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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15614
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Posted - 2015.04.19 11:36:48 -
[1] - Quote
Yuri Gagarijn wrote:How much SP do you recommend for the RS? Im just playing for two or three months.
I would say go for the raven and use it for level 3 missions to get used to the ship class.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15622
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Posted - 2015.04.21 22:07:15 -
[2] - Quote
Caleidascope wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yuri Gagarijn wrote:How much SP do you recommend for the RS? Im just playing for two or three months. 1) I would say go for the raven 2) and use it for level 3 missions to get used to the ship class. 1 is good advice. 2 is bad advice.
No it is sound advice.
Level 3 missions are far less dangerous than diving right into level 4 missions and will allow the OP to use the battleship with far fewer skills both in terms of SP and piloting.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15626
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Posted - 2015.04.23 03:20:39 -
[3] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:baltec1 wrote:Caleidascope wrote:baltec1 wrote:Yuri Gagarijn wrote:How much SP do you recommend for the RS? Im just playing for two or three months. 1) I would say go for the raven 2) and use it for level 3 missions to get used to the ship class. 1 is good advice. 2 is bad advice. No it is sound advice. Level 3 missions are far less dangerous than diving right into level 4 missions and will allow the OP to use the battleship with far fewer skills both in terms of SP and piloting. I think the point they were trying to make is a Raven is a horrible choice for L3 missions and they are correct. However I see what you want the OP to accomplish so I understand your reasoning for the suggestion.
Slap RHML on it and its not too shabby. ( It earns more than an ishtar in lvl 3 blitzing) Its not a mach thats for sure.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15638
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Posted - 2015.04.25 11:37:00 -
[4] - Quote
Rattle is not a good ship for someone new to battleships, especially for level 3s.
They require more SP to use, more management and they are twice the cost of a raven. In level 3s you want to be moving to the next objective while you are shooting targets so rattles with sentries are right off the bat at a disadvantage in speed. If you use other drones then you have the flight time of the drones. On top of that you are managing two weapon systems at the same time.
Raven is much faster to train into and easier to use. Remember, OP is learning the basics of flying a battleship so tossing him into the most management intensive of all the battleships is not the best way to go about this.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 03:45:09 -
[5] - Quote
W0lf Crendraven wrote:
Did you read the stuff above? Of all bs the rattler is the easiest to train into, its harder to maximize but to reach 750+ dps easily you need to spend like a week of training as its main damage comes from its role bonus.
Did you read what I said?
No matter how you try to argue this the rattle had two weapon systems you need to train and maintain. When you are learning a ship class you want the first steps to be as easy as you can make it and the rattle is not the best option for this. The raven only has the one weapon system it needs to worry about and is so easy to get into it has been to go to mission boat for the last decade.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 04:08:06 -
[6] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote: I think the Rattlesnake is potentially more forgiving for newer players.
How?
Two weapon systems to train for so it takes twice as long to train.
Two lines of battleship are required to be trained.
You have two weapons to use so you have twice as much work in that area.
Drones require you to look after them and the rattle is not bonuses for light/med drones.
The raven is much easier to get into, cheaper, easier to use and fit. The rattle is something to aim for after you have been in the raven not before.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 04:29:54 -
[7] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Because even at level 3 in each BS line, each weapon system type it will still out damage and with better application a Raven.
You can out damage a fully level V skilled Raven pilot in a Rattle piloted by a player with level 4 skills. It is just that simple. Again, Raven is not a good choice for level 3, you get all the draw backs of using a BS in a level 3 without the benefit of more dps. Rattle is also a ship that the OP can continue to skill and get better and better, where a Raven the pilot has to change weapon skills to get better and get a new hull.
What you are proposing is the OP get a Raven and skill for heavy missiles, then after "mastering" that he start skilling for cruise or torp, skill for Rattle (which means drones) or a Golem (very long skill train) and then sell his hull for upgrade.
What the rattle offers is to train for heavies and drones (which he already has) and use a ship that today gets him more DPS, more tank and better application of damage. Then tomorrow when he is level V his Rattle is only that much more amplified.
You are asking him to waste time and skills on something he wont fly tomorrow.
Remind me, what battleship skill is required for the raven and the rattle?
Also, tell us what weapon system both ships get bonuses to?
Zero time is wasted here, the skills you get for the raven are the very same skills you need for the rattle. Also remember, I put a lot of time into a level 3 raven on a new pilot so I know exactly what it can do. The rattle was also tested and it is slower simply because of the way drones work. DPS isn't everything here.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 04:36:14 -
[8] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
You want the OP to train heavy missiles and fly a Raven then switch to a Golem with Cruise.
I have never mentioned the golem. What the OP does after learning the basics with the raven is up to him.
Market McSelling Alt wrote: I want the OP to max his skills to fly a Rattle while actually flying a Rattle all the while a better choice both now and in the future for him.
And I want the OP to learn the basics in an easy to get into ship as possible as quickly as possible for as little isk as needed.
Market McSelling Alt wrote: I don't see why you continue to argue this
Because you are giving poor advice.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 05:06:27 -
[9] - Quote
Aeon Ecko wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Aeon Ecko wrote:Megathron. I'm not re-quoting this fit. It makes my eyes bleed... No one one told you too in the first place. The OP was asking. That fit is outdated been updated anyway its already been answered. Your comment is mind boggling.
Its a poor fit.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 05:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
Aeon Ecko wrote: Never said it was the best in the game but I did ask for a counter fit to help out.
Blasters lack the range to be effective lvl 4 mission runners unless you have speed and TE/Computers which your ship doesn't. The weapon systems in question reduce your resists to zero and even with the best willpower a ship with zero resists and no rep is going to die even in level 3s. The lowslots have way way too many damage mods, past three they become pointless.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 05:38:31 -
[11] - Quote
Aeon Ecko wrote:
I respect that that is fair points. You learn something new everyday. Thanks for info will pass it along. Need more post like this. I did try put a few resists on but they never show correct not sure if bug or what. I figured too many damage mods before but I was not sure how much power OP needed but I could easy on them in a heart beat for repair, nano, or resist mod and go micro but I don't know if he will get scrambled or something.
Those guns reduce resists to 0 no matter what you fit. Damage mod wise anything over 3 suffers from diminishing returns to the point where they add very little. The last 4 damage mods on your ship add no damage at all, they are dead weight. Rats don't scramble.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15646
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Posted - 2015.04.26 05:58:08 -
[12] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote: The 4th typically yields 4.5-5% additional DPS, so I wouldn't exactly call it pointless.
I'd only fit it if you didn't have anything else. A TE will add more DPS than a Mag stab.
baltec1 wrote: I would generally say that's correct. There are a few L4 missions ("The Damsel", "Stop the Thief") where blasters will excel, but these would be the exception rather than the rule.
Kronos can pull it off. If you can hit 50km with null then you can get away with it in a normal mega but you need max skills to get away with it.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15663
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Posted - 2015.04.26 21:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
If we are going to push the OP towards high damage pirate battleships then we might as well say train for the mach.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
15671
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Posted - 2015.04.27 08:18:22 -
[14] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Mach does not scale well to low skill players.
It took a month to be viable on my alt who had no gunnery or minmatar ship skills, It is a shorter train than the rattle.
Market McSelling Alt wrote: T1 arties and ACs and the lack of ability to properly use a MJD or MWD would be a death sentence in a ship that already has tank issues and relies on DPS for tank.
Hence my advice of running it in level 3 missions for a while.
Market McSelling Alt wrote: Rattle is not just a high damage pirate BS, it is a High Damage/High Survivability multipurpose Pirate BS. It honestly is OP, but that is ok. It just happens to be one of the most perfect ships to learn missions in
The perfect ship to learn how to pilot battleships in missions is something you can train into very quickly, is very easy to use and costs as little as possible. That rattle is not that ship.
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