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My proposal is as followed: [ TLDR ]
All of the Secondary bonuses should apply to rapid heavy missile launchers aswell.
I do not feel like they would become OP. The Barghest is in a decent spot right now and isn't rediculously strong.
This would also create a more diverse usage of missile launcher types.

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So they hit frigates and other small ships easier.
Can all turret ships then have tracking bonus as well?

Why ALL turret ships? Are the ships I listed ALL missiles ships?
There's plenty of turret ships with tracking bonuses.

does ANY turret has the signature resolution of heavy missiles? (after you fit to ship rigors, target painter and enjoy the bonus of ship like reduction in exp. radius).
no to idea.

Current, No missile cruiser's damage application bonus affect RLML at moment*, and only Barghest out of All missile BS have ship bonus that increase RHML range.

*certain cruiser's ship bonus that boost missile range do apply toward RLML.


Anyway, when RHML was added, it was pointed out about BS ship bonus don't apply to RHML and CCP reply that it is intented as designed.

does ANY turret has the signature resolution of heavy missiles? (after you fit to ship rigors, target painter and enjoy the bonus of ship like reduction in exp. radius).
no to idea.

With such a lofty claim now I posit you show some evidence.

, i try to avoid this, but you started.
to those who think that they are clever than i :
exp radius of heavy missiles by numbers:
all skill 5 - 105
all skill 5 and 1 rigor T2 - 78
all skill 5 and 2 rigor T2 - 67 (destroyer sig)

Does any of middle/large turrets have such a sig resolution? And what will happens if for example CNR can use his bonuses with heavy missiles? Try to think if you can.

-1 RHML already have application bonuses in the form of firing a smaller missile

o7
Scorpion Navy Issue
5% bonus to rapid heavy missile, cruise missile and torpedo launcher rate of fire
4% bonus to all shield resistances

, i try to avoid this, but you started.
to those who think that they are clever than i :
exp radius of heavy missiles by numbers:
all skill 5 - 105
all skill 5 and 1 rigor T2 - 78
all skill 5 and 2 rigor T2 - 67 (destroyer sig)

Does any of middle/large turrets have such a sig resolution? And what will happens if for example CNR can use his bonuses with heavy missiles? Try to think if you can.

There's a reason why they don't get a range bonus to heavy missiles.
You can pull out a good amount of DPS with an RHML BS, with much better application.

CCP specifically kept their range low in order to keep them balanced.

You can get close to 1k DPS on a Raven with RHMLs at 50km...
If you throw on 3 t1 range rigs, you can get 70km...

That's almost 1k dps with higher damage application, and more mid slots to support a web and/or TP thus increasing application even more.

The only real use for rapid lights in PVP, and if you're out past 50km, you're likely doing it wrong.

I think they're balanced just fine.

Im confused. Where are you getting 50km from when HM have a base range of 63km? 3 t1 velocity rigs take it to 88km. Not to mention using 3 range rigs is absurd... tank? Whats that? What sane person would sacrifice all 3 rigs for missile range?

Then you state 1k dps, thats an eft number. Turn on the "count reload into dps" preference and see that number drop. Not to mention even with a tp, damage applied to anything smaller than a mwd shield cruiser will be much less than that number. Not factoring in the ever common link scrub too.

"More mids to support TP and webs" explain how your triple velocity rigged raven has webs that reach out to 88km (and a tank for that matter). A single TP will help, but you will still get fairly poor application because TP will be operating in falloff.

Then rapid lights are mentioned.. are you sure you're talking about the right weapon platform?

Now, i think RHML are in decent shape. Though having the velocity bonus on the raven count towards RHML would be fine. The caracals velocity bonus applies to RLML.. so i dont see an issue there. The typhoon bonus though... as much as i would LOVE IT, it would be pretty OP. I kill t3d and AF all the time with my application fit t1 and FI phoon. Having that bonus apply to heavies would mean i could drop some application and fit more tank/EWAR and still obsolutely dunk frigs/t3d.

responses

No. Bad pilot *hits with newspaper*

Fury missiles should NEVER be used against a target at range. It has terrible application and will only do full dps to a webbed BC. Or double webbed cruiser when you have rigor (maybe).

150km with fury missiles is still bad because of how poor they apply. You can literally do 200dps to a mwd cruiser using unsupported fury missiles.

Fury/rage missiles MUST be supported properly to get all that dps on target. Meaning webs/tp/rigor etc.

Yes you do factor in reload, not every fight is a 1v1. I was fighting a VNI and legion in my phoon. The VNI (he was linked i think) soaked up a whole clip and my drones had to kill him. Then i waited for reload before missile spamming legion (he lived). Ideally you burst dps a few targets, but that is rarely the case.

RHML need more support to apply properly than a RLML caracal. Bottom line is, a cruiser is getting a bonus to an ammo group smaller than its hull. The same could be applied to the raven under the same principle. Heavies will still apply poorly even if the raven can shoot to 90km.

See, the thing is, most missile ships are bonused to damage and range.
RHMLs don't need the range... They're a close range weapon system, for the most part.
The only missile BS that is bonused to HM range is the Barghest.

However, there are only 3 BS class ships (that i can think of) that have an application bonus, but the bonus does not apply to HMs. (this is specifically to application and not range)

They would be the
Raven Navy
Golem
Typhoon


So, out of all the missile BSs, only one is bonused to range with HMs.

As I've stated, the range bonus isn't a big deal, as RHMLs are intended to be limited range engagement.

My concern is those 3 ships.
Why does their application bonus (only BSs with applicaton bonus) not apply to HMs?

IMO, this is all that needs to be addressed with RHMLs..

RHML are not close range. Heavy missiles are long range. HAMs and torpedos are short range. RHML are used close range because heavy missiles have terrible application and require webs/rigor to apply well. However that is not always the case. Against shield tanked mwd cruisers, you can apply fairly well with a TP/rigor at range. Actually killed a lach at 55km with RHML the other day.. he wasnt even pointed lol.

Now adding the application bonus would be alittle too strong. But the ravens velocity bonus would be fine IMO. It would be the big brother of the caracal except instead of swatting frigates, it would swat cruisers.

I'm not going to search out the quotes, but CCP specifically stated that they didn't want secondary bonuses to apply to RHMLs.
Their reasoning was that no one would use torps/cruise, as RHMLs have better application, thus better against smaller ships.