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I got caught by pirates in my missions!!11

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Verus Potestas Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.11.30 00:04:00 - [1] Can any one think of a way this could happen whereby the agent runner paying attention and putting some bloody effort in couldn't have prevented it? I'd leave you with a few points: 1) Ctrl-F11, this sees both scan probes and player ships. 2) Cloaked ships decloak within 2km of an object 3) Missions all have fixed warp-ins. Between corps atm, the NPC one is strictly a temporary thing. RAWR!111 Sig Hijackz0r!!11 - Immy
Chris TheNinjaPirate Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.11.30 00:28:00 - [2] how is the scanner used to find enemy scan probes? i dont really know how scan probes work.. but there is no way to tell if you are BEING scanned, right? and if you do not scan right as the scanprobe flies by you (which you can not see right/) you have no way of knowing that you are being scanned?
Nordvargr GoonWaffe GoonSwarm	Posted - 2006.11.30 01:30:00 - [3] Watching local.
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2006.11.30 01:30:00 - [4] I guess the problem is really going to have to do with how often pirates try to probe out mission runners. If it's more a matter of being smart about what systems you choose to mission in, no problem. But if it's hard to find decent systems where it doesn't happen a lot, people just aren't going to bother with lowsec missions. Sure, you can save your ship, but it's not exactly much fun or good for your EVE career to zip to a safe or station if you're having to put off missions every few hours. I say that both as somebody who both runs missions and pirates. While I like the idea of mission runners being vulnerable, I don't want it to be so extreme that the only targets are noobs who don't know any better. If that sounds exaggerated, well it shouldn't: it will be the near mirror image of LowSec belts. In other words, LowSec will continue to devolve into something that's no fun for either carebears or any pirate worth their official YARRR! bandanna; while the good stuff happens in 0.0 and to some extent in HighSec. Sorry, somehow this bacame another one of my LowSec rants. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Jago X	Posted - 2006.11.30 01:40:00 - [5] most pirates will kill missions runners by moving into a nearby system and using various noob corp alts to scan down the mission runners and then once theyve found someone they will bring in the gank squad for them. This means you really need to pay attention ALL the time in local. Scanning down missions just got a whole lot easier now tho. Its something every passsing pirate will probably have a go at now in the main lvl4 mission running centres around eve low-sec .. most of which are allready infested with pirates. In short they can leave alts in the system and prevent most sensible people from bieng able to run missions for the entire time they are logged on. Only way to fight them is to hunt down the pirates themsevles and gank them until they leave - which from my previous experince is a rather pointless endevour as they will just either stay docked until the odds are in ther favour or undock and fight and your basically giving them what they want anyway which is just a bit of fun. Imo low sec lvl4 mission running isnt a good isk earner anymore. The rewards are lower than living in decent 0.0 and the risks are higher than almost any other way of making your isk now that its sooo easy to scan missions down. In short if you dont like PvP stick to high sec lag systems with lvl3/4 agents in them and if you dont mind PvP then go join a decent group living in 0.0 and make your isk that way.
Daos Leghki Paxton Industries	Posted - 2006.11.30 01:45:00 - [6] The OP misses one critical point: the pirates have the advantage of initiative. If a mission runner wants to not get ganked, he has to keep watching local all the time, scan all the time and always be alert. That's a lot of work when you're lagged to hell doing a mission. A pirate's job is easier, even if it doesn't necessarily earn more isk. If a mission runner gets away from you, sure you've not gained anything, but the mission runner pretty much can't finish that missin now for fear of being ganked. I don't know if it'll become a problem, but it sure looks like it. Repopulate Low-Sec Paxton Industries is Recruiting
6Bagheera9 Shadows of the Dead Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.30 03:23:00 - [7] Originally by: Nordvargr Watching local. Pretty much the first rule of EvE pvp, anyonethat can't do that needs to go play WoW.
Dahin Maza Nostra Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.11.30 03:51:00 - [8] Edited by: Dahin on 30/11/2006 03:56:02 Missionrunners should expect to start getting ganked in their missionspots more with each passing day. MMmmmmm, I wanna try this tommorow or something. Any ebil pirate that has scouted a faction-fitted bs missionrunning in lowsec gimme a call pls 8k km deviation from the missionspot from an observator probe within 30 seconds of scanning time will pritty much get you killed FAST. I highly doubt the scanner can help missionrunners any more since one can spit probes outside scanner range and still get on the missiongate (hey, if observator does like 8k deviation without skills on an indy, ferret should do a whole lot more on a bs with skills. And don't forget that warping anywhere close to a missionspot sucks you in on the gate) EDIT: 3 demanding cheers so the dev will actually move lvl4 agents into lowsec and not just say they will.
Xenny Lee Minmatar The Splinter Syndicate SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.30 04:13:00 - [9] Edited by: Xenny Lee on 30/11/2006 04:16:44 Theres a variety of types of missions and the big thing that can will keep a mission runner relatively safe from scanning (less it was changed) is that you cant warp in a complex.... meaning dont go for missions where there isnt an initial gate (and Im fairly sure less its changed, that probing will bring you to the entrance of the plex but you cant warp in)... The biggest thing is if they put the Recon Launcher in game.... That thing is positively Evil and if they fix up the probes (which to last news wasnt working) Im not opposed to it, and Im sure as hell not opposed to 0.0 being just a little bit more dangerous, but thats the launcher that with proper skills will catch safed Battleships and Cruisers fairly easily. Also last I heard low sec was preety much the most dangerous place ever since Pirates get the luxury of going AFK in stations and stuff, have next to no crud littering their scans and can catch all these people that are under the illusion that Low sec is safer than 0.0. Edit: Dahin as much as I sorta feel that mission runners dont bring a whole lot to the game, them getting isk from us buying their stuff is almost as good as an isk sink... and they provide a huge base to all the named T1 stuff and implants... That IMO isnt worth moving them into the dead zone of eve.
Morp p'LLoran Redemption EnterpriseS Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.30 04:33:00 - [10] Originally by: Dahin Edited by: Dahin on 30/11/2006 03:56:02 ...... EDIT: 3 demanding cheers so the dev will actually move lvl4 agents into lowsec and not just say they will. Why is this alway the first thing pirates scream for - more easy targets. Why is there never a call from pirates for more PvP targets? My conclusions - too afraid to fight something that can fight back. My opinion? - Give low-sec "something" that will draw alliances - big corps. More PvP targets, more logistic needs - will make pirating tougher - but more profitable, and the peeps getting killed are there BY THEIR OWN WILL. Why do all the lo-sec solutions proposed have to be about dragging unwilling easy targets there kicking and screaming? Get some balls and ask for solutions which will bring you what you say you want - real PVP. Or is that too scary??
Mnengli Noiliffe	Posted - 2006.11.30 04:42:00 - [11] and then what? only newbs will do lvl4 missions, and pirates will keep ganking newbs. Somehow I doubt though, because they will learn in lvl1-3 stage that lowsec missions are not worth while, so lvl4 missions won't be done at all. Excepto for courier. And all those asocial people who only stayed in this game to do missions, will quit the game, yay for less lag!
JoCool Caldari Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2006.11.30 06:33:00 - [12] Originally by: 6Bagheera9 Originally by: Nordvargr Watching local. Pretty much the first rule of EvE pvp, anyonethat can't do that needs to go play WoW. That's so sad. If there was no local mission runners would be hidden from pirates. _______________________________________________________________________ Trey Azagthoth > Youre my idol Jocool. I wanna be like Jocool jr. or Jocool the sequel! Oveur > ohnoes jocool
Tachy	Posted - 2006.11.30 07:59:00 - [13] You have to scan for probes every minute now as a low/NulSec mission runner - and if you detect one, you better not be scrambled. --==*-- The cause for this is not yet known, but we do have a possible fix in testing. by Sharkbait \| 2006.09.20
schurem Anarchy Inc. Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2006.11.30 09:16:00 - [14] nothing we can do about it eh? no stealthing rigs or counterprobes or anything? <<<< No Boundaries, No Fences, Fly Free* Or Die Trying* >>>> Warning sounds!, My kingdom for more warning sounds!
Kagura Nikon	Posted - 2006.11.30 13:12:00 - [15] Originally by: Morp p'LLoran Originally by: Dahin Edited by: Dahin on 30/11/2006 03:56:02 ...... EDIT: 3 demanding cheers so the dev will actually move lvl4 agents into lowsec and not just say they will. Why is this alway the first thing pirates scream for - more easy targets. Why is there never a call from pirates for more PvP targets? My conclusions - too afraid to fight something that can fight back. My opinion? - Give low-sec "something" that will draw alliances - big corps. More PvP targets, more logistic needs - will make pirating tougher - but more profitable, and the peeps getting killed are there BY THEIR OWN WILL. Why do all the lo-sec solutions proposed have to be about dragging unwilling easy targets there kicking and screaming? Get some balls and ask for solutions which will bring you what you say you want - real PVP. Or is that too scary?? because that is piracy.. what you describe is all out combat... corp conflit. Its more military combat quite different from piracy. Pirats want civilian targets.. get over it... You should not be obligated to go into pirate range.. but you should be persuaded to if you want a BIG reward.
Valerek Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.30 16:36:00 - [16] Originally by: Morp p'LLoran Originally by: Dahin Edited by: Dahin on 30/11/2006 03:56:02 ...... EDIT: 3 demanding cheers so the dev will actually move lvl4 agents into lowsec and not just say they will. Why is this alway the first thing pirates scream for - more easy targets. Why is there never a call from pirates for more PvP targets? My conclusions - too afraid to fight something that can fight back. My opinion? - Give low-sec "something" that will draw alliances - big corps. More PvP targets, more logistic needs - will make pirating tougher - but more profitable, and the peeps getting killed are there BY THEIR OWN WILL. Why do all the lo-sec solutions proposed have to be about dragging unwilling easy targets there kicking and screaming? Get some balls and ask for solutions which will bring you what you say you want - real PVP. Or is that too scary?? That's the whole problem with prats. They're like low-browed gang bangers in the inner city slums. They hang out in GROUPS and fight peeps that cannot fight back. For some reason this latest patch name is appropriate: "Revelations"...of how badly Eve is going for all...
Ishquar Teh'Sainte Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2006.11.30 16:50:00 - [17] Edited by: Ishquar Teh''Sainte on 30/11/2006 16:50:47 Originally by: Morp p'LLoran Originally by: Dahin Edited by: Dahin on 30/11/2006 03:56:02 ...... EDIT: 3 demanding cheers so the dev will actually move lvl4 agents into lowsec and not just say they will. Why is this alway the first thing pirates scream for - more easy targets. Why is there never a call from pirates for more PvP targets? My conclusions - too afraid to fight something that can fight back. My opinion? - Give low-sec "something" that will draw alliances - big corps. More PvP targets, more logistic needs - will make pirating tougher - but more profitable, and the peeps getting killed are there BY THEIR OWN WILL. Why do all the lo-sec solutions proposed have to be about dragging unwilling easy targets there kicking and screaming? Get some balls and ask for solutions which will bring you what you say you want - real PVP. Or is that too scary?? in fact this is dahin's sikrit plan to force a change in the scan probe system. if the devs don't listen to the concerns of the covops specialists on the forums ... carebears must be sacrificied to fill the forums with their whining about the stupid scan probe system ___________________ EVE: Revelations - The Game for Carebears and Gankbears no more skill needed for PvP - only skillpoints for Large Bubble and CovOps n00b-alts
LukaG	Posted - 2006.11.30 16:56:00 - [18] Can someone please tell me if pirates can go through your deadspace gates while your doing a mission or if they are "locked" to them. Since I have a very limited understanding of the scanning system particularly the new one, how easy is it to track someone down like this while they are doing a mission?
slothe Caldari Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2006.11.30 17:00:00 - [19] pirate e.g. me 1. scan probes location of mission runner. 2. warps to first gate of mission. 3. scans mission type and ship type of mission runner. 4. fits tank knowing what mission runner is firing. 5. fits jammers to jam mission runners ship.. 6. if more than 1 gate waits until mission runner is on 2nd or 3rd gate. 7. follows mission runner. 8, engages mission runner (often while mission runner is afk) 9, asks for reasonable ransom. 10. doesnt recieve answer. 11. blows mission runner up and scoops loot. 12. receives angry mail when mission runner has made cup of tea. man its easy, and fun, id recommend anyone try it. *Before complaining about any ship try flying Minmatar*
Smagd Encina Technologies Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.11.30 17:14:00 - [20] Actually, if you ask me it looks like the general idea is to get rid of boring gate camps and replace them with exciting mission deadspace pirating, which I can sort of agree with. First pirate buff in what, 2 years. Will be interesting to see how low sec mission runners adapt, or if they do at all and not just return to high sec or start belt ratting in 0.0 instead or turn pirate themselves (but who'll be then prey?). Anyway, if removal of gate camps is the point, then can we have the old highways back please? -- Thukkers do
Skunrah Eve's Brothers of Destiny The Shadow Ascension	Posted - 2006.11.30 17:19:00 - [21] Level 4 mission runners like myself will just refuse the missions that force you into low sec. Since only about 20% of the missions I get send me there anyway, I'll just save my 'once-every-4-hours' mission refusal for that. Skunrah Director - Eve Brothers of Destiny
Slevin Kalebra	Posted - 2006.11.30 17:26:00 - [22] Originally by: LukaG Can someone please tell me if pirates can go through your deadspace gates while your doing a mission or if they are "locked" to them. Since I have a very limited understanding of the scanning system particularly the new one, how easy is it to track someone down like this while they are doing a mission? A) Yes they can B) Extremely easy. Read Hoshi's guide to the new scanning system (stickied at top). It's quite possible to be 'found' by a probe within a few minutes of starting the mission.
Magnus Card Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.30 17:46:00 - [23] Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe Edited by: Mnengli Noiliffe on 30/11/2006 04:48:11 and then what? only newbs will do lvl4 missions, and pirates will keep ganking newbs. Somehow I doubt though, because they will learn in lvl1-3 stage that lowsec missions are not worth while, so lvl4 missions won't be done at all. Except for courier. And all those asocial people (western society generates lots of them, and TQ is primarily for western ppl) who only stayed in this game to do missions, will quit the game, yay for less lag! and CCP will lose a ton of income and who knows, maybe you are actually cheering for the end of Eve. Good job on thinking that one through. <---- mods please fix the pic
LukaG	Posted - 2006.11.30 18:02:00 - [24] I don't really understand the some peoples vehement hatred of mission runners, it seems a bit childish to me. A huge amount of people run missions, mostly as part of other activities but some almost exclusivly its true. What I don't understand is why PvP's hate them so much, its not like they are doing you any harm is it, not everybody wants to the same stuff in this game for christs sakes?? On a seperate note this will mean the end of solo low sec mission running which is what I thought the devs wanted to encourage (as a pose to high sec mission running.) Think about it, to have any chance of doing the more difficult lvl 4 missions you need a massive tank setup. This means you have no way of defending yourself against ECM, warp jamming, NOS etc that a typical PvP will have equiped. Fights will be short, one sided and the pirate will always have the option of buggering off if it isn't going his way since the missions runner is highly unlikely to be able to equip a warp jammer. Now before I hear a massive chorus of "So What??" and "sounds pretty good to me", consider for a second that pretty soon there will be NO mission runners in low sec, who the f&^k are you going to gank then eh? It will just be a load of pirates chasing each other in circles bleeding themselves dry of money..... IF we want this to be the state of things in low sec then thats FINE but for gods sakes change the missions structure/content so that people can do them in PvP setups and so that they can stand a tiny chance when that pirate gang warps in. flame away.
Shagrath Xarra	Posted - 2006.11.30 18:44:00 - [25] There are a lot of people who go to Low sec to rat and mine. Some just go to run complexes or even go through to buy items or move goods. Some of you Mission Runners on this board make it sound like you are the only people who ever go to Low sec ever. Contrary to popular belief, it isn't true.
Verus Potestas Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.11.30 19:00:00 - [26] Originally by: LukaG I don't really understand the some peoples vehement hatred of mission runners, it seems a bit childish to me. A huge amount of people run missions, mostly as part of other activities but some almost exclusivly its true. What I don't understand is why PvP's hate them so much, its not like they are doing you any harm is it, not everybody wants to the same stuff in this game for christs sakes?? I don't hate mission runners at all. In fact, it's my easiest source of ISK (running them, not ganking the runners). What I hate is people who get probed out and killed, and then rather than going "well ****, maybe next time I'll use that scanamidoodle thing", they say "OMG QUIT CRY CARE NERF PIRATES EAT KITTENS AND PUNCH ORPHANS IN REAL LIFE". Between corps atm, the NPC one is strictly a temporary thing. RAWR!111 Sig Hijackz0r!!11 - Immy
Xori Ruscuv Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.11.30 19:02:00 - [27] Edited by: Xori Ruscuv on 30/11/2006 19:03:22 Originally by: LukaG I don't really understand the some peoples vehement hatred of mission runners, it seems a bit childish to me. A huge amount of people run missions, mostly as part of other activities but some almost exclusivly its true. What I don't understand is why PvP's hate them so much, its not like they are doing you any harm is it, not everybody wants to the same stuff in this game for christs sakes?? shrug I used to be a mission ***. I didn't understand the attitude. Then one day I couldn't take another single mission. I went pirate. I still don't understand the attitude. Then I decided to join an alliance. I still don't understand the attitude. What it all comes down to: people can't stand that other people are playing the game in a different way. It is just the same in RL - everyone trying to tell each other how they have to live. Bleh. It goes both ways, though. Carebears telling PVPers/Pirates that they are "teh suxx", etc... the just goes around and around... Originally by:** Verus Potestas What I hate is people who get probed out and killed, and then rather than going "well ***, maybe next time I'll use that scanamidoodle thing", they say "OMG QUIT CRY CARE NERF PIRATES EAT KITTENS AND PUNCH ORPHANS IN REAL LIFE". That's what I don't understand though. Who cares? They'll QQ, and then they'll either quit or get over it. Either way, is it worth the hate? If so, well, ok I guess... you play the game you want... It's great playing Caldari-online, isn't it?* This IS my main! I just did a portrait swap...
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.30 19:18:00 - [28] Originally by: slothe pirate e.g. me 1. scan probes location of mission runner. 2. warps to first gate of mission. 3. scans mission type and ship type of mission runner. 4. fits tank knowing what mission runner is firing. 5. fits jammers to jam mission runners ship.. 6. if more than 1 gate waits until mission runner is on 2nd or 3rd gate. 7. follows mission runner. 8, engages mission runner (often while mission runner is afk) 9, asks for reasonable ransom. 10. doesnt recieve answer. 11. blows mission runner up and scoops loot. 12. receives angry mail when mission runner has made cup of tea. man its easy, and fun, id recommend anyone try it. Only part that is total CRAP is the AFK part. Pirate fits with loads of ECM and locks the mission runner down. Pirates asks for ransom, gets paid, then blows up the mission runner anyway. Pirates ransoms are in general 100 mill plus, which takes you about 5 missions to make back. Those pirates who take their ransom and go...I salute you. I also feel sorry for you that any clown with a scanner is not going to be able to do in 1 minute what it took you about 20 to do... --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment until you've looked at them.
Elaron Minmatar Legio Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.30 19:33:00 - [29] In a game like this, if there is a cheap way to get kills, people will do it. If there is a cheap way to avoid getting killed, people will do it. These rules always seem to be forgotten by both sides of the argument. I see mission runners having to "adapt" in the following ways: 1) Take more than one character into the mission, with fits closer to PvP ones. If this involves more than one person then, sure, it's a slower rate of LP (assuming you split the mission load between the runners) but you have the greater security that numbers bring. 2) Run missions only in hi-sec. 3) Dock up every time an untrusted character is in local for more than 30 seconds or so. 4) Use cloaks more. 5) Always leave a jetcan on the warp-in point. Perhaps even a small secure, so it isn't blown up quickly. 6) Develop greater situational awareness - at least, until Local gets nerfed. 7) Develop an intimate relationship with the CTRL + Q key combination. Elaron It is never too late to correct the mistakes of the past.
Xori Ruscuv Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.11.30 19:43:00 - [30] Originally by: Elaron 5) Always leave a jetcan on the warp-in point. Perhaps even a small secure, so it isn't blown up quickly. ? Quote: 7) Develop an intimate relationship with the CTRL + Q key combination. It's great playing Caldari-online, isn't it? This IS my main! I just did a portrait swap...

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