EVE Search - CCP thank you for our amazing new T3 destroyers, but...

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

CCP thank you for our amazing new T3 destroyers, but...

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Mournful Conciousness Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate 830	Posted - 2015.03.02 16:19:11 - [1] - Quote Having used both the svipul and confessor in solo and gang pvp in both lowsec and w-space. Here is what I and my corp found: They're epic. Probably a bit too epic. None of us will ever fly any other frigate sized ship into combat ever again, since: no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors they out-dps most cruisers (taking into account small weapon tracking, make that all cruisers) They can be dual propped, dual repped, armour tanked, shield tanked, bricks or (toughened) glass cannons. Their cap is strong enough to easily support perma-MWD. They can insta-warp by changing from speed to defence mode 1/3 of the way through alignment. They have an enormous cargo hold for charges, loot, MTUs, mobile depots so make perfect wormhole loot delivery vans while being able to transform themselves from short range to long range fit and from pve to pvp fit, mid-mission without any penalties to performance. They do not have a single weakness. There is not even the punishment of skill loss for losing one. The skill loss which incidentally is arguably the only reason that eve is not called "TenguQuest". Oh, and once you've bought the fittings, a fully-fitted tactical destroyer is approximately the same price as any other T2 frigate, which it will easily mince. Does the design team have any thoughts on this? I mean, I know the community will instantly reply, "OiGetYourDirtyHandsOffMyNewShineyPwnMobile!!!", but I imagine the dev team will have a view on eve combat that is a little less myopic than that of us capsuleers? I hope so anyway... Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Crystalline Entity Outdated Host Productions Talos Coalition 9	Posted - 2015.03.02 16:33:59 - [2] - Quote Having been blapped by a couple last night I am in no way bitter (pretty bitter tbh ) .... I agree
Nami Kumamato School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 551	Posted - 2015.03.02 16:49:30 - [3] - Quote Mournful Conciousness wrote: no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors I think a Destroyer is supposed to do that. On the other points...I got nothing. " And now my ship is oh so cloaked and fit - I never felt so good, I never felt so hid ! " - Ramona McCandless, Untitled
Elenahina Agony Unleashed Agony Empire 157	Posted - 2015.03.02 16:54:57 - [4] - Quote Here's one that was killed by an Assault Frigate and a Talwar for jebus sake. https://zkillboard.com/kill/44974433/ Another killed by a solo rupture which the confessor should have been able to outrun, right? https://zkillboard.com/kill/44975907/ Wait - here's a Svipul killed solo by an Enyo. https://zkillboard.com/kill/44975429/ So it seems like frigates can stand up to them - solo even. Admittedly, the T3 destroyers are great ships, but they're hardly the undefeatable WTFOMGBBQPWN mobiles you're making them out to be. Agony Unleashed is Recruiting - Small Gang PvP in Null Sec
Iroquoiss Pliskin Hedion University Amarr Empire 4	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:02:12 - [5] - Quote A Navy slicer will solo your yolo* Confessor any day. *DLP
Agondray Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces 204	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:06:26 - [6] - Quote Elenahina wrote: Here's one that was killed by an Assault Frigate and a Talwar for jebus sake. https://zkillboard.com/kill/44974433/ Another killed by a solo rupture which the confessor should have been able to outrun, right? https://zkillboard.com/kill/44975907/ Wait - here's a Svipul killed solo by an Enyo. https://zkillboard.com/kill/44975429/ So it seems like frigates can stand up to them - solo even. Admittedly, the T3 destroyers are great ships, but they're hardly the undefeatable WTFOMGBBQPWN mobiles you're making them out to be. So what your saying is poster is bad and should quit eve? Agreed. Also the proper name would be "Tengu Online" not "TenguQuest". Most other MMOs make you seem like your the only one in the thousands of adventures that can save the world, Eve can takes thousands of capsuleers to to accomplish saving a world/system "Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
baltec1 Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 15339	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:11:17 - [7] - Quote They are hilariously overpowered. Given the history of t3 they wont be fixed for another 6 years. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
Elenahina Agony Unleashed Agony Empire 158	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:12:01 - [8] - Quote Agondray wrote: So what your saying is poster is bad and should quit eve? Agreed. More like the OP should remember that the plural of "anecdote" is not "evidence". I'll admit, I've never solo'd a T3 destroyer. But I'm not going to make blanket claims based solely on my own limited experience without doing at least some kind of digging into the matter. The fact that it took me a couple of minutes skimming zkillboard to find counter examples indicates to me that the OP is mad and/or bitter. Agony Unleashed is Recruiting - Small Gang PvP in Null Sec
Frostys Virpio The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc 1611	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:23:11 - [9] - Quote Elenahina wrote: Agondray wrote: So what your saying is poster is bad and should quit eve? Agreed. More like the OP should remember that the plural of "anecdote" is not "evidence". I'll admit, I've never solo'd a T3 destroyer. But I'm not going to make blanket claims based solely on my own limited experience without doing at least some kind of digging into the matter. The fact that it took me a couple of minutes skimming zkillboard to find counter examples indicates to me that the OP is mad and/or bitter. EVE is filled to the brim with pad pilots. I would most likely manage to lose a T3 dessy to a solo T1 frig with how bad I am but that does not mean the ship is "balanced" because someone can solo someone else piloting it. Many people have more ISK then brain and will do stupid ****.
Mournful Conciousness Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate 831	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:24:29 - [10] - Quote Sure, there'll be the odd few expertly flown t2 frigates that will take down the odd poorly flown and fitted T3 destroyer, but I think you get the general point. Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Kiandoshia Applied Anarchy SpaceMonkey's Alliance 2185	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:33:25 - [11] - Quote Nami Kumamato wrote: Mournful Conciousness wrote: no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors I think a Destroyer is supposed to do that. On the other points...I got nothing. Yeah, the original destroyers aren't terrible at it but they're slow and all that boring balancy crap. Screw that! We'll just have new ships with fancy speed mods for when you want a destroyer but just can't be bothered to fly one. Oh well, I suppose the idea behing T3 destroyers was to throw low sec a new toy, so, that's worked, I guess.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 2039	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:40:55 - [12] - Quote Destroyers were always meant to be "anti-frigate" ships, however the T1 destroyers were never really fit for that purpose, sometimes struggling to take down T1 frigates solo, and generally losing to T2 and faction frigates. Suddenly you have destroyers that are actually capable of doing their job. Also they don't out DPS cruisers, at all. They don't even come close.
Commander Spurty Dimension Door We need wards. 1426	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:45:02 - [13] - Quote Destroyers are the solution to a 'frigate problem'. Good to read there's finally some out there capable with their ship chassis role. Counters to these ships are 'cruisers, battle cruisers', webs, nuets, bubbles, drones, more destroyers and pretty much, anything but their favourite crunchy snack, frigates. There are good ships And wood ships And ships that sail the sea But the best ships are Spaceships Built by CCP
Mournful Conciousness Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate 831	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:49:24 - [14] - Quote I'm fine with the concept of OP T3 ships but there should be a downside. With T3 cruisers the downside is skill loss, which provides a degree of balance (actually it just gives the loser a 5 day cooling-off period). I think T3 destroyers should have a similar skill loss penalty. It won't stop me using them, but it will stop me using them every day to the exclusion of anything else, as I do now. Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Remiel Pollard Shock Treatment Ministries 6536	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:54:08 - [15] - Quote Mournful Conciousness wrote: Having used both the svipul and confessor in solo and gang pvp in both lowsec and w-space. Here is what I and my corp found: They're epic. Probably a bit too epic. None of us will ever fly any other frigate sized ship into combat ever again, since: no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors they out-dps most cruisers (taking into account small weapon tracking, make that all cruisers) They can be dual propped, dual repped, armour tanked, shield tanked, bricks or (toughened) glass cannons. Their cap is strong enough to easily support perma-MWD. They can insta-warp by changing from speed to defence mode 1/3 of the way through alignment. They have an enormous cargo hold for charges, loot, MTUs, mobile depots so make perfect wormhole loot delivery vans while being able to transform themselves from short range to long range fit and from pve to pvp fit, mid-mission without any penalties to performance. They do not have a single weakness. There is not even the punishment of skill loss for losing one. The skill loss which incidentally is arguably the only reason that eve is not called "TenguQuest". Oh, and once you've bought the fittings, a fully-fitted tactical destroyer is approximately the same price as any other T2 frigate, which it will easily mince. Does the design team have any thoughts on this? I mean, I know the community will instantly reply, "OiGetYourDirtyHandsOffMyNewShineyPwnMobile!!!", but I imagine the dev team will have a view on eve combat that is a little less myopic than that of us capsuleers? I hope so anyway... In my experience with the 'fessor, which is extensive, both PVP and PVE, I disagree with all of the above. Mostly, I use a duel-rep fit which has one legitimate major weakness - neuts. A duel-prop or other kiting fit tends to be squishy as ***, (there was a one guy kept getting his ganked by 'nados in Jita when they first came out, it was hilarious) and they don't get any dps bonuses, so 80% of the time they are no more difficult to counter than any other kiting ship. And like any other kiting ship, usually low enough on DPS that they can be easily tanked. "no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors" Good, working as intended. I always said from the very beginning, when the 'fessor first came out, these ships will be the first efficient counter to assault frigates (when I say efficient, I mean ships of the same size that aren't the same type) and that can only be a good thing given how highly capable assault frigates can be in the right hands. "Their cap is strong enough to easily support perma-MWD." Only if you sacrifice reps and/or dps on the 'fessor.My duel-rep fit requires a cap booster running afterburner, which means I only have one mid left for a warp scrambler. While it is tanky as all hell (I have permatanked gate guns in lowsec and duel-web lokis with autocannons with it), it sacrifices a lot to get that tank. Likewise, in any other fitting configuration, it sacrifices things to be excellent at something else. Working as intended. "They can insta-warp by changing from speed to defence mode 1/3 of the way through alignment." If someone's clever enough to figure out how to get the best use out of each mode and mode switching, then good on 'em. Working as intended. "They have an enormous cargo hold for charges, loot, MTUs, mobile depots so make perfect wormhole loot delivery vans while being able to transform themselves from short range to long range fit and from pve to pvp fit, mid-mission without any penalties to performance." This is mostly correct, until that last bit - without any penalties to performance. Sorry, that's just wrong, because how a ship performs depends on the circumstances it's required to perform in. Mode switching is not some 'I win' button that suddenly changes your entire fit, it just doesn't work that way. The first thing I did with my friends when I first got my 'fessor was figure out how to kill 'em. It's not that hard if you put your mind to it, depends on how they're fit and how the pilot is flying it and just like in any given PVP situation, that requires 'reading your opponent', but at the end of the day, T3 destroyers explode like anything else. GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥ - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104*
Altrue Exploration Frontier inc Brave Collective 1644	Posted - 2015.03.02 17:58:30 - [16] - Quote I killed a svipul with a comet. They are not immortal. The nice thing about these new T3s is that you can have fun with them without them becoming a problem like T3 cruisers can. Because at the end of the day, even T1 cruisers can take them down. Signature Tanking Best Tanking
Remiel Pollard Shock Treatment Ministries 6536	Posted - 2015.03.02 18:03:43 - [17] - Quote I will agree with one thing - they feel a little cheap for what they are. I just took a look at current prices and I'll say this much, I felt more comfortable with their cost when they were around the 150-200 mil mark. GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥ - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Ncc 1709 Fusion Enterprises Ltd Shadow of xXDEATHXx 135	Posted - 2015.03.02 18:04:56 - [18] - Quote after killing a few. I have to admit that the T3 dezies are op. its take a lot of effort to catch one if he don't want to be catch or a lucky landing on 0 to one. hell a 10mn mwd svip can hit 22km/s without implants or wh mechanics. even just ab fit they go fast enough to make 90% of ships that use missiles useless against them as they simply out run them. and the few that do hit due to the speed bearly scratch. guns have the same issue. almost nothing can track them at those speeds, so if you do hit them its either luck or their poor pilots.
Remiel Pollard Shock Treatment Ministries 6536	Posted - 2015.03.02 18:06:55 - [19] - Quote Ncc 1709 wrote: after killing a few. I have to admit that the T3 dezies are op. its take a lot of effort to catch one if he don't want to be catch or a lucky landing on 0 to one. hell a 10mn mwd svip can hit 22km/s without implants or wh mechanics. even just ab fit they go fast enough to make 90% of ships that use missiles useless against them as they simply out run them. and the few that do hit due to the speed bearly scratch. guns have the same issue. almost nothing can track them at those speeds, so if you do hit them its either luck or their poor pilots. Question: let's say you're not pulling numbers out of your backside, does a ship that size with a 10MN mwd do anything OTHER than go at 22m/s? Because I've seen similar things done with a wide variety of ships, including Caracals and Talos', and 100% of the time they're hitting unrealistically high and uncatchable speeds while being incapable of anything else. Yet no one seems to have a problem with those... GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥ - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Ned Thomas Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave 975	Posted - 2015.03.02 18:09:20 - [20] - Quote Ncc 1709 wrote: 10mn mwd svip .........huh? Don't get lost alone - Join Signal Cartel, New Eden's premier haven for explorers! Onward to Thera with Eve Scout
Rowells ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans 2040	Posted - 2015.03.02 18:10:28 - [21] - Quote Ncc 1709 wrote: after killing a few. I have to admit that the T3 dezies are op. its take a lot of effort to catch one if he don't want to be catch or a lucky landing on 0 to one. hell a 10mn mwd svip can hit 22km/s without implants or wh mechanics. even just ab fit they go fast enough to make 90% of ships that use missiles useless against them as they simply out run them. and the few that do hit due to the speed bearly scratch. guns have the same issue. almost nothing can track them at those speeds, so if you do hit them its either luck or their poor pilots. you mind sharing that fit? I cant seem to get close to that kind of number even with gimmick fits E: nvm i found it E2: yeah, so gimmick fits are gimmick fits. Also, unless im completely fubar in this fit, it requires links and implants to reach 25km/s. youre looking at more of a 10km a second with 20pg for any thing else.
Mournful Conciousness Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate 831	Posted - 2015.03.02 19:00:45 - [22] - Quote Nami Kumamato wrote: Mournful Conciousness wrote: no frigate can stand up to them no two frigates working together can stand up to them they out-perform interceptors I think a Destroyer is supposed to do that. On the other points...I got nothing. I take your point. I have edited the post to be more specific. To my mind the svipul makes a better interceptor than interceptors do, in that it's incredibly fast and agile and when it catches its prey it can quite happily stay alive in a way that interceptors cannot. Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Phoenix Jones Isogen 5 1109	Posted - 2015.03.02 19:38:55 - [23] - Quote Well let's differentiate points. Interceptors are bubble immune, warp faster (or they should if they don't). Some have viable combat roles. The interceptors are in a decent place. Assault frigates, some need some love, but not all of them. Yes the destroyers are good, very good, but their engagement roles still limited mainly because people haven't gone over to them totally yet. We still have two more to go. The confessor and svipul have filled two pretty good holes in the destroyer class. We'll see what the last two do. The real ship that has issues against this is the frigate though, hard but not impossible. I'd still take a wait and see stance, but a balance pass wouldn't be unwarranted after some more statistics are taken. Yaay!!!!
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 34244	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:24:20 - [24] - Quote As a class of ship, the T3 Destroyers have pretty much taken the top spots on zkillboard now, sitting constantly at #1 and #3: http://puu.sh/gg9u1/09b82b1cb1.jpg (7 day stats) Before the Svipul was released, the Confessor was sitting even wiith the Ishtar for kills (with the Sabre constantly sitting in #1), but now with two of the T3 Destroyers out, they are pretty much leading the way. Total kills for those two ships sits at between 17000 - 18000 per week. Even the Sabre, which has a pretty unique role compared to the T3 Destroyers, has dropped about 1000 kills per week since the Svipul was released. Whether that is purely because they are so popular, or because they are so strong; I don't know but it's most likely a combination. What is certain is that the role for Assault Frigates is disappearing fast. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 220	Posted - 2015.03.02 20:50:24 - [25] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: As a class of ship, the T3 Destroyers have pretty much taken the top spots on zkillboard now, sitting constantly at #1 and #3: http://puu.sh/gg9u1/09b82b1cb1.jpg (7 day stats) Before the Svipul was released, the Confessor was sitting even wiith the Ishtar for kills (with the Sabre constantly sitting in #1), but now with two of the T3 Destroyers out, they are pretty much leading the way. Total kills for those two ships sits at between 17000 - 18000 per week. Even the Sabre, which has a pretty unique role compared to the T3 Destroyers, has dropped about 1000 kills per week since the Svipul was released. Whether that is purely because they are so popular, or because they are so strong; I don't know but it's most likely a combination. What is certain is that the role for Assault Frigates is disappearing fast. I was thinking about this last night while talking about assault frigs current role, we didn't see one for it apart from people being loyal to a ship they've flown for ages. so will it be a nerf to them soon.tm? or some love given to assault frigs? or working as intended HTFU? they are T3 after all.
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 34245	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:10:49 - [26] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: so will it be a nerf to them soon.tm? or some love given to assault frigs? or working as intended HTFU? they are T3 after all. I hope they aren't nerfed. It's probably too early to draw any solid conclusion yet. After 6 months with all 4 of them in the game it might be clearer. If anything, some differentiation of role for the assault frigates might be needed so they maintain a purpose in the game. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
Liafcipe9000 Critically Preposterous 33904	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:22:32 - [27] - Quote Mournful Conciousness wrote: HThey do not have a single weakness Except for ECM, cap neutralizing, webbing, scramming, disrupting as well as turret, damping, target painting and excessive weapon damsge AKA biting on more than they can actually chew. inb4 the falcon Founder of the Graycember movement and LAGL's pet cat. Critically Preposterous is recruiting! please send evemail if interested.
Buzz Tard The Black Swarm Curatores Veritatis Alliance 0	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:48:29 - [28] - Quote Handing out tinfoil hats They are very nice ships indeed and apart from the price tag pretty newbie friendly, whichmight the the original intention behind them other then just dealing with the so called "frigate problem", otherwise T1 destroyers or assault frigs could simply have been buffed. They are relatively easy to get in, can be flown (and providing fun) for a decent amount of time while scaling pretty good while the pilot accumulates skillpoints. Their "Transformer ability" mitigates the rock, paper, scissor concept to a certain point, so the pilot can concentrate on learning to pilot a ship properly. Given the fact that they are also overpriced at the moment - 60%-80% margin currently (yes, i have an industry alt as well) they will be only a little more expensive compared to a T2 frig, but with nowhere near the entry barrier SP wise. Besides -you might already guessed - CCP offers a way for everyone to get isks for those who can-¦t (or want) to make the needed amount ISK ingame. Maybe CCP is in a certain need for both - new players (and money).Take this with the apropriate amount of salt of course... But...yes, they are a gift for vets and newbies alike some might benefit more from it than others. Now, take off your tinfoil hats, count down from ten, and when i snap my fingers, you will wake up perfectly refreshed - feeling the strong whish to buy one yourself. :->
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 220	Posted - 2015.03.02 21:53:01 - [29] - Quote Buzz Tard wrote: Handing out tinfoil hats feeling the strong whish to buy one yourself. :-> i now wander the stars seeking a whish to feel so that i may buy one
Sniper Smith Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 312	Posted - 2015.03.03 00:12:23 - [30] - Quote I think they are both fairly well balanced sofar. They are no more "OP" than an AF is to a normal Frig, or a HAC is to a normal Cruiser.. (I'm not gonna mention current T3's cause all agree, they need work, and as such aren't a justification for anything) They kill frigs, shocking, that's what a Destroyer is SUPPOSED to do. Not just gank Miners :p Why are they so high on killboards? Well, for one, yes, they are good. Two they are widely used because they are "new" but not overpriced anymore. Three most groups haven't thought up effective counters to them yet. As times go one people who are having a blast in them will, at least in part, go back to what they were using before, or move on to something else new.. and groups will learn how to deal with them best. Now all of this is subject to change, they are still new, but I don't see them as overtly OP.. and wouldn't suggest looking at them closely till next year.. seeing how both their usage, and counters evolve.

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

Copyright © 2006-2025, Chribba - OMG Labs. All Rights Reserved. - perf 0,03s, ref 20251012/0200
EVE-Online™ and Eve imagery © CCP.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.