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BURN EDEN response to Kali and "end of BE" allegations

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Shin Ra BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.10.25 11:50:00 - [1] There are certain things that define us as a corp. It is a well known fact that BE and their infamous ravens use lots of WCS. The news that WCS are to be nerfed has been going around for years. One year ago it would have upset me. At that time, people were complaining a lot about WCS. So CCP were kind enough to invent the interdictor. The forums declared it to be the end of BURN EDEN, as they did when Missles, EW and dampners were nerfed. Sadly for them, it was quite the opposite. We began using interdictors to the extreme. On a normal day, we go through 50 warp disrupt probes. This meant we could stop relying on our ravens to get points to hold down targets for a longer time and introduced many people complaining about us warping in at 200k and spamming javelins etc. After we gained experience doing this, we began to questions the need for wcs. If we were fighting close range, it tended to be in our own bubble. If we were fighting long range, few ships ever got within scramble range. If we were getting ganked, stabs rarely saved us. So BE members slowly began wearing less and less warp core stabs. We kept the word going that we still fitted 4 or 5 stabs and people still believed it, despite what our loss mails said. The wcs nerf now means that anyone fitting stabs and fighting us will have a really hard time due to the stab penalties and our dampners. This pleases us greatly. Secondly, the javelin torperdo has been nerfed to uselessness. I do not believe they will stay nerfed like this as from reading the jav torp nerf thread it is clear there is a massive over nerf here. Still, its highly likely that they will never be as powerful as they currently are. Not to worry, all of us have cruise spec 5 too. A 100dps reduction against battleships, made up by a massive dmg increase against frigs and cruisers (Guided Missle precision 5 anyone). Our setups always aim to use the most powerful and potent weapons and systems at the time. This has been true since 2004. Nothing will change. Almost every single patch since 2004 has nerfed our setups or boosted counter setups in some way. This has never, not once, had a negative effect on our ability to kill. The lowest point nerf wise we have ever been at was just after interdictors came out when dampners were nerfed to uselessness. Yet, we had once of the most successful contracts ever in the gameÆs history against RA + friends at this point. So to all those non believers saying this is our end. This is but another chapter in the legend. Our corporation has never in its history been stronger than is it right now. Our history at nerf adaptation speaks for itself. This one is no different. Have a nice day. Shin Ra BURN EDEN Summary: WCS + jav torps are getting nerfed. This will have little effect on us. Everyone who thinks this is our end, hmm.. well..
Kasibee'an Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2006.10.25 11:53:00 - [2] BE 4tw/
Joshua Foiritain Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.10.25 11:53:00 - [3] Post with your main! ----- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.25 11:55:00 - [4] I expected as much. While I consider your tactics lame, it didn't seem to be depending on the use of stabs. You were always far enough away with your ravens to not need stabs. Question though. What do you think the impact of the 50% hitpoint increase will be on your strategy? Won't it make it a lot easier for people to race back to a gate and survive long enough to jump through? If I had to guess, this might force you to go in a lot closer (to web people) than your current tactics do.
Shin Ra BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:00:00 - [5] Originally by: Malachon Draco I expected as much. While I consider your tactics lame, it didn't seem to be depending on the use of stabs. You were always far enough away with your ravens to not need stabs. Question though. What do you think the impact of the 50% hitpoint increase will be on your strategy? Won't it make it a lot easier for people to race back to a gate and survive long enough to jump through? If I had to guess, this might force you to go in a lot closer (to web people) than your current tactics do. Sabre's have 4 midslots. Dual webs anyone?
Gunship Amarr FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:00:00 - [6] frankly my dear, who gives a d.... So you want to join us?
Rexthor Hammerfists Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:01:00 - [7] be=stabs like pdu=power diagnostic system. simple. ur fault. - Purple Conquered The World, We the Universe.
Elve Sorrow Amarr Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:01:00 - [8] Irrelevant of the whole BE dead thing... Calling yourself a legend doesnt actually make you one. It's great being Amarr, aint it?
Waagaa Ktlehr Amarr Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:02:00 - [9] Nice post :) Refreshing :) - - One ship to jam them all, one ship to damp them. One ship to suck them dry and in the dark void gank them.
LUKEC Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:02:00 - [10] Originally by: Malachon Draco I expected as much. While I consider your tactics lame, it didn't seem to be depending on the use of stabs. You were always far enough away with your ravens to not need stabs. Question though. What do you think the impact of the 50% hitpoint increase will be on your strategy? Won't it make it a lot easier for people to race back to a gate and survive long enough to jump through? If I had to guess, this might force you to go in a lot closer (to web people) than your current tactics do. It's huge issue for everyone and will lead to even bigger blobs. Cough cough undocking and docking again in moros with neutron blasters, anyone:P? I'll have something silly like 400k armor and aggro timer is 60s at it worst. And considering fact that biggest killer in fleets is lag, this hp increase is completely unneccessary. Apart on capital ships maybe.

DB Preacher Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:10:00 - [11] Grats, Evolution is the bloodline of any corporation and those failing to do so simply fade away in the wind. Make sure that you take a trip to visit us at some point, I would very much enjoy seeing your new structure first hand. cheers, dbp Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
Chochko KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:11:00 - [12] Originally by: LUKEC It's huge issue for everyone and will lead to even bigger blobs. Cough cough undocking and docking again in moros with neutron blasters, anyone:P? I'll have something silly like 400k armor and aggro timer is 60s at it worst. And considering fact that biggest killer in fleets is lag, this hp increase is completely unneccessary. Apart on capital ships maybe. Hmm first more hp is bad for lag ... than it is bad for lame dock-undock tactic with dreads, second more hp is good on cap ships - this means you adore lame dock-undock tactic? -------------------------------------------
Shin Ra BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:12:00 - [13] Originally by: DB Preacher Grats, Evolution is the bloodline of any corporation and those failing to do so simply fade away in the wind. Make sure that you take a trip to visit us at some point, I would very much enjoy seeing your new structure first hand. cheers, dbp You won't need blob numbers to scramble us now then
KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:15:00 - [14] Blah blah tbh Shin. I don think anyone really cares. You do what you do well, but it looks to me like CCp took a alook at your corp to see exactly what the lamest possible way is possible to engage in PvP and nerfed it. ANY of us could do what you do, but we choose not , cos quite simply we care about the reputation of our corps. Your entire recent strategy got the nerf bat, that in itself says something. Your not stupid, and you are good Pvpers, so you will adjust, but if you wanna shake of the reputation of being a bunch of dckwads, then you should try understanding the concept of honour, and not go purposefully out of the way to fight in the lamest possible way you can. (ps I do however respect the fact that you dont log off trap, no lag bombing etc, if youhave anything to hold onto is that you did it all fair n square.... but results aren't everything in life m8, its not always what you did, its quite often how you did it) KIA EVE Home
DB Preacher Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:19:00 - [15] Originally by: Shin Ra Originally by: DB Preacher Grats, Evolution is the bloodline of any corporation and those failing to do so simply fade away in the wind. Make sure that you take a trip to visit us at some point, I would very much enjoy seeing your new structure first hand. cheers, dbp You won't need blob numbers to scramble us now then Nah, the blob numbers were never to scramble you... they were to try and one shot your ravens when you came in at range :D Almost worked too if it wasn't for Woody forgetting to actually fire his guns :\| Anyway good luck, dbp Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
Chode Rizoum Minmatar Finite Horizon	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:25:00 - [16] Gl
LUKEC Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:26:00 - [17] Originally by: Chochko Originally by: LUKEC It's huge issue for everyone and will lead to even bigger blobs. Cough cough undocking and docking again in moros with neutron blasters, anyone:P? I'll have something silly like 400k armor and aggro timer is 60s at it worst. And considering fact that biggest killer in fleets is lag, this hp increase is completely unneccessary. Apart on capital ships maybe. Hmm first more hp is bad for lag ... than it is bad for lame dock-undock tactic with dreads, second more hp is good on cap ships - this means you adore lame dock-undock tactic? Yes, i've learned it from tjakka first hand, if you want to flame. Back on topic: I don't like it, and huh, maybe capital ships could use different aggro timer. Problem with capital tanking is that capital reps in siege mode repaired nearly 50% armor in one cycle, burst damage was killing tanks etc.
Chochko KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:30:00 - [18] Originally by: LUKEC Edited by: LUKEC on 25/10/2006 12:27:00 Originally by: Chochko Originally by: LUKEC It's huge issue for everyone and will lead to even bigger blobs. Cough cough undocking and docking again in moros with neutron blasters, anyone:P? I'll have something silly like 400k armor and aggro timer is 60s at it worst. And considering fact that biggest killer in fleets is lag, this hp increase is completely unneccessary. Apart on capital ships maybe. Hmm first more hp is bad for lag ... than it is bad for lame dock-undock tactic with dreads, second more hp is good on cap ships - this means you adore lame dock-undock tactic? Yes, i've learned it from tjakka first hand, if you want to flame. Back on topic: I don't like it, and huh, maybe capital ships could use different aggro timer. Problem with capital tanking is that capital reps in siege mode repaired nearly 50% armor in one cycle, burst damage was killing tanks due to armor leaking into structure. Yes i want to flame - i learned it from LUKEC if you want to know. Back on topic too: Increase of HP only on one "Class" of ship introduces imbalance. Anyway this 50% up will mean much more on CAPS than other. 1 milion Shield Phoenix Anyone? -------------------------------------------
Death Merchant InterGalactic Corp. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.10.25 12:43:00 - [19] Anyone reading you killboard and looking at your raven lost(how ever few they are) have noticed that you dont fit full low of stabs anymore. However there is still usually 1/2 on your setup depending on pilot. The fact that having even 1 on you setup basically nullifies your sensor boosters is still a victory all around. Alot of the people you shoot are trying to get away from you anyway so most of them will still keep having stabs or will go with more pure speed setups. The warp core change will make people alot more vulnerable(you included) to the frigate swarm again since its almost useless to put even a stab on in pvp situation and now one 20km disruptor means you cant warp. Plus ecm is so overpowerd they could probably take off the dual scram setups and start fitting ecm modules. However one of the main problems when battling you has been the lack of ability to get you to stay so you can be blobbed. I believe this will either shorten your engangment times or you will have to bring other ships or setups to compesate. Will this affect your ability to kill? Probably not much or not at all. Will it affect you in some way. Probably yes. Does this really F up the sniping BS,eagles, zealots, deimos and stababonds that depend on wcs to get away alot of times? Yes. Will it change the way alot of people pvp? Yes. Even then will people still keep calling you stab "who res"? Yes. "What happens in Deklien stays in Deklien".
Hardin Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:03:00 - [20] Originally by: Death Merchant The warp core change will make people alot more vulnerable(you included) to the frigate swarm again since its almost useless to put even a stab on in pvp situation and now one 20km disruptor means you cant warp. As Shin Ra said at the top I don't think this nerf will really effect BE greatly. When they were down in CVA space they would never stay put in one spot for long and even if you had enogh time to land a frig/dictor on top of them they were all aligned and ready to warp the instant any danger threatened. ------------------------------

Masta Killa The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:07:00 - [21] Burn everything! Note that I still wear 5 stabs, despite this stuff Shin is saying -------------------------------------- Different corp but we still show up and UDIE.
Al Haquis Minmatar Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:09:00 - [22] Making a new alliance Hardin? With love From Al Haquis P.S Your still a girly boy
Hardin Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:24:00 - [23] Originally by: Al Haquis Making a new alliance Hardin? With love From Al Haquis P.S Your still a girly boy Yes, And I love you too terrorist ------------------------------
Max Teranous Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:45:00 - [24] It's all ok Shin, they haven't nerfed Photoshop yet Max --------------------
KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.25 13:53:00 - [25] Originally by: Max Teranous It's all ok Shin, they haven't nerfed Photoshop yet lol. KIA EVE Home
Sorja E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.10.25 14:04:00 - [26] Originally by: Elve Sorrow Irrelevant of the whole BE dead thing... Calling yourself a legend doesnt actually make you one. Heh, they are indeed a legend, they weight more in EVE than many corps and even alliances. Of course, they are good at 'public relations' ____________________ Darko1107 > does anything in ascn space have tech II fittings? Quillan Rage > Iron ships
Einheriar Ulrich Minmatar Black Reign Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.25 14:56:00 - [27] Originally by: Hardin Originally by: Al Haquis Making a new alliance Hardin? With love From Al Haquis P.S Your still a girly boy Yes, And I love you too terrorist New Alliance Old disco Balls Hardin for Emperor....we all knwo he has a warm heart
Zhaine B e l l u m	Posted - 2006.10.25 15:19:00 - [28] Ego-filled post by a fairly insignificant attention whoring corp? Well yah in my opinion. Made a good read, just about, might even be a worthwhile thread in Ships and Modules. Meh. - - - - - - - - - - Quote: I don't even want a ship, ships are for carebears. Give me a fish bowl for my head (to keep space out) and smear me with lard, then armed with a toasting fork-
DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.10.25 15:22:00 - [29] Adaptation is key to everything, and we at BE are really f'ing good at it. See you after kali with cruise missiles a flying and I hope to god that vagas think they are fast enough to get to us 8). WildCat
Nebuchadnezzar I Grettistak Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.10.25 16:02:00 - [30] Originally by: KIAEddZ Edited by: KIAEddZ on 25/10/2006 12:19:24 You do what you do well, but it looks to me like CCP took a alook at your corp to see exactly what the lamest possible way to engage in PvP and nerfed it. ANY of us could do what you do, "Jav Torps/Interdictors and Stabs" but we choose not ,cos quite simply we care about the reputation of our corps. Your entire recent strategy got the nerf bat, that in itself says something. Your not stupid, and you are good Pvpers, so you will adjust, but if you wanna shake of the reputation of being a bunch of dckwads, then you should try understanding the concept of honour and respect, and not go purposefully out of the way to fight in the lamest possible way you can. (ps I do however respect the fact that you dont log off trap, no lag bombing etc, if you have anything to hold onto is that you did it all fair n square.... but results aren't everything in life m8, its not always what you did, its quite often how you did it) pss. Your reputation as WCs *****s (basically cowards) is one you garnered fairly, and developed joyously, no one to blame but yourself. Since when are jav torps lame? Sorry i didnt get that memmo? It seems to me people more and more are just starting to "decide" wow that is lame without many arguments? I mean sure WCS can be argued against in pvp fittings, certainly same thing with logging out to save ships in bubbles etc - but jav torps why again?



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