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The first Australian/New Zealand Alliance has been formed

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Sharmina ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:56:00 - [91] Originally by: cptblood Anzac alliance , used to have alot of respect from myself , with these actions i think u should take time to look up the meaning of ANZAC's and maybe ask yourself ,do you have the right with these actions to carry such a great name?. You sir, seem to be as misinformed as so many others in here. ANZA left ASCN at short notice because we could not, in any shape or form, sustain the war any longer, we had no ships (we were supplying our members with T1 frigs and cruisers and as many mods as possible free), we had no offices left in ASCN space because our offices were in GQ2 and H8. We were trying to get access to better ships and mods but there was nothing at the frontline or even close, our members were out of ISK, the corp was out of ISK, if the ISK/equipment situation were different we would still be on the frontlines. We have regrouped in Empire to rebuild, we are out of the war completely, we do not fight for ASCN and we do not fight for BOB. Some members were very upset because we left ASCN without asking them first, yes this was probably a mistake, but it was not to screw them over. These members attempted a coup de gras to hijack the corp and make all the leaders (all the leaders were involved in the decision) stand down (except one, who was their friend and is now CEO of their corp - a bit of irony there ), this was denied and as a result those members have left ANZA and formed their own corp. ANZA is now going ahead with it's long term goals of forming an Australian and New Zealand Alliance so that like minded Aussies and Kiwis can play together and yet still retain their own corps.
Sharmina ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:07:00 - [92] Originally by: Irimi Nage Originally by: Sharmina Originally by: Cowan rofl. So this is the second alliance you've screwed over. This is the second time you've torn Anza apart. I'm ashamed that I ever had anything to do with Anza now. For those aussies and kiwis out there that want an aussie/nz corp that hold the true values of mateship and comradery try Dragons of Redemption. What scares me most is that you have said before that your main concern is the corp. We as Anza helped create took no priority in your mind. You just cared about what the corp could get out of it. Ok yes that alliance was technically flawed and it's future was always going to be a struggle you still screwed them over. I feel for any corps silly enough to join this alliance as when the going gets tough don't expect Anza to be there for you. You need to get your facts straight LOL, it was actually some members in Dragons of Redemption (they may not still be in there now though) that screwed ANZA over last April, for wanting to fight BOB, and the corp was split in two. ANZA was kicked out of Tribal Souls and the CEO made KOS (plus a lot of corp assets and ISK disappeared). As a result we had to more or less rebuild the corp from scratch, hence why we were not ready for a huge war, we did not have the massive mineral and ISK reserves that all the other ASCN corps have. The members wanting to remain in Paragon Soul formed a new corp called The Anzacs, which was then disbanded and Dragons was formed. I know, I was there and took over the CEO position and with a few loyal members led the corp back to Empire. Maybe you should find out the real history of your corp, although I doubt that you will get the truth - so please don't throw stones. Sharm, isn't Cowan smoke's alt? From memory it was a name very similar to that. You are so right Irimi, the same smoke AU who with others, screwed ANZA over, smoke go get back in your hole
Nemafow Antipodean inc.	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:12:00 - [93] Your such a liar Sharmina, and I'm glad I'm no longer part of your sick twisted world. Kook keeee
Evil Thug Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:17:00 - [94] Originally by: Walking Contradiction Originally by: Evil Thug Those, who ran from danger doesnt deserve community respect. You are weak. Go play wow. Exploiters don't deserve community respect either. You are weak. Go play WoW. Force me to do so, or stfu. Bob alt.
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:20:00 - [95] Originally by: Evil Thug Originally by: Walking Contradiction Originally by: Evil Thug Those, who ran from danger doesnt deserve community respect. You are weak. Go play wow. Exploiters don't deserve community respect either. You are weak. Go play WoW. Force me to do so, or stfu. Bob alt. Post with your (ASCN) main!
Evil Thug Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:28:00 - [96] I don`t have ASCN main
Jasmine Dupre Sha Kharn Corp Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:30:00 - [97] I will say this ASCN may have issues but being an Aussie i dont run and if i need something peeps will help out. I once held ANZA to high standards and enjoyed having more Aussies around but recient events have changed that. I hope that theres more to it but from accounts from ANZA members there not. GL
RangerXT Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:39:00 - [98] Edited by: RangerXT on 07/11/2006 13:41:44 ASCN gave us two choices. First was to disband and be absorbed other ASCN corps. The second was to be booted out of ASCN. We found a third option. Sure it made some of our members angry to "turn against ASCN and join bob" even though we tried to explain many times that ASCN was being set neutral and we would in no way be attacking them or joining bob. I guess all that ASCN forum propaganda really worked on some of the guys to make them think bob was the hacking logoffskis that they want their members to believe. That's all fine and good. In a few months when people start seeing the truth about the matter most will be welcomed back. We didn't turn traitor as some would like you to believe. We staggered away from ASCN after the knife was put in our back.
Father Calistas Antipodean inc.	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:39:00 - [99] Edited by: Father Calistas on 07/11/2006 13:45:58 Due to Sharmina's post I feel compelled to point one thing out, pretty minor, but worthy of saying. We (Antipodeans Inc, the former ANZACs mentioned by Sharmina) had been keeping out of the various mud-slinging on this thread, but now we've had a splat right in the face, so I guess some comment is due. When around 15 of the members of ANZAC were clearly going to leave ANZAC for some of the reasons mentioned by previous posters (there are subtleties I won't go into), Law Zix came and asked us to stay, he said he'd miss us in the corp, and to be honest, we all agreed we would miss being in the corp too and playing with generally a pretty good bunch. Despite Law's chat with us everyone's resolve was pretty strong. We were unhappy and had decided to leave. About an hour after Law talking to us (the very regular ANZAC players used vent a lot) the idea was proposed that we would stay if a few conditions were met and agreed upon by everyone in ANZAC Alliance. Let me repeat this. We agreed we would stay if our idea was put to the popular vote and the corp as a whole accepted it. This is not my definition of a coup. We saw problems, clearly outlined by the way leaving ASCN was handled and we wanted to see them fixed. We bore no malice to AA members or leaders then (or now), but mistakes had been made and needed to be addressed. We wanted to stay, but couldn't betray certain principles without compromises from AA directors, especially after they had all admitted that they had probably made a mistake in how they went about leaving ASCN. This wasn't a chuck-our-toys hissy fit, it was the only way wecould see to keep our faith in the corp and the corp leadership. As the majority of the directors had spoken to us and felt they had probably made a mistake we suggested changes in how AA was run. These changes were along the lines of all current directors and leaders stepping down and being replaced. We personally liked our current leader (of our new corp, who was an excellent ANZAC junior director), but I think had there been discussion of the ideas we presented any guilt-free leader would have done. Yes, we essentially asked the leadership to fall on their swords and admit they had made a mistake in not consulting with their members about taking us in a completely new direction - regardless of the relative qualities of ASCN, BOB, or just leaving quietly. Second thing we proposed was to explain to both BOB and ASCN that we just didn't feel we were ready for the war and the big alliances and that in hindsight we should have just retreated to Empire and focused on rebuilding. Many felt that changing sides in a war was pretty dishonourable and a far more honourable thing to do would have been to just step out, go to empire, chill and rebuild. From memory, that was about all we asked for, and we asked it be put to the corp and discussed. As the people presenting it represented about 70% of the active players (the every-night crowd) we didn't think it was too unreasonable to talk about it. At first pass the idea was accepted by a couple of directors and a lot of the membership, but opinions changed after some fairly intense lobying (by one director in particular). Sharmina was not there for the early part of this discussion (midnight to 5am!) and so I don't know how the whole proposal was put to her later on. What we felt was a reasonable position for corp wide discussion was thrown away, leaving us who were not too happy with things not much choice. So we left. Right now we're all having a blast up in low-sec in our new corp, chasing naughty Chickens around (we almost had you with our cunning trap mate!), setting up POSs, preparing Cap Ships and all that good stuff. Once day we'll return to 0.0 and hopefully the honour which the members of ANP gained fighting BOB and fighting for ASCN as ANZACs will be carried with us. Please note: I don't speak for Antipodean Inc. Father Calistas
Weebear Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:52:00 - [100] Originally by: RangerXT Edited by: RangerXT on 07/11/2006 13:41:44 Sure it made some of our members angry to "turn against ASCN and join bob" even though we tried to explain many times that ASCN was being set neutral and we would in no way be attacking them or joining bob. I guess all that ASCN forum propaganda really worked.... it's from your own corp mail Quote: At midnight evetime (10 hrs from now) we will no longer be in ASCN Alliance. Eventually we will be back in Paragon Soul as the caretaker corp for BOB (we will NOT be joining BOB Alliance). For now it is advised that you should all relocate back to Empire to rebuild. Do not stay in PS as you will not be allowed to fight in BOB gangs. Standings with BOB will be set to + tomorrow. The fact that you think you are moving in to Paragon Soul after this conflict is an attack on ASCN, being a caretaker corp for BoB is changing sides no matter how you try to dress it up.
Max M RazorBack Inc Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:53:00 - [101] Congrats Shar, This is indeed good news, and well overdue. Max M
Logoff Suki	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:53:00 - [102] Edited by: Logoff Suki on 07/11/2006 13:54:36 Ahh, wrong char.
Dynamist Antipodean inc.	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:54:00 - [103] Liviy wrote a pretty accurate summary of events. Even though I left with a number of others to form our new corp, actually changing sides in the war didnt bother me. IMO, we were borderline exploited by ASCN, and once the decision to leave was taken, the next alliance we joined was completely irrelevant. I personally left because of the way the decision was handled, and the fact that most of my friends were leaving and forming a corp that sounded a lot more fun. I bore no ill-will towards ANZA. Originally by: Sharmina You sir, seem to be as misinformed as so many others in here. ANZA left ASCN at short notice because we could not, in any shape or form, sustain the war any longer, we had no ships (we were supplying our members with T1 frigs and cruisers and as many mods as possible free), we had no offices left in ASCN space because our offices were in GQ2 and H8. We were trying to get access to better ships and mods but there was nothing at the frontline or even close, our members were out of ISK, the corp was out of ISK, if the ISK/equipment situation were different we would still be on the frontlines. We have regrouped in Empire to rebuild, we are out of the war completely, we do not fight for ASCN and we do not fight for BOB. Some members were very upset because we left ASCN without asking them first, yes this was probably a mistake, but it was not to screw them over. These members attempted a coup de gras to hijack the corp and make all the leaders (all the leaders were involved in the decision) stand down (except one, who was their friend and is now CEO of their corp - a bit of irony there ), this was denied and as a result those members have left ANZA and formed their own corp. ANZA is now going ahead with it's long term goals of forming an Australian and New Zealand Alliance so that like minded Aussies and Kiwis can play together and yet still retain their own corps. I'm sorry Sharmina, but you just lost most of the considerable respect I had for you. I was present at the discussions that you refer to as a "coup", and it was done openly. It was even discussed with one of the ANZA directors who wasn't leaving and he agreed that it was a workable idea to save the corp. Sadly, other directors felt threatened by the request to have them step down and hold an AGM to discuss the future of the corp. I can understand their feelings. Losing their directorship after so much work was a harsh price for the mistake they made. However, they werent willing to pay that price in order to save the corp. So, a large number of us left to form a new corp. We tried to leave peacefully, and maintained friendly relations with our mates back in ANZA. We were a bit saddened by the way the leadership spun our leaving into a "betrayal", but decided to leave well enough alone. However, by attacking us in public like this Sharmina, you force us to respond to the half-truths that have been floating around. It was not a "coup". Perhaps you could call it an "ultimatum", but even thats a bit strong. After our last attempt at compromise was shot down, the only form of democracy open to us was voting with our feet, and that's what we did. Personally, I wish ANZA and the new SCA alliance all the best. Dynamist
Father Calistas Antipodean inc.	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:55:00 - [104] Ranger, as someone who was very keen on SirMolle's offer of caretakership of PS from the moment you heard about it - I don't expect you to entirely see the point of view many are putting on this thread, but I do want to say that those who were frustrated with ANZAC directors IN NO WAY believe BOB to be evil nasty little people (unless you're a BOB who podded me! HaX0r!1one! ;) ). In fact, I think we all agreed that the fights we had were great fun. Wow, I put in some late nights and saw some of my first truely awesome battles! Thanks BOB! Further, I've not seen any emails from ASCN HC or forum posts threatening members of ANZAC. If there are such emails it would have been great for the corp to see them and then as a corp decide how to respond. FC
RangerXT Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:06:00 - [105] Originally by: Father Calistas Edited by: Father Calistas on 07/11/2006 13:59:55 Ranger, as someone who was very keen on SirMolle's offer of caretakership of PS from the moment you heard about it - I don't expect you to entirely see the point of view many are putting on this thread, but I do want to say that those who were frustrated with ANZAC directors IN NO WAY believe BOB to be evil nasty little people (unless you're a BOB who podded me! HaX0r!1one! :LOL:). In fact, I think we all agreed that the fights we had were great fun. Wow, I put in some late nights and saw some of my first truely awesome battles! Thanks BOB! Further, I've not seen any emails from ASCN HC or forum posts threatening members of ANZAC. If there are such emails it would have been great for the corp to see them and then as a corp decide how to respond. FC Yes. It would be hard to see anything like that after you were banned for posting corp emails to both public and private forums. Funny I remember some 'omg bob are scum' comments coming from somewhere. Oh well. You are really not worth my time noobling.
Sharmina ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:13:00 - [106] Originally by: Dynamist It was not a "coup". Perhaps you could call it an "ultimatum", Dynamist ROFL, as I said an attempted coup Moderators please lock this thread, as it has served it's purpose. Thank you.
End Yourself Core Domination	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:17:00 - [107] What a disgrace. Hope BoB makes you pay alot to leech out of the same region the third time. And what a blatant joke beeing out of ISK is. After ZERO capital ship losses, less than 40 BS, less than 10 BC.... and hardly any t2 ship losses in this war. How many members did your corp have? Less than 10?!? --- Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity.
3lade Runner	Posted - 2006.11.07 17:02:00 - [108] I wish ANZA and SCA all the best. Personnal comments aside, We are all human and we all make mistakes be it in life or ingame. I only wish that all parties involved grow and learn from this. I still have alot of friends In Anza, In ASCN and In BOB. Goodluck. And thats all I am saying. CEO Antipodean inc. Ex-Director ANZAC Alliance.
3ungle Antipodean inc.	Posted - 2006.11.07 17:04:00 - [109] Sorry Wrong Char ^^ Now thats all I am saying ...
Havras The Syndicate Inc Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.07 18:54:00 - [110] Edited by: Havras on 07/11/2006 18:57:01 You know. I probably should stay out of this but I'm going to tell a little story. Earlier this year, back during the ASCN/BOB operations up north when they were still friendly a relatively small corp, with not many resources, was brought into ASCN as a trial corp. Our members literally got stationed in C9N which was, at the time, the frontier of ASCN. Most of the alliance was up north doing operations. This corp, having just been stationed in C9N, was given the duty of keeping the AZN-c9n area as free of hostiles as we could. So what you might say? Well, at the time ER was running around down there pretty much unchecked, A couple other alliances/corps were doing much the same thing with daily raids. Now, anyone who has fought ER knows they are very good at what they do. I was a complete noob then barely 2 mil SPs. We lost many many ships trying to confront ER and back in those days we had NOTHING in the way of ISK reserves or ship and mineral reserves. All of our replacements came out of our own members pockets. We rarely won any battles against ER, maybe a kill here and there.. but we certainly lost a lot. That corp didn't give up because we didn't get immediate backing from the alliance. We were a TRIAL corp. We were warned we would be a meatshield in order to test our metal. That corp survived and became a full member of ASCN until recently. TOGCO was the corp. Many of TOGCO members have now joined other corps in ASCN to support the war effort as our own corp membership had gone through some serious attrition due to real life issues and the like. The Corp is not gone. The name is not lost. The members of TOGCO had the CEO's and HC's full blessing in how things were handled and TOGCO is leaving the alliance but only in a sense. Why this long winded story you ask? Simply this Anzacs claim they were harshly used by ASCN. Probably true to a point. If they were you can be sure it was with eyes wide open and KNOWING it was coming. Just as TOGCO knew back then. TOGCO persevered through its early days until this war with bob started and ANZAC's could have handled it in the same way TOGCO did. I'm pretty sure that is what was meant by merging with another corp. If things had been handled as it was handled between TOGCO membership/leaders and ASCN leadership you would have seen ANZAC's maybe going into a sleep mode for a while during the war but the name would not have been lost and it would have been in a good position to become fully active as an ASCN member corp after the war. The way you chose to handle the situation is where some hard feelings are coming from. I wish you good luck in the future. Just my two cents and a little story how another small corp of fighters handle the exact same situation. [edit to clean up some grammar]
Raznarok Amarr Defence Initiative	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:52:00 - [111] Gratz yobbo'z! :D To everyone else who has nothing positive to say - get over it newbz.
Liviy Gallente ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:02:00 - [112] Originally by: 3lade Runner I wish ANZA and SCA all the best. Personnal comments aside, We are all human and we all make mistakes be it in life or ingame. I only wish that all parties involved grow and learn from this. I still have alot of friends In Anza, In ASCN and In BOB. Goodluck. And thats all I am saying. CEO Antipodean inc. Ex-Director ANZAC Alliance. /me agrees Go 3ungle, with the wrong char! ;) P.S. All I can say is, like what 3ungle said...I have friends who left the corp and I'd like them to stay that way...can we not sling mud from either side of the fence. It's bad enought that I'm gonna see them less without the fighting going on...remember it's not just the corp or the director the comments are aimed at that get hurt/brought into this but your friends, the rest of the corp members. Chill guys, Peace! :) Murphy's 1st law of combat - "Incoming fire always has right of way!"
Liviy Gallente ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:05:00 - [113] Originally by: Havras Edited by: Havras on 07/11/2006 18:57:01 If things had been handled as it was handled between TOGCO membership/leaders and ASCN leadership you would have seen ANZAC's maybe going into a sleep mode for a while during the war but the name would not have been lost and it would have been in a good position to become fully active as an ASCN member corp after the war. [edit to clean up some grammar] Maybe so but you forget the "merge with another corp or leave ASCN" bit...so we would have had no corp after the war... :P Murphy's 1st law of combat - "Incoming fire always has right of way!"
Havras The Syndicate Inc Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.07 21:42:00 - [114] Originally by: Havras Simply this Anzacs claim they were harshly used by ASCN. Probably true to a point. If they were you can be sure it was with eyes wide open and KNOWING it was coming. Just as TOGCO knew back then. TOGCO persevered through its early days until this war with bob started and ANZAC's could have handled it in the same way TOGCO did. I'm pretty sure that is what was meant by merging with another corp. If things had been handled as it was handled between TOGCO membership/leaders and ASCN leadership you would have seen ANZAC's maybe going into a sleep mode for a while during the war but the name would not have been lost and it would have been in a good position to become fully active as an ASCN member corp after the war. [edit to clean up some grammar] Liviy, I'm not going to get into a debate here and this will be my last post on the subject but I wanted to point your attention to the last sentence in the paragraph directly above the one you quoted. I've set it bold to make it easier. I'm sure they weren't talking about a full merge and forget your old corp. I could possibly be wrong, I don't know the specifics behind the ANZAC situation. All I know is TOGCO was in a very similar situation and I can assure you that no messages were worded like that to TOGCO membership.
Baun 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.11.07 21:49:00 - [115] Originally by: sylh Quote: Aussie aussie aussie :) Oy oy oy? Not these guys. They are hardly representative of the aussie spirit or tne name they hold. Sorry fellas but a true aussie would never turn in the face of a hard fight. Pass the sugar! The Enemy's Gate is Down
Remmington Daniels Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.07 22:08:00 - [116] GL ANZAC. Give em hell
Liviy Gallente ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 22:57:00 - [117] Edited by: Liviy on 07/11/2006 23:08:26 Originally by: Havras Originally by: Havras Simply this Anzacs claim they were harshly used by ASCN. Probably true to a point. If they were you can be sure it was with eyes wide open and KNOWING it was coming. Just as TOGCO knew back then. TOGCO persevered through its early days until this war with bob started and ANZAC's could have handled it in the same way TOGCO did. I'm pretty sure that is what was meant by merging with another corp. If things had been handled as it was handled between TOGCO membership/leaders and ASCN leadership you would have seen ANZAC's maybe going into a sleep mode for a while during the war but the name would not have been lost and it would have been in a good position to become fully active as an ASCN member corp after the war. [edit to clean up some grammar] Liviy, I'm not going to get into a debate here and this will be my last post on the subject but I wanted to point your attention to the last sentence in the paragraph directly above the one you quoted. I've set it bold to make it easier. I'm sure they weren't talking about a full merge and forget your old corp. I could possibly be wrong, I don't know the specifics behind the ANZAC situation. All I know is TOGCO was in a very similar situation and I can assure you that no messages were worded like that to TOGCO membership. That's cool and I admit I was blonde and missed that line, my bad ;) I can't comment on the TOGCO wordings so I'll take your word for it but it was how it was put to us...even saying that I'm completely wrong and it wasn't...what other kind of merge is there? ANZA is more than just a name, it's also linked with being for mainly Aussies n Kiwis so either losing the name or even keeping the name but suddenly having the aussie & kiwi's out numbered because it's something the alliance wants means a loss of identity for the corp. At the end of the day, or requests for either a temp docking station or to be rotated off the front line to rebuild were tiny in comparison to what we'd already sacrificed for ASCN. When you're enemy starts to show you more respect and understanding than your own alliance does it makes you wonder what you're fighting for. Especially since it's costing us to fight for them, not like we're merc's...we were almost like anti merc's! We'll give you billions of isk to help you gith your war! lol We've lost our ships, our fittings, our isk, our 0.0 home & some of our members/friends in less than a month...haven't we lost enough without people thinking they have the right to take the moral high ground on something they will never truely understand. If we really were switching side with BoB in this war, wouldn't we have just stuck in ASCN n fed info to them rather than removing ourselves from the arena, alliance & war totally? At the end of the day, we're not asking for respect, we're not asking for flamage, we just want to be allowed to build our own dream out of the ashes of this war in peace from both parties...we're here to enjoy ourselves otherwise we may as well be paying our fee's to charities n be doing something else. Good luck to ASCN with their fight. Good luck to BoB with their fight. May the outcome speak for itself whatever it may be. Good luck to the rest of EVE with their goals. Why can't everyone (discounting those that have already) just say, "New Alliance, cool...good luck with that" and be the end of it? Anyone who can't be polite about the whole thing then what you do say is nothing more than a bad representation upon yourself. Peace be with you all! P.S. Thanks to everyone that have shown their support by wishing us luck with the new alliance :) Murphy's 1st law of combat - "Incoming fire always has right of way!"
Nez Perces Amarr Black Spot.	Posted - 2006.11.07 23:08:00 - [118] Edited by: Nez Perces on 07/11/2006 23:12:41 Originally by: Liviy Why can't everyone (discounting those that have already) just say, "New Alliance, cool...good luck with that" and be the end of it? Anyone who can't be polite about the whole thing then what you do say is nothing more than a bad representation upon yourself. Its not quite that simple.... right now is an extremely crucial time for your new alliance and your corp. You left ASCN during a time of war. The reasons for your actions are crucial... if it is proven that you did not infact fight like you say you did, then you could be branded as traitors..and that will follow your young corp for the rest of your time in EVE. Infact this thread is make or break for Southern Cross Alliance and ANZAC. By making your anouncement as public as you have done, you have entered the world of trial by forum. In effect right now ANZAC is on trial by the community. Fortunately for yourselves, ASCN have not produced any evidence that what you particularly liviy, have said in defence of your Southern Cross/ANZAC is not true. As it stands, I would say that the picture appears to be one of ASCN being guilty of treating your corp like cannon fodder and offering very little or no support. But you are not out of the woods yet...
Dianabolic Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.07 23:13:00 - [119] Regardless of what any of you "haters" think of Anzac, we offered them the chance to stick the boot in and they refused it. We fully expected them to do this, of course, but you make the offer anyway. Why? Because you want to see if they really are as honourable as they claim to be. They are. So, we offered this corp the opportunity to get their game up and running again. Is there an ulterior motive to this? Of course there is. What that motive is shall be judged later, for now however the following is true: The deal is good for anzac. The deal is good for BoB. Regardless of what the haters may think when those two become true, especially where we're concerned, saying no is nigh on impossible.
Liviy Gallente ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 23:15:00 - [120] Edited by: Liviy on 07/11/2006 23:19:15 Yeah, I understand where you're coming from... :) But I don't recognise the authority of the community to pass judgement ;) :P Priorities as I see them are 1) Corpies 2) Corp 3) Alliance 4) EVE If any of the proceeding priorities fall down then the rest will follow due to dependencies... Murphy's 1st law of combat - "Incoming fire always has right of way!"

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