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Handsome Hussein
178
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 08:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Handsome ******* wrote:First Lieutenant Dan wrote:And so it has begun, all according to plan. Well played, sir. Now let's hope this **** thread actually dies. Needed steps 1. look at thread 2. dont give a **** 3. walk away /see no posting.. more people do that better chance it stays burried. Thank you for the concise instructions. BEFORE CRUCIBLE EVE WAS ON CRUISE CONTROL. After Crucible EVE didn't need cruise control. |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 08:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Andski wrote:Psychophantic wrote:Andski wrote: "I'm a badposting forum alt and I'm too dumb to get a proper hisec voting bloc, the CSM should be disbanded instead!!!!!!"
Look. It's a a goon. Shouldn't you be playing sticky biscuit? hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation are all things that only benefit goonswarm and nobody else at all anywhere lmao I'm not trying to be rude or anything, but "hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation" sounds to me like "nothing happend". For a carebear like me those changes didn't help at all.
i'm sorry that you want ABCs in highsec or soloable incursions or whatever but lol |

Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
93
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 08:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Andski wrote:Psychophantic wrote:Andski wrote: "I'm a badposting forum alt and I'm too dumb to get a proper hisec voting bloc, the CSM should be disbanded instead!!!!!!"
Look. It's a a goon. Shouldn't you be playing sticky biscuit? hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation are all things that only benefit goonswarm and nobody else at all anywhere lmao I'm not trying to be rude or anything, but "hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation" sounds to me like "nothing happend". For a carebear like me those changes didn't help at all.
But it did not harm you ..
Got some ideas. Push them forward. Make an discussion. Provide some well written document. Consult with CSM*
Profit ???
Its not like CSMs are some unknown force. They are well known. And as far as i know they are "normal" people. So if someone contact them and they have time for rational discussion .. "you know how it works. "
|

Fix My Lasers
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Fix My Lasers wrote:Andski wrote:Psychophantic wrote:Andski wrote: "I'm a badposting forum alt and I'm too dumb to get a proper hisec voting bloc, the CSM should be disbanded instead!!!!!!"
Look. It's a a goon. Shouldn't you be playing sticky biscuit? hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation are all things that only benefit goonswarm and nobody else at all anywhere lmao I'm not trying to be rude or anything, but "hybrid rebalancing, supercapital balancing, time dilation" sounds to me like "nothing happend". For a carebear like me those changes didn't help at all. But it did not harm you .. Got some ideas. Push them forward. Make an discussion. Provide some well written document. Consult with CSM* Profit ??? Its not like CSMs are some unknown force. They are well known. And as far as i know they are "normal" people. So if someone contact them and they have time for rational discussion .. "you know how it works. "
Yes, it didn't harm me. It was just sad because something new came out and there was nothing for me or any other carebear.
Also I think we both know how suggestion or ideas threads end up with trolling or holy war. Look at the goon guy that already throws mindless trolls: "i'm sorry that you want ABCs in highsec or soloable incursions or whatever but lol" Carebears want this and null people want that.
Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE.
I don't feed the trolls. |

Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
16
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ai Shun wrote:Ten Bulls wrote:I support compulsory voting in RL I'm curious. Why do you support this? Asking because to a point, I do too, but only if the ballot paper had an option for " None of the above" in the cases where I don't find myself agreeing with the policies of any candidate. Currently the only way to cast a no-confidence vote is either through a spoiled ballot or by not voting.
I believe in compulsory voting because people are inherently lazy, but thats not a good enough reason to avoid your democratic duty.
Spoiled ballot is reasonable choice, at least society can still measure the peoples "lack of faith" in their current choices.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE.
If only you could train other races' ships!
And really, with lasers you don't have to reload (faction/T2 crystals take forever to burn through so that's not an argument) and pulses with scorch have a hilarious optimal, and it really doesn't make sense that lasers would deal kinetic and explosive damage, now does it? |

Ai Shun
State War Academy Caldari State
32
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:37:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ten Bulls wrote:I believe in compulsory voting because people are inherently lazy, but thats not a good enough reason to avoid your democratic duty.
Good point, thank you for the response. What about the risk of random voting? If somebody is forced to vote when they are not sufficiently motivated / educated / invested in their democracy, would they actually vote for somebody that represents what they believe in or would they vote for the one with the funniest looking avatar?
Like Fix My Lasers' poll. I'd vote for "Both", because it would be the win-win choice. But equally, I can see people voting for the "kill carebear" option for the lulz or the self interested to vote for PvE or PvP exclusively.
Hmmm. I suppose that is the core principle. At the end it will hopefully reflect the thought of the participants.
|

Fix My Lasers
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:37:00 -
[8] - Quote
Andski wrote:Fix My Lasers wrote:Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE.
If only you could train other races' ships!
This is it. After I made my noobish Amarr choice I started training others and end up being able to use every marauder. Even have Marauders V on one of my chars. From time to time I get bored by golem, then vargur, then kronos that still performs so-so after hybrid buff and then paladin that can't do well 50% of missions unlike others. If Amarr performed well at missions I wouldn't unsub that char.
Anyways there is nothing going on in high sec. Same as always which is sad.
Andski wrote:And really, with lasers you don't have to reload (faction/T2 crystals take forever to burn through so that's not an argument) and pulses with scorch have a hilarious optimal, and it really doesn't make sense that lasers would deal kinetic and explosive damage, now does it?
Being able to choose THERM-only damage whould make a huge difference.
Also: http://eve-online.itemdrop.net/eve_db/items/charge/advanced_pulse_laser_crystal/blaze_l/ I don't feed the trolls. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
1935
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE. Bad example, since you willfully ignored the fact that lasers do excellent damage against 5 out of the 8 NPC types (and sufficient damage with the right crystals against two more) and that the damage type restriction (which isn't quite as restricted as you made it out to be, nor is it unique to Amarr) is connected to a set of pretty nice benefitsGǪ
Just because people corrected you on these glaring omissions doesn't mean that it was a bunch of null players trolling you. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
16
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:49:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ai Shun wrote:Ten Bulls wrote:I believe in compulsory voting because people are inherently lazy, but thats not a good enough reason to avoid your democratic duty. Good point, thank you for the response. What about the risk of random voting? If somebody is forced to vote when they are not sufficiently motivated / educated / invested in their democracy, would they actually vote for somebody that represents what they believe in or would they vote for the one with the funniest looking avatar?
There will always be "uninformed voters", people who vote for someone for the wrong reasons (wrong according to serious voters), but they probably cancel themselves out.
There is a danger of the donkey vote, where people just vote in the simplest way they can rather than voting informal (spoiling their ballot)
My personal belief, is that if people know in advance they have to do something, and feel even in a small way that its in their best interest to do it, they will take some time to evaluate their choices, talk about it with others. It would be better if people voted for the best person to lead the country/organization rather than the best person to serve their own interests, but nothing is perfect.
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baltec1
226
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Posted - 2011.12.05 09:49:00 -
[11] - Quote
So let me get this right.
People who dont care about the game enough to vote are angry at people who did care enough to put in the time to become CSM and got voted in by other people who cared about the game enough to vote for them.
This smacks of the silant majority argument. |

Fix My Lasers
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 09:57:00 -
[12] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:So let me get this right.
People who dont care about the game enough to vote are angry at people who did care enough to put in the time to become CSM and got voted in by other people who cared about the game enough to vote for them.
This smacks of the silant majority argument.
Most people play the game without wasting their time on forums since 85% of forum people are trolls. If I was at home at the moment I wouldn't waste my time here too. When I lived in null and had a lot of time at home I didn't pay attention to forum too - it's better to do something fun then reading trolls. The logic is quite simple. I don't feed the trolls. |

baltec1
226
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 10:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:
Most people play the game without wasting their time on forums since 85% of forum people are trolls. If I was at home at the moment I wouldn't waste my time here too. When I lived in null and had a lot of time at home I didn't pay attention to forum too - it's better to do something fun then reading trolls. The logic is quite simple.
This is why thousands have died in the gal ice belts. |

Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
222
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 10:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Yes, it didn't harm me. It was just sad because something new came out and there was nothing for me or any other carebear. Just like the rest of the game the past 2 years, and at least nullsec was beginning to stagnate hard because of it. So crucible is an attempt to try to at least partially rectify that.
Also, don't tell me nothing came of crucible that you'd care about, there are tons of UI changes and new boats which can be used with a fairly high amount of damage for a fairly low SP cost.
Fix My Lasers wrote:Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE. Actually, I'd argue that lasers have a huge bonus in the form of not needing to be reloaded, which is useful both in PVP and PVE (PVE because it means less ammo costs, and you can do missions in deep nullsec without a particular base of operations for longer), which is offset by the fact that you have limited damage types.
Rat somewhere which is vulnerable to EM/Therm, or change the tools which you use? |

Fix My Lasers
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 10:54:00 -
[15] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Fix My Lasers wrote:Yes, it didn't harm me. It was just sad because something new came out and there was nothing for me or any other carebear. Just like the rest of the game the past 2 years, and at least nullsec was beginning to stagnate hard because of it. So crucible is an attempt to try to at least partially rectify that. Also, don't tell me nothing came of crucible that you'd care about, there are tons of UI changes and new boats which can be used with a fairly high amount of damage for a fairly low SP cost. Fix My Lasers wrote:Good example: I want my lasers to be useful in PvE because there is a lot of NPCs that have high EM/Thermal resists. Amarr ships are the worst in missions. Therefore I want selectable damage types for Amarr lasers. So people that live in null start trolling/whining that Amarr is fine and their ships are good in fleet and so on. While it doesn't concern PvE. Actually, I'd argue that lasers have a huge bonus in the form of not needing to be reloaded, which is useful both in PVP and PVE (PVE because it means less ammo costs, and you can do missions in deep nullsec without a particular base of operations for longer), which is offset by the fact that you have limited damage types. Rat somewhere which is vulnerable to EM/Therm, or change the tools which you use?
Few facts: - New BCs are useless on missions because they have no drones. Only Talos have them, but it is a blaster boat = useless too. 1st scrambling frig will be your death. - T1 laser crystals are useless. T2 or faction ones are the only valid choice for missions. Amarr ships already pay for ammo via useless bonus that reduce cap use. - I never lost even a bit of my DPS while reloading guns on Vargur or Kronos.
Anyways this arguing won't help improving the game because no one listens and CSMs are busy fixing null. I don't feed the trolls. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
1935
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:04:00 -
[16] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:- T1 laser crystals are useless. T2 or faction ones are the only valid choice for missions. This is not a fact GÇö it's just a limitation you've set up for yourself. It's also largely inconsequential.
Quote:- I never lost even a bit of my DPS while reloading guns on Vargur or Kronos. This is false by very definition of GÇ£not firingGÇ¥.
Quote:Anyways this arguing won't help improving the game because no one listens and CSMs are busy fixing null. Maybe because null (and lowsec) are in more need of fixing?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
41
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:30:00 -
[17] - Quote
Would a CSM support the idea of WHs randomly appearing and depositing ABC ores randomly through out hi sec space?
|

Terminal Insanity
Convex Enterprises Unprovoked Aggression
146
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:39:00 -
[18] - Quote
Zevina wrote:I am a highsec carebear too and quite enjoy Eve as such.
When I look at the CSM priorities and people it consists of its probably true a vital and big part is absolutely not represented by the CSM. Though I like the new Crucible very much I would also wish for a more PvE focused and laid back expansion in the future that will be more interesting for the non-PvP players out there.
A change in voting mechanics will surely help to give us highsec people a louder voice. So please make it happen.
Make an ingame Voting (maybe at startup like issued) and make it simple and understandable what each players goals are and most importantly what sort of player he considers himself (business tycoon, alliance leader, mission runner, wormhole dweller etc)
You mean like Incursions? or PI? or Wormholes? or any of the tons of other PvE content CCP has put out each patch while ignoring the PvP'res? How can you possibly claim that CCP has been ignoring PvE'ers? They've released the FIRST PVP patch in... years... and you're claiming CCP never listens to PvE'ers because of it? Incursions alone have made 0.0 space pointless. The real money now is in highsec incursions. You highsec dwellers wont stop complaining untill TQ is like sisi, by which time everyone will be bored of it since theres no risk left in the game |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
Terminal Insanity wrote:The real money now is in highsec incursions.
That's only true because the pubbies that run them try to farm them as fast as possible with 2bn ISK faction BS, while few people would be dumb enough to do that with low/nullsec incursions.
Seriously, a constellation is under attack by pirates and CONCORD still manages to respond instantly to anything that happens in there, that's hilarious |

Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery Dead On Arrival Alliance
448
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:49:00 -
[20] - Quote
Highsec bears outnumber null players by 4:1
If you're still complaining the voting system is skewed in favour of the null players (and the system does NOT use proportional representation) then you're doing it wrong.
During the last elections, most of the people I spoke to in highsec didn't know what they were.
That kind of apathy shouldn't be present on the CSM - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Highsec bears outnumber null players by 4:1
So what? |

Tore Vest
Vikinghall
100
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 11:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
CSM still here ? 
Oh... and i see that "goons forum poaster brigade" is forming to deffend their mittens  |

Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery Dead On Arrival Alliance
448
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
Andski wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:Highsec bears outnumber null players by 4:1 So what? Hey, read all the words I put in that post, man! - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |

Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery Dead On Arrival Alliance
448
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:03:00 -
[24] - Quote
I <3 DP - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |

rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
41
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Highsec bears outnumber null players by 4:1
If you're still complaining the voting system is skewed in favour of the null players (and the system does NOT use proportional representation) then you're doing it wrong.
During the last elections, most of the people I spoke to in highsec didn't know what they were.
That kind of apathy shouldn't be present on the CSM
Null sec players sound cooler and more hip hop, much like bill clinton playing the saxophone or obama being kenyan and exotic. That kind of stuff helps alot in elections. You could always try a get out to vote approach and tell other hi sec people to vote for the boring person running for CSM.
Vote for me I solo veld with a hulk and run a small pos since it sure is hard finding reserach slots in hi sec. Sometimes I do PI but not now with taxes, and incursions only want faction fitted ships so I dont do them. I will represent all hi sec if you vote me in. And we shall recieve better tutorials on how to play eve but also have a life outside of it ( Of course voiced by aura). Thank you for your consideration. |

Mara Tessidar
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
278
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:17:00 -
[26] - Quote
Highsec players may outnumber nullsec players by a ratio of 4:1, but just trying killing an Erebus with that Covetor. :smirk:
Seriously though, I have 4 highsec alts and 2 nullsec characters. But I vote in the CSM elections as someone from nullsec. I would ordinarily expect a rational and reasonably intelligent human to infer the rest from this, but since you probably aren't, I'll lay it out for you. My highsec alts outnumber me two to one. I am at least partially representative of the rest of nullsec, because most people keep at least one highsec alt to buy things on the market for their character or run missions for them or both. Therefore, the number of highsec "players" as opposed to nullsec players will be an inflated one. Notify: You are eaten by the Whumpus
http://goo.gl/uX5vk |

Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
222
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 12:52:00 -
[27] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:Few facts: - New BCs are useless on missions because they have no drones. Only Talos have them, but it is a blaster boat = useless too. 1st scrambling frig will be your death. Solo, yes. Combine those with a tanking BC like, say, a drake, and I would assume you'd have a nice combo that still costs less than your average hisec tengu.
Disclaimer: I don't do missions, I think they're about as fun as watching paint dry. ymmv.
Fix My Lasers wrote:- T1 laser crystals are useless. T2 or faction ones are the only valid choice for missions. Why?
Fix My Lasers wrote:Anyways this arguing won't help improving the game because no one listens and CSMs are busy fixing null. I'd argue that they aren't just "fixing null", there's been a lot of changes that affect hisec as well, like the neutral repping issue, I believe, and literally tons of small UI and usability fixes.
However, they are probably spending more time trying to get CCP to fix null, because null was, and probably still is, in danger of stagnating hard. What was the last huge war you saw a report on the last 6-12 months? Have you seen the quality of posting that's been going on on sites such as kugu? Some threads there are literally threatening to become worse than most eve-o threads because literally the only thing they can argue about is who was most honourable, the guys selfdestructing dreads or the guys dropping titans and supercarriers.
It's in dire need of help before it goes below a critical mass because of things like the anom nerf which caused tons of 0.0 space to be vacated, and SOV systems which allowed IT Alliance to keep SOV several months after they'd essentially officially disbanded and left the area. And therefore it's the area of the game which I would expect to get the most attention for at least the next patch, because face it, eve online does not get any press whatsoever for mining or doing missions. It gets it for being a cold place, where backstabbing is rife, and whole swathes of space swap hands at gunpoint. If that part of the game goes poof, so does the entire game.
This isn't to say that I believe that empire is worthless, there's been tons of suggestions for adding valid career paths to living in hisec, and I support that. I'm just saying that right now, if nullsec hadn't been at least begun worked at again after about 2 years of seemingly nothing but apathy from CCP, I would've expected EVE to cease to exist in a few years, and CCP along with it. |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 13:03:00 -
[28] - Quote
Tore Vest wrote:CSM still here ?  Oh... and i see that "goons forum poaster brigade" is forming to deffend their mittens  it really sucks to get kicked around nullsec, doesn't it |

Tore Vest
Vikinghall
100
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 13:05:00 -
[29] - Quote
Andski wrote:Tore Vest wrote:CSM still here ?  Oh... and i see that "goons forum poaster brigade" is forming to deffend their mittens  it really sucks to get kicked around nullsec, doesn't it
Im not living in nullsec..... Im a highsec carebear 
|

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1184
|
Posted - 2011.12.05 13:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Tore Vest wrote:Andski wrote:Tore Vest wrote:CSM still here ?  Oh... and i see that "goons forum poaster brigade" is forming to deffend their mittens  it really sucks to get kicked around nullsec, doesn't it Im not living in nullsec..... Im a highsec carebear 
because you got thrown out, lmao |
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