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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.31 13:52:00 -
[1]
A significant change in the way gangs are formed and managed will have a massive impact on the way that large scale combat is conducted in Eve.
I have read massive amounts of speculation on the topic, but the ONLY information we have on this massive change in one of the most basic game mechanics are the new skills on Sisi (http://imagesocket.com/view/leader6e1.png) and the following comment by Oveur.
http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=382
Quote: We also have the Combat Organization project consisting of the seamless map, improved system scanning, new gang hierarchy (fleets, squadrons) and better situational awareness through gang information broadcasts and integrated voice communication.
From the above you can easily see that each squad can contain up to 10 people, each wing can contain up to 5 squads (50 people), and each fleet 5 wings (250 people).
Current fleets in alliance combat are regularly around 80-150 people. Using my own stats (only 6 charisma, starting with learning 3), it would take over 60 days to train Fleet Command V allowing me create a gang larger than 40 people (including advanced learning).
Obviously it is not possible to test these skills AT ALL on the test server, so I have a number of questions regarding the implementation of these skills that really need answering:
1) Are we going to be forced to use the new gang hierarchy and skills, or will we be able to create gangs as we can now and lose any tactical advantages of the new system?
2) What exactly are the advantages of the new system? What will we be able to do that we cannot currently do with a small amount of organization on teamspeak?
3) How are invites handled with the new system, who does it?
4) Assuming I have Fleet Command V; will I have to find and organise 5 people with Wing Command V, and 25 people with Squad Command V to get 250 in gang, or will my skills cascade down to Wing/Squad commanders?
5) What happens to the fleet if a Fleet/Wing/Squad commander crashes?
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.31 15:04:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Bermag Can't be hard to test for those of you on test server. Just form a gang without the gang leader have any leadership skills and see what will happen.
The problem is that last time I checked you could not form a gang on the test server.
You also cannot train 70+ days worth of skills to actually test anything.
Even if you could, getting 70+ people on the test server at the same time is almost impossible.
This is why I would like to have a developer step in and answer some of our questions, because is is a major change to a very low level game mechanic which we have no way to test.
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.11.01 10:02:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Decairn It shouldn't be hard to test out wing command - many people have leadership V already, will only take a second to train wing command I and II.
Last time I check you CAN NOT FORM A GANG ON THE TEST SERVER
The only way we are going to get any questions answered is if a developer comes in here and answers them for us. This is a major change that I am extremely concerned about, and we are completely in the dark with almost every bit of information.
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.11.04 21:12:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Fubear on 04/11/2006 21:13:53
Originally by: Oveur Trolling the forums on Saturdays are good and beneficial for all mankind! 1: Is the old gang mechanism still available and if so has it been changed at all
Old gang is still available but has the following limitations (which might change): Max 50 members, no damage state updates, no members visible in seamless map and no gang bonuess work. Some of the new stuff works, like the roles and the gang broadcast messages.
<snip>
6: How much situational information is available, eg in current gangs you can see the health of all members in the same grid
See above. You also get the new gang broadcast and new gang commands.
<snip>
13: Can you skips levels, so can you have a squadron included in a fleet along side some wings, without needing a token wing in between.
No, afaik you need to stick to the hierachy.
1: What are these new gang-roles you speak of? How do broadcast messages work?
6: New Gang commands?
13: What do you do when you have more squads than wing commanders to lead them? Do these people have to stay at home?
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.11.04 22:17:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Hllaxiu
Originally by: Fubear
13: What do you do when you have more squads than wing commanders to lead them? Do these people have to stay at home?
You create a second gang - duh... This will all be coordinated on TS anyways.
So you have your fleet of 40 people, and then a seperate gang of stragglers who completely lose out on any of the gang advantages like broadcast messages, gang chat, being 'warpToAble' or appearing on the seamless map for the FC. All because the commanders dont have 3Mil SP in Leadership?
the newgang structure is interesting, and I would like to try it out, but limiting it by skills does not bring anything positive to the game at all and only acts as a barrier to grouping people up.
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.11.06 12:31:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Satal Sonshi
I Fully Support Dracones Recommendations
I think this is one of the most insightful recommendations I've yet read, and I would like to promote it. The "gang-size" and "organization" should not be heavily limited by the game. It's the *bonuses* that should be limited.
Eve's skill system is predicated on the thought that you can get access to whatever you want fairly easily (e.g. I have a BS with 1.8M skillpoints), but you may or may not be particularly effective with what you have until you train the specialist skills.
This is how it will become as well, with the new cascading gang bonuses, the fleet commander trains the skill to create the gang, and then has to train the other (support) leadership skills to make the most of their position within the fleet as far as gang bonuses go.
Skill requirements to form the fleets should be dropped completely, the people who put those with leadership skills at the top of the pyramid will have an advantage over those who do not. Regular FCs and Wing Commanders will still be encouraged to train the leadership skills to give the best bonuses to the gangs they can.
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