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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
230
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:10:00 -
[1] - Quote
After chewing on this over the last day I have come to slightly agree with those who are concerned with harassing gangs roaming about in Inties and Bombers with an Entosis modules just to grief (sorry, ibis invasions are too easy to pop to be taken seriously). Hulls capable of cloaking, hulls capable of bypassing gates easily, and interdiction nullification should not have it.
So, simply, the Entosis module should be restricted to Battlecruiser Hulls and only Battlecruiser class hulls. |
Hairpins Blueprint
CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans
155
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:20:45 -
[2] - Quote
Petrified wrote:After chewing on this over the last day I have come to slightly agree with those who are concerned with harassing gangs roaming about in Inties and Bombers with an Entosis modules just to grief (sorry, ibis invasions are too easy to pop to be taken seriously). Hulls capable of cloaking, hulls capable of bypassing gates easily, and interdiction nullification should not have it.
So, simply, the Entosis module should be restricted to Battlecruiser Hulls and only Battlecruiser class hulls.
i don't see way only BC class, i think only COvops and inties should be baned with this.
but giving the link to BC or bigger ships mighit be much easier and not such a bad idea |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
3550
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:20:57 -
[3] - Quote
Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm. |
Kunnilar
Moonshine Runners
10
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:24:21 -
[4] - Quote
Agreed.
Infact, I think limiting them to BC's ... (maybe BC and higher) , means actual fights will ensue if defending / taking sov, instead of aggressors being able to troll or use flaky methods to be irritating and avoid committing
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2746
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:28:05 -
[5] - Quote
With a 5 min and a 2 min cycle that doesn't start to do anything until the end of the first cycle, I doubt you have trouble dealing with people looking to pick a fight by using the module. |
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
230
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Posted - 2015.03.05 03:34:49 -
[6] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm. Just because trolling can happen, does not mean it should be easy. |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
1126
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Posted - 2015.03.05 04:18:53 -
[7] - Quote
Petrified wrote:Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm. Just because trolling can happen, does not mean it should be easy.
I like that thought :-)
Yaay!!!!
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Catherine Laartii
Imperium Technologies Evictus.
485
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Posted - 2015.03.05 06:09:04 -
[8] - Quote
oddly enough, I made a thread myself earlier that reached this exact same conclusion. It got locked and redirected to the main balance thread, which i thought was BS because we're talking about a specific part of it. |
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
230
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Posted - 2015.03.05 06:49:49 -
[9] - Quote
Catherine Laartii wrote:oddly enough, I made a thread myself earlier that reached this exact same conclusion. It got locked and redirected to the main balance thread, which i thought was BS because we're talking about a specific part of it. I am inclined to agree that it sounds like baloney.
This is the discussion of a feature, not a rant, and a proposal regarding a forthcoming mechanic. |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Intrepid Crossing
1645
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Posted - 2015.03.05 06:53:24 -
[10] - Quote
I agree entosis module needs tweaking, but not by restricting hull.
If someone wants to go in solo in an interceptor to some completely abandoned system with no one in it, he should be able to take that system.
The problem is when you goes into an occupied system in a seboed fast frig. T2 entosis has a range of 250km, so you can burn around within that radius to structure and play hard to catch.
Entosis should have the same effects as cyno - generate a beacon and lock you into place. If the system is abandoned, lol for them, you just soloed a sov system. New sov working as intended. If the system is occupied, well, you can expect to be shot. |
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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
230
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Posted - 2015.03.05 07:12:56 -
[11] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:I agree entosis module needs tweaking, but not by restricting hull.
If someone wants to go in solo in an interceptor to some completely abandoned system with no one in it, he should be able to take that system.
The problem is when you goes into an occupied system in a seboed fast frig. T2 entosis has a range of 250km, so you can burn around within that radius to structure and play hard to catch.
Entosis should have the same effects as cyno - generate a beacon and lock you into place. If the system is abandoned, lol for them, you just soloed a sov system. New sov working as intended. If the system is occupied, well, you can expect to be shot.
I like this idea as well. Simply because you are not going to have someone cloaking up when someone enters the system. I missed where the range of 250 KMs came from in the Dev blog. Must be from another thread...
I still think people who use the module need to be more intentional in it's use to make it more challenging for an interceptor gang armed with entosis modules in addition to their regular weaponry to undo weeks worth of work on an IHUB in 10 minutes - not so much to capture sov or to disrupt the competition, but to greif. I doubt the response time for a small alliance would be adequate for that. Unless you also add in the law of diminishing returns: the more applications of an entosis module to a structure still decreases the capture time, but degree of increase diminishes with each subsequent application.
In which case unrestricted hulls would be fine in my mind if the module locks you into place akin to a cyno and, while more ships applying the entosis module will speed up the process, the effectiveness diminishes. |
Kestral Anneto
Umbra-Domini SpaceMonkey's Alliance
59
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Posted - 2015.03.05 08:25:55 -
[12] - Quote
Make it battleships only, then battleships will suddenly have a role. simple, then we dont hvae to deal with the trollceptor fleets. |
Erasmus Grant
EVE University Ivy League
19
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Posted - 2015.03.05 09:53:05 -
[13] - Quote
Petrified wrote:After chewing on this over the last day I have come to slightly agree with those who are concerned with harassing gangs roaming about in Inties and Bombers with an Entosis modules just to grief (sorry, ibis invasions are too easy to pop to be taken seriously). Hulls capable of cloaking, hulls capable of bypassing gates easily, and interdiction nullification should not have it.
So, simply, the Entosis module should be restricted to Battlecruiser Hulls and only Battlecruiser class hulls.
I said something like this on that thread that will never end, but battle-cruisers should be entry level hull for it and then supers and higher use T2. This will prevent grieving to a degree and expand the battle space. Battle-cruisers because they are the first ships that appear to have any form of command and control(hell the T2 variant are called command ships) with booster and etc. |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
888
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Posted - 2015.03.05 10:20:36 -
[14] - Quote
I would limit the module to BC + BS hulls. If they want to stick with the 400% increase in time for capitals then limit it to non super caps.
And T3's should be banned from having it for sure. Cloaky 100mn MWD interdiction T3 + Entosis Link, I'll let you mull that over for a bit...
Friends
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Arla Sarain
330
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Posted - 2015.03.05 10:39:18 -
[15] - Quote
Instead of panicking and doing some kneejerk reaction change
wait and see if people find enough counters with what he have. |
suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
157
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Posted - 2015.03.05 10:59:01 -
[16] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm.
QFT.
If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself,
do you really use that space? and do you actually deserve it?
the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones
-á--áCommander Ted
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Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
11991
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Posted - 2015.03.05 11:17:29 -
[17] - Quote
I'd much rather see it disable prop mods on any ship that has an active cycle. For both aggressor and defender.
I have no issue with anklebiting at sov holders. Harassing renters was once my favorite pastime. But taking a bite as big as an Entosis module can allow you to do should come at the cost of vulnerability. If you're going to bite the ankle, you should be in a position to get kicked.
This would have the major benefit of incentivizing escort fleets more than is presently proposed. The current proposal incentivizes scattering about and just being a headache, rather than actually fighting over anything.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Promiscuous Medusa
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2015.03.05 11:58:29 -
[18] - Quote
Make it Battleship only solving the "why would we fly BS?" problem -¼_-¼ |
Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
11991
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Posted - 2015.03.05 12:34:12 -
[19] - Quote
Promiscuous Medusa wrote:Make it Battleship only solving the "why would we fly BS?" problem -¼_-¼
I would like to point out that removing the ability to activate prop mods would functionally have an effect close to this. You know, seeing as battleships are hurt the least by lack of prop mod.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
383
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Posted - 2015.03.05 13:24:00 -
[20] - Quote
I would not agree with a hull restriction.
I would however support a flag which means that the Entosis module and any form of cloaking device cannot be onlined simultaneously on the same hull... Doing so wouldn't significantly change the operation of the module, nor its use, but it should reduce the perceived power of the AFK Cloaker (which is already decaying the system indices) and therefore the potential for justified whines. |
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GeeShizzle MacCloud
523
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Posted - 2015.03.05 13:32:40 -
[21] - Quote
suid0 wrote:Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm. QFT. If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself, do you really use that space? and do you actually deserve it?
lol coming from a player of a mostly sovless entity, yah i would expect you to be entirely in the griefing camp on this. |
Sinigr Shadowsong
Monkey Attack Squad Goonswarm Federation
138
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Posted - 2015.03.05 13:44:32 -
[22] - Quote
Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable. Cloaky nullified T3s are fine as are expensive, easier to catch and much more satisfying to kill than worthless throwaway instawarp ceptors on worthless throwaway alts. Bombers are fine as they can be catched on gates.
BC+ restriction sounds logical, and this is the exact reason why it can't be implemented. |
suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
158
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Posted - 2015.03.05 15:24:28 -
[23] - Quote
Sinigr Shadowsong wrote:Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable. Cloaky nullified T3s are fine as are expensive, easier to catch and much more satisfying to kill than worthless throwaway instawarp ceptors on worthless throwaway alts. Bombers are fine as they can be catched on gates.
BC+ restriction sounds logical, and this is the exact reason why it can't be implemented.
They're not really worthless throwaway ceptors when they'll cost at least 100m each.
the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones
-á--áCommander Ted
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suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
158
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Posted - 2015.03.05 15:28:11 -
[24] - Quote
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:suid0 wrote:Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Yeah, um... no.
Every hull should have it. Looks like patrolling your space and dealing with trolls is going to become part of the new "So you want Sov, eh?" paradigm. QFT. If an Inty can reinforce your stuff within a 4 hour window inside your 'prime time' then you probably need to ask yourself, do you really use that space? and do you actually deserve it? lol coming from a player of a mostly sovless entity, yah i would expect you to be entirely in the griefing camp on this.
It has nothing to do with griefing and everything to do with CCP attempting to make it difficult for you to defend unused & unpopulated space.
the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones
-á--áCommander Ted
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Arla Sarain
333
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Posted - 2015.03.05 15:39:21 -
[25] - Quote
Sinigr Shadowsong wrote:Interceptors are a concern since they are virtually untouchable Damp ECM Other small ships that WILL track ceptors
Can see interceptors getting through bubbles and making you **** your pants in paranoia of someone flipping the station services
But cannot really see the flip actually happening unless the system is just empty. In which case, working as intended? Unpopulated space must go. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
823
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Posted - 2015.03.05 15:53:06 -
[26] - Quote
Trollceptors are only a threat to empty, barren Sov space.
If you want to rock about in a <2k ehp paper bag with an 80m mod that blocks warping hanging off your ass, you be my guest.
The missile boats will chew you up and spit you out. |
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
1464
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Posted - 2015.03.05 16:01:18 -
[27] - Quote
I could see making the fitting requirements for the T2 link (the one with the ungodly range) high enough that a frigate would have a really hard time fitting them. But for the short range one? Yeah, let the trollceptors have at it at that range.
My Many Misadventures
Reading Comprehension: so important it deserves it's own skillbook.
I seek to create content, not become content.
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suid0
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
159
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Posted - 2015.03.05 16:18:44 -
[28] - Quote
Bronson Hughes wrote:I could see making the fitting requirements for the T2 link (the one with the ungodly range) high enough that a frigate would have a really hard time fitting them. But for the short range one? Yeah, let the trollceptors have at it at that range.
Hardly a problem when they can't lock that far.. and if they want to fully gimp fit just to get that range, they're not a threat anyway
the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones
-á--áCommander Ted
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blackiice
Jorm syndicate
7
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Posted - 2015.03.05 19:13:29 -
[29] - Quote
Why not make the link expensive. Make them 2 bil each and that will stop the trolling. Also make the link act like a triage or bastion module where you can't move while using it so it doesn't matter which hull you are in you are stuck and ready to be shot. Taking SOV shouldn't be THAT easy to take. |
Alexis Nightwish
116
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Posted - 2015.03.05 19:52:52 -
[30] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:...And T3's should be banned from having it for sure. Cloaky 100mn MWD interdiction T3 + Entosis Link, I'll let you mull that over for a bit... This was actually the very first thing I thought when I read about the Entosis.
There could even be a good lore reason why as the interface to the T3 cruiser precludes using the Entosis link.
CCP only approaches a problem in one of two ways: nudge or cludge
EVE Online's "I win!" Button
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