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Invention, Don't make it any easier

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Tharrn Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:13:00 - [151] And as a sidenote only ONE team can farm at a time efficiently. Now imagine three or four trying at the same time - it will either rain wardecs, people stand in line or what is the plan? Now recruiting!
Chochko KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:17:00 - [152] Edited by: Chochko on 21/12/2006 15:18:09 Originally by: Tharrn And as a sidenote only ONE team can farm at a time efficiently. Now imagine three or four trying at the same time - it will either rain wardecs, people stand in line or what is the plan? Very good sidenote :P You are right, in the first days after Rev those plexes were overcrowded. Now ... -------------------------------------------
Jowen Datloran Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:21:00 - [153] Edited by: Jowen Datloran on 21/12/2006 15:22:55 Nice numbers and work. But please, do not feed the troll any more by posting in this crappy thread. Anybody with two eyes and the ability to read can see what that guy is up to. I did the only sensible thing with the isk I had stored up for Invention: spent it all on ISS shares. ---------------- Mr. Science & Trade Institute
Zolofine Obsidian Inc.	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:22:00 - [154] Hey, i got an idea, let's make a new miniprofession. Faction salvaging. The idea is that you go around looking for unsalvaged faction spawns (shadow serps, dread gur etc) and you get something special from that and with that times 1000, you can built a faction ship...MAYBE! Now howmany people are actually going to take up this new profession you think? Exactly! It's not worth the time spent, plus it's boring. Now go make some sense, kthxbye
Ritchler Gallente Proof Or Stfu	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:25:00 - [155] Originally by: Lady Noir Anyone can do invention, you just need to figure out what you need and where to get it, then spend the time doing it, it's that simple. Devs, don't cave into the whiners like Kia, this is exactly what EVE needs, content that is really hard to achieve yet in the reach of anyone who really puts the effort in. Lets face it, all the whiners complaining about it are just whining because they don't want to put the effort in, they thought it was going to be easy, EVE doesn't need more easy, easy gets boring fast. If you REALLY want to do invention, you'll get hold of all the required parts, it won't be easy, and you have to have at least a little smarts too (unlike the whiner-brigade in the daily invention whine thread that kia starts). Invention is fine, it's only been a few weeks, and actually only a few days since multispec probes were released, if after half a year hardly anyone is inventing, then maybe look into things a bit more. Allow me to translate this post for you guys Hi, my name is Lady noir, i am an alt of a major T2 Producer, i don't like invention because it means i cannot charge extorionate rates for my T2 items anymore because more and more people make them I feel you should do what i say because i have T2 BPOS and i make more ISK than msotly everyone. Please listen to my whine whilst i pretend i am complaining about other's whining Thanks Okay boys, all translated for you :)
Queen Hades	Posted - 2006.12.21 15:29:00 - [156] As for invention I stand between the two opinions "to hell with it, it's a barrel burst and future will continue to see the absurd t2 prices we have now" and "yes fix that so t2 becomes very common". And I tend to ignore t2 producer alts.
Atius Tirawa	Posted - 2006.12.21 16:10:00 - [157] That ** should be 'bought' using RPs. X number of RPs equal Y T2 ship/wepon/mod. This Invention thing is bull**, and anyone that thinks it is not hard enough owns a T2 BPO that makes money (sorry Tharrn, nice ship class, wrong clour). Anyone should, with time, have a reliable chance at a T2 BPO. I fear all these wow players have come over to EvE and they mine and run missions thnking that that is the point in the game. . .wake up!!
Ishmael Hansen No Quarter.	Posted - 2006.12.21 17:21:00 - [158] Edited by: Ishmael Hansen on 21/12/2006 17:22:11 Edited by: Ishmael Hansen on 21/12/2006 17:21:45 Edited by: Ishmael Hansen on 21/12/2006 17:21:30 Atm I think we have more chance to have Estamel drop a DG invul in Providence then to invent something. Invention is a bad joke CCP pulled on us, after agent offers in R&D agents, reverse engineering, etc. When the hell does a dev come here and say something? They been faster to unnecessary drop the skill req of salvaging, rig components drop, but this that can actually be of any use not a ***** word. Never been so close to go start look for another game. Ffs why are you so afraid of upsetting BoB and MC and the other tech 2 owners? Do you think it's fair they get enough isk for a dread by selling 5 cruisers? In the end industrial mine, mine, and do their stuff that takes **load of hours to build the dreads, players have to gring missions and npc's so they afford tech 2 and this lucky bastards just need to open market, component buy order, hac sell order and instant isk to financiate their tech 2 fleet. Sounds freaking fair to me. Guess all I have left is apply for rkk or stk, because that's eve in easy mode. The old i-win button. No work, all profit and I win eve
Ishmael Hansen No Quarter.	Posted - 2006.12.21 20:49:00 - [159] Just got home from work and this thread seems to be dying. Did someone invent anything or the alt trolls are away for xmas cashing out their iskies on ebay?
Altrex Stoppel Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.12.21 23:30:00 - [160] Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:47 Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:17 Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Right now, using invention to compete against the current T2 producers is stupid. It's like building cars by hand that are built better by an assembly line. How exactly do you compete with your one car a month to their several thousand cars per month? Take that exact logic and think now, I'm not here to disagree with you, just pointing out your flaws. (I'm an ass like that.) If only a handful of people have acces to an assembly line while THOUSANDS have access to build cars with their hands. Put two and two together and we get, dare I say, balance? (Prolly not but whatever) Omg, Dark Shikari got pregnant with the forums!

DefJam101 Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.22 01:36:00 - [161] Originally by: Lady Noir Originally by: subvert what do you call winning a T2 BPO at random and having the power to print ISK? hard? It's harder than hard, since your chances are almost non existant. LOL *** Sorry mods, edited sig and forgot to save for web.
DefJam101 Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.22 01:39:00 - [162] Originally by: Altrex Stoppel Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:47 Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:17 Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Right now, using invention to compete against the current T2 producers is stupid. It's like building cars by hand that are built better by an assembly line. How exactly do you compete with your one car a month to their several thousand cars per month? Take that exact logic and think now, I'm not here to disagree with you, just pointing out your flaws. (I'm an ass like that.) If only a handful of people have acces to an assembly line while THOUSANDS have access to build cars with their hands. Put two and two together and we get, dare I say, balance? (Prolly not but whatever) Not enough mins to go around? Or time, or well anything. *** Sorry mods, edited sig and forgot to save for web.
Altrex Stoppel Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.12.22 03:02:00 - [163] Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 22/12/2006 03:02:00 Originally by: DefJam101 Originally by: Altrex Stoppel Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:47 Edited by: Altrex Stoppel on 21/12/2006 23:30:17 Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Right now, using invention to compete against the current T2 producers is stupid. It's like building cars by hand that are built better by an assembly line. How exactly do you compete with your one car a month to their several thousand cars per month? Take that exact logic and think now, I'm not here to disagree with you, just pointing out your flaws. (I'm an ass like that.) If only a handful of people have acces to an assembly line while THOUSANDS have access to build cars with their hands. Put two and two together and we get, dare I say, balance? (Prolly not but whatever) Not enough mins to go around? Or time, or well anything. New regions have greatly increased the income of high end minerals and time is something we cannot control and are at the mercy of. Omg, Dark Shikari got pregnant with the forums!
Chochko KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 10:47:00 - [164] No one has replyed, because no one has made succesfull invention. And i`m not expecting this to happen in this Year. -------------------------------------------
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 11:11:00 - [165] Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 11:13:41 Originally by: Chochko No one has replyed, because no one has made succesfull invention. And i`m not expecting this to happen in this Year. We will start our first ship invention job later but those take a while to complete, but it will be done way before next year. I thought your boss said you'd build two interfaces this week, a ship and a module?
Necronomicon Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 11:17:00 - [166] May I suggest that we stop feeding the troll in the hope it can only injest forums posts and dies? Carlsberg dont make Eve Pilots, but if they did, i wouldnt be one of them.
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 11:36:00 - [167] Originally by: Necronomicon May I suggest that we stop feeding the troll in the hope it can only injest forums posts and dies? Just because your corp is seriously to clueless to get an interface built, it does not mean that everyone is. Our's is about ready to be built, will take 16 hours though.
deathstoker	Posted - 2006.12.22 14:23:00 - [168] Originally by: Lady Noir Originally by: Necronomicon May I suggest that we stop feeding the troll in the hope it can only injest forums posts and dies? Just because your corp is seriously to clueless to get an interface built, it does not mean that everyone is. Our's is about ready to be built, will take 16 hours though. Screenshot or STFU
KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 14:24:00 - [169] Edited by: KIAEddZ on 22/12/2006 14:25:32 Originally by: Lady Noir Originally by: Necronomicon May I suggest that we stop feeding the troll in the hope it can only injest forums posts and dies? Just because your corp is seriously to clueless to get an interface built, it does not mean that everyone is. Our's is about ready to be built, will take 16 hours though. So you have built an interface.... big deal. We are about 24 hrs from our second build, but we know the astounding amount of effort involved, JUST like you do. We choose to be honest about it, you choose to lie through your greed stained teeth. Your succesful build deosnt change the FACT that your facts n fgures for this entire thread have been total and utter bulsht. In fact your entire motivation in these threads about invention has been about 1 thing. You dont want Invention made realistic because you want to be in the niche market of inventing T2 BPCs and still strangling the market for huge profits. You are greedy self centred and totally see through in your motivations. You know if Invention gets easier, more people will be doing it, and the Tech 2 prices will fall. Your Tech 2 BPOs and your invented BPCs values will drop. You are whats wrong with Eve. Show me your main, and I'll gladly make sure your "Profits" are spent resupplying your corp with new ships. KIA EVE Home
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 14:41:00 - [170] Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 14:50:20 I am not lying, i am stating fact's, it took us 50 hours to collect the materials to build a ship interface, which is by far the hardest interface to build. I want to profit? Oh no, whatever gave you that idea? Who on EARTH would want to profit? At the end of the day, it's up to CCP, you can whine and whine, they created this game and if they say invention shouldn't be easy to get into then tough ***** i'm afraid. So ingame threats now? I am getting to you so much that you would have your entire corp go out of their way to try to cause us grief ingame simply because i am arguing with you on the forum? You guys are poor at what you do anyway. Just how many threads are you creating on the corp and alliances forum these days anyway? About one thread a day isn't it? Face it, you'll never be famous no matter how many threads you make on that forum.

KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 14:47:00 - [171] Edited by: KIAEddZ on 22/12/2006 14:47:15 Originally by: Lady Noir I am not lying, i am stating fact's, it took us 50 hours to collect the materials to build a ship interface, which is by far the hardest interface to build. Liar KIA EVE Home
KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 14:51:00 - [172] Originally by: Chochko SOme clarifications. Ship BPC. Armour blocks - 120 Spare Parts - 600 Electronic Link - 960 Power Couplings - 300 *Computer Chips - 60 ---- Those with 1 drop from Airmia Complex IF we assume that half the time Cans drop Armmor Blocks and half time Spare Parts. The Complex can supply 15 Spare Parts and 15 Armor Blocks per Hour (this cant be increased) So after the 40th Hour you will have 600 AB and 600 SP. If you remember 2 persons are needed to do this complex - than this makes 80 Man hours for Both the components. Now the other Complex in Friggi there the cans drop those with 3 * IF we assume that one third of the time Cans drop Electronic Links, one third of the time POwer Couplings and one third of the time Computer Chips. This Complex can supply 25 Electronic Links, 25 Power Couplings and 25 Computer CHips per hour So after the 39th hour you will have 960 from each type. If you remember 4 persons are needed for this complex - than this makes 156 Man hours. IF AND ONLY IF There are No other ppl, you have insane luck, that the most needed parts drop at least half the time (Counting the stock of our components i think that we are unbelieveable unlucky or just some items dont drop in the same proportion as others). The Conclusion - in perfect situation you will need 236 hours to collect all the required items. in reality this is far far from that number. SO plz Noir Stfu with your numbers which are just plain crap. I dont know what you are defending, but i think the idea of EVE-ONLINE is not to be the stupid WOW type grinding. 236 Hours to collect the components needed IF the perfect ratio of drops is observed. The perfect Ratio of drops is not observed as we well know. You offer no proof of your Magical 50hrs of work that gained you 1700 components to build your Interface, no figures other than we did it so... honest we did. We know damn well that 50 hrs is utter crap, as do you if you really are building a ship interface. Public opinion is that you are a liar, my opinion is that you are a liar. You sir, are basically a liar. KIA EVE Home
Tanis Bastar Caldari Interstitial Incorporated	Posted - 2006.12.22 15:21:00 - [173] KIA, thanks again for the info, and for not putting up with any crap from certain smack-talking, lying, alt-posting tards!
Jovialmadness	Posted - 2006.12.22 15:28:00 - [174] I dont own any bpo's. I earned my modest wealth the old fashioned way by slaving for it. THAT is the only thing im concerned about...i just hope ccp doesnt nerf isk p.s. i think the devs are bonified republicans..thats why they believe in trickle down. 90% of the eve player base are liberals...thats why they believe all should be equal. Flame on Quote: As a side note, i liken capacitor to blood. Without blood, nothing can function in the body. I do NOT like being a race that bleeds quicker than anyone else. yes, i am an alt..Jovial Quote:
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 15:58:00 - [175] Originally by: Tanis Bastar KIA, thanks again for the info, and for not putting up with any crap from certain smack-talking, lying, alt-posting tards! It's ok, you just go ahead and believe kia, works out better for us anyway, if people believe what he is claiming over what i am, then that means far less people will even attempt invention, which means more isk for me. Oh wait, I thought kia said i was only in this for greed?
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 16:50:00 - [176] Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 16:56:36 Originally by: Tanis Bastar Originally by: Jovialmadness p.s. i think the devs are bonified republicans..thats why they believe in trickle down. 90% of the eve player base are liberals...thats why they believe all should be equal. Oh boy, another alt-poster talking nonsense. So you're saying that if CCP makes it easier to create a data interface than a Titan, it will make all players equal? I'm not going to waste much time with this one... ROFL - still going on about how it's easier to make a titan than a data inferface? It took us 4 days to build our ship data interface, that was from the moment we got our hands on a bpc, to 4 days later when we had collected enough materials to build the first one. Believe me, if building a titan were that easy, by now we'd have several. Screenshot anyone? Ship interface in production Honestly kia, i think you are just trying to make people not want to invent by making out it's much harder than it really is. You probably want to make sure nobody else comes and farms components as they will only slow your own production down. So you make people believe it takes an ungodly amount of hours so they will stay out of your way. There you have it folks, kia is the real liar here.
KIAEddZ Caldari KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.12.22 17:14:00 - [177] Great Advice: Do not ever argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. Your new argument that I am trying to dissuade people from trying invention is sheer genius. At this point I am going to rest my case. You are whats wrong with Eve. Plain and simple. CCP please look at this issue asap. thx. KIA EVE Home
Tharrn Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2006.12.22 17:30:00 - [178] Damn, busted. Eddz paid all of us to say he's right. P.S.: I didn't get the billion yet, Eddz. Now recruiting!
Snarls McGee	Posted - 2006.12.22 18:35:00 - [179] Originally by: Lady Noir Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 11:13:41 Originally by: Chochko No one has replyed, because no one has made succesfull invention. And i`m not expecting this to happen in this Year. We will start our first ship invention job later but those take a while to complete, but it will be done way before next year. I thought your boss said you'd build two interfaces this week, a ship and a module? 1) You said you'd post pics when your mods were done. Where are they? 2) Why do you conveniently ignore all the posts that point out how blatantly wrong you are and only 'happen' to answer the ones that are easy or have nothing to do with the thread? KIA has provided us with actual examples, this thing called math which can be proven or disproven (so far no one has disproven their math) while you just come up with "I typed it in a forum so it must be true" claims like (paraphrasing) "We got all the componants in 75 man hours" and "I got a +6.0 standing from 0 in 36 hours".. OK, fine. I made 3 Titans in 2 weeks. I'll offer no proof, I'll flame anyone who disagrees and tell them they don't know how to play Eve and I'll conveniently ignore everyone PROVING it is impossible but, hey, I typed it in a forum so it must be true, right? ---------- We've all heard that a million monkeys typing will eventually create something intelligent. Thanks to message forums we know that isn't true.
Lady Noir	Posted - 2006.12.22 18:57:00 - [180] Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 19:00:22 Originally by: Snarls McGee Originally by: Lady Noir Edited by: Lady Noir on 22/12/2006 11:13:41 Originally by: Chochko No one has replyed, because no one has made succesfull invention. And i`m not expecting this to happen in this Year. We will start our first ship invention job later but those take a while to complete, but it will be done way before next year. I thought your boss said you'd build two interfaces this week, a ship and a module? 1) You said you'd post pics when your mods were done. Where are they? 2) Why do you conveniently ignore all the posts that point out how blatantly wrong you are and only 'happen' to answer the ones that are easy or have nothing to do with the thread? KIA has provided us with actual examples, this thing called math which can be proven or disproven (so far no one has disproven their math) while you just come up with "I typed it in a forum so it must be true" claims like (paraphrasing) "We got all the componants in 75 man hours" and "I got a +6.0 standing from 0 in 36 hours".. OK, fine. I made 3 Titans in 2 weeks. I'll offer no proof, I'll flame anyone who disagrees and tell them they don't know how to play Eve and I'll conveniently ignore everyone PROVING it is impossible but, hey, I typed it in a forum so it must be true, right? Look a few posts up for the screenshot i posted of a ship data interface in production, theres your proof. The math shown previous is incorrect, there are 25-30+ possible spawns for components per each empires data interface type, these respawn new components every 20 minutes, thats about 90 spawns an hour per type, well over half the time they spawn a component, the other time's they spawn useless junk, you will end up with to many of some components and to few of others, but that's just the way it goes, you cant get the perfect amount. If half of the 90 respawns per hour (30 or so spawnpoints respawning every 20 minutes) drop a component, that's over 1000 components spawned in a 23 hour period, the ship interface requires 1700 components, in 50 hours of getting every spawn you will have farmed around 2500 components overall and probably have the required amount to build, or be very close to it.



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