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Kali HP Boost: Good or Bad

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Space Samuri	Posted - 2006.10.28 04:10:00 - [1] I havn't been able to get in the test server because i don't have the right "build" so i wanted to know... What exactly is all this talk i hear about HP boosts about? Is it going to benefit PvP?
lofty29 Tolarri Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.10.28 04:28:00 - [2] PVP takes 50% longer (or more). Much more fun --- Praxiteles Inc. is Recruiting! WTB Brokara's Modified Cap Booster
Areconus Caldari Cereal Killerz Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.10.28 04:34:00 - [3] Originally by: lofty29 PVP takes 50% longer (or more). Much more fun I agree Gloria Stitz- "Try not to bring reality in to these forums Otherwise we might take the game seriously"
Phoenix Lord The Arrow Project The ARR0W Project	Posted - 2006.10.28 05:17:00 - [4] Originally by: lofty29 PVP takes 50% longer (or more). Much more fun QFT The HP increase MIGHT also decrease the effectiveness of a blob now. So 100 ****ty ships wont automatically win against 25 heavily skilled and T2 fitted ships in fleet battles. Arrow Capital Ship Sales
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.28 05:19:00 - [5] Originally by: Phoenix Lord Originally by: lofty29 PVP takes 50% longer (or more). Much more fun QFT The HP increase MIGHT also decrease the effectiveness of a blob now. So 100 ***ty ships wont automatically win against 25 heavily skilled and T2 fitted ships in fleet battles. Wrong... - It's great being Minmatar, ain't it?*
Blighter	Posted - 2006.10.28 05:26:00 - [6] just makes them get a bigger blob
Samirol Ore Mongers	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:00:00 - [7] bad, blobs ftl This corp is recruiting. Billboard Project
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:09:00 - [8] Edited by: Dred''Pirate Jesus on 28/10/2006 06:09:35 Originally by: Samirol bad, blobs ftl Until they fix the node crashes/massive lag that blobs cause then I bet it'll be "Blobs ftw" again.. [2:02:08] Dred'Pirate Jesus > I'm Mexican you dolt.. It's pronouced "hey zeus" not "gee zus"
Glumpumpkin House Elf Liberation Front	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:09:00 - [9] The HP boost puts huge emphasis on DPS over alpha strike. I'm not going to draw conclusions until Kali is live and I have a chance to fly around killing things, but I'm looking forward to fleets of hilariously fitted battleships MWDing 200km to engage enemy snipers at close range, and winning (if the snipers don't warp off, of course)
zurich93 XERCORE	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:14:00 - [10] its made it alot harder for solo pvpers, say it was 2 vs 1 the 2 people have a higher advantage since they have 2x the bonus from kali while the solo dude only has 1x the bonus Eg, The solo dude had (random number) 1k armor, the bonus has given him 1.25k armor (tech 2 ship) the people he is fighting have 1K armor each also and are in tech 2 ships so they both ahve 1.25k, thus the solo guy has a bonus of .25 or 250 armor but the 2 pilots have a combined bonus of 500, thats just the way i look at it. Sucks for people like me who do have theses kind of fights alot. 50% and 25% bonus wont make a difference when a 100 man fleet locks on to your bs, you will still get insta popped. seems like an easy option to fix a problem that i pearsonaly diddnt think was there. Nope starts here actually :O -----Sig starts here------- <3 Kaemonn eep eep beep heep keep womble... YOU DO NOT POSESS THE POWER TO DISGUINISH MY SIG FROM MY POST MWHAHAHA
Major Stormer Caldari Demon Womb	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:15:00 - [11] Gonna say good for now. I will reserve full judgements until after playing in pvp combat. -------------------------- Join Demon Womb! PVP, Rats, Industry, join the fun!
MECTO	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:18:00 - [12] Edited by: MECTO on 28/10/2006 06:18:13 kali favors blobs, noobs and carebears soo.. bad It's Great Being Carebear in Kali - aint it? Originally by: Tuxford In this picture you might think that Gallente totally pwn. Well they're alright
Zaethiel Murder-Death-Kill Blood Raiders Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:29:00 - [13] Couldn't they just have made the corresponding skills add more than 5% Armor/Shield as they are leveled up? So you would have 50% more armor/shield with lvl 5 in the skill? _________________________________________
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:43:00 - [14] I don't see how double the hp suddenly would make gangs increase. People who blobbed before, are going to keep at it. It all depends on how many are in the corp/alliance. And what that alliance does. 8 man specialized merc corps for instance, will not magically increase to 45 active mercs, because there was a hitpoint increase. If they decided to disband and join a bigger corp. because it became too difficult to work under those conditions. Then -yes- that's bad. However, we do not know the ACTUAL effects yet. I think most people will remain oblivious to how to set their ships up, despite having more hitpoints. And those who aren't will still have the upper hand in combat. [ore mongers, recruiting]
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:43:00 - [15] Originally by: MECTO kali favors blobs, noobs and carebears soo.. bad Considering that carebears and noobs make up the majority of the player base and the extreme difficulty of trying to hammer out some other balanced way to have alliance warefare beyond blobs without completely revamping pvp i'd say the changes are going to be good.. Remember CCP has all the info to map out changes whilst we only get tidbits here and there to base our views.. Not saying that some players views don't have merit.. [2:02:08] Dred'Pirate Jesus > I'm Mexican you dolt.. It's pronouced "hey zeus" not "gee zus"
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 06:47:00 - [16] Originally by: Tobias Sjodin However, we do not know the ACTUAL effects yet. Yup.. Just coined a new term.. "Wait and SeeÖ" [2:02:08] Dred'Pirate Jesus > I'm Mexican you dolt.. It's pronouced "hey zeus" not "gee zus"
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.28 07:50:00 - [17] Its going to make fights longer. I havent heard anyone complaining about it on the test server though, so maybe you quickly get used to it. Personally Im fine with it and I dont think its the end of the world. I never wanted longer fights, but now that its here, I think I can learn to enjoy it. :) --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:04:00 - [18] both, the extended pvp periods is a good thing as fights are over to quick. but if other items such as cap booster charges alpha strike weapons are not adjusted in a similar manner it will unbalance the game making it a bad thing. _____ RAM is recruiting
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:10:00 - [19] Originally by: dantes inferno it will unbalance the game making it a bad thing. And what do you know about that? Have you seen it implemented? People judge too damn quickly. Get a grip. [ore mongers, recruiting]
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:14:00 - [20] Quote: And what do you know about that? Have you seen it implemented? People judge too damn quickly. Get a grip. ok atm the things are more or less balanced though alpha strike is not as good as it should be. now you increase one side of the equation but not the other that now makes it unbalanced. im not saying hp should not be increased, i am saying that cap and booster should also be increased also weapons which rely on a large initial dmg output should also be increased to bring them in line again retaining balance _____ RAM is recruiting
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:16:00 - [21] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 28/10/2006 08:17:12 Originally by: dantes inferno both, the extended pvp periods is a good thing as fights are over to quick. but if other items such as cap booster charges alpha strike weapons are not adjusted in a similar manner it will unbalance the game making it a bad thing. This is really a topic that needs its own thread (cap and booster charges). Personally I would very much prefer if you couldnt just pop cap charges like crazy, because it nullifies the minmatar and caldari advantage of using no cap for their guns/missiles. Anyway, it deserves a discussion. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:18:00 - [22] there is a limit to how much charges you can pop though, once you load your hold with enough ammo to actualy fight you are lucky if you can hold 4/5 charges. so it does not nullfy the advantage that much. especialy now with combat been drawn out longer-it could infact overpower that no cap usage advantage of the caldari/mimitar if cap/boosters are not adjusted with hp _____ RAM is recruiting
Nicholai Pestot Gallente Havoc Inc	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:20:00 - [23] Edited by: Nicholai Pestot on 28/10/2006 08:21:56 I forsee an increase in the 'bait' tactic. For those of you who havn't experianced this, a super tanked BS sits on a gate and waits for someone to agress.He then holds while re-inforcements flood in and jumps while at 10% armour after doing his job and trapping the smaller blob for his own larger blob. With the HP changes im thinking the bait BS's can be spread over wider areas, or you could even use a bait BC or bait cruiser (stranger things have happened). Huzzah for picket ships and any change that encourages such tactics . Lets hope people engage such obvious traps with their own sacrifical ships to spring the trap.OMG skirmish fighting in alliance space ________________ What you do is you store up the rage, let it fester while you gain strength, then use it to gank those weaker than you... and so the circle of life is complete
Toro Viejo	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:21:00 - [24] According to this info... does it mean that those who rely more in capacitor to keep shooting will get nerfed (again)? If fights are going to be longer, won't those who use energy weapons be somehow nerfed? note: I haven't tested that, it is just a question that comes to my mind after reading that ships will have 50% more HP.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:21:00 - [25] Originally by: dantes inferno there is a limit to how much charges you can pop though, once you load your hold with enough ammo to actualy fight you are lucky if you can hold 4/5 charges. so it does not nullfy the advantage that much. especialy now with combat been drawn out longer-it could infact overpower that no cap usage advantage of the caldari/mimitar if cap/boosters are not adjusted with hp I used to use 12 cap charges with Raven with no problems. Still plenty of room for missiles etc. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:28:00 - [26] Quote: I used to use 12 cap charges with Raven with no problems. Still plenty of room for missiles etc. what size charges?? cause the only ones usefull for pvp is a 800 on a bs...and i can only fit 10ish at most on a domi which needs no ammo, but we could possibly leave charges as they are and just increase cap...because now its going to be very difficult for other ships to hold their tank and kill a opponent on current cap with the hp increase. either that or bring balance by making missiles and proj use cap so every one is in the same boat. or we could end up with the scenario where every one is flying caldari as their the only viable pvp option. _____ RAM is recruiting
Lygos ISS Navy Task Force	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:30:00 - [27] Well, Destroyers are 50% less effective agaisnt Interceptors now, which, combined with their previous ratio makes almost no difference at all. It's also going to be harder for +8km disruptor-tacklers to keep up capacitor long enough. Nos is going to be more powerful. It always becomes more powerful as the game shifts to tanking. The changes to Capital ships means they may get more front-line use. Probably not, unless the majority of the fleet can each field one. Autocannons will be all the rage in close range setups, which means increased popularization of EANMs. All the same, we've been through stranger changes, and I've got more important things to worry about. --- Private Investment should preceed Public Investment
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:33:00 - [28] Originally by: dantes inferno Quote: I used to use 12 cap charges with Raven with no problems. Still plenty of room for missiles etc. what size charges?? cause the only ones usefull for pvp is a 800 on a bs...and i can only fit 10ish at most on a domi which needs no ammo, but we could possibly leave charges as they are and just increase cap...because now its going to be very difficult for other ships to hold their tank and kill a opponent on current cap with the hp increase. either that or bring balance by making missiles and proj use cap so every one is in the same boat. or we could end up with the scenario where every one is flying caldari as their the only viable pvp option. Yeah, it was 800 sized, but I had 4 loaded in the injector, so 8 in cargo. And yeah, I could have 10 if I wanted to as well. Still, thats A LOT of cap to be injected. :) People will have to test the impact of the hp changes on the test server to see if a change is needed. I think the blasterships will rip through the extra hp with just a few extra charges, but we'll see.... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:36:00 - [29] i was counting those in the hold. but you cant hold 10 if you have any form of ammo. most i can hold with 3000 rounds of am ammo is 5..so gives me 9 charges, which as you can appreciate on long ops in hostile territory is usless (i speak of pvp as that is where unbalance will show the most). but i would be happy with booster charges remaining the same. what i would like to see is either 1) cap increased on all ships to match the hp changed 2) missiles and projectiles given cap usage to level it out. _____ RAM is recruiting
Pottsey Gallente Acme Shipping Inc	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:48:00 - [30] The HP change was good last time and its good this time. Some thing might need tweaking but overall its good. Passive shield tanking guide click here
ElCoCo KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:54:00 - [31] You'll just get used to it. I can't remember if on my gankathron it took 20 secs to kill someone or 30
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.28 08:58:00 - [32] Originally by: ElCoCo You'll just get used to it. I can't remember if on my gankathron it took 20 secs to kill someone or 30 Yeah, this is what im saying... the changes wont be a problem for gallente. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 09:02:00 - [33] I don't see how running out of cap (either as an attacker, or a target) is a necessarily a bad thing. The point is to get the fight to last longer, both the attacker and the defender needs cap for a fight. And running out of cap will still have the same consequence as previously. If you run out of cap & cap-charges early in a fight, you will die easily. This applies to all parties. How is this NOT balanced? [ore mongers, recruiting]
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 09:42:00 - [34] Quote: I don't see how running out of cap (either as an attacker, or a target) is a necessarily a bad thing. The point is to get the fight to last longer, both the attacker and the defender needs cap for a fight. And running out of cap will still have the same consequence as previously. If you run out of cap & cap-charges early in a fight, you will die easily. This applies to all parties. How is this NOT balanced? how? scenario 1: raven vs railathron 40 seconds into the fight mega runs out of cap no mods work. raven is still able to fire its weapons..balanced? scenario 2: apoc vs railathron 4o secons into the fight apoc runs out of cap..mega still at 40%...balanced? these are small deficiencies in todays game play which will be made oh so much more aparant with a increase in HP therefore a increase in time for fights to finnish. RAM is recruiting
wierchas noobhunter Caldari Praxiteles Inc. E N I G M A	Posted - 2006.10.28 09:52:00 - [35] bad ... join me be cool
Pestillence Chav-Scum	Posted - 2006.10.28 09:54:00 - [36] See how fun you think pvp is when all your targets de-aggress and dock or jump.
Thor Xian State War Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 09:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Pestillence See how fun you think pvp is when all your targets de-aggress and dock or jump. Most people call that a win. ~TX
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 10:03:00 - [38] Bah.. Same concern before RMR hp boost and noones complaining now.. And TBH if there really is a game breaking imbalance i'm sure the flames on the forums will get a hotfix or two after some actuall playing is done.. OR.. All you smart alliance guys could log on to SISI and help prebalance things now that the initial "OMG Kali is on SISI" rush is over.. CCP can only have so many paid testers ya know.. [2:02:08] Dred'Pirate Jesus > I'm Mexican you dolt.. It's pronouced "hey zeus" not "gee zus"
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 10:16:00 - [39] Originally by: dantes inferno how? scenario 1: raven vs railathron 40 seconds into the fight mega runs out of cap no mods work. raven is still able to fire its weapons..balanced? Surely depends on how the ships are fitted, and a bunch of other factors (if both are prepared for the 1v1, or what happened previously, etc.). If the combatants are prepared for the fight, and close range, I would stack the odds for the winner about the same as I do today. Hypothetical scenarios and real in-game experience are two entirely different things. Quote: scenario 2: apoc vs railathron 4o secons into the fight apoc runs out of cap..mega still at 40%...balanced? these are small deficiencies in todays game play which will be made oh so much more aparant with a increase in HP therefore a increase in time for fights to finnish. It will perhaps change how I would fit my ship. Perhaps go with more NOS for lastability as the Apoc. I should imagine "generally" (since this is all hypothetical) an Apoc has a better tank, and if the mega is using all blasters in the highs. I would still factor the odds about the same in this fight as they are today. Meaning, close-range, I would put favour to a well-equipped megathron in close combat. Skills, and circumstances still play in. And what you deem as "unbalanced" I think may just be 'different'. But we still don't know the implications it will have on Tranq. there are a lot of differences applied ALONG with the hp change. All calculated and tested by devs. who we have entrusted our faith to before. Let's give it a shot before we start whining and complaining, shall we? [ore mongers, recruiting]
Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.10.28 10:43:00 - [40] Edited by: Plutoinum on 28/10/2006 10:50:26 Originally by: Jim McGregor Originally by: ElCoCo You'll just get used to it. I can't remember if on my gankathron it took 20 secs to kill someone or 30 Yeah, this is what im saying... the changes wont be a problem for gallente. Yes, it's not only about cap, but also about dps. 10% less dps doesn't mean that you need 10% more time to kill a heavy tank, it can mean that you need twice (!) the time or that you can't even break a tank at all in the extreme.
ElCoCo KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.28 10:44:00 - [41] Originally by: dantes inferno scenario 1: raven vs railathron 40 seconds into the fight mega runs out of cap no mods work. raven is still able to fire its weapons..balanced? scenario 2: apoc vs railathron 4o secons into the fight apoc runs out of cap..mega still at 40%...balanced?. So in the first scenario the mega runs out of cap in 40 seconds Where in the second scenario the same mega still has 40% cap left at the same 40secs? You know you should stop exaggerating to make your point. Also in comparison, tachyon beams don't drain that much more cap compared to 425 rails and the apoc has a much larger capacitor to start with. I've yet to see a sensible post wanting to buff this, nerf that, that also takes into account the races differences (i.e. no ammo for lasers, no cap for projectiles). So far almost everyone wants to do the same damage as his X races counterpart ship.
Zoxia Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:01:00 - [42] Edited by: Zoxia on 28/10/2006 11:04:01 I have a question. I have heard there will also be more damage too is this true?? that would seem to offset this HP boost abit. something about riggs. Also are they making it possible to add to resist more??
ElCoCo KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:05:00 - [43] Originally by: Zoxia I have a question. I have heard there will also be more damage too is this true?? that would seem to offset this HP boost abit. The existing ships/modules haven't changed. Only thing in kali that will increase damage is the addition of rigs and combat boosters.
Zoxia Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:09:00 - [44] Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: Zoxia I have a question. I have heard there will also be more damage too is this true?? that would seem to offset this HP boost abit. The existing ships/modules haven't changed. Only thing in kali that will increase damage is the addition of rigs and combat boosters. so once these boosters rigs are in play the HP boost will be less of a factor.
ElCoCo KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:11:00 - [45] Originally by: Zoxia Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: Zoxia I have a question. I have heard there will also be more damage too is this true?? that would seem to offset this HP boost abit. The existing ships/modules haven't changed. Only thing in kali that will increase damage is the addition of rigs and combat boosters. so once these boosters rigs are in play the HP boost will be less of a factor. It will depend on their price, ease of use etc Noone would put expensive stuff on t1 stock ships so we'll see.
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:24:00 - [46] Edited by: dantes inferno on 28/10/2006 11:25:30 Quote: So in the first scenario the mega runs out of cap in 40 seconds Where in the second scenario the same mega still has 40% cap left at the same 40secs? Raven does more dmg than the apoc hence needs to use the LAR more which affects the mega cap :D also in my hypothetical scenario raven has NOS, Apoc dont :D Quote: The existing ships/modules haven't changed. Only thing in kali that will increase damage is the addition of rigs and combat boosters. yes the ships have changed..a considerable increase in hp is quite a change dont you think? RAM is recruiting
Misses Gap	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:25:00 - [47] Edited by: Misses Gap on 28/10/2006 11:26:44 A couple of thoughts: o) Station warfare: The undock/redock timer needs to be increased substantially as soon as HPs are boosted or you will just see people undock, tank a bit, redock, rinse repeat. We already see the boring routine of that many times a day, but this time not even one ship will pop. o) Near gate warfare Bait(le) ships tanked to hell sitting on a gate will be very common, to effectively remove them before they are able to jump out will be moving from near to absolute impossible. Subsequently PvP oriented players will be Blobbing yet even more which can topple the Eve experience quite a bit. Especially with the servers still not being able to handle fleets that go over 60 ships. o) Projectile and low DPs weapons These will be a very rare breed to be used out there anymore. Devs, prepare to hear shouts of terror and despair from Minmatar players. There will be hardly any for ships that cannot shell out absurd amounts of damage so anything sub-battleship will be degraded to tackling at best. Possible Fixes: - Increase redock timer - Allow low DPs weapons (and maybe those exclusively) to target, harm and maybe cripple vital enemy shipsystems. - Change aggression timers and find a way to delay jumps to balance bait ship techniques ? - In case it didnt sink in - Make it so that while high shields, armor, hull, etc keep ships from actually popping that the enemy can target warp engines, shield boosters, armor reppers, cap injectors, and so on directly. Maybe even disable the jump gate communication system on a target to prevent it from gate jumping out.
dantes inferno Caldari Rampage Eternal	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:26:00 - [48] and ofc the agression timer needs a 50% increase to keep it balanced. RAM is recruiting
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 11:41:00 - [49] Originally by: Misses Gap [...] Subsequently PvP oriented players will be Blobbing yet even more which can topple the Eve experience quite a bit. Especially with the servers still not being able to handle fleets that go over 60 ships. Again, how will this happen? With the same people still playing the game. Will everyone in todays gangs somehow multiply like cells? It's all dependent on what people are in the game, in the corp., in the gang. Alliances will still blob, since fleets is how alliances generally combat eachother. Pirates will still be in small gangs, they will not somehow magically have ALOT more people in their gangs. This idea of people suddenly flying in blobs is senseless in my eyes. People who blobbed before, will still blob. It's a part of the game. You don't like it? Fine. But if you can't live with it... then that's your decision. Camping specific people at stations imho, is pretty silly in general. I'm glad if that changes so it won't be as easy. If you stillwant to gank them, then you can place a mwd battleship behind the docking-ramp, and bump the target out of docking-range. then web it. If they don't want to fight you, they still can undock, and redock. They don't have to open fire. And you don't have to sit there. Oh, all weapons don't magically become unbalanced, because the hitpoints of the ships are doubled. [ore mongers, recruiting]
Misses Gap	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:10:00 - [50] Edited by: Misses Gap on 28/10/2006 12:15:50 Tobias, I am sorry to say you are wrong. Yes, the total amount of people in combat may stay the same. But - blobbage will simply occur at 99% of the time instead of 75 %. I know it is hard to imagine but some others than you actually rove around in small gangs of 3-5 people, then sometimes blob and occasionally go solo. That is, the very same people - say - in my corp. This will not happen much anymore as the DPs cant match the HP boost that well. It'll be the Blob or nothing at worst. Also, with more hitpoints people can undock, take one two pot shots and then wait out the aggression timer far more easily That is, if the agression timer will stay the same of course ;) Fix to the HP and BloB thing above - give small cailber guns/lasers/missiles a chance to target and disable vital systems and modules on enemy ships. It's sexy and you know you want it. grins Gap
Zoxia Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:17:00 - [51] until they see they complete effects of the riggs and boosters you cant really say squat. SO i would hold off saying anything until that happens. trying to milk the devs for other options before those that are being introduced have been fully tested and exploited is jumping to conclusions at best and pushing your own agenda at worst.
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:23:00 - [52] Originally by: Misses Gap Tobias, I am sorry to say you are wrong. I am sure, you're convinced otherwise. But before we see everything implemented, we simply do not know. Right now, I just take the above statement as arrogance. [ore mongers, recruiting]
Misses Gap Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:31:00 - [53] Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Originally by: Misses Gap Tobias, I am sorry to say you are wrong. I am sure, you're convinced otherwise. But before we see everything implemented, we simply do not know. Right now, I just take the above statement as arrogance. 'tis fine if you want to call it arrogance, Tobias hun. :D However nothing in Eve is ever finished, waiting things out without discussing its implications before they hit the stone and stay there occassionally hurt quite a bit. Sit back and wait until this happens and you may be getting a surprise that has no return tag. After all, this is a would be discussion to probe the changes. hugs, Gap
Amerame Section XIII	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:35:00 - [54] Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Originally by: Misses Gap Tobias, I am sorry to say you are wrong. I am sure, you're convinced otherwise. But before we see everything implemented, we simply do not know. Right now, I just take the above statement as arrogance. Players will adapt to the game mechanisms, might not be overnight, but if you need more people to be efficient in a pvp gang(k) then corps / alliances will use bigger gangs.
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:36:00 - [55] Originally by: Misses Gap [...] waiting things out without discussing its implications before they hit the stone and stay there occassionally hurt quite a bit. I suggest you try it out before you discuss it. Things are so different between hypothesis and actual experience. People always tend to whine when changes happen. I think it's more a general fear of change that hits people. If you want to change something, there's always some people who will whine about it. If we go five months ahead of time, and, devs decide to nerf HP back to how it is now. Someone will argue, very eloquently how "everything is balanced", and "CCP doesn't know what they're doing!!11" followed by "The sky is falling!". I myself trust the Tux, until proven wrong, through hard gameplay. And quit pretending to be a woman, There are none in this game. ;) [ore mongers, recruiting]
Dred'Pirate Jesus Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:37:00 - [56] Edited by: Dred''Pirate Jesus on 28/10/2006 12:38:21 blah comments discarded.. [2:02:08] Dred'Pirate Jesus > I'm Mexican you dolt.. It's pronouced "hey zeus" not "gee zus"
Godar Marak Amarr Return Of Red Dawn	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:37:00 - [57] Lets see.... CCP says 'blobs are not cool' then CCP says 'more hitpoints longer fights' DO I need thicker glasses? I cant find the logic -------------------- Tuxford you broke my beloved EVE
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:40:00 - [58] Originally by: Amerame Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Originally by: Misses Gap Tobias, I am sorry to say you are wrong. I am sure, you're convinced otherwise. But before we see everything implemented, we simply do not know. Right now, I just take the above statement as arrogance. Players will adapt to the game mechanisms, might not be overnight, but if you need more people to be efficient in a pvp gang(k) then corps / alliances will use bigger gangs. This is as true now, as it's ever been. WHEN has blobs, in the history of EVE, NOT been effective? When in the past has 20 battleships versus 5 battleships been an even match? It still comes down to fittings, tactics, and how you operate. Yeah, it's a change, but saying everyone will just "start blobbing, or fail at EVE", is just a huge hyperbole. [ore mongers, recruiting]
Amerame Section XIII	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:42:00 - [59] Originally by: Godar Marak Lets see.... CCP says 'blobs are not cool' then CCP says 'more hitpoints longer fights' DO I need thicker glasses? I cant find the logic I'm even more concerned about the capital ship HP boost, on the paper it might look cool, but when you'll absolutely NEED a 250 people fleet to defend a PoS guess what ? all that will be left in eve are alliances that can get 250 people in a gang to defend their PoS, therefore battles will involve 500+ people all the time, which again might be good in theory but I fear that the server are nowhere near able to deal with this kind of battles.
Mi Lai Sanguine Legion Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:47:00 - [60] Only slight worry I have is more people able to play the 'de-aggress Jump/Dock game'. I reserve my final judgment after I tried upping my damage output by more then the HP boost in my new Hurricane
Misses Gap Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.28 12:55:00 - [61] Edited by: Misses Gap on 28/10/2006 12:55:46 Tobias sweety, your logic is flawed - again. If there are no woman in this game, then so are not any pirates. Unless you are the guy who stabs others with the umbrella to get his morning coffee first. I am now on test server and ready to do some fighting if you want. Dont be so obsessed and try not to flame the others too much to drive your agenda. Try to be more empathic, e.g. the fact that more HPs are fine, but it needs a change in combat itself. For instance - yes you guessed it - small damage dealing weapons should be allowed to have a chance to disable modules/systems on the enemy ship. Gap P.S.: Neither gender can ignore your lovely jaw - so dont be shy ;)
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.28 13:13:00 - [62] Sorry, "Misses", I will not agree to any of your hypothesises unless they're proven to be right after a good while of playing it on Tranquility. And I think you roleplay a woman just fine. Just don't forget what MMORPG really stands for. [ore mongers, recruiting]
Gonada Gallente Cross Roads	Posted - 2006.10.28 13:23:00 - [63] methinks the hp boost is a good idea. methinks you all are whining for no apperant cause, remeber hp boost affects everyone methinks everyone is going to have to adapt, and those that cry no cap! better learn to use cap injectors. -I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.-
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2006.10.28 13:35:00 - [64] Originally by: Gonada methinks everyone is going to have to adapt, and those that cry no cap! better learn to use cap injectors. I'm posting here to tell you that your thinking isnt enough since your thinking is below the average standard. Didnt you hear, cap boosters are getting nerfed. N=R* x fp x ne x fl x Fi x fc x L
St Dragon Blood Association of Dragons	Posted - 2006.10.28 13:36:00 - [65] HP increase is just the begining of the changes tux wants to do to fix combat abd destroy blobs so on its own its ok i guess but its just the start of the changes. ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2006.10.28 20:02:00 - [66] on test server, dessies are about worthless. At least on trang you can use them to pop pods/shuttles at gatecamps very quickly.
Nir	Posted - 2006.10.28 20:15:00 - [67] You can't boost 50% HPs without creating a spree of side effects that go with it. RMR created more problems than it solved. Combat becomes longer yes, but if you don't fix the side effects.. at what cost? I think Tuxford has done a good job since he was appointed honestly, but he needs to drop the idea that a 50% HP increase is the miracle cure for everything.

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