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Malicious Wraith
The Dark Side of the Moon Edge of Sanity
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Posted - 2006.11.11 19:24:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Malicious Wraith on 11/11/2006 19:24:04
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
Rofl, I dont like the combat changes but that may be a bit harsh ^.- ----------------------------------------
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Kristoffer
Amarr Blackguard Brigade
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Posted - 2006.11.11 19:38:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Malicious Wraith Edited by: Malicious Wraith on 11/11/2006 19:24:04
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
Rofl, I dont like the combat changes but that may be a bit harsh ^.-
Except thats the truth.
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Wrayeth
Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.11 20:16:00 -
[63]
It might be slightly exaggerated, but it's close enough as to make no real difference. The fight duration increase completely screws solo and small gang PvP. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven R.I.P. Solo PvP R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle.
Thanks, CCP. |
Tetovo
Caldari Art of War Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2006.11.11 20:25:00 -
[64]
Things I like Drake(HAMS + Drake=overpowered but the drake itself is fine) Harbinger ECM Nerf(Still can get jammed by non ecm ships but its less common) New Bs except abbadon Contract System Things I don't like 50% HP change. I like this in theory. Unfortunately the capacitators on ships have been untouched. Amarr and gallente should have an enormous capacitator advantage over Min/Cal(Rokh excluded) because of their cap-less weapons. I think with a little bit of balancing of cap,this change could be good. 4 Nos/4 Guns. Missle slots on the rokh(Think NOS Domi with missles ewww)
It needs work, overall I think it will be pretty good for the game. Even though my ships, gallente, are getting hit pretty hard I have confidence that it will be righted over time.
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Zacheria Malfor
Gallente FightClub TQ
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Posted - 2006.11.11 20:26:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Malicious Wraith Edited by: Malicious Wraith on 11/11/2006 19:24:04
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
Rofl, I dont like the combat changes but that may be a bit harsh ^.-
Unfortunatly that isnt far from the truth, I fought an Abaddon in my Hyperion the fight lasted around 15 - 20 minutes approx and I used the time to make a drink, take care of bodily functions and check what was on TV... came back with plenty of time to see the explosion occur... and unfortunatly the rush just disappears due to the length of the fights, you can afford to have slower reactions and take it at a much slower pace simply because you now have the time to burn.
Do not fear the reaper, for death is the only certainty in life. |
entaru adun
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Posted - 2006.11.11 20:42:00 -
[66]
Edited by: entaru adun on 11/11/2006 20:48:23 Edited by: entaru adun on 11/11/2006 20:46:52 Edited by: entaru adun on 11/11/2006 20:44:28
Originally by: Sir Drake
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
1. Doesnt really make me cry to get rid of some pvpers (and some Quakekiddies), so thumbs up for Kali on that point.
2. Longer battles with more importance to cap, sounds good to me, guess that will bring the PvE and PvP setups another step closer together (on some ships).
4. New BS/BC AWESOME!!!! cant wait to get them
perhaps it sounds good to those that don't need cap(Caldari) but to those who do need cap(Gallente,Amarr) this is the worst update ever.
Hyperion is Basicly a Megathron with an extra turret slot and less pg,Myrmidon can only kill something if it's t2 fitted and a 2 yr old player is piloting it.
as for the T2 ammo changes,a huge nerf...making null useless and void not nearly as effective as it should be.
Quote: Things I like Drake(HAMS + Drake=overpowered but the drake itself is fine) Harbinger ECM Nerf(Still can get jammed by non ecm ships but its less common) New Bs except abbadon Contract System Things I don't like 50% HP change. I like this in theory. Unfortunately the capacitators on ships have been untouched. Amarr and gallente should have an enormous capacitator advantage over Min/Cal(Rokh excluded) because of their cap-less weapons. I think with a little bit of balancing of cap,this change could be good. 4 Nos/4 Guns. Missle slots on the rokh(Think NOS Domi with missles ewww)
It needs work, overall I think it will be pretty good for the game. Even though my ships, gallente, are getting hit pretty hard I have confidence that it will be righted over time.
i think you mean Caldari/Minmatar have it good.
Edit:Spelling
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Kristoffer
Amarr Blackguard Brigade
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Posted - 2006.11.11 20:47:00 -
[67]
Originally by: entaru adun Edited by: entaru adun on 11/11/2006 20:44:28
Originally by: Sir Drake
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
1. Doesnt really make me cry to get rid of some pvpers (and some Quakekiddies), so thumbs up for Kali on that point.
2. Longer battles with more importance to cap, sounds good to me, guess that will bring the PvE and PvP setups another step closer together (on some ships).
4. New BS/BC AWESOME!!!! cant wait to get them
perhaps it sounds good to those that don't need cap(Caldari) but to those who do need cap(Gallente,Amarr) this is the worst update ever.
Hyperion is Basicly a Megathron with an extra turret slot and less pg,Myrmidon can only kill something if it's t2 fitted and a 2 yr old player is piloting it.
as for the T2 ammo changes,a huge nerf...making null useless and void not nearly as effective as it should be.
There is nothing wrong with the Hyperion unless you fight like you'd fight on TQ. I love the Hyperion. I have won every fight since i fought in Kali style with my hyperion. But I don't enjoy Kali fighting.
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Sir Drake
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Posted - 2006.11.11 21:02:00 -
[68]
m8 stop thinking of gank setups! Think cap setups!
Im using amarr BS for almost 3 years now and the way i see it the apoc with its big cap and some CR/CPR will certainly come out on top from this patch. My amarr BS PvE setups usually have a cap recharge of <200 sec to keep the amor reps and weapons constantly running. Those setups have been pretty useless for PvP until now guess i will give them a go on Kali. Outlasting instead of outdamaging ftw
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Kristoffer
Amarr Blackguard Brigade
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Posted - 2006.11.11 21:30:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Sir Drake m8 stop thinking of gank setups! Think cap setups!
Im using amarr BS for almost 3 years now and the way i see it the apoc with its big cap and some CR/CPR will certainly come out on top from this patch. My amarr BS PvE setups usually have a cap recharge of <200 sec to keep the amor reps and weapons constantly running. Those setups have been pretty useless for PvP until now guess i will give them a go on Kali. Outlasting instead of outdamaging ftw
Are you talking to me? If you are, I don't think you have read any of my posts at all.
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Sir Drake
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Posted - 2006.11.11 21:48:00 -
[70]
nope, was talking to entaru adun.
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Mr Ninjaface
Minmatar Shurekin INC
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Posted - 2006.11.12 19:07:00 -
[71]
Hey everyone thanks for your replies thus far been a very interesting read. MY thoughts on Kali |
Mudduck
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Posted - 2006.11.12 22:09:00 -
[72]
I have done some testing on the server and I noticed the same things (in general) with Kali, that I noticed with every other big content patch since the game came out. Most of these giant "content" patches add little by way of "new content" and a lot by way of "carrot moving".
Crib notes versions:
There is the ever popular nerf/skill insertion scenario. Although the "nerf" part isn't present (yet) as far as I can tell, they have added a bunch of new skills, that will have to be trained to put your char to same place relative to where it was the day before the patch. Time sink basically.
Then there is the all the brewhaha about some type of ship not being competitive with other types of ships. One of the last patches the big thing was making frigates more powerful than they should be, so that bigger ships and drones didn't have an "I win" button against them. This time, it is making T1 ships more competitive with T2.
We know that game makers must try to appease the newer players, that is where the money is.
Rigs (and the skills needed for them), from a use in game perspective are useless. But as I stated above, in order to compete you will have to waste time training for them if you wish your char to stay where it was prior to the patch.
So Kali will be like every other big patch:
There will be a few cool things put into the game that very few people will be able to use and most people can't.
They will add some really semi useless things into the game and dozens of skills to use them. Everyone will have to train because being at the top of your specialty requires it, but it will add nothing to game other than sinking time.
They will again attempt to narrow the divide between players in game for 3 years and players in game for 3 months.
I am sure I missed some, but these are included in every patch since they started doing big patches.
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Fools nobody
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Posted - 2006.11.12 23:36:00 -
[73]
Those of you complaining about the hit points, i see your reasoning, ten minute battles are boring but the whole point in kali is fleet warfare. If you're stuck in a 1v? battle it gives you a chance to call reinforcements. admittedly 50% seems to be abit too much but thats what testings for. Right now, battles are over in a matter of seconds, that doesn't seem fun to me, especially when i'm not prepared for them. A fleet battle would be lucky to last ten minutes. Thats hundreds of ships blasted in a very short time. From any perspective it makes no sense. Why would an armoured combat ship get blasted to pieces in mere seconds? Do real naval battles last less than a minute? they tend to last abit longer. Current combat is over too fast and is off putting. They just need to balance it right
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Deva Blackfire
DAB RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.13 08:23:00 -
[74]
My opinion abt kali?
1. Amarr kicked in the balls again (maybe its time to un-nerf pulse range? radio crystals nerf and damage mod stacking still works...)
2. Probes are fun (and fast)
3. Warp to 0 - another cool thingy (w/o it i'd need to copy another 15000 BMs for my alt...)
4. Already found new ways of griefing :) YAY for me and more fun :)
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Bellum Eternus
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Posted - 2006.11.13 08:43:00 -
[75]
After reading quite a few of the observations posted here, I'd have to agree that I think the HP increase does more harm than good. I'm specced in Large T2 Blasters and Gal BS for my Mega. Looks to me that I'll just have to completely ignore all my effort and start over with something else once Kali hits. Kinda disappointing, but I guess there isn't anything I can really do about it is there?
Anyone have suggestions as to what I should train? It's a celebration beeootch! |
Caleb Paine
ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.13 10:20:00 -
[76]
Not sure if it's already been mentioned but keep in mind that on the test server people will fit ship with the most outrageous modules and use stupid implants, just because they can.
Try it again with a normal T1 setup or possibly a T2 one, see what happens.
-------------------------------- ISS Navy Task Force; Protecting your interest. |
Bellum Eternus
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Posted - 2006.11.13 10:26:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Caleb Paine Not sure if it's already been mentioned but keep in mind that on the test server people will fit ship with the most outrageous modules and use stupid implants, just because they can.
Try it again with a normal T1 setup or possibly a T2 one, see what happens.
While this is true, I fit all my stuff as realistically as possible so I have a good idea of what it will really do on TQ. Sometimes I use best named damage controls etc, but TBH I use them on my BSs quite a bit. But yes, I agree that lots of players fly around with full sets of high grade crystal implants etc.
IMO I don't see the point, but what ever. It's a celebration beeootch! |
zcinner
Caldari Murder-Death-Kill Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.14 14:10:00 -
[78]
Edited by: zcinner on 14/11/2006 14:12:43 havent read the replies to this post so someone might said it alredy..
the 50% more armor will make you survive like 10 secs longer in a fleet battle?
and evry one who wines about the 0km warp in..they will allow dictors with bubbles in low sec in kali. and id say 90% of eve players alredy uses instas by now so it wont be a big diffrence..
and the new map i dont like for some reason,,
//zcinner
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Zacheria Malfor
Gallente FightClub TQ
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Posted - 2006.11.15 18:49:00 -
[79]
HP's primary affect will be in solo and small scale engagments, as far as fleet combat goes as many have mentioned... it will not make a massive difference.
ECM will still be the bane of existence to many pilots as it is still chance based and despite the nerf to the strength it will still be viable on most ships if a slot and the appropriate cpu are spare.
Drones are in need of a HP increase for the Kali patch if the HP increase goes through.
T2 ammo rebalance... some of it is ok, other parts are sickening.
Rigs are a nice idea and should hopefully add to the complexity and make fights more interesting but this will depend on the markets.
As for the contracts and other new bits and pieces i havent really had chance to look at them in depth.
Do not fear the reaper, for death is the only certainty in life. |
Burakus
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Posted - 2006.11.15 18:53:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Kristoffer
Originally by: IHaveTenFingers
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
Battleship fights are supposed to last a long time.
I've been in over 20 battleship 1v1s on the test server in the last day and a half. Against incompetent pilots and pilots with low sp fights would last around 10 minutes. Against pilots who have a clue about what Kali is about, they'd last twenty minutes or more. The longest of my fights went 27 minutes, Hyperion vs Rokh.
That is not fun, nor is it exciting. That is just stupid.
I agree, though I havent tested so i'll have to take your word for it that they really are that long. It is also really bad news for pirates- you think people get blobs of friends in a lot now? It'll be even harder to kill anyone. Hopefully more players and a better populated lowsec will offset this. ______________
Booooo signature hijack. Hooray beer! |
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.11.15 19:38:00 -
[81]
I have strong feeling that Eve is becoming worse. - ECM is almost banned from the game. - 50% HP boost destroys balance in every possible area, PvP, PvE, drones, capcitors, cargohold size, etc. - torpedo Ravens are banned from the game. - HACs are banned from the PvP by BC tier2 and 50% HP boost. - WCS nerf disvourage noobs from fighting in lowsec, discourages experienced pilots from occasional using expensive ships with juicy fit. Also dictors pilots will be not so important with their bubbles after WCS nerf - tier 3 BS are laughful. Say least. Rokh is again real Caldari-no-dps-no-alpha-strike warship. Great idea, CCP. Abaddon... Ok, RIP Abaddon till Tux add more capacitors to all ships. Mael? Get Tempest! Hyperion? Get Mega! - ECM is baned from the regular game(may be Rook?). Falcon is too expensive and too weak to jam, Scorpion and BBird cannot jam effectively. So only universal weapon for poorman are deleted from the game.
The only good thing I noticed is local boost.(I do not need warp to 0 option) --------------------------------- Hint: Train for Mega, not for Rokh R.I.P. <Torpedo Raven> R.I.P. <Eagle> R.I.P. <ECM>
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Sean Dillon
Caldari Snakes in a Pod
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Posted - 2006.11.15 20:46:00 -
[82]
Kali sucks
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Admiral Pieg
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.11.15 21:56:00 -
[83]
Originally by: zcinner Edited by: zcinner on 14/11/2006 14:12:43 havent read the replies to this post so someone might said it alredy..
the 50% more armor will make you survive like 10 secs longer in a fleet battle?
and evry one who wines about the 0km warp in..they will allow dictors with bubbles in low sec in kali. and id say 90% of eve players alredy uses instas by now so it wont be a big diffrence..
and the new map i dont like for some reason,,
//zcinner
thats the problem isnt it? Wasnt the hp boost intended to fix fleet battle instapopping? If so, then id say it failed miserably. The only way i can think of to fix instapopping in fleet battles is to penalize concentrated fire on a single ship. ______________
Pod from above. |
Agrias Hellion
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Posted - 2006.11.16 02:36:00 -
[84]
Pretty much everything looks cool bar the HP increase.
Looking at my Armageddon and my Apocalypse side by side ingame at the moment and to be honest it only seems that the Tier 2 ships need a slight increase in stats to differentiate between them. With these particular ships the gap is very small. With the geddons current bonus it technically makes it the better ship.
Price increase between them is around 40 million, you should see a slightly bigger difference than you do. They need to make Tier 3 ships somewhat better otherwise whats the point of the additional cost? New skin?
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Red Ochre
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Posted - 2006.11.16 04:27:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Kristoffer Edited by: Kristoffer on 10/11/2006 02:08:12
Originally by: Sir Drake
Originally by: Kristoffer My personal thoughts on Kali will be canceling my account.
PVP totally sucks now. I was on Kali for a while today, the majority of my 1v1 BS fights lasted 20 to thirty minutes. I brushed my teeth, went to the bathroom, and got changed while my hyperion was fighting a rokh. Its not fun or exciting at all.
1. Doesnt really make me cry to get rid of some pvpers (and some Quakekiddies), so thumbs up for Kali on that point.
2. Longer battles with more importance to cap, sounds good to me, guess that will bring the PvE and PvP setups another step closer together (on some ships).
You make me sad. I don't think you know what pvp is, nor have ever experienced any good pvp fights. Twenty to thirty minutes is not fun. There is NOTHING exciting or fun about it. The 50% HP buff is the problem.
Quake kiddies? How about any competent pvper.
Please get a clue. Thanks.
But I agree that the new ships and rigs are pretty awesome.
no, you make me sad kris, your opinionated. try an opinion, it will go over better.
as for your wanting to quit, regardless of the reason, it's your choice, eve will most likely become a better place.
dont let the door hit you on the way out, or?....were you just funnin' with us and your staying? |
Kamal Drax
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Posted - 2006.11.16 05:45:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Andrue Edited by: Andrue on 10/11/2006 12:41:38 There seem to be too many people here that don't understand Eve.
THERE IS NO "I HAVE WON" IN EVE.
There is no point aspiring to be the unbeatable "Red Barron" and therefore no point getting annoyed when your chosen equipment or playstyle gets changed.
Eve is a journey and a long journey at that. Kali just means that we're turning onto a different road and that gives us new sites to see and new equipment/skills to get the hang of.
Be grateful that CCP have the guts to change things. If they didn't it would all get old and stale. With the changes to Kali you have a chance to reassess how you play the game and what you play it with. Investigate the options, see what opportunities you can find. Now is the chance to be the first one to spot that opportunity and exploit it. Suddenly we almost have a level playing field again.
When I joined in Feb '04 beams were crap. Then they became uber. Then they became so-so. Now they are back to crap. I'm still here. I had the guts to change my tactics and my game play. I enjoyed changing to different weapon systems and playing the game differently.
If you don't understand this concept then you don't understand Eve.
Eve is not about finding the best equipment and best game play style then winning. It is about progressing your character and overcoming adversity and exploiting opportunity. It's a lot like life in that respect. Those that adapat will flourish. Those that can't adapt will drop out.
UBER pwnage to all you ungrateful turds!
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Lokius Ahgamemnon
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Posted - 2006.11.16 07:08:00 -
[87]
idk bout everyone else but I pay for online games because I hope to recieve new content in regular intervuls, otherwise I forget why I'm paying for this online game and therefore...I stop paying, as long as there is new content I don't care whether it's good or bad, I'm a very open person and am willing to adapt/change to whatever the creators intend, you guys are forgetting the enourmouse amount of bug fixes that Kali is introducing as well as all the nice content, get the sand out of your cooters, stop whining, CCP has the final say and I'll side with ccp cuz I like me some new content
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Spike Larosse
RSP Enterprises
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Posted - 2006.11.16 07:19:00 -
[88]
I think the ECM nerf is a bit over the top. I agree it maybe was somewhat out of hands earlier, but now it is basically useless on non-ECM ships unless you're trying to gank a t1 frig. I think it takes away from the variety of setups possible, as I for one, after a few test fights on SiSi, will never fit ECM on my ships. Multispecs are just useless. Now racials might still have a small chance to work, but then of course, how often is that a viable option, and why waste 1 slot on it when it is most likely to fail anyways. Just feel that the action here is too harsh, first with the ECCM boost and now this. And now, please reimburse the SP I wasted on ECM skills, as gallente can't use them anymore!! ------------------------------------------------ -RSP- |
Lorn Yeager
Gallente Blessed Souls
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Posted - 2006.11.16 09:23:00 -
[89]
I dont know how EVE will be for me when we get Kali on TQ (never made it onto the test-server so cant test the changes for myself).
But I do know that if EVE stops being fun, then I leave. I dont play because I can gank others, or mine veldspar. But because I want to have fun with whatever I want to do.
Lately, EVE has been in a not-so-fun slide down the ladder. Lag, instability is one thing. Players abusing mechanics another. Reasons are many. Reading some of your replies I think that the EVE funfactor for the experienced player is decreasing. If it takes 30 minutes to conduct 1v1 fighting it becomes ... not fun. On an average evening I have around 2 hours of playtime. Those hours are spent with chat, shipfitting, searching for targets and shooting them. If the latter WILL REQUIRE a couple of team-mates before it becomes viable/reasonably effective, the fun goes out the window.
Especially when it comes to solo PvP or even pirating, it looks like its turning impossible. Increased HP and even the nerfed ECM turns things into a battle of capacitors more than a battle of setups or pilots. ECM gains you the upper hand. Thats the point of it, if it becomes useless no-one will use it. Remember the Damage controls before the upgrades? You dont fit something on your ship you cant rely on. The value of the indivdual slot is very high, so you have to believe in the modules you put into it.
Without effective ECM or alike, every battle will come down to DPS vs. RPS divided by the cap. All math... no fun. With 50% more HP, the time it will take to destroy a rather large ship will be long enough to remove the element and effect of surprise. In turn, will force pilots to look for targets they KNOW they can destroy somewhat fast... no more destroying BS's with your thorax. Also, more HP or "survival buffer" will make outgame combat experience devalued as it doesnt matter if you turned on your repper at the right time.
Just what I had in mind right now.
Begin sig: //->
Its Aloha time!
Lorn Yeager Blessed Souls
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Malakai0
Eye of God Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.11.16 10:59:00 -
[90]
Oh and warp to 0km option is freaking fantastic. I have about 2000 bm's that will get auto delted with kali, and I couldn't be happier. We all have bm's anyway, lets just dispense with the lag and time consuming bookmarks and get to the pew pew. _________________________ - We are Eye Of God, being so, we see the big picture. - Axiom is a self-evident truth upon which other knowledge must rest AND if its not self-evident to you, thats what |
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