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Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.26 23:43:00 -
[1]
Well ive seen lots of facny new Rohk threads and such. But does anyone else (Amarr people?) get weak in the knees when they get in this ship?
I finally got to log on after 2 hours and the first thing I went for was this ship. I love this ship, and I think it will dominate all other BC's for gang PvP honestly. Save maybe the Drake.
It is just like the Abaddon, its older brother, except it can keep its weapons running easily. Its like the Abaddon because, it can have a great tank while still fitting a full rack of Heavy Pulse II's, a Medium NOS, and a Medium Cap injector to keep it all going.
So on a lighter note, heres the setup I fitted and used on the test server for a bit.
Highs-
6x Heavy Pulse Laser II's (Conflag/Scorch)
Medium Diminishing Nos
Mids-
10mn Afterburner II
Medium Cap Injector
Stasis Web
Warp Scram
Lows-
MAR II
2x EANM II's
2x Active Hardener II's (Kin, Exp)
Internal Damage Control unit
This setup gives me about 80% on all resistances and 82-84% on two. So its tank I would say is rather beastly for a BC. Also the ability to fit a full rack of Heavy Pulses gives it very nice damage output for gangs.
Unlike its cousin the Prophecy who's grid couldnt even support 6 HPL II's a Med nos and a Cap injtor.
This BC makes me cry its so beautiful. Amarr owes you one Tux.
 Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr 
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xHalcyonx
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2006.10.26 23:57:00 -
[2]
I'm in love with the Harbinger. I am first training up to Crusader and then the Harbinger. :).
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korrey
Taurus Inc
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:00:00 -
[3]
I love this ship. I specialize in BC's with all my skills pretty much so its like magic for me.
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Scordite
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:03:00 -
[4]
Honestly it's a good thing the harbinger is a pretty solid ship. Leaves more energy left to focus whines on the abaddon.
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The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag:
Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead. |
Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:07:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Angus McLean on 27/10/2006 00:07:40
lol yeah. Although I love the Abaddon too heh. Both are really sweet looking ships, just fix the cap issue on the Abaddon and ill be the happiest (gate) camper alive.
No pun intended 
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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EnglishBob
0utbreak
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:09:00 -
[6]
Shhh, Don't talk about the Harbinger. We know it will be good but if the Caldari find out, we'll end up with a 10% mining drone range bonus or the like.
Come to think of it, that might be useful for that bloody Abaddon.
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Myrrdin
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:10:00 -
[7]
I worked out that if I get the energy turret rig skill to at least 4 or 5, I should be able to stack 2 of the t2 version on a harbinger. With 7 heavy pulse 2's and conflag, and 3 heatsink II's, I calculated rough dps to be just over 750, not including drones.
My skills aren't quite maxed, so some will be able to do close to 800. I'm really looking forward to this beast hitting tranquility... 
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Scordite
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:11:00 -
[8]
Originally by: EnglishBob
Come to think of it, that might be useful for that bloody Abaddon.
It has too low cpu to be a proper mining ship, and besides, mining drones give less ore/min the longer they have to ferry it back and forth.. Mining drone SPEED might be better 
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The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag:
Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead. |
Toaster Oven
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:21:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Angus McLean
Its like the Abaddon because, it can have a great tank while still fitting a full rack of Heavy Pulse II's, a Medium NOS, and a Medium Cap injector to keep it all going.
It can't tank well with Heavy Pulses. 1 rep + 5 hardeners? Waste of slots. And complete lack of damage. A Drake for example can field a tank more than twice as strong, without gimping it's damage. Hurricane has no trouble fitting dual rep tank, or single rep + 1600mm plate.
Quote:
Highs-
6x Heavy Pulse Laser II's (Conflag/Scorch)
Medium Diminishing Nos
You have an empty high slot
Quote:
This setup gives me about 80% on all resistances and 82-84% on two. So its tank I would say is rather beastly for a BC.
Lies, with maxed out skills you get:
EM - 79.8
EX - 79.2
KI - 80.5
TH - 67.2
On top of that, you only have one rep. And no plate for survivability. A single 1600mm rolled Tungsten is worth 3 minutes of repping power coming from a MAR II.
Quote:
Also the ability to fit a full rack of Heavy Pulses gives it very nice damage output for gangs.
Your dmg output is nothing special. Any of the other Tier 2 BC will have no problem matching and easily exceeding the dmg ouptut of your setup. While fielding better tanks. And the cap on a Harbinger is a joke compared to other BC. With max skills you're only getting 1.666 cap/s more than other BCs. While all the other BC don't need to consume cap for their weapons. With maxed out skills, a full rack of Heavy Pulse II w/ Conflag leaves you with just 1.2 cap/s leftover. That puts Harbinger at a distinct disadvantage compared to the other Tier 2 BC.
There's a reason Drake and Hurricane are getting so much love. 
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Nyobe
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:25:00 -
[10]
Single repper tanks don't work very well in Kali.
either fit a dual rep tank (favourised on ships with repper bonus) or fit plates to soak up as much dmg as possible.
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Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:26:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Angus McLean on 27/10/2006 00:26:58
Originally by: Toaster Oven
Originally by: Angus McLean
Its like the Abaddon because, it can have a great tank while still fitting a full rack of Heavy Pulse II's, a Medium NOS, and a Medium Cap injector to keep it all going.
It can't tank well with Heavy Pulses. 1 rep + 5 hardeners? Waste of slots. And complete lack of damage. A Drake for example can field a tank more than twice as strong, without gimping it's damage. Hurricane has no trouble fitting dual rep tank, or single rep + 1600mm plate.
Quote:
Highs-
6x Heavy Pulse Laser II's (Conflag/Scorch)
Medium Diminishing Nos
You have an empty high slot
Quote:
This setup gives me about 80% on all resistances and 82-84% on two. So its tank I would say is rather beastly for a BC.
Lies, with maxed out skills you get:
EM - 79.8
EX - 79.2
KI - 80.5
TH - 67.2
On top of that, you only have one rep. And no plate for survivability. A single 1600mm rolled Tungsten is worth 3 minutes of repping power coming from a MAR II.
Quote:
Also the ability to fit a full rack of Heavy Pulses gives it very nice damage output for gangs.
Your dmg output is nothing special. Any of the other Tier 2 BC will have no problem matching and easily exceeding the dmg ouptut of your setup. While fielding better tanks. And the cap on a Harbinger is a joke compared to other BC. With max skills you're only getting 1.666 cap/s more than other BCs. While all the other BC don't need to consume cap for their weapons. With maxed out skills, a full rack of Heavy Pulse II w/ Conflag leaves you with just 1.2 cap/s leftover. That puts Harbinger at a distinct disadvantage compared to the other Tier 2 BC.
There's a reason Drake and Hurricane are getting so much love.
Well thanks for totally killing Amarr's only joy right now.:P And heh are you using Quickfit to get those readings? Generally not accurate.
And to be exact, you dont need more than 1 rep. I tanked sentries until my cap bosters ran out easily.
And FYI the damage output is great...for Amarr ships.
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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Zosimos Sabina
Amarr
Loot
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:26:00 -
[12]
TBH you need to drop down to Focused Pulses for a decent tank, which is how it should be.
Remember, the NOS slot will give you some addition cap/sec to play since you now have grid to put a Med Diminishing on.
Although, I agree, its sorta missing a little bit of something. But this is only because Beams and top-tier pulses have stupid huge fitting requirements. Same reason Omen is sort of gimped.
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Toaster Oven
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:29:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Angus McLean
And heh are you using Quickfit to get those readings? Generally not accurate.
I'd like to know where are you getting your numbers from? I logged onto TQ and fit out the same hardeners on a Geddon (same base resists). Clicked show info, and that's what I get. And I do have maxed out armor comp skills. So I know my numbers are accurate 
Quote:
And to be exact, you dont need more than 1 rep. I tanked sentries until my cap bosters ran out easily.
Tanking sentries is a joke. Go try and tank another player in a Tier 2 BC.
Quote:
And FYI the damage output is great...for Amarr ships.
Sadly enough, this is true 
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Benjamin Olson
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:33:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Benjamin Olson on 27/10/2006 00:33:29
erm...my resistances are lower.
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Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:34:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Benjamin Olson
Edited by: Benjamin Olson on 27/10/2006 00:33:29
erm...my resistances are lower.
Maxxed mechanic skills?
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:34:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Toaster Oven
Originally by: Angus McLean
And heh are you using Quickfit to get those readings? Generally not accurate.
I'd like to know where are you getting your numbers from? I logged onto TQ and fit out the same hardeners on a Geddon (same base resists). Clicked show info, and that's what I get. And I do have maxed out armor comp skills. So I know my numbers are accurate
Quote:
And to be exact, you dont need more than 1 rep. I tanked sentries until my cap bosters ran out easily.
Tanking sentries is a joke. Go try and tank another player in a Tier 2 BC.
Quote:
And FYI the damage output is great...for Amarr ships.
Sadly enough, this is true
Me and a corp mate were doing some test with all the BC's. Meh Harbinger won all of them except the one against the Drake...curse you Caldari.
LOL and I multiplied the numbers from the information on TQ. Lemme try it out on SISI again.
Shhhhh...Maybe they gave the Binger a secret resistance bonus because I swear I wrote the numbers down right.
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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Toaster Oven
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:44:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Toaster Oven on 27/10/2006 00:45:09
Originally by: Angus McLean
Me and a corp mate were doing some test with all the BC's. Meh Harbinger won all of them except the one against the Drake...curse you Caldari.
Try fighting against a properly setup Hurricane. With a single MARII + 1600mm plate tank, you don't need a cap injector. Stick a tracking disruptor in the last mid slot and Harbinger is toast every time. And btw, to make it really unfair you can get Hurricane sig radius down to 175m with low grade Halo set and Skirmish Warfare Mindlink 4tw 
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ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:49:00 -
[18]
Factor in rigs and this ship can become even more insane.
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 00:49:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Toaster Oven
Edited by: Toaster Oven on 27/10/2006 00:45:09
Originally by: Angus McLean
Me and a corp mate were doing some test with all the BC's. Meh Harbinger won all of them except the one against the Drake...curse you Caldari.
Try fighting against a properly setup Hurricane. With a single MARII + 1600mm plate tank, you don't need a cap injector. Stick a tracking disruptor in the last mid slot and Harbinger is toast every time. And btw, to make it really unfair you can get Hurricane sig radius down to 175m with low grade Halo set and Skirmish Warfare Mindlink 4tw
Well if I knew my corp mate was doing that id load up on Target painters for fun. Oh and I figured out the reason the damage on my Binger was so nice was all the implants I had on lol.
I took them out and it was amazing, I was going 60 damage per shot on the Drake 
Aww..you were right about the resistances too.
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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Toaster Oven
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Posted - 2006.10.27 01:00:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Toaster Oven on 27/10/2006 01:01:58
Originally by: Angus McLean
Well if I knew my corp mate was doing that id load up on Target painters for fun.
It's not so much the tracking as it is the hit to optimal range. With decent skills, a tracking disruptor II will give Heavy Pulse II with Conflag an optimal of ~3km. Hurricane with MWD is much faster than Harbinger on AB so it can dicate range and pummel you with Barrage from farther away. And if you switch to Scorch, you'll be firing into 85% EM resists on a Hurricane fielding a standard 2x EANM + DCU tank 
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Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 01:12:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Toaster Oven
Edited by: Toaster Oven on 27/10/2006 01:01:58
Originally by: Angus McLean
Well if I knew my corp mate was doing that id load up on Target painters for fun.
It's not so much the tracking as it is the hit to optimal range. With decent skills, a tracking disruptor II will give Heavy Pulse II with Conflag an optimal of ~3km. Hurricane with MWD is much faster than Harbinger on AB so it can dicate range and pummel you with Barrage from farther away. And if you switch to Scorch, you'll be firing into 85% EM resists on a Hurricane fielding a standard 2x EANM + DCU tank
Heh Im smarter than that. 425mm Autocannon II's ftw
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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LWMaverick
Quam Singulari
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.10.27 01:16:00 -
[22]
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Factor in rigs and this ship can become even more insane.
You make it sound like other ships cant use rigs.. and that the rigs are in harbinger's advantage, over all others
<3  |
Angus McLean
Gallente
Divinity Trials
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Posted - 2006.10.27 01:18:00 -
[23]
Originally by: LWMaverick
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Factor in rigs and this ship can become even more insane.
You make it sound like other ships cant use rigs.. and that the rigs are in harbinger's advantage, over all others
LOL yeah, well granted most people cant afford them. They are estimated to be 30mil each, so with any luck newer players wont be able to utilize rigs, or at least many of them.
Quote:
Basically we've established, EVE physics > Amarr
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2006.10.27 01:30:00 -
[24]
Needs the 8th turret and the grid/cpu to use it back, tbh.
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Please fix BC Sig/Agility! |
Sniser
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.10.27 10:47:00 -
[25]
Originally by: keepiru
Needs the 8th turret and the grid/cpu to use it back, tbh.
post this with numbers in kali developement forum in sticky BC tier 2 ;) there it will be read
It's great being Amarr, ain't it? |
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