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NosDomi not overpowered, you say?

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Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 13:51:00 - [1] So I'm flying my Blasterrax back to my base out in Lowsec(I'm gutsy, I know) This Nosdomi with a positive sec status manages to lock on, close, and scram before I can align and warp(Took approx 3-5 seconds). I of course open up, launch drones, etc...it's set up for PvP. Fire off my Med Nos, webber, Scrammer, etc. Dude tanks the gate turrets, me, and my hammerheads simultaneously, drains my cap, and kills me when I can't even shoot back. Then warps out without his structure even taking a single ding(though he didn't have much armor left). Ended up to where the only thing I could do...was Nos back, ineffectually. He would've at least gotten hurt if I'd been able to shoot back! Maybe I should train minnie ships... If nothing else, it certianly makes solo pirating in lowsec way the heck too easy. Of course, he didn't get anything for it but reduced sec status and a thorough taunting. Well, except my four hammerheads that he stole.
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.16 13:53:00 - [2] Edited by: Ithildin on 16/12/2006 13:53:37 Rejoice. Had it been an Abaddon, you'd been dead before your cap broke. Possibly even before you got lock. - EVE is sick.
Private Iron Caldari Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.16 13:57:00 - [3] Originally by: Ithildin Edited by: Ithildin on 16/12/2006 13:53:37 Rejoice. Had it been an Abaddon, you'd been dead before your cap broke. Possibly even before you got lock. QFT. Any battleship would have ripped you to shreds anyway -----
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 13:58:00 - [4] Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 13:59:32 Hehe. The thing that annoys me about it is that he was actually taking quite a bit of damage, and had to leave two of his ogre IIs behind to keep the turrets from blasting him(I woulda been the one swiping drones if my Velator was faster!) With the help from the turrets, he nearly got wiped out. Trick is, I had to stop shooting(Med Electrons. I need adv weapon upgrades!) because he sucked my cap dry. Looked like he was an all-Nos setup, and his drones were the only thing shooting me. Only took a couple seconds to drain me. Edit: Yeah, I'd expect a battleship to. Only reason it was as close as it was, the gate turrets. Those things do so much damage... Like I said, if I'd even just been able to keep firing the blasters, punk woulda been into structure before I died.
Damien Smith ExScape	Posted - 2006.12.16 13:58:00 - [5] You were in a cruiser, he was in a battleship. The usual way for cruisers to beat battleships is by using their smaller size and maneuverability against them. In this case you couldn't because he was using nos and drones. What did you think would happen? By neutralising your offensive abilities as well as your tank he just had to tank the sentries. Oh noes, call the nerfmobile! ----------- Join channel 'ExScape' or die! (bring pie) I <3 carebears on toast ^^ - Xorus I'll trade you some carebears for some sheep -Tirg
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:03:00 - [6] Well, if you are going to make a comment about Nos(domi), get an example where you wouldn't have been killed faster if the guy had had just about any other battleship ('cept Scorpion). Fact is, not only would you have been dead by any other sort of battleship, you'd have been dead sooner with even less chance of retaliation. On top of that, since the Dominix actually had problems tanking sentries in low sec, it speaks volumes. A proper nosdomi is actually a pretty bad tank, it relies solely on denying the target to shoot back. - EVE is sick.
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:05:00 - [7] Originally by: Damien Smith You were in a cruiser, he was in a battleship. The usual way for cruisers to beat battleships is by using their smaller size and maneuverability against them. In this case you couldn't because he was using nos and drones. What did you think would happen? By neutralising your offensive abilities as well as your tank he just had to tank the sentries. Oh noes, call the nerfmobile! In this case he couldn't because the Dominix set the stage complete with first strike and 0 transversal. That means death for anything, really fast, if the attacker is larger. It is fully possible to dance a Nosdom as long as you don't let him get the jump on you. Oh, and blasters really aren't good when you need to stay out of web or nos range, which you need when facing larger Gallente ships. - EVE is sick.
wierchas noobhunter Caldari Kemono.	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:11:00 - [8] u need be uber like me to kill bs with cruiser else u just die period ^^ i am WIERCHAS i am like UBER and stuff
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:13:00 - [9] Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 14:14:35 yeah and it didn't orbit when I told it to...but that's incidental. Simple fact is though, Nos is the only module that works pretty much equally well across both races and ship class. In fact, I heard the finals of the big PvP tournament were determined entirely by which team could nos better. I played SWG, I saw the effect of having an alpha class. When there's one thing that dominates everything else, everyone flocks to it, and you end up with hundreds, even thousands of identical characters that all fight exactly the same way. Ain't good for the game. An Alpha Module is just as bad. It wouldn't be so bad if the effects were equal across race too. Right now it works better against Gallente and Amarr, less so against Caldari, and even less so against Minnie. Hybrids and Lasers take cap to fire. Missiles and Projectiles do not. It still shuts down anything active, including boosters and reppers, but they can at least still fire their weapons. Simple fact is, everyone that wasn't a Jedi on SWG screamed and screamed and screamed for them to get nerfed, and the jedi screamed and screamed back that it was fine and they should leave it. Simple fact is, it's the only module type that has small, medium, and heavy versions where the larger ones work BETTER against smaller ships than the smaller ones do. Of the other modules that have the same overall effect on any ship, it's one of the very few with no stacking penalty. There shouldn't be a 'Must Have' module, that is equally useful in any situation. You want every different setup to have a different, effective counter, so that no one thing dominates any aspect of the game. Simple fact is, last game I played where they had something that was this absurdly powerful, that game is now all but dead.
Felix Dzerzhinsky	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:15:00 - [10] Basically ya, the only way to beat a Nos-Domi is through overwhelming dps and/or range. Once its closed in on you - you die in a long and embarassing way. as for training Mini ships, you will be trading in some nice blaster damage for some weak and sometimes hard to find projectile guns. . .I'd say, stick with the blasters. Of course, you will be able to use the nos-domi yourself soon, and I always find flying the supposed 'overpowered' ships (I know you did not call it that, just an expression really) is the best way to learn how they are not overpowered. But the Domi is a very nice ship to solo in. As for the fight, I think a well skilled Raven would take a rax out in a volley or two, a Geddon could probably melt you in a few seconds. . .the only thing you could survive would be a Tempest, which would need some serious alpha to kill you right off, but after the first volley, you are ok to run or close distance and eat alive :)
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:20:00 - [11] Heh...I make a general rule that I will NOT use any setup that's dramatically overpowered, particularly if it's popular. I like being different, and I also like challenges. Having to use my own skill to succeed instead of some formula that's been used a thousand times. Simple fact is, in this fight...he was actually getting beat up pretty bad. He might even have lost his precious Domi(probably not, but you never know), if I'd been able to shoot. He was actually going down faster than I was till my cap ran dry(wierd, but true). Losing simply because of an overpowered module irks me. badly. Especially when I wasn't even looking for a fight...
NiGHTS	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:22:00 - [12] well you were in a cruiser and he was a battleship :/. ALL GOOD SIGNATURES ARE CENSORED
DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:24:00 - [13] LOL at this post. any bs in game can tank sentries while killing a rax. ur dmg on him would be pretty low tbh and sentry tanking is easy. tbh the domi is one of the worst bs for doing that cos his drones get popped by the guns if u last longer than 30 seconds. a hyperion can tank sentry guns with 1 rep and using a 2nd rep to tank a bs at the same time. and sorry to say dude but taking a rax into low sec ballsy? i hope that's sarcasm. taking a 3.5bil vindicator in low sec day after day while -10. nwo that's what i call ballsy DE
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:27:00 - [14] No...my base is out in Lowsec. I have two more raxes, an itty, an incursus, an imicus, and a Navitas out there. I do missions out there, I mine out there(rarely, I hate mining). In fact, the only time I go back to highsec is to sell or buy items. Even most vets won't stay out in lowsec. They either go to 0.0 with their Corp or they stay in Empire.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:29:00 - [15] Originally by: Idami Raptor Heh...I make a general rule that I will NOT use any setup that's dramatically overpowered, particularly if it's popular. I like being different, and I also like challenges. Having to use my own skill to succeed instead of some formula that's been used a thousand times. Simple fact is, in this fight...he was actually getting beat up pretty bad. He might even have lost his precious Domi(probably not, but you never know), if I'd been able to shoot. He was actually going down faster than I was till my cap ran dry(wierd, but true). Losing simply because of an overpowered module irks me. badly. Especially when I wasn't even looking for a fight... He was in a Battleship, you were in a Cruiser. He did toast you, he should have toasted you and the gate guns in a low sec system should not have been a large impediment to that. The fact that if you were able to be shooting "he would have taken a beating" is a testiment to the strength of your setup or the weakness of his. However, that doesnt mean he shouldnt have toasted you. If he had been in any other battleship[for the most part] he still would have toasted you, and since you are in a cruiser and unable to tank damage for a long time, he would have toasted you even worse if he were in a DPS setup. NOS works well because you can drain a tank that would be difficult to break, or taken a long time to break and break it without having to deal damage. If there is no difficulty breaking the tank, then there is no benefit to fitting NOS. Put it this way, if he lost 400 dps by not fitting guns in the highs, that is 400 damage per second that he would have dealt to you.[and he probably gives up a lot more than that] You should have adjusted normalized HP of somewhere around 10000[armor/shield/structure +resistances] which means he would have toasted you, if you tank equalled the damage he was giving out when reping, in 25 seconds. This is highly optimistic. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:33:00 - [16] Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 14:34:29 I know he should've toasted me. Though if he hadn't had Nos, unless he had medium guns fitted he'd be missing a lot of those shots, so that DPS estimate is probably optimistic. In any case, all I'm saying is...yeah I lost. So? It actually helped me. The Insurance and remaining parts are going to outfit my two other raxes that were sitting empty. But...he might've died too, had it not been for that Nos. All I'm saying. :P Edit: Base HP was somewhere up about...uh....7-8K. With one EANM. No idea what that works out to normalized.
Terraform Gallente	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:37:00 - [17] if you actually made it a fair piece into his armor i would probably be annoyed, but proud of the fact that he even noticed me shooting back at him. It's a BS versus a cruiser, what's the problem? I hereby remove my sig, sigs are evil, sigs are the devil and i suck at drawing...
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:41:00 - [18] That he was down to 10% or less armor left and I couldn't shoot? :P
Kirja	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:50:00 - [19] Play the game another year or so. Then maybe your opinion will matter . Sorry but "oh noes i got killed by BS in my cruiser" is just stupid beyond any reason
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:54:00 - [20] Has it occured to you, that if no new people play... that the game will eventually die? Some of you people need to wake up and realize that you can't discount new players or casual players as worthless...because without them you have nothing to play. The difficulties involved for both are already the reason why this game is such a tiny speck in the universe of games that matter...
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:55:00 - [21] Originally by: Idami Raptor Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 14:34:29 I know he should've toasted me. Though if he hadn't had Nos, unless he had medium guns fitted he'd be missing a lot of those shots, so that DPS estimate is probably optimistic. In any case, all I'm saying is...yeah I lost. So? It actually helped me. The Insurance and remaining parts are going to outfit my two other raxes that were sitting empty. But...he might've died too, had it not been for that Nos. All I'm saying. :P Edit: Base HP was somewhere up about...uh....7-8K. With one EANM. No idea what that works out to normalized. base HP? impossible unless you are really, really well fitted[or plated]. Your max shield HP[max skills] is going to be about 1904. Max Armor[max skills], sans plate 2051, and 2341 structure[max skills]. If you are using a plate that is a bit different, but it also means you are using small guns[or no rep/mwd] or is a small plate[and not as beneficial as extra resists for the most part. He is going to tear through you. Tanked well[2 eanm II/DC] that is going to be around 13000 HP[+/- 2000HP]. So yea, he is going to web you and then slaughter you. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Private Iron Caldari Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:57:00 - [22] Originally by: Idami Raptor Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 14:34:29 But...he might've died too, had it not been for that Nos. He hadn't fitted nos he would have an uber tank on and you wouldn't have even dented him. -----
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:58:00 - [23] Originally by: Idami Raptor Has it occured to you, that if no new people play... that the game will eventually die? Some of you people need to wake up and realize that you can't discount new players or casual players as worthless...because without them you have nothing to play. The difficulties involved for both are already the reason why this game is such a tiny speck in the universe of games that matter... Yes, but has it occured to you that you should have gotten toasted in a cruiser versues a domi, and the fact that he was so damaged is actualy a point against yours? ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 14:58:00 - [24] Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 15:01:10 Edited by: Idami Raptor on 16/12/2006 14:58:59 Four Heavy Electron blaster, one Medium NOS MWD, Webber, Scrambler Two Small Armor Rep II, EANM, Magstab, 800mm Plate. >P Edit: Note that it calls 'medium' class blasters 'heavy' blasters for the actual name of them. Wierd. Edit2: okay so goumin has a point. I wouldn't mind so much if it hadn't shut down my guns too. It's one thing for it to break a tank and other active modules...the guns too is a bit much. Thus the comment about minnie ships.
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 15:07:00 - [25] Originally by: Ithildin On top of that, since the Dominix actually had problems tanking sentries in low sec, it speaks volumes. A proper nosdomi is actually a pretty bad tank, it relies solely on denying the target to shoot back. What? A bad tank? You can fit 4 heavy nos, cap injector, 2 LAR II, 3 t2 actives and an EANMII on that thing with one RCUII in that last low. That is not a bad tank. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
Sedai Hara	Posted - 2006.12.16 15:16:00 - [26] So. You say that NOS are overpowered? I say t2 neutron blasters are overpowered as they can do 2000 dps on a BS. 425IIs are also overpowered as they can almost instapop my cruisers at 200km range. ohh! and t2 rage topedos are also, my Brutix goes down fast in a fight versus a Raven with those. Ofc you cant forget the Dampners! Buhuhu, some guy is sitting in a Battleship 40km away killing me while i cant even lock! it doesnt matter he sacrificed 4x Med slot for that! Well t2 Ogers on a moros is also overpowered! etc etc etc There will ALWAYS be a better setup than another in a certain task! You see. you can whine and whine and whine.. Doesnt make any difference. And plz, tell me when a Thorax accualy pwn a dominix! wont happen anytime soon. So. face it. you encountered a player that had a better setup for teh task that he was doing. to Kill cruisers.
DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2006.12.16 15:21:00 - [27] Originally by: Idami Raptor That he was down to 10% or less armor left and I couldn't shoot? :P in that case this guy was a but of a noob. my nosdomi dan tank sentries quite easilt while killing any cruiser and my armour will always be above 80%. if ur saying the nosdomi is overpowered then it's really not. without ecm now most decent tempests can take one down as they don't need cap to fire. nor do any missile ships. a couple of drakes can probably kill a nosdomi with passive tanks. how about a scorp then. that could have killed u at a gate probably and u won't have fired a single shot because you'd be perma jammed. how about a rokh wich would probably pop u a a few volleys while easily tanking gate guns. this is just a generaly bs situation. nothing special mate. DE
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 15:28:00 - [28] Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 15:30:02 Originally by: Sedai Hara So. I say t2 neutron blasters are overpowered as they can do 2000 dps on a BS. A maxed out blasterthron pilot will never reach 2000dps, it's just under 1000dps (w/3 damage mods) actually. And maxing out you blaster skills will take millions of skill points, heavy nos takes 16.000 skill points to use. Originally by: Sedai Hara 425IIs are also overpowered as they can almost instapop my cruisers at 200km range. Actually only a Rokh can reach that range (a mega will be in falloff) and the Rokh's alpha will not even 'almost' instapop your cruisers. Originally by: Sedai Hara ohh! and t2 rage topedos are also, my Brutix goes down fast in a fight versus a Raven with those. Well those not only require wast amounts of skill points they also require 3 medslots dedicated to target painters to do full damage to a brutix. Originally by: Sedai Hara So. face it. you encountered a player that had a better setup for teh task that he was doing. to Kill cruisers. The average nosdomi doesn't really have a hard time killing battleships, that's pretty good for a ship 'setup to kill cruisers'. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.16 16:39:00 - [29] Originally by: Caletha A NOS-Domi is probably one of the strongest solo battleships out there. Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. - EVE is sick.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 16:46:00 - [30] Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Caletha A NOS-Domi is probably one of the strongest solo battleships out there. Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. Or you could just fly Amarr. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
AKULA UrQuan Caldari STK Scientific Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.12.16 16:46:00 - [31] I've heard the following line from every FC I know at least once, "If you bring a domi for this fight I'll pod your myself". It just sucks that hard for formal fleet fights. As for fighting Nos domies. Put 3x T2 sensor damps on him before he gets drones out and there is a pretty good chance you just won before the first real shot is fired. Originally by: Wrangler Win ME is more a some sort of virus than a OS..
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 16:57:00 - [32] Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 17:02:52 Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Dixon Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 15:15:12 Originally by: Ithildin On top of that, since the Dominix actually had problems tanking sentries in low sec, it speaks volumes. A proper nosdomi is actually a pretty bad tank, it relies solely on denying the target to shoot back. What? A bad tank? You can fit 4 heavy nos, cap injector, 2 LAR II, 3 t2 actives and an EANMII on that thing with one RCUII in that last low. That is not a bad tank. EDIT: I'm not saying that particular nosdomi didn't have a crap tank, I don't know if he did. But nosdomis in general tend to have pretty good tanks. I ran the numbers on that setup. If it's a large injector, you should have about -1412.5 grid left. That is after Nos, LAR2, H Injector and RCU2. You actually need two RCU2s to fit all that, unless you use a medium cap injector. Also, you'll have a really hard time functioning at your prefered range (short) due to lack of MWD. You're right dual lar doesn't fit, it fits with a lar II + MAR II and cap injector + AB. But for solo/small gang, you really don't need a mwd when your nos covers more than scramble range. Originally by: Ithildin Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. Well I don't think anybody is suggesting nerfing the dominix. It's fairly balanced with guns, but the nosdomi has to go. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:01:00 - [33] Originally by: AKULA UrQuan I've heard the following line from every FC I know at least once, "If you bring a domi for this fight I'll pod your myself". It just sucks that hard for formal fleet fights. As for fighting Nos domies. Put 3x T2 sensor damps on him before he gets drones out and there is a pretty good chance you just won before the first real shot is fired. tbh someone has to be a complete noob to not deploy his drones before u get him locked and activate damps on him. but nos domis still have many weaknesses. if u can outrun his heavy drones and use damps u've won already most of the time. nano phoons eat nosdomis for breakfast for example and if u pop all it's drones it's useless. also killing bs at gates is very hard where as other ships can do it ok. it's a very effective solo bs but not overpowered imo. DE
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:13:00 - [34] well for the record, this guy started out about 19-20ish KM away, and MWD'd over so fast it was scary. and he didn't deploy the drones till he was on top of me, either. I dumped my hammerheads and started blasting. Almost worked. I didn't know a battleship could move that fast...or lock that fast either.
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:21:00 - [35] Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 17:23:13 Originally by: Ithildin Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Actually, IIRC, the dominix can fit a full rack of 425mms with 2xrcuII (like teh amarrians). Sure it's not the best fleet setup, but probably better than most fleet Ravens/Phoons. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:28:00 - [36] Originally by: Dixon Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 17:23:13 Originally by: Ithildin Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Actually, IIRC, the dominix can fit a full rack of 425mms with 2xrcuII (like teh amarrians). Sure it's not the best fleet setup, but probably better than most fleet Ravens/Phoons. Yup, but then it'd barely have enough powergrid to fit the sensor boosters and tracking computers it'd need. It'd have just over 500 powergrid left - EVE is sick.
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:30:00 - [37] Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Dixon Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 17:23:13 Originally by: Ithildin Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Actually, IIRC, the dominix can fit a full rack of 425mms with 2xrcuII (like teh amarrians). Sure it's not the best fleet setup, but probably better than most fleet Ravens/Phoons. Yup, but then it'd barely have enough powergrid to fit the sensor boosters and tracking computers it'd need. It'd have just over 500 powergrid left Well the lack of grid is made up by the fact that you will never be primary. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
Chikity China	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:33:00 - [38] In a situation like that, you at least have the ability to inflict a loss on the pilot, unlike some of the other BS's. The NOSdomi is reliant upon drones. Preferably tech II drones. If you're in a blaster fit cruiser with a webber... Just start popping whatever drones they shoot after you. You won't come out with the big W, but at least you'll know you caused him the same ISK output as he caused you.
Rulkez FireStar Inc Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:40:00 - [39] a battleship killed a thorax.....oh dear god CCP FIX THIS NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
MECTO Xenobytes Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:40:00 - [40] Originally by: Dixon Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 17:02:52 Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Dixon Edited by: Dixon on 16/12/2006 15:15:12 Originally by: Ithildin On top of that, since the Dominix actually had problems tanking sentries in low sec, it speaks volumes. A proper nosdomi is actually a pretty bad tank, it relies solely on denying the target to shoot back. What? A bad tank? You can fit 4 heavy nos, cap injector, 2 LAR II, 3 t2 actives and an EANMII on that thing with one RCUII in that last low. That is not a bad tank. EDIT: I'm not saying that particular nosdomi didn't have a crap tank, I don't know if he did. But nosdomis in general tend to have pretty good tanks. I ran the numbers on that setup. If it's a large injector, you should have about -1412.5 grid left. That is after Nos, LAR2, H Injector and RCU2. You actually need two RCU2s to fit all that, unless you use a medium cap injector. Also, you'll have a really hard time functioning at your prefered range (short) due to lack of MWD. You're right dual lar doesn't fit, it fits with a lar II + MAR II and cap injector + AB. But for solo/small gang, you really don't need a mwd when your nos covers more than scramble range. wrong, u need it much more in small gang then in BIG It's Great Being Carebear in Kali - aint it? Originally by: Tuxford In this picture you might think that Gallente totally pwn. Well they're alright
DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2006.12.16 17:44:00 - [41] agreed. nosdomi without mwd is very bad idea imo DE
Caletha	Posted - 2006.12.16 18:18:00 - [42] Originally by: Ithildin Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. Perhaps the domi needs a boost when using a different setup, but the NOS domi is too strong, imho. I've seen plenty of vids where 2-3 battleships where fighting a NOS domi and the NOS domi won or got away after killing 1 or 2 of the BS. I've also seen, first hand, how a NOS domi took on 2 ravens and a phoon at the same time. Granted neither of the 3 bs where setup for PvP and the domi was, but that doesnt remove the fact that its, imho, too strong. And you dont need to have full heavy-nos in the hi's: Hi: 2x Heavy NOS, 4x Medium NOS (or perhaps 2x med-nos 2x med-neut) Mid: 1x MWD T1 (named?), 1x Cap Booster, 3x whatever Low: 2x LAR T2, 3x Hard (Expl/Kin/Therm), 1x EANM T2, RCU T2 (Gives me: 68% EM, 68% Expl, 77% Kin/Therm) With 2 Neut's it'll leave you with 194CPU and 65PG (at least with my alts skills, which arent that great) for the 3 mid-slots. It'll suck 44cap/sec off your enemy with 2x Heavy 4x Med-nos (let alone if you add 2x neut). Dude, if that gets within 10km (for medium nos) your screwed. No tank can withstand that. And with cap-800's this setup can run for a LONG time with everything, except mwd, active (even with 2 med-neut instead of the extra 2 med-nos). 'But you will lose the needed sucking from extra heavy nos', thats not true because you get cap from your booster, the nos is there to break the tank of your enemy. The free cap from the nos's is just added bonus. If you add a sensor damp in the mid slots, and a web / scram, then unless the other has a smartbomb, he wont be going for your drones either. Since targeting them will take ages, and if he finally starts shooting at them, you retreat them to your drone bay and redeploy with full shields.
MECTO Xenobytes Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.12.16 19:13:00 - [43] Originally by: Caletha Perhaps the domi needs a boost when using a different setup, but the NOS domi is too strong, imho. I've seen plenty of vids where 2-3 battleships where fighting a NOS domi and the NOS domi won or got away after killing 1 or 2 of the BS. I've also seen, first hand, how a NOS domi took on 2 ravens and a phoon at the same time. Granted neither of the 3 bs where setup for PvP and the domi was, but that doesnt remove the fact that its, imho, too strong. well, first of all in this videos that domi killed PVE fitted battleships. not any Battleship can't take 2-3 adequately fitted [t2] battleships its all matter of setup.. It's Great Being Carebear in Kali - aint it? Originally by: Tuxford In this picture you might think that Gallente totally pwn. Well they're alright
Xori Ruscuv Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2006.12.16 19:17:00 - [44] Originally by: Idami Raptor So I'm flying my Blasterrax back to my base out in Lowsec(I'm gutsy, I know) This Nosdomi with a positive sec status manages to lock on, close, and scram before I can align and warp(Took approx 3-5 seconds). Uhh... Dude, you were in a cruiser, he was in a battleship. Most HACs have some trouble against well set up battleships, let alone cruisers. Anyway, everyone knows NOS is overpowered... old news... It's great playing Caldari-online, isn't it? This IS my main! I just did a portrait swap...
Idami Raptor	Posted - 2006.12.16 19:28:00 - [45] Originally by: Xori Ruscuv Originally by: Idami Raptor So I'm flying my Blasterrax back to my base out in Lowsec(I'm gutsy, I know) This Nosdomi with a positive sec status manages to lock on, close, and scram before I can align and warp(Took approx 3-5 seconds). Uhh... Dude, you were in a cruiser, he was in a battleship. Most HACs have some trouble against well set up battleships, let alone cruisers. Anyway, everyone knows NOS is overpowered... old news... I'm not annoyed about getting beat by a BS in a cruiser. It's not a surprise at all. Why everyone thinks that first off I don't know... What annoys me is that his tank was so pathetic that without the Nos being overpowered, he might actually have lost. Or at least taken some structure damage. I swear, I think he'd set up for uberspeed and scanning, or something.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 19:37:00 - [46] Originally by: Idami Raptor Originally by: Xori Ruscuv Originally by: Idami Raptor So I'm flying my Blasterrax back to my base out in Lowsec(I'm gutsy, I know) This Nosdomi with a positive sec status manages to lock on, close, and scram before I can align and warp(Took approx 3-5 seconds). Uhh... Dude, you were in a cruiser, he was in a battleship. Most HACs have some trouble against well set up battleships, let alone cruisers. Anyway, everyone knows NOS is overpowered... old news... I'm not annoyed about getting beat by a BS in a cruiser. It's not a surprise at all. Why everyone thinks that first off I don't know... What annoys me is that his tank was so pathetic that without the Nos being overpowered, he might actually have lost. Or at least taken some structure damage. I swear, I think he'd set up for uberspeed and scanning, or something. No, he probably just would have killed you faster. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Mjala	Posted - 2006.12.17 01:34:00 - [47] Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Caletha A NOS-Domi is probably one of the strongest solo battleships out there. Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. the most post here are crap, but not this one, agree
PrettyMe Caldari	Posted - 2006.12.17 01:56:00 - [48] Originally by: Mjala Originally by: Ithildin Originally by: Caletha A NOS-Domi is probably one of the strongest solo battleships out there. Yup, the Dominix is also the only battleship that can't be outfitted for fleet fights. Even Typhoons and Ravens can do that marginally well. Now, I don't defend nosferatus, but I DO defend Dominix. Take it from me, if you want to play something rewarding and really difficult, fly Dominix WITHOUT nosferatus. Suddenly you'll understand what it means to have fitting problems and weaknesses. the most post here are crap, but not this one, agree same ^^
Kiaara Amarr	Posted - 2006.12.18 07:19:00 - [49] Edited by: Kiaara on 18/12/2006 07:24:39 You got attacked by a battleship in your cruiser, and you're screaming overpowered? offers cheese...supposedly it goes really well with whine And yes, a domi with a full rack of named nanos in the lows can MWD at well over 2km/s. A successful speed domi has an avoidance tank, not an endurance tank...he sets himself up so that he can stop you from dishing, rather than accepting meekly whatever damaage you want to spoonfeed his way. Nos, damps, ecm (pre nerf), same effect. I prefer damps to ecm anyway, less chance of suddenly losing the lottery.
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.18 07:37:00 - [50] Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 18/12/2006 07:38:58 NOS, or NOSdomi is not overpowered. It has counters, like all setups. If you can't take it out. Go play another game. [OMG! SMASH!]
Scordite	Posted - 2006.12.18 11:42:00 - [51] Originally by: Chikity China In a situation like that, you at least have the ability to inflict a loss on the pilot, unlike some of the other BS's. The NOSdomi is reliant upon drones. Preferably tech II drones. If you're in a blaster fit cruiser with a webber... Just start popping whatever drones they shoot after you. You won't come out with the big W, but at least you'll know you caused him the same ISK output as he caused you. Hell, if rax blasters+drones+sentries took the domi to near structure, shooting at his drones instead might have slowed down his dps enough to let the sentries finish it. ----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead.
slothe Caldari Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2006.12.18 11:50:00 - [52] im in 2 minds about whether or not the nosdomi or nos are overpowered. my current view is their not. i think the nosecmdomi of doom was overpowered, but that isnt any more. *Before complaining about any ship try flying Minmatar*
Bradshaw Kingsman	Posted - 2006.12.18 12:32:00 - [53] I agree with slothe, ecm was annoyingly overpowered. First off I think we kinda established that being beaten by a dominix in low sec while in a poorly tanked thorax is not really something to complain about. 1 EANP on a rax with 800mm plates while facing ogre II's.. honestly the domi pilot could well rather new aswell (granted it takes a few M sp to get heavy t2 drones..) being hurt like that.. As for nosdomi setup.. yup very powerful setup.. nice tank, nice anti tank and reasonable dps.. You get whooped my nanophoons and certain rokh setups (4x heavy nos, 4x torp, webber scrambler passive tank type stuff), anything that can stay out of nos range or lock range, using remote sensor damps or kill drones and anything that can jam it (honestly if you can't keep your ship alive vs just 5 heavy t2 drones wtf were you thinking taking a domi on..), but for the most part it's pretty damned powerful at pretty low sp .. apart from the like 4M sp in drones you will want and BS 4. You can out nos a nosdomi pretty well, loads of people just don't. Don't forget you get like 11,250 power one a domi with skills and heavy nos are like 2000 and LAR break the 2000 aswell.. Injectors add another 2000 .. and drones die well .. if a domi does the return/release thing his dps drops by like 40% easy.. But yes if it can nos you prolly won't be able to fire cap using guns.. although with injectors you can really keep your cap up high.. for minutes.. NosDomi is powerful, def not overpowered (and you get way more fun using 6 mega electrons and drones than nos :))
ChalSto The Galactic Empire Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.18 12:42:00 - [54] I took out entire fleets with my nano-NOS-domi. Well...THATS evil Ask IMP and Privateers After 3 years in EvE, I finaly can say, that I lost more ships due to lag and bugs, than in any battle.
Terraform Gallente Deviance Inc SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.18 12:44:00 - [55] Edited by: Terraform on 18/12/2006 12:45:10 Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 18/12/2006 07:38:58 NOS, or NOSdomi is not overpowered. It has counters, like all setups. If you can't take it out. Go play another game. That comment is quite stupid. Everyone knows the only counter to NOS is NOS, cap-injectors or passive tank/no-cap weapons. Nos is overpowered, not the module itself, but the fact that they have no penalties for fitting 5-6 on the same ship. THAT'S what makes it overpowered. The Nos was never meant as a primary weapon, but due to the way it was made it's one of the most standard modules on any ship.
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.18 15:04:00 - [56] Originally by: Terraform Edited by: Terraform on 18/12/2006 12:45:10 Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 18/12/2006 07:38:58 NOS, or NOSdomi is not overpowered. It has counters, like all setups. If you can't take it out. Go play another game. That comment is quite stupid. Everyone knows the only counter to NOS is NOS, cap-injectors or passive tank/no-cap weapons. Wrong, like I said - there are counters to NOS, you yourself even admit to it. There are more ways to counter NOS. There are more ways: 1) Attack outside of NOS-range. Simple, yet effective. Yes, it's a bit hard to tackle, for instance a dominix (that is, get it tackled). But then again, the dominix is an excellent close-quarters ship. It's however not the win-button some of you try to convince others that it is. 2) Use ECM. Render most/all highslots of the NOSdomi useless. Put a couple of racial on your ship, and said domi will have trouble. Have a blackbird in your gang, with six gallente jammers, and see how uber NOS is. 3) Sensor dampeners. A couple of dampeners makes the dominix unable to target you, and effectively unable to NOS you. Sensor dampeners are extremely effective, and it gives your tacklers the ability to hold down the target without it being able to nos them. EVE is not a singleplayer game, if you see a dominix on target - it's likely to have a NOS-setup. Which means you know what you're dealing with. If they're so immensely effective you imply, everyone should be out there flying them, right? Stop yelling nerf about everything. Possibly NOS shouldn't be able to function past the users cap reaching 100%, but that's it. NOS is fine. Quote: Nos is overpowered, not the module itself, but the fact that they have no penalties for fitting 5-6 on the same ship. THAT'S what makes it overpowered. The Nos was never meant as a primary weapon, but due to the way it was made it's one of the most standard modules on any ship. NOS has it's uses. Yes. But it's not overpowered. In gang-combat, DPS balanced with tankability is more important. At least pre-revelations I've seen blasterthrons make piecemeals out of nosdomi's. An ECM:ed nosdomi will die as soon as it runs out of cap charges (if it uses them). I disagree with you completely, I think that NOS as a primary weapon is fine. Since it can be used by anyone. With the risk of being countered in the way you said, or the way I did. [OMG! SMASH!]
Dark scarlet	Posted - 2006.12.18 15:36:00 - [57] Edited by: Dark scarlet on 18/12/2006 15:45:16 (aimed at Tobias Sjodin) All i got from your post is "Your going to need more then 1 ship to kill the domi" And staying out of nos range(25KM with best named) is not really possible. Truth is I have 1 phoon setup that can give MOST NOS-domis a run for their money. But there is 1 NOS-Domi that as a far as i know is unbeatable 1v1. 2xHeavy 4xMeds 4xMagic 4(diswebjectorab) 1xTracking disrupter 2xBest named LAR 3xActive hardners 1xDamage control 1xEANM II Not only will you be able to solo everything.You should be able to take on even 2 battleships at once with out having to much of a hard time. ------ A Xeom Alt because i forgot to pay for my mains sub.
Breed Love FATAL REVELATIONS	Posted - 2006.12.18 15:42:00 - [58] The op is a noob and he got pwned. Whats al the fuss about? Originally by: Wrangler We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want both anti-social and social players to grief each other!
Franconis	Posted - 2006.12.18 17:10:00 - [59] Quote: No...my base is out in Lowsec. I have two more raxes, an itty, an incursus, an imicus, and a Navitas out there. I do missions out there, I mine out there(rarely, I hate mining). /flame
mallina Caldari Cure.	Posted - 2006.12.18 17:47:00 - [60] The NOSDomi can: - Drain your cap at an excessive speed, whilst doing heavy damage from drones forcing you to tank and use even more. - Return your cap to itself, aiding its near unbreakable (in some cases) 7 slot tank. - Do damage to you whilst jammed and/or out of cap - Take on ALL ship types in close quarters in short, the only thing using cap will be the tank, BUT it has the ability to cripple the cap of the high-damage ships required to break it (Blastathron, Abaddon) so fighting one is extremely difficult. What's more, you only need about a month of training to be effective in a NOSDomi. to KILL it solo, you need: A tier-3 battleship Neutron II blastathron (single rep/plates/resists/damage mods) Another NOSDomi Curse+MWD+faction disruptor ----------- vids: Terrorseries Turbulance
Stive Svenskere	Posted - 2006.12.18 17:54:00 - [61] Edited by: Stive Svenskere on 18/12/2006 17:53:56 Originally by: Tobias Sjodin Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 18/12/2006 07:38:58 NOS, or NOSdomi is not overpowered. It has counters, like all setups. If you can't take it out. Go play another game. Oh god Thank you!!!1111!1one!onebbq21221!11111 You are oh so wise!
Tobias Sjodin Caldari Ore Mongers SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.19 05:21:00 - [62] Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 19/12/2006 05:21:01 Originally by: Dark scarlet Edited by: Dark scarlet on 18/12/2006 15:45:16 (aimed at Tobias Sjodin) All i got from your post is "Your going to need more then 1 ship to kill the domi" And staying out of nos range(25KM with best named) is not really possible. Then you didn't read it. That's not my problem. Plenty of people have killed NOSdomis in 1v1's, the ones who come here to whine about NOSdomis are usually the ones falling victim to them, and not being able to beat them. It's like the people who claimed the raven was overpowered in PvP, the people who claim the crow is overpowered, or the people who think it's unfair being Amarr, "because Amarr sucks" (I would like to redirect these people to Generatorn out of The Corporation). Domi is effective in close-quarters PvP, yes. It's what it's made for. Not overpowered though. Definitely not. [OMG! SMASH!]
ScreamingLord Sutch Hand in Mouth	Posted - 2006.12.19 07:11:00 - [63] Any battleship would have beaten you if it was piloted by a good pilot.

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