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A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations

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Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.01.16 11:57:00 - [361] Having read through the guide in E-ON I have found no major error, just 2-3 small so I am not going to bother doing an errata. What I will do is post the last chapter of the guide that was cut out due to space limitation. It's about avoiding being found by probes. From the eyes of the victim In the name of fairness, I must give some tips to potential probe targets on how to avoid being found. The most powerful defence is the cloak as if you are cloaked, you can not be found. There have been some indications that this might change in the future but at the time of writing this holds true. You can also fit ECCM as increasing your sensor strength makes you a smaller target for probes. This will not stop people from finding you but it can delay them considerably. You can use your Directional Scanner to check if there are probes nearby. It will show probes if set to not filter by overview. If you see the probes on the scanner, you know someone is looking for you and you should start moving. You are going to need to check the scanner often; if itÆs a skilled hunter with both plentiful experience and many skill points in probe skills, the probes will only show up on your scanner for around 30-40 seconds. ItÆs also possible that you might catch his ship uncloaked as he needs to drop the cloak to launch probes and start scans. Be a moving target If your ship has a micro warp drive and you can run it constantly a good defence is to just point yourself straight up or down and activate the MWD. While you wonÆt be harder to find, it wonÆt matter because once the hunter gets to the position returned by the probes, you are already far away. Just donÆt go afk doing this; it is possible that their group will include an even faster ship than yours that can overtake you if given enough time. ItÆs also possible they might warp in a battleship and snipe you before you get out of range. Another tactic to avoid being caught is to keep warping around between safe spots. This used to be an almost 100% sure safe tactic but with the new ultra short scan times, itÆs possible they might catch one of your safes just after you've left and then just sit there and wait until the next time you return to it. *poof* Finally, we have the controversial but highly effective option to log off. Just make sure you donÆt have an aggression timer when you log off. This timer is invisible and is started when the last offensive action from you against someone else or someone else against you happened, essentially the last PvP action you were involved in. If you log off during that 15 minute long aggression timer, your ship will stay in space for another 15 minutes, which gives your hunters plenty of time to find and kill you. If you did not have an aggression timer, your ship will disappear after just 1 minute, which is almost certainly too short to both find and kill you. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Ishan Shade	Posted - 2007.01.16 13:38:00 - [362] Edited by: Ishan Shade on 16/01/2007 13:42:11 Nice guide Hoshi. In your last post however you state that the log-off timer is 1 minute for unagressed ships. This is however 2 minutes. Still I can say from experience that it is very hard to find and kill the logged off person within that time. (basicly you have to have your prober there the moment the guy logs off, or you have no chance) On the other hand thanks to your formulas I have seem to found the trick in probing people in dead space complexes. I'm not going to tell you how, (maybe someone already did but I cba to read all the pages) since it could possible lead to even more nerfage, but I can find people pretty reliably in deadspace these days, partly thanks to your guide :D so carebears be warned!
JJ McHawker	Posted - 2007.01.19 15:26:00 - [363] Hi all.. just started investigating probes a day or so ago, and this guide has provided an invaluable insight into the techniques and skills to train - great work Hoshi and the other contributors! My experiments so far have yielded nothing more than a selection of ships and drones in my home system. Mostly, the ships I picked up were abandoned shuttles and players going about their business - they were outside stations and near gates. I found numerous sets of drones - sometimes, the odd lone one; more often 3-5 in a bunch. (I am now self-sufficient in Hammerheads for a while!). With regard to people wanting to find mission runners and wrecks, it seems the drones may be a valuable clue.. a couple of sets of drones I found were abandoned next to 20-30 wrecks, while another set seemed (from the scan results; I didn't go there) to be at the same range as a small gaggle of ships. My point is, maybe CCP nerfed the sensor/scan strength of ships in complexes but forgot to do drones?? It seems a shame that scanning for wrecks doesn't work, as I could see that being a scrap merchant in one of the popular missions systems could be a fairly profitable pastime. JJ Peace Out
JJ McHawker	Posted - 2007.01.20 00:41:00 - [364] Tonight I have continued to experiment with Probes in my home system (which has no Exploration sites), puting some of the theory from the guide into play. I used only Quest drones, and pretty randomly selected a race. Once again, I found only uninteresting Ships and lots more Drones - I collected about 50 drones in total; pretty much the entire range of small & meds and even some heavies and T2. Again, warping to some of the drones also netted me a few wrecks and salvage. However, having "walked" further away into deadspace, I then found a set of drones that instead led to a jumpgate when warped-to. I found 5 in total, all of which led to apparently incomplete multi-room missions, with empty rooms (occasional wreckage from Battlships and the like). On a couple of occasions, I did catch up with the person / people doing the mission. So, it seems it is possible to find people out doing missions, although I'm not sure how useable this is. Certainly, the agent mission rooms are temporary ones. JJ
marcouk2 Gallente Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.01.20 14:59:00 - [365] Originally by: Hoshi Be a moving target If your ship has a micro warp drive and you can run it constantly a good defence is to just point yourself straight up or down and activate the MWD. While you wonÆt be harder to find, it wonÆt matter because once the hunter gets to the position returned by the probes, you are already far away. Just donÆt go afk doing this; it is possible that their group will include an even faster ship than yours that can overtake you if given enough time. ItÆs also possible they might warp in a battleship and snipe you before you get out of range. Just note that the corresponding increase in your sig radius does make it a fair bit easier for probes to detect you and give a greater accuracy for probe results. for ex. i can frequently get 0m results on frigs with the longer range probes.
Dillon Arklight Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:22:00 - [366] Originally by: Siggur I've seen that your signal output is like 1/100th when you're in deadspace - meaning you're much less likely to be found on a deadspace mission (It might have been early on in the thread actually).. Is that true? If it is true, does anyone know if it's true for exploration sites? Or for deadspace sites found via exploration? Its seems this is true. For the last few hours ive been scanning down mission runners and despite being well under 5au and looking for ships ranging from tech 1 frigates to logistic ships i havent found a single one except for the rare times when i do get a hit its usually from their drones. Any ideas why CCP would reduce the chances of missions runners being found? It seems like a contradiction to the whole scanning system.
Joerd Toastius Octavian Vanguard	Posted - 2007.01.22 13:12:00 - [367] It's almost certainly because of the potential for straightforward grief play. For example, in missions which require you to pick up a certain item from a destroyed ship, there exists the potential for someone to probe the player down, chase them out of the mission area and then steal the item themselves, thus screwing over the mission-runner without firing a shot and bypassing all the punishment mechanisms.
Kirex Gallente Vale Heavy Industries SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.23 03:48:00 - [368] What does cycle time on both of the launchers mean? The time it takes until you can launch a new probe? Click above for my killboard stats.
Dillon Arklight Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.01.23 08:42:00 - [369] Originally by: Joerd Toastius It's almost certainly because of the potential for straightforward grief play. For example, in missions which require you to pick up a certain item from a destroyed ship, there exists the potential for someone to probe the player down, chase them out of the mission area and then steal the item themselves, thus screwing over the mission-runner without firing a shot and bypassing all the punishment mechanisms. How can they chase them out without firing a shot? And if they take from a wreck not belonging to them the lawful owner will have kill rights. I just dont see why mission runners should be practically immune to scan probes.
Joerd Toastius Octavian Vanguard	Posted - 2007.01.23 11:07:00 - [370] Originally by: Kirex What does cycle time on both of the launchers mean? The time it takes until you can launch a new probe? There's two sets of timer on each launcher, but I can't remember which is which. The short one is the delay until you can either launch another probe or start analysing (2.5s on Recon, 15s on SPL1), and is fixed. The long one is the base time it takes to analyse (2min recon, 10min spl), and can be reduced by skills and bonuses Originally by: Dillon Arklight Originally by: Joerd Toastius It's almost certainly because of the potential for straightforward grief play. For example, in missions which require you to pick up a certain item from a destroyed ship, there exists the potential for someone to probe the player down, chase them out of the mission area and then steal the item themselves, thus screwing over the mission-runner without firing a shot and bypassing all the punishment mechanisms. How can they chase them out without firing a shot? And if they take from a wreck not belonging to them the lawful owner will have kill rights. I just dont see why mission runners should be practically immune to scan probes. In lowsec missions, if someone finds you it's generally sensible to run first and ask questions later, and by the time you get back he's taken the item and moved to a new system. I'm not saying it's perfect, I'm just saying I think that's why CCP did it.
Yseult Atreus	Posted - 2007.01.25 17:08:00 - [371] Anyone know what it's possible to get the (exploration) probe scan time down to?
Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.01.25 17:21:00 - [372] Originally by: Yseult Atreus Anyone know what it's possible to get the (exploration) probe scan time down to? Slightly over 2 minutes with covert ops 5, sig analysis 5 and 2 scan speed rigs. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Yseult Atreus	Posted - 2007.01.25 17:32:00 - [373] Originally by: Hoshi Originally by: Yseult Atreus Anyone know what it's possible to get the (exploration) probe scan time down to? Slightly over 2 minutes with covert ops 5, sig analysis 5 and 2 scan speed rigs. Cheers Hoshi. that with the T2 rigs?
Shaded Fury Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.01.31 20:11:00 - [374] Applause 4 much informational value in this forum. I have one question that I did not see addressed however. Scanning Deadspace Complexs for the NPC's themselves. People enjoy griefing/hoarding/incorrectly running the complexs. Since the last major patch the complexs can no longer be scanned using the directional scanner to see if it is ready or close to being ready. Is there a work-around for this problem using probes. Thanx in again for ur work in this field.
Joerd Toastius Octavian Vanguard	Posted - 2007.02.01 10:51:00 - [375] No, basically
AKULA UrQuan Caldari STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.02.02 11:31:00 - [376] Originally by: Hoshi If your ship has a micro warp drive and you can run it constantly a good defence is to just point yourself straight up or down and activate the MWD. Don't overuse this tatic. With it now possible to gang warp on probe returns it's possible to slingshot a minmatar recon into web range. Also anything cruiser size or above with a MWD running the chances of getting a WTZ return off of 40/1000AU probes is quite high.
Snow Chainz	Posted - 2007.02.02 23:31:00 - [377] Question: Can I scan in one ship, find a target, dock and get in another ship, and then still use the results to warp to the target?
AKULA UrQuan Caldari STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.02.03 02:39:00 - [378] no. Have to go the the scan result BM the spot then switch ships.
Behedwin RSP Enterprises	Posted - 2007.02.04 18:12:00 - [379] i did not understand the multiple probes thing... how can i launch two probes that is in range of one targets without having one of the probes being inside the other probes scanning range so they overlap?
GammaDriver Caldari Lemmings Corporation	Posted - 2007.02.04 21:46:00 - [380] Originally by: Behedwin i did not understand the multiple probes thing... how can i launch two probes that is in range of one targets without having one of the probes being inside the other probes scanning range so they overlap? I'm not positive, but it seems that the probe, itself, can't be within the scan range of another probe - however, their ranges CAN overlap (just not over a probe).
Yseult Atreus	Posted - 2007.02.05 15:16:00 - [381] Draw a circle. The centre of the circle is the probe, the circumference of the circle shows the probe's scan range. Draw another circle, representing a second probe. The centre of the second circle cannot be within the circumference of the first circle but, as long as this proviso is met, the circles (scan ranges) CAN overlap.
Behedwin RSP Enterprises	Posted - 2007.02.16 05:49:00 - [382] I it posseble to use explorations probes to find player ships? Sure the scan time is longer and flight time to... But the multispectral frequency probe have 1mil points scan strength and 999 au range compared to the observator deep space probe that have 1 pont scan strength and 1000au range. Or have i missunderstod the hole thing?
Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.02.16 12:29:00 - [383] Originally by: Behedwin I it posseble to use explorations probes to find player ships? Sure the scan time is longer and flight time to... But the multispectral frequency probe have 1mil points scan strength and 999 au range compared to the observator deep space probe that have 1 pont scan strength and 1000au range. Or have i missunderstod the hole thing? Multispectral probe can not be used for finding ships, it only returns exploration sites and it only returns the fact that there is one is system or not, it doesn't give location so it would be mostly meaningless anyway. The other exploration probes can be used but they have as you say much longer scan time and very short range. Unless you are looking for a mission runner in a deadspace area which is located less than 3-4 au away they are not really useful. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Dirty Rider	Posted - 2007.02.18 15:23:00 - [384] First off, great walk-through have learnd alot second, thanks to all that have posted with even more ussfull infomation. finaly, the question--> how do i find my lost secure cargo containers along with some random small deployable warp disrupers? ccp apparalnly waxed my bookmarks for some of the items listed above, and i want them back. any help would be most appircated, even if i cant spell it
Yseult Atreus	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:27:00 - [385] Originally by: Dirty Rider Edited by: Dirty Rider on 18/02/2007 15:28:01 First off, great walk-through have learnd alot second, thanks to all that have posted with even more ussfull infomation. finaly, the question--> how do i find my lost secure cargo containers along with some random small deployable warp disrupers? ccp apparalnly waxed my bookmarks for some of the items listed above, and i want them back. any help would be most appircated, even if i cant spell it Also, consering probe overlaping? now i know my probes can not be seen by each other, but say i have a wing man with me and we both launch 1 4au probe each? what happens? world implode?....lol :P thanks agian It's only your own probes that can't overlap. Your wingman's probe will sit happily right alongside yours If this wasn't so it would be posssible to close several systems to exploration by jumping between them spamming multispecs.
Dirty Rider	Posted - 2007.02.21 00:03:00 - [386] Ok thats cool with the probes, but my main quetion still stands. Is it possibal to find my MIA secure cargo containers with scan probes or do i have to contuine to just make random bookmarks hoping to get lucky and find themm agian Again thank you Yseult Atreus for your timely awnser
Krenshaw Universal Parcel Service	Posted - 2007.02.21 08:38:00 - [387] The info posts gave me enough info to get started in exploration right away. Well done. Now to the hard stuff. On of the sites I found has 6 Circle Constructs and several of the non interactive wreck like spaceshuttle w/debris partisle accelerators and such. It appears to have a green cloud with it but it does not show as a harvestable cloud and no way to select it. No NPCs or gates. Anyone have an idea of what to do? The constructs show wanted so I destroyed one but it left no wreck or container. Took about 2500 tech 2 cruisys to destroy it. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks What for centuries raised man above the beast is not the cudgel but the irresistible power of unarmed truth...B. Pasternak
Hoshi Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.02.21 16:01:00 - [388] Originally by: Dirty Rider Ok thats cool with the probes, but my main quetion still stands. Is it possibal to find my MIA secure cargo containers with scan probes or do i have to contuine to just make random bookmarks hoping to get lucky and find themm agian Again thank you Yseult Atreus for your timely awnser No you can not find cans with probes. Only thing I can suggest is to send in a petition and pray. ---------------------------------------- A Guide to Scan Probing in Revelations
Dirty Rider	Posted - 2007.02.22 01:23:00 - [389] Bummer, well I tryed anyway, thanks agian Hoshi for a most insightfull guide, and for the the others that post very usefull NfO Im off to pray now, and if that dont work ill maybe send in a refund petition for the cost of cans and ammo Cheers beers ppls
Car Wars adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.02.25 11:24:00 - [390] I have a question concerning ship results that maybe at a POS. What do you guys normally do? warp in @ 100km to check first. And then warp in closer if it turns out not to be at a POS?

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