound driver. System 3 XP32 with patches AMD XP3000 o/c to XP3200 speed using pin mod 1GB DDR2400 2-2-2 timings ATi 9700AIW 185GB HDD (old IBM) nVidia nForce 2 soundchip Rock solid as well. Play with sound off here as no speakers on system, has worked fine with sound before though. All except the notebook are running the newest 6.9 ATi cat drivers (notebook is stuck at v6.4), newest motherboard / chipset drivers (from chipset manufacture not board maker) and newest sound drivers. Note a lack of creative sound cards, I had crashing problems with them for a long time, finally gave up on them and feel much better for it. I now have an external and PCI AWE32 sat in a draw, not going to sell them as I like keeping friends. ---- God gave us a brain, he also gave us a voice. Shame some people have yet to connect them.

Jeretomi Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.10.10 15:31:00 - [11] Edited by: Jeretomi on 10/10/2006 15:34:27 Originally by: Grez Edited by: Grez on 09/10/2006 21:48:57 The issue was server side and it was fixed a few patches ago. The last CTD's are normaly because of incorrectly setup systems, or a non-supported OS. Clear your cache, install all the Windows XP updates, and disable ingame sound. This is just not true. There are still lots of us with this problem, and no the issue has not been fixed. My system was as solid as a rock before the last patch, since then I can't do four jumps in an empty system without a CTD. Yes we have tried clearing our cache, disabling sound, updating our drivers, and none of these have worked. But to be honest we shouldn't have to disable sound to play the game. We shouldn't have to go delving into our registry to tweak OpenGL settings just to make the client stable. There are four pages of comments here and it seems that the majority of us with the problem are running dual-core processors. There are numerous fixes to try, some of which have helped certain people and not others. Yes it is a problem with our hardware, but please don't tell us the EVE client isn't also involved because let me reiterate...I have only started getting this problem since the last patch. We have yet to have a dev response to this. It would be nice to know that they are at least looking into reproducing and debugging this issue. Whilst I applaude the OP for trying to give this issue a boost, perhaps we should keep all these comments in the original thread...I have already tried to get people to post their system specs there. I don't know...just a thought.
katz3 moon7empler Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.10.10 16:20:00 - [12] No probs here with a AMD64 x2 4400+. (winxp 32bit with MS dual core patch and AMD cpu drivers)
OneSock	Posted - 2006.10.10 16:46:00 - [13] /signed. Intel Core2 Duo E6600 Asus P5N32-SLI Delux 2GB RAM (2x1GB PC5400) Nvidia 7900GTX (using built in Realtek AC97 audio) Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10k RPM SATA150 HD 600watt PSU etc. Already ruled out the Audio, cleared cache, etc. usual stuff, still CTD on Undock and Jump only since last client side patch.
Charok	Posted - 2006.10.10 22:38:00 - [14] My roommate had issues with a AMD dual core CPU. He had many of the same system specs of the OP AMD X2 4000+ ASUS A8N32-SLI Motherboard 2 gigs of Corsair memory gforce card that I dont know right now, high end.. I looked into why his system was crashing and found two sources of posable problems. The Asus board shorts out easly make sure to use stand offs WITH a cardboard offsets. Second his system was rather warm. It was not frying but was at the edge of where I like to keep my systems. So I water cooled his system this got the heat of the CPU and the GPU outside the system his system now runs at about 3 to 5 over room temp. These 2 things got his system stable and he was able to run EVE and even boosted his FPS in other games. Its not the eve client, its your system.
Mortious Vayantix	Posted - 2006.10.11 02:59:00 - [15] I've had a lot of problems for a while which I resolved successfully by applying correct drivers to sketchy setup and some hardware incompatibilities. Here's my setup ASUS A8N-Sli Deluxe AMD X2 3800+ (S939) 2 gig ram Sapphire Radeon X700 Pro The A8N SLI Motherboard has a nvidia nforce chipset which gives some issues with the ATI Card in the x series. It would randomly crash in this game only and I had an issue with playing in windowed mode as I do so often as I have dual monitor and like multitasking. SOLUTION -------- My issue was solved by installing all the most up to date drivers for the nForce chipset for my motherboard and downloading a special release of the graphics drivers from the forums on the ATI website. (not found in the downloads section as it was not an official driver). The driver is specifc for x series. They were saying over x1000 but my x700 pro was suffering from the same issue. its for 64bit processors (even un 32bit mode) and the nforce chipset on the motherboard. To install the drivers I had to use ATI's uninstall utility. They have a special one to delete everything. Reboot Install all the nvidia chipset drivers reboot Install the special ATI Drivers reboot come back and should work after that. Once I had done all of this, I did not experience a single crash in the past month and a half.
Mortious Vayantix	Posted - 2006.10.11 03:16:00 - [16] Link to the "special driver page" https://support.ati.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=894
Seagravity Amarr Fl Mining and Industry Corp.	Posted - 2006.10.11 04:09:00 - [17] Edited by: Seagravity on 11/10/2006 04:09:14 Originally by: Grez Almost 100% of the CTD's in EVE are due to system related errors. You might think you've tried everything, chances are you havn't. Have you tried tweaking driver options? Deleting your entire cache? Playing in windowed mode only, fullscreen only? Lower resolution? Higher resolution? Underclocking your GFX card / CPU? so wait we have to play without using game features? we need to try to stunt our systems to possibly make this game work? i use a bone stock(read untweaked not overclocked) system with fairly powerful video card and a nice processor. i try the newest, older, and MS recommended drivers. all you can say i need to SLOW it down BELOW manufacturer specifications? change settings we shouldnt have to and arent always recommended by the manufacturer? Originally by: Grez If you have a creative card and do not want to, then I suggest you get used to the crashing. Creative drivers are rubbish, and 90% of crash cases where a creative card was involved, said creative card caused the crash. and you can prove this? what about when we arent using creative cards? for me, these problems all happen on Clean OS installs and clean EVE installs again with newest release drivers etc. you think we dont try everything but many have probably spent money on fixing these problems they shouldnt have to. for months we sat and listened to recommendations.. disable sound this, reseat that, try and try and try. i can tell you this i have 3 seperate systems with many options for component choices and my only stable system in THIS GAME is my oldest system. i then tried to do their recommendations and send error and debugging files only to find the reporting site is down after 45 minutes of writing and attaching files i believe it is incompatabilities with newer chipsets and equipment. and with a trend that is not just a handful of players, we cannot all be at fault!
Jeretomi Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.10.11 08:40:00 - [18] Well said!! The "disable your sound fix" has been around for as long as I've been playing the game (over two years now) and quite frankly I think that it is disgusting that this is still being put around as an official fix to some CTD issues. I work as a developer for a company that supplies geological data aquisition and visualisation software for the oil industry. Companies like Shell, BP and Total all use our software, and this so-called fix would be like us telling them that they can't use our visualisation software with the monitor turned-on!! Sound is all part of the immersive quality of games and I like to play with it on, and should be able to. Why hasn't this been looked into and fixed? Now, please don't get me wrong, I am fully aware that developing games is an order of magnitude more complex than writing data collection and visualisation software, and I am full of admiration for CCP as to the quality of gaming they provide us, but the process of reproducing problems and debugging code will be identical. They should have built and AMD and an Intel dual-core cpu machine and should be trying to reproduce the problem. This is what we had to do when one of our customers couldn't run our data server on a Citrix system. And perhaps equally as important, they should tell us, their paying customers, that this is being done....one line in these forums would be all it would take to reassure us.
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.11 08:47:00 - [19] Edited by: Grez on 11/10/2006 08:47:55 Originally by: Seagravity Edited by: Seagravity on 11/10/2006 04:09:14 i believe it is incompatabilities with newer chipsets and equipment. and with a trend that is not just a handful of players, we cannot all be at fault! If that where the case this motherboard I'm using now wouldn't work, but it does. All that above would do is pinpoint where the issue is located. Underclocking the GFX card would make us realise that it's an issue with your graphics card - see where I'm coming from? @Jer, it's creatives fault that the drivers crash the system in EVE, I suggest you complain to them like I have many-a-time. --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Jeretomi Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.10.11 10:43:00 - [20] Originally by: Grez @Jer, it's creatives fault that the drivers crash the system in EVE, I suggest you complain to them like I have many-a-time. Sure, I realise it's a very complex problem that has many variables. But the current CTD problem doesn't appear to be related to soundcard drivers. I was running on-board Realtek sound when this problem started. Disabled sound, no change. Tried Creative card, no change. And to keep getting told to disable sound to make the problem go away is just getting a bit frustrating (no disrespect, I know you're only trying to help ) My system was stable before the last patch....the only thing that changed was the EVE client, so please don't tell me it's something to do with my system set-up...no logic on earth can come to that conclusion!! But to be honest, Creative are probably the biggest supplier of peoples PCI soundcards and as such CCP really should be working with them to work out why their game doesn't work with Creative cards. Other games don't suffer from this problem, so it's not a generic problem with the drivers but an issue in the EVE client code and how it interfaces with the creative drivers....it's not Creatives job to change that

OneSock	Posted - 2006.10.11 11:00:00 - [21] Edited by: OneSock on 11/10/2006 11:00:28 Originally by: Charok These 2 things got his system stable and he was able to run EVE and even boosted his FPS in other games. Its not the eve client, its your system. This is frankly nonsense. We are not talking about random crashes and lockups which you would expect in all games not just Eve. We are talking about specific repeatable problem on Jumping and Undocking. 1. My system is completely stable in all other games and software. 2. My system is not hot. 3. I am using all the latest drivers. 4. I have proven it is not the "disable audio" excuse. 5. I have ruled out power saving options. and last but not least. 6. THIS PROBLEM ONLY STARTED AFTER THE LAST CLIENT PATCH.
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.11 11:02:00 - [22] Are you all using Windows XP SP2? --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Jeretomi Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.10.11 11:24:00 - [23] Originally by: Grez Are you all using Windows XP SP2? I am, yes
Bombcrater DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.11 11:46:00 - [24] Originally by: OneSock This is frankly nonsense. We are not talking about random crashes and lockups which you would expect in all games not just Eve. We are talking about specific repeatable problem on Jumping and Undocking. I should point out that just because a problem is specific to one game and can be reproduced doesn't mean it's not an issue with your system being unstable. Many moons ago I ran a creaky old 1GHz Duron system. It worked fine with every single application and game I had - except one. 3DMark 2001 would always freeze up at one specific point in the dragon test. It always locked on exactly the same frame. I changed drivers, swapped in new memory, bought a new PSU, flashed in the latest BIOS, installed a new heatsink,etc. It still froze up. Then I underclocked the processor to 950MHz. Bingo. Problem solved. I'm not saying this is what's happening here, but it's very easy to blame the software when it can actually be a case of your hardware taking a trip to the twilight zone.
Muuhah Freelance Blood Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.11 14:52:00 - [25] Hi guys. I am having random crashes as well, despite using slipstreamed Windows XP installation, with the latest RyanVM integrator. I have an AthlonXP-32bit processor. It has never hanged with EVE, except when the dragon code branch appeared, which caused me to crash randomly. So using the abovementioned windowsXP method, I reinstalled my OS, and installed EVE from scratch, without altering anything / adding the previous folder settings. Although the amount of crashes seemed to have reduced, its still happenning. Later, using older Forceware drivers, 84.21, from March 2006, it further reduces my random crashes, drastically. System specs: AthlonXP 11 x 200mhz tbred A, MSI5700 256mb, 1gig single channel ram, Asus a7n8x-Deluxe mboard. Note: My p4 630 system, freshly formatted and reinstalled with EVE(only)suffers lesser crashes, when i used the older graphics drivers as well. apparrently, the newest forceware drivers ain;t too compatible with EVE. It has a 128mb ti4400 in it. Hope my observations help.
Karash Amerius Amarr O.E.C	Posted - 2006.10.11 16:25:00 - [26] The problem is centered around session changes in the game. My system only has games installed on it. I dont even surf websites with this box...only games, OS, drivers. @Grez: I used to work at Creative Labs tech support (N.A. center is in Stillwater Oklahoma where I went to college). I can assure you this is not a sound related issue...for the simple fact that the client crashes without the soundcard present, and BIOS onboard soundcard disabled. The OS doesnt even see a sound device when it crashes...hence, no soundcard driver issue on this one. I do thank you for your help, and I know you are trying to help...but I am not a newb that doesnt know how to troubleshoot my box. This is another reason my OP is worded the way it is. The issue might be centered around ASUS as I am seeing a lot of ASUS systems in various threads with this problem. Merc Blog
Grez Minmatar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2006.10.11 16:51:00 - [27] Originally by: Karash Amerius The problem is centered around session changes in the game. My system only has games installed on it. I dont even surf websites with this box...only games, OS, drivers. @Grez: I used to work at Creative Labs tech support (N.A. center is in Stillwater Oklahoma where I went to college). I can assure you this is not a sound related issue...for the simple fact that the client crashes without the soundcard present, and BIOS onboard soundcard disabled. The OS doesnt even see a sound device when it crashes...hence, no soundcard driver issue on this one. I do thank you for your help, and I know you are trying to help...but I am not a newb that doesnt know how to troubleshoot my box. This is another reason my OP is worded the way it is. The issue might be centered around ASUS as I am seeing a lot of ASUS systems in various threads with this problem. Regardless, Creatives sound cards do cause issues in the EVE client, causing it to crash, and sometimes a hard BSOD, hence it's best to try and get rid of that possibility first. --- Cache Clearer Still waiting for a Wrangler-edit!
Jeretomi Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.10.11 17:46:00 - [28] OK, for consistency here's my full system specs: MSI K8N Neo Platinum Motherboard AMD 64 X2 3800+ Point of View GF7600GT 256MB Onboard Realtek AC'97 Audio 1GB Crucial DDR400 RAM (1 stick) 2x 80GB Maxtor PATA HD Liteon CD/RW Liteon DVD/RW Windows XP Pro SP2
necronarcosis	Posted - 2006.10.11 19:09:00 - [29] Originally by: Grez Edited by: Grez on 09/10/2006 21:48:57 The issue was server side and it was fixed a few patches ago. The last CTD's are normaly because of incorrectly setup systems, or a non-supported OS. Clear your cache, install all the Windows XP updates, and disable ingame sound. why should anyone have to diable sound? this is a stock reply to most problems. many games dont suffer with problems due to sound why should this one? omg
Karash Amerius Amarr O.E.C	Posted - 2006.10.12 23:13:00 - [30] No one should have to disable sound. CCP doesnt have a list of known hardware problems with their game anywhere. Besides, I believe this CTD issue is revolving around system memory addressing and how the game client accesses it (just an opinion). I believe the disable sound is quite an urban legend at this point in the development of Eve...but it will increase your framerates. Merc Blog



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