EVE Search - Wardec thoughts

Check My IP Information

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Wardec thoughts

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Cidanel Afuran Chickenhawk. 293	Posted - 2015.10.06 17:38:09 - [121] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: creating a corp is the same as waving a flag that says "come at me bro, we are a business ready to compete in New Eden." It's not the same as some mmos where it means you get a fancy cape and a guild bank with a private chat and a circle-jerk cave. now if only eve had a working stock market and I could buy all your shares, take everything in your corp, and pound you with litigation if you do anything to stop me. I don't necessarily agree. If you are smart about the systems you live in you can survive pretty peacefully with a smaller corp. If you run out of a backwater system and use an NPC alt for hauling, you generally won't get decced. The average new player probably doesn't know that though And if you do get wardecced, just jump 30 jumps away from the wardec corp's home system and AFK cloak at a safe spot for a few days. Nothing is more annoying than hunting a target across half the universe only to not see him in station and not be able to find him in space.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3325	Posted - 2015.10.06 18:19:13 - [122] - Quote If you move 30 jumps away you get to test the often touted carebear rhetoric about everyone who ever declared a war being permanently glued to a trade hub undock. Realistically if you do move and you're not at war with P I R A T or whatever the current hub camper respawn is they'll still show up at some point. However they're likely to bring much lighter ships and fewer assets like boosts and logistics, which makes armed resistance more viable. And of course if they are in fact only interested in hub camping they pose no threat whatsoever.
Cidanel Afuran Chickenhawk. 293	Posted - 2015.10.06 18:26:08 - [123] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: If you move 30 jumps away you get to test the often touted carebear rhetoric about everyone who ever declared a war being permanently glued to a trade hub undock. Realistically if you do move and you're not at war with P I R A T or whatever the current hub camper respawn is they'll still show up at some point. However they're likely to bring much lighter ships and fewer assets like boosts and logistics, which makes armed resistance more viable. And of course if they are in fact only interested in hub camping they pose no threat whatsoever. 90% of the time they just move to easier targets closer to home.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3328	Posted - 2015.10.06 18:47:41 - [124] - Quote It kind of depends on the number of active wars they have and how many guys you have active and in space in the same area. If you have a bunch of 5.0 sec status dudes in space 23/7 sooner or later someone is going to send an alt to see what's up. Obviously if it turns out those guys 30 jumps out are mining in ventures there's probably not going to be any follow up. But if they're in marauders there probably will be. Of course if they're a large group with 30,000 war targets they probably don't even run locates on anyone who isn't a contract target. The specifics will always vary obviously since each aggressor and defender are different and the motivations and objectives are infinitely variable. That's why I like wars, every one is different and there's so much nuance to it!
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 412	Posted - 2015.10.06 19:46:48 - [125] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: It kind of depends on the number of active wars they have and how many guys you have active and in space in the same area. If you have a bunch of 5.0 sec status dudes in space 23/7 sooner or later someone is going to send an alt to see what's up. Obviously if it turns out those guys 30 jumps out are mining in ventures there's probably not going to be any follow up. But if they're in marauders there probably will be. Of course if they're a large group with 30,000 war targets they probably don't even run locates on anyone who isn't a contract target. The specifics will always vary obviously since each aggressor and defender are different and the motivations and objectives are infinitely variable. That's why I like wars, every one is different and there's so much nuance to it! Sure, 30,000 wartargets in eve... Seems to me you are not in sync with the actual playercount. Your imagination and the actual situation in new eden have almost nothing in common. Those things almost never happen. Also this story where the wardeccer got smacked by his victims: How old is this story? PIRAT shows how massive this system is abused. And as posted in this thread, its abused for quite some time now. Changes are coming and ccp says nothing is unthinkable. Maybe some wishes of those wannabe hisec pvplers will come true, but they will still not like the result. Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Austneal Nero Fazione End of Life 80	Posted - 2015.10.06 19:57:20 - [126] - Quote Ceryph Archai wrote: Austneal wrote: Ceryph Archai wrote: WarDecs should not be for harassing people just because you have nothing better to do. Why? What is "better" in this game than doing something you find fun? There are people that enjoy highsec wardecs, and would rather do that than live in lowsec. It seems to me that you are villainizing these guys because they "shouldn't" be allowed to do this or that because it dissatisfies you. There are people that like to mine and make money. Why shouldn't they be able to do that without having to PvP? The only way to be successful when PIRAT is making war decs on everyone is to fight back. So, your method requires people who don't want to PvP be forced to, my way allows them to have limited engagements if they don't **** someone off because my method limits how many people can be wardecced. I'm not saying no war decs at all, but the whole of hisec shouldn't be under war alert just because people don't want to go to lowsec to fight. So we are supposed to force the people in hisec to fight but not force the people who want to war in hisec, to losec where these actions are permitted. Your arguments are one-sided and you only apply your logic to the people you want to. Even if HiSec wars were entirely banned, there are still places to go for PvP content. That's where your logic falls apart. Your entire comment assumes that highsec is supposed to be a PvP-free or "safe" zone, which CCP has said multiple times that it's not. High Security space is only that: High Security. Not "Total Security" Also, what would limiting the number of wars per alliance / corp really do? Do you think that an alliance of 5 corps is just going to go "Oh no, we can only dec X number of people at a time"? Or do you think it's more likely that if they REALLY want more than X number of active decs, that they would just gather everyone into a public channel and dissolve the alliance to dec everyone separately? I do agree that the war mechanics need to be looked at. However, a hard limit enforcement is (if not a bit anti-sandbox) only a band-aid solution.
Cara Forelli Green Skull LLC Bad Intention 1268	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:08:10 - [127] - Quote Broodin wrote: new players who, even in groups, lack the skills and experience to survive an attack from a skilled player in a level 2 destroyer... It was a t1 frigate. I'm not a monster. And you did attempt to blob me. Adventures New player with questions? Join my public channel in game: *House Forelli* Titan's Lament
Cidanel Afuran Chickenhawk. 296	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:15:48 - [128] - Quote Ceryph Archai wrote: There are people that like to mine and make money. Why shouldn't they be able to do that without having to PvP? The only way to be successful when PIRAT is making war decs on everyone is to fight back. So, your method requires people who don't want to PvP be forced to, my way allows them to have limited engagements if they don't **** someone off because my method limits how many people can be wardecced. I'm not saying no war decs at all, but the whole of hisec shouldn't be under war alert just because people don't want to go to lowsec to fight. So we are supposed to force the people in hisec to fight but not force the people who want to war in hisec, to losec where these actions are permitted. Your arguments are one-sided and you only apply your logic to the people you want to. Even if HiSec wars were entirely banned, there are still places to go for PvP content. That's where your logic falls apart. As someone who spends a good chunk of time PvE-ing, if you are getting caught during a war, you're doing something wrong. For the duration of the war haul your ships with someone in an NPC corp and travel in a pod/interceptor. Find a low-use system and set up shop there during the war. With a decently set up overview and d-scanning you should never be on grid when the aggressor lands. I would also suggest moving to null. Nullsec is infinitely safer than HS for the PvE-er assuming they are in a sov holding alliance.
Cartaris Caldari Provisions Caldari State 34	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:26:15 - [129] - Quote La Rynx wrote: Also this story where the wardeccer got smacked by his victims: How old is this story? https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=253092 I wrote that awhile back, but its not ancient. I'm not an amazing storyteller, but it's there if you want a read.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 1856	Posted - 2015.10.06 20:30:19 - [130] - Quote Cidanel Afuran wrote: Chainsaw Plankton wrote: creating a corp is the same as waving a flag that says "come at me bro, we are a business ready to compete in New Eden." It's not the same as some mmos where it means you get a fancy cape and a guild bank with a private chat and a circle-jerk cave. now if only eve had a working stock market and I could buy all your shares, take everything in your corp, and pound you with litigation if you do anything to stop me. I don't necessarily agree. If you are smart about the systems you live in you can survive pretty peacefully with a smaller corp. If you run out of a backwater system and use an NPC alt for hauling, you generally won't get decced. The average new player probably doesn't know that though And if you do get wardecced, just jump 30 jumps away from the wardec corp's home system and AFK cloak at a safe spot for a few days. Nothing is more annoying than hunting a target across half the universe only to not see him in station and not be able to find him in space. bleh, too many similar topics/responses. I wrote something about wars not being all that hard to avoid in another post. You still have that flag flying, but by avoiding jita 4-4 undock and the public recruitment channel people probably don't care enough (or even see it for that matter) to wardec. anyways I've been on pretty much every side of a wardec and in hindsight any way I look at it now it was mostly a stupid waste of time. @ChainsawPlankto

La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 413	Posted - 2015.10.07 06:30:56 - [131] - Quote Cartaris wrote: La Rynx wrote: Also this story where the wardeccer got smacked by his victims: How old is this story? https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=253092 I wrote that awhile back, but its not ancient. I'm not an amazing storyteller, but it's there if you want a read. This described situation is not, whats being talked about. Bad luck for aggressors, that the corps had experienced ingame friends who helped out. nice Sytem worked like intended. We are talking about hisec groups like pirat or mercs like break a wish. Clearly 200 parallel wars show that something is not allright. Mercs are no help at all. Some think it is evil and funny to take the isk for assistance, but not do their work. In RL those companies break up in no time, cause no one hires them. In eve they just go to forum c&p and beg for work. Wardeccs don't have to go, they have to be refined. IMO CCP wants a cool evil universe, not so much pathetic baby seal clubbers and juvenile kindergarden bullis. Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 40459	Posted - 2015.10.07 07:31:56 - [132] - Quote La Rynx wrote: Vimsy Vortis wrote: Of course if they're a large group with 30,000 war targets they probably don't even run locates on anyone who isn't a contract target. Sure, 30,000 wartargets in eve... Seems to me you are not in sync with the actual playercount. Your imagination and the actual situation in new eden have almost nothing in common. What is the actual player count? I thought we didn't have that number accurately anymore. It's not as though they all have to be logged in at the same time to count as a war target. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 413	Posted - 2015.10.07 08:05:43 - [133] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: [quote=La Rynx]It's not as though they all have to be logged in at the same time to count as a war target. You got me there! I was only taking the logged in players into account. However, there is not much different since those unlogged players are not really a wartarget. How this unlogged players create "nuances" or even content, escapes me. Wimsi did sound like she was talking about logged players as for fictional absent players are not worth talking about. The number 30,000 is to big. Face it. Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 40460	Posted - 2015.10.07 08:53:05 - [134] - Quote La Rynx wrote: The number 30,000 is to big. Face it. I don't know. I don't really think about that sort of thing much, but Vimsy would certainly know. Just taking a quick look at P I R A T, who currently have 206 active wars. Just three of their current wars are against NC. (2187 members), TISHU (623 members) and P-A-T-R-I-O-T-S (759 members). It's possible to argue all day on whether all of those members are war targets or not, but a straight counting of numbers for just 3 of their wars totals 3569 potential targets. I'm not sure what the 203 other wars would add up to. 30,000 seems quite possible I guess. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3334	Posted - 2015.10.07 11:14:13 - [135] - Quote 30,000 was kind of an exaggeration, but not a huge one and I wasnt referring to concurrently logged in players. Specifically I was talking about trade hub camping groups that declare war on nullsec alliances, they routinely have literally 10,000+ targets, so there's no chance of them adding and locating every single target. Not that we don't currently have 7,000 war targets right now ourselves.
BirdStrike State War Academy Caldari State 8	Posted - 2015.10.07 11:32:15 - [136] - Quote Well a simple solution to prevent wardec spamming would be to make wardecs a skill based system the same as corporation management. The CEO can only hold one war dec per skill point and a bunch of related skills that determine concords fee, duration, sec status of systems they can fight in etc. Then require a minimum number of kills within the wardec timeframe or the war is considered lost. Then like t3's you should be docked a skill point for each war you declare and lose, and have a cool down time say of 7 days between war decs. Also the wardec should be required to place a bond with concord of a non trivial amount, if they lose then the target gets the bonded amount as reperations / war prizes, which would give a fiscal incentive for the target to fight the aggressor. If you disband a corp under active war dec you should lose all your corporate management skills and be unable to form ir join a new non npc corp for a minimum cooldown period. CCP likes to talk about consequences, there should be consequences for war deccers, and having it a skill based requirement that forces investment in leadership skills, and limits the amount of wars you can have would prevent a lot of the casual griefer mechanics while still enabling a legitimate playstyle. You do need wardecs, lets face it a lot of hisec activity is nullsec/lowsec players using security to support their activity, but it should still be limited the way corporate management is.
Storm Aumer Vega Farscape 0	Posted - 2015.10.07 12:14:09 - [137] - Quote Xert Trassien wrote: The current war dec system sucks the way it is. What is the point of decking a corp at all when by the time the war goes active the corp has disbanded and made a new corp.. There should be a system in place to at least stop ppl just dropping corp to avoid decs. After all eve is based more as a pvp game yes ? they dont have to logg in at al to the game during war.Thers not in ccp's interes to stop people from playing iven if that means people living a war deced corperation .Thers shud rater be a limit to howe many open/pending wars a corperation/alliance kan have,its not good for the game when som alliance's have more active wars than they have people in theyr alliance like 106 people 140 active wars,as you kan see those are the problem not so mutch the war dec consept. Shit hapens,mowe on......Luky maby your good then......Playe as you like and not as others tell you to.....It dont hurt to be nice....
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3334	Posted - 2015.10.07 13:10:01 - [138] - Quote If you can effectively prosecute 140 wars at the same time with 106 members why should you be prevented from doing so by an arbitrary mechanical limitation? From a sandbox perspective the only limit should be their ability to pay the bill and fight the targets. Given that they end up outnumbered by multiple hundreds to one they should be constantly overwhelmed by the defenders. But the defenders instead take no action whatsoever and die en-masse in trade hubs. The large number of wars is a symptom of how incredibly passive defenders tend to be when faced with wars, even ones with massive military superiority would rather take billions of isk in losses and whine about bad game design than take any action themselves. Defenders do nothing which allows aggressors to act with absolute impunity.
Kaarous Aldurald Black Hydra Consortium. 14637	Posted - 2015.10.07 13:34:35 - [139] - Quote BirdStrike wrote: Well a simple solution to prevent wardec spamming You only need a "solution" for things that are problems. This is not only not a problem, it's working exactly as intended. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 414	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:48:03 - [140] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: ...bla... this: Vimsy Vortis wrote: 30,000 was kind of an exaggeration Further "dancing" around those numbers doesn't get you anywhere. Wimsi, Skippy and codie, as you can see a lot of people do not share you oppinion and see the need for discussion for possible changes. CCP is already working on hisec changes, to create more competition there. The "sandbox" argument was heavily abused too, so it is quite dead argument. Gamesettings and functions get changed when needed. Just check the Jump-Fatigue, which was working as intended too, but it was changed to work even better. And that is what this discussion is about. Make "wardeccs" better and more meaningfull. Not just spray them around to finally get some scraps. Sandbox arguments from wimsi and aldous "works as intended" arguments ignore what many people already discussed in this thread. Basically Andou says nothing more than "change is bad" and repeats that he does not like it and he does not think much of people who discuss it... surprise... Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 40462	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:55:11 - [141] - Quote La Rynx wrote: Wimsi, Skippy and codie, as you can see a lot of people do not share you oppinion and see the need for discussion for possible changes. Just out of curiosity, what opinion of mine are you referring to here? Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
Kaarous Aldurald Black Hydra Consortium. 14639	Posted - 2015.10.07 14:59:59 - [142] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: La Rynx wrote: Wimsi, Skippy and codie, as you can see a lot of people do not share you oppinion and see the need for discussion for possible changes. Just out of curiosity, what opinion of mine are you referring to here? Come now, you know who you're replying to. If you have an opinion that PvP belongs in highsec in any capacity, or that no one has the right to be left alone in a sandbox PvP game, then you give him the badfeelz. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 25240	Posted - 2015.10.07 15:13:14 - [143] - Quote La Rynx wrote: Make "wardeccs" better and more meaningfull. Not just spray them around to finally get some scraps. It's not the problem you think it is that is the cause of wardec spam. Wardecs are spammed because at least 50% of the targets will turtle up or drop corp, wardec corps spam wardecs so that they have targets to keep their membership entertained and playing Eve. Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business. Nil mortifi sine lucre.
Kaarous Aldurald Black Hydra Consortium. 14639	Posted - 2015.10.07 15:17:55 - [144] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: La Rynx wrote: Make "wardeccs" better and more meaningfull. Not just spray them around to finally get some scraps. It's not the problem you think it is that is the cause of wardec spam. Wardecs are spammed because at least 50% of the targets will turtle up or drop corp, wardec corps spam wardecs so that they have targets to keep their membership entertained and playing Eve. 50/50 that Trollboy there actually knows this, and that fits his precise intent with his snide "suggestions". You gotta understand, whether it's ignorance or malice, they want to kill the game either way, and both are equally damnable. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3342	Posted - 2015.10.07 15:23:09 - [145] - Quote You can either spam and hope for the best or declare war on nullsec corps and camp trade hubs. CCP Continuously nerfing highsec PVP in response to carebear whining has conditioned people into whining on the forums to get what they want in game, rather than actually playing the game.
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 414	Posted - 2015.10.07 16:52:44 - [146] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: Just out of curiosity, what opinion of mine are you referring to here? Oh sorry you do not have an oppinion, you are just trolling? Sorry. Jonah Gravenstein wrote: La Rynx wrote: Make "wardeccs" better and more meaningfull. Not just spray them around to finally get some scraps. It's not the problem you think it is that is the cause of wardec spam. Wardecs are spammed because at least 50% of the targets will turtle up or drop corp, wardec corps spam wardecs so that they have targets to keep their membership entertained and playing Eve. Of course and if i put stabs on my travel fit i am avoiding PvP too. Been there done that. It is not only about wardecc spamming, also its about equality. Rise the risk for both sides, especially those ppl crying about other players (easier opponents) than just accept that and hunt other targets. How comes that those crybabies do not shoot it out between those other crybabies that want "to kill something". If someone avoids the fight, he is afraid it might be surethat he will loose. That is something almost all eve players do! And thats not risk averse, its smart. I do not engage solely a 100man fleet. Thats not risk averse. Its just not being stu-pid. If you want fights, go nullsec. Roams happen always and i have been victim to them more than once. It is risk averse and pathetic to fight smaller, weaker entities, because you do not dare to do what you tell others to do. It is pathetic to pound on your chest when you are only kill caspules, exhumers and haulers. It is PvP, but it is not elite. Compared what others do, it is just pathetic. And yes "trollboy 1" knows this. But "mr trollboy 2" at least i am not crying "noooooo" all the times. You know: How many Eve players does it take to change a light bulb? Kaarous: "Change? Noooooooooo!!!11!!1!!!". At least i try to discuss productiv. You whinning (really it is) is whining none the less, even if the tears you cry are angry tears. Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 414	Posted - 2015.10.07 16:57:40 - [147] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: CCP Continuously nerfing highsec PVP in response to carebear whining has conditioned people into whining on the forums to get what they want in game, rather than actually playing the game. You realise that hisec mercs are also pathetic carebears? Would you follow CCPs blogs, you could see some changes on the horizon with those citadels. And if i got them right, there will be changes for wardeccs to. Better be prepared. I will watch from nullsec and comment. Vimsy Vortis wrote: You can either spam and hope for the best or declare war on nullsec corps and camp trade hubs. NO! You can always get to nullsec and get YOUR asss wiped! Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Austneal Nero Fazione End of Life 85	Posted - 2015.10.07 17:06:12 - [148] - Quote La Rynx wrote: You realise that hisec mercs are also pathetic carebears? https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Carebear I don't think "Carebear" is the word you want here.
La Rynx School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 414	Posted - 2015.10.07 17:11:22 - [149] - Quote Austneal wrote: La Rynx wrote: You realise that hisec mercs are also pathetic carebears? https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Carebear I don't think "Carebear" is the word you want here. Wrong, that is absolutly what i had in mind. Ppl stating otherwise just do not look into the mirror. Kaarous Aldurald wrote: they want to kill the game either way, and both are equally damnable. Man, you really lost it for good. EvE is changing all the time. Your comfortable times in hisec might come to an end. You know what you just wrote? "Eve is dying" Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 3345	Posted - 2015.10.07 17:17:08 - [150] - Quote They can continue to do the same thing they've been doing for years and nerf highsec aggression yet again but doing so won't fix any kind of perceived problem because it doesn't address or even attempt to identify the causes. Nerfing aggression is a blunt instrument that tries (and usually fails, see the rise of CODE. and the current large highsec merc alliances that we get to enjoy as a result as past nerfs) to address the most superficial symptoms. As long as changes are unintelligent knee-jerk responses to whining without any attempt to find out what player need the "problem" behavior is satisfying the problem won't be solved, it'll stay the same or get worse, but will manifest in a different way. If hitting something with a hammer ten times doesn't fix it hitting it an eleventh or twelfth time won't fix it either.



Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.