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The Possible move of all Level 4 Agents

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Tyler Lowe Minmatar DROW Org Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 04:41:00 - [1] I'd like to preface this by saying how much I enjoy, and have enjoyed Eve, despite the problems I have given the nature of my low end computer, and the lag issues that have plagued the server. Taken from a recent devchat: <Viceroy> High Sec has been overbloated with people since lvl 4 agents came out, when can we expect this massive flaw to be addressed? Hammerhead: It's true, people used to live out in 0.0 then we got the lvl 4 agents and now we have the Jita problem. We should remove level 4 agents from 0.5 and above. I can see a desire to nerf the rewards, particularly the faction offers granted by highsec agents, maybe drastically reducing the quality of agents available in high security systems. I would, however, like to point out that the users, such as myself, that currently play in a less "interactive" manner (read PvE), due to constraints of client peformance, would be left with very little to keep us entertained. For reference, on a good night, I look forward to a relatively lag free evening of running missions at 17 frames per second interupted periodically by screen freezes. If the removal of GtG bookmarks creates a massive improvement in my game play experience, I would drop mission running in a heartbeat. For the time being, however, at least until I find myself in a position to upgrade my computer to something which would allow for something other than a slideshow of me getting podded in PvP (and pray that my connection isn't part of the issue) level 4 mission running is about the only thing remaining to me other than mining Veldspar, which is a pursuit I find slightly less interesting than watching paint dry. If the game design vision is to completely exclude anyone without a decent, and fairly up to date gaming rig and/or good connection from Eve, I'm fine with that, but I'd like to know if that's the case before I send any more subscription fees to CCP. Post Script: For those thinking of asking the inevitable question next... "no". J.A.F.O.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.11.06 04:44:00 - [2] You know that missions run much slower FPS than most PvP combat, right? Only large fleet battles are slower than missions. -[23] Member- Awesome new space games site, from the editor of E-ON!
Tyler Lowe Minmatar DROW Org Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:07:00 - [3] Originally by: Dark Shikari You know that missions run much slower FPS than most PvP combat, right? Only large fleet battles are slower than missions. I've been in PvP, and experienced a similar dip in framerate at the release of drones. Keep in mind that my top rate, even before I enter a mission is at about 25 fps. I used to live in 0.0, back before the RMR, and could get around pretty well. PvP used to be at something closer to 30 fps to 45 fps for me back then, even in small fleet actions. I'm really hoping they can get the server side lag under control to a point that will allow me to drop mission running altogether. Contrary to popular belief, it's not all that lucrative to begin with in comparison to other ISK earning pastimes (0.0 ratting, pirating, etc.), and anyone that has done it can tell you it gets extremely repetitive in short order. So, yes, I know what my performance is like in 1 v 1, and small gang combat, and currently, bottom line, PvP is a waste of my time, because it's simply no fun, win or lose. J.A.F.O.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:13:00 - [4] Originally by: Tyler Lowe So, yes, I know what my performance is like in 1 v 1, and small gang combat, and currently, bottom line, PvP is a waste of my time, because it's simply no fun, win or lose. Nobody ever said you have to do it. -[23] Member- Awesome new space games site, from the editor of E-ON!
elbenito Battlestars Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:17:00 - [5] Originally by: Tyler Lowe I'm really hoping they can get the server side lag under control to a point that will allow me to drop mission running altogether. Server-side lag has nothing to do with your FPS.
Tyler Lowe Minmatar DROW Org Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:29:00 - [6] Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Tyler Lowe I'm really hoping they can get the server side lag under control to a point that will allow me to drop mission running altogether. Server-side lag has nothing to do with your FPS. I couldn't tell you why I've seen a drop in performance in that case, but I have, and it started just before RMR was released, and hasn't been the same since. However, if this is correct, removing missions leaves me with logging in to change skill training until I can upgrade to something more current than my tired P4 1.6Ghz system, and hope it isn't some issue with my ISP/connection compounding other problems. J.A.F.O.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:34:00 - [7] Originally by: Tyler Lowe Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Tyler Lowe I'm really hoping they can get the server side lag under control to a point that will allow me to drop mission running altogether. Server-side lag has nothing to do with your FPS. I couldn't tell you why I've seen a drop in performance in that case, but I have, and it started just before RMR was released, and hasn't been the same since. However, if this is correct, removing missions leaves me with logging in to change skill training until I can upgrade to something more current than my tired P4 1.6Ghz system, and hope it isn't some issue with my ISP/connection compounding other problems. NPCing, mining, trading, complex-running, and producing (plus many more professions) are no more "FPS-intensive" than missions. -[23] Member- Awesome new space games site, from the editor of E-ON!
Aeaus Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:40:00 - [8] Ugh, hehe. I helped out a corpie with a LVL III mission recently (Camping Blues), there was so much needless crap in the level (gas cloud, about fifty structures) that my PC chugged along at about 5 FPS, and I normally expect to get around 20-30 FPS in PVP. Last Weeks Signature
Daktor The Galactic Trade Federation	Posted - 2006.11.06 05:48:00 - [9] Originally by: Tyler Loweuntil I can upgrade to something more current than my tired P4 1.6Ghz system, and hope it isn't some issue with my ISP/connection compounding other problems.[/quote I run Eve on a 600 Mhz P4, and I get better than 25 fps. What kind of video card are you using?
Victor Valka Caldari Archon Industries	Posted - 2006.11.06 06:00:00 - [10] It's the flippin' overview! Try closing it. You'll notice a difference instantly. Of course, that's not really a solution.
Tyler Lowe Minmatar DROW Org Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 06:01:00 - [11] Originally by: Daktor Originally by: Tyler Loweuntil I can upgrade to something more current than my tired P4 1.6Ghz system, and hope it isn't some issue with my ISP/connection compounding other problems.[/quote I run Eve on a 600 Mhz P4, and I get better than 25 fps. What kind of video card are you using? It's an ATi Radeon X700 Pro, AGPx8, 256meg card. I had upgraded to it hoping to see an increase in performance and picked up maybe 2 to 3 fps. J.A.F.O.
Hirokishi	Posted - 2006.11.06 07:08:00 - [12] and how much RAM do you have ? Seems like it's more a RAM problem than a video card one... and for the devchat you quoted, as far as I know Viceroy was a pirate (actually he was a pirate 2 years ago but I don't know for now), it's easily comprehensible he wants people to go to low sec then...
Thor Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2006.11.06 07:18:00 - [13] Well I never understood the logic in a pirate fleet invading hi sec systems alegedly from other hi sec systems without the faction navies getting bent out of shape. The mission npcs should follow the same sec rules that belt npcs follow. ~Thor Xian, Material Defender What is your opinion?
Infinity Ziona Privateers	Posted - 2006.11.06 07:31:00 - [14] Originally by: Tyler Lowe Hammerhead: It's true, people used to live out in 0.0 then we got the lvl 4 agents and now we have the Jita problem. We should remove level 4 agents from 0.5 and above. How stupid do you have to be to think that people are in high sec because of your boring unimaginative unchallanging missions. They're in high sec because they dont want to participate in the already mentioned lagfest, the boring PvP and non-existant market that is in 0.0 space and the stupid game mechanics like logoff, lag traps, gate camp ganking, deliberate POS lagging tactics and flying around with cans of BM's which is all blessed and allowed by CCP. I imagine in the future we're going to be reading something like this from Hammerhead-> "It's true, people used to live out in 0.0 then we got the lvl 4 agents and had the Jita problem. Then we removed them high sec lvl 4 agents. Everyone not lobotomized went and played WoW and now Im in this stupid soup kitchen in a queue and im number 99 in line" The Privateering Life
Aodha Khan Minmatar The Necroborg The Sani Sabik	Posted - 2006.11.06 08:45:00 - [15] Originally by: Infinity Ziona Everyone not lobotomized went and played WoW" Dream on. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Cipher7	Posted - 2006.11.06 09:15:00 - [16] Originally by: Infinity Ziona How stupid do you have to be to think that people are in high sec because of your boring unimaginative unchallanging missions. They're in high sec because they dont want to participate in the already mentioned lagfest, the boring PvP and non-existant market that is in 0.0 space and the stupid game mechanics like logoff, lag traps, gate camp ganking, deliberate POS lagging tactics and flying around with cans of BM's which is all blessed and allowed by CCP. QFT Sorry to say but Eve PVP sucks. Today I spent 3 f*ckin hours in a gang, and the combined time when we had contact with the enemy was like 45 seconds. Used to think mish runners are morons, now I think they're the smart ones. At least the NPC's don't spend most of their time in a safespot. Keep agents profitable and in highsec, because if this garbage keeps going on any longer, I might have to start running missions just to be able to shoot something without having it warp away.
Victor Valka Caldari Archon Industries	Posted - 2006.11.06 09:54:00 - [17] Edited by: Victor Valka on 06/11/2006 09:55:44 Originally by: Cipher7 QFT Sorry to say but Eve PVP sucks. Today I spent 3 f*ckin hours in a gang, and the combined time when we had contact with the enemy was like 45 seconds. Used to think mish runners are morons, now I think they're the smart ones. At least the NPC's don't spend most of their time in a safespot. Keep agents profitable and in highsec, because if this garbage keeps going on any longer, I might have to start running missions just to be able to shoot something without having it warp away. I don't really see how this is CCP's fault. It's the player's choice. They have no obligations to jump in front of your guns so you could have some fun. It's that players that make PvP into what it is. Edit: Camping an instance entrance in WoW seems like a viable alternative.
Valan	Posted - 2006.11.06 10:32:00 - [18] Originally by: Tyler Lowe Hammerhead: It's true, people used to live out in 0.0 then we got the lvl 4 agents and now we have the Jita problem. We should remove level 4 agents from 0.5 and above. I can't believe a GM has said that. There have always been more players in empire since the beginning. More subs mean even greater numbers in empire. There used to be more people in low sec, but low sec is just tedious. I reckon they should move all agents to 0.0 that will solve the lag problem across the server. People are there becuase they want to be. If you make them move and they cease to be able to do what they want, they leave. I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
Ineeh	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:20:00 - [19] I think it's a fake. This is not a quote from the devchat of Oct. 19th, and this is the only official devchat in one year at least. log is there : http://eve.coldfront.net/article/12 , and hammerhead didn't even take part to the chat. If Tyler is not able to show us where this quote come from, i think we face another flamebait.
Jowen Datloran Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:30:00 - [20] CCP will NOT move level 4 agents from high sec.* What they will do is give you higher rewards (money and LP) by doing them in low sec. Also certain missions and perhaps even offers will be low sec only. This is already happening and will most likely be improved. *Unless utterly retarded. ---------------- Mr. Science & Trade Institute
Fred0 Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Infinity Ziona How stupid do you have to be to think that people are in high sec because of your boring unimaginative unchallanging missions. We'll count that as a vote for removing them then.
Valan	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:43:00 - [22] The issue over populated empire has been around since the beginning. Things have been tried to coax people out. I was wondering why empire is needed. 10 systems per empire set at 1.0 with uber concord to prevent any high sec ganking and protect the noobs. Change the rest to low sec. Less choke points. More pvp. More room so you can evade if you're mining. Makes it difficult for macroers and isk sellers. I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
Gats Amarr Black-Sun The SUdden Death Squad	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:47:00 - [23] Originally by: Daktor Originally by: Tyler Loweuntil I can upgrade to something more current than my tired P4 1.6Ghz system, and hope it isn't some issue with my ISP/connection compounding other problems.[/quote I run Eve on a 600 Mhz P4, and I get better than 25 fps. What kind of video card are you using? fyi there is no P4 cpu that runs @ 600 mhz stock speed , P4 came after the p3 1 ghz . And there is more then just the cpu that effects your performance .
Roshan longshot Gallente Ordos Humanitas	Posted - 2006.11.06 11:47:00 - [24] Agent missions should be phased out...all except the newbie ones and maybe level one. Here is why... ISK...When they started, the miners left the belts to earn more isk...which in turn allowed the macros to dominate the mineral market. Loot...Missions droped better loot then tech I manufactures could produce. Even though they have been nerfed, players rather run missions and refine the loot then mine. Empire space...nuff said... Even with my high skills in industry, it cost me 7 million isk to make a thorax last night, that is buying from the market all the minerals I needed. The region average for a thorax is 5 million.... Phase out these missions...at least move them where they wont effect the game as bad as they have. Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter *pirate* or mixture of them all. [i]As read from the original box.
Acama	Posted - 2006.11.06 12:09:00 - [25] Originally by: Roshan longshot Even with my high skills in industry, it cost me 7 million isk to make a thorax last night, that is buying from the market all the minerals I needed. The region average for a thorax is 5 million.... Uhh... which region??? /emote prepares the refining bay for a stack of thoraxes
Morfane Privateers	Posted - 2006.11.06 13:16:00 - [26] Originally by: Ineeh I think it's a fake. This is not a quote from the devchat of Oct. 19th, and this is the only official devchat in one year at least. log is there : http://eve.coldfront.net/article/12 , and hammerhead didn't even take part to the chat. If Tyler is not able to show us where this quote come from, i think we face another flamebait. Post-Devchat http://eve.coldfront.net/article/13 Its not a fake. I think the problem of how some people cannot believe that a dev would say something like that shows that you don't understand at all how this game is supposed to work. I don't think the devs do sometimes either, because we have things like instas, omniscient local, and high-end content in low-end areas.
Ineeh	Posted - 2006.11.06 13:32:00 - [27] Ok it's not a fake then. Originally by: Morfane I think the problem of how some people cannot believe that a dev would say something like that shows that you don't understand at all how this game is supposed to work. I don't think the devs do sometimes either, because we have things like instas, omniscient local, and high-end content in low-end areas. It looks like YOU understand how this game works better than anyone else, even the devs. Maybe you could share your all-seeing widosm with us poor fools. It's strange that it's always the PKs who understand the game better than the people who make it
Yumi Katanawe Caldari Demon Womb	Posted - 2006.11.06 14:05:00 - [28] Edited by: Yumi Katanawe on 06/11/2006 14:06:09 The Right Way (tm) to do this is to implement level 5 agents but locate them all in low-sec.
Ogdru Jahad Amarr	Posted - 2006.11.06 14:08:00 - [29] Originally by: Tyler Lowe <Viceroy> High Sec has been overbloated with people since lvl 4 agents came out, when can we expect this massive flaw to be addressed? Hammerhead: It's true, people used to live out in 0.0 then we got the lvl 4 agents and now we have the Jita problem. We should remove level 4 agents from 0.5 and above. Bahahahahaha Is it aprils fools already? anyone who has DONE thier research would know THAT! most of the lvl4 agents are already in low sec or 0.0. If all Lvl 4 agents are going to be moved to low sec. what will become of the pirate agents? have the tards thought about that before faking a dev remark? hmmm seems someone has had a lot of faking recently. woman related i bet. -
Jack Brimstone Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2006.11.06 14:38:00 - [30] Wouldn't surprise me if Viceroy slipped this one in just to watch the explosion of forum apoplexy -------------------------------------------------

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