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Inherent Implants 'Noble' ZET400/ZET4000

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Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 01:39:00 - [1] So I fly Gallente ships and I thus armour tank. Always striving to achieve the best possible result, I wanted to plug in either the Inherent Implants 'Noble' ZET400 or the ZET4000. I can't. Through the grapevine I heard that these implants don't drop anymore. They aren't available. Sold. Whatever. The question is: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Nex Angelus Caldari Hypherians	Posted - 2007.01.11 01:46:00 - [2] Hmm... They seem familiar somehow. When I get back online I'll check my hangars, and IF I find one I'll send you a mail.
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:34:00 - [3] Thank you for the effort, but we're talking about the ZET400/ZET4000, not one of the others. That is, the +3%/+5% armour repair increase hardwiring implants. As I said, word has it they don't drop from missions anymore, and haven't for ages. If you have one in your hangar and wanted to sell it, I probably couldn't afford it. Which is what this is about. There's nothing special about these two implants. They mirror the shield boost increase implants that one can use in the same slot. However, the ZET400/ZET4000 is not available, and the shield ones are. The question therefore remains: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Ather Ialeas Amarr Karjala Inc. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:36:00 - [4] Gallente may be the reason why it's not available, just imagine what such implants would do to your Command Ships. That or capitals of course...
Chronus26 Gallente Vale Heavy Industries SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:38:00 - [5] Originally by: Ather Ialeas Gallente may be the reason why it's not available, just imagine what such implants would do to your Command Ships. That or capitals of course... They more likeley than not, wont affect Capital reps. -----
Spenz Gallente FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:40:00 - [6] Kaldari ftw once again...
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:41:00 - [7] ZET4000's have never dropped yet, to the best of my knowledge. ZET400's have dropped, although they may not be dropping atm. If so, this is By DesignÖ, to create variations in the price of implants on the market. They will begin dropping again soon and later will stop again for a while. Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
Rab	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:50:00 - [8] I last got one in an LP deal from a Minmatar L2 agent 6-8 months ago, it was for 5,000 LP plus 5m isk for a complete set of Zet100-Zet500. Sold the zet400 for 100 mil in Jita about 2 months later. In the last month or two I have seen 3 for sale in Jita, all for about 170-180 mil. and all sold soon after according to the market history. Seems it may still drop somewhere, but is incredibly rare, haven't seen any hardwiring set from an LP deal in at least 6 months though. The ones selling recently may just be old ones from when the deals existed. - In an infinite universe, everything is definite. -
Nex Angelus Caldari Hypherians	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:56:00 - [9] Ok, seems to be rare stuff these things. Checked my implants inventory, and I had all the others but not the zet400... Sorry I couldn't help
Baleorg Gallente Guys of Sarcasm	Posted - 2007.01.11 10:58:00 - [10] Edited by: Baleorg on 11/01/2007 10:54:31 ÷hhh. youre telling me those are rare? yesterday i found one (dropped as usual... :-P ) and plugged in an "+3 armor repair duration thingy" so for how much can i sell the next one i find? :-P BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:03:00 - [11] The idea that CCP manually stops and starts implant drops to create price fluctuations sounds ludicrous to me, especially since the mission drop system introduces variations in drop frequency all by itself, automagically. The idea that the ZET400 and ZET4000 are overpowered is laughable as well, especially since the Zainou 'Gnome' KYA1000/KYA2000, i.e. the +3%/+5% shield recharger rate implants, which basically does the same thing but for shields, are still available. The inapplicability to capital armour repair modules has been adequately explained already. So if the absence of the ZET400/ZET4000 is by design; what is that design? Or am I to conclude, which I admit I'm leaning towards, that the adsence of the ZET400/ZET4000 is because of some error on the part of CCP. An unfortunate circumstance created when deleting some missions perhaps? At any rate: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:06:00 - [12] Originally by: Baleorg Edited by: Baleorg on 11/01/2007 10:54:31 ÷hhh. youre telling me those are rare? yesterday i found one (dropped as usual... :-P ) and plugged in an "+3 armor repair duration thingy" so for how much can i sell the next one i find? :-P That would be the Inherent Implants 'Noble' ZET100. This is not the implant we're talking about. Thank you for trying though. -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:11:00 - [13] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane The idea that CCP manually stops and starts implant drops to create price fluctuations sounds ludicrous to me, especially since the mission drop system introduces variations in drop frequency all by itself, automagically. Ludicrous it may be, but it happens nonetheless. Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane So if the absence of the ZET400/ZET4000 is by design; what is that design? Or am I to conclude, which I admit I'm leaning towards, that the adsence of the ZET400/ZET4000 is because of some error on the part of CCP. An unfortunate circumstance created when deleting some missions perhaps? At any rate: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? When I say "by design", I do not necessarily suggest concious design. It is certainly due to dev interference though. Some may say that the loot tables get bugged every patch... they may be right. Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:21:00 - [14] anyone seen an ay-2 lately? i need a new one since ever since i rammed my trade-probe into the evil smartbomb camp in amamake =( - alas, no luck thus far
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:24:00 - [15] Originally by: Roemy Schneider anyone seen an ay-2 lately? i need a new one since ever since i rammed my trade-probe into the evil smartbomb camp in amamake =( - alas, no luck thus far Haven't seen an AY-2 in Empire in weeks either. Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
Mnengli Noiliffe	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:31:00 - [16] lots of good implants vanished since mission offers nerf, when stuped people whined about how hardwiring offers were "useless". Some were returned though, but not all. luckily I still have 3% armore rep and 5% to agility and speed in some of my clones, but it seems to be a unique stuff now, no replacement after pod loss.
Greavus Minmatar House of Tempers	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:38:00 - [17] OP - A corp mate picked up the 3% armor rep implant last night in a lvl3 extravaganza, i did a price check for him in heimatar region and they came in at about 5m a piece, plenty were up for sale. Might be worth flying over and havin a look yourself. Greavus
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.11 11:41:00 - [18] Originally by: Greavus OP - A corp mate picked up the 3% armor rep implant last night in a lvl3 extravaganza, i did a price check for him in heimatar region and they came in at about 5m a piece, plenty were up for sale. Might be worth flying over and havin a look yourself. Greavus There are no ZET400's in Heimatar. Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 12:37:00 - [19] Edited by: Bartholomeus Crane on 11/01/2007 12:45:04 To those who point me to the wrong hardwire implants, please refrain from doing so. It's the ZET400/ZET4000 I'm after. I've either checked Empire space myself or had companions do it for me. There are none for sale. Repeat: none for sale. So please stop harassing me with tales of the ZET100. It gets tiring after a while. I suspect the poster some posts above is right. Some implants, like the ZET400/ZET4000, and apparently the AY-2, have been fallen by the wayside when the loot tables of missions were changed (some would say borked) some time ago. In a way, this is the reason I'm making this effort. We have an update coming up. Perhaps CCP is willing to rectify some of their decisions in this respect. You know, do something silly as making sure that all implants drop or something. Some (official) news about the issue would be useful as well. Like if this is truly by design or not, and if so, what that design can possibly be. -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 12:47:00 - [20] Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Edited by: Tommy TenKreds on 11/01/2007 11:09:36 Edited by: Tommy TenKreds on 11/01/2007 11:08:34 Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane The idea that CCP manually stops and starts implant drops to create price fluctuations sounds ludicrous to me, especially since the mission drop system introduces variations in drop frequency all by itself, automagically. Ludicrous it may be, but it happens nonetheless. You have absolutely no prove for that statement what-so-ever now do you? I also can not help but notice that you've severely edited your original post so it collaborates with your later reply. Pretty fatuous, I must say. Unfortunately for you, it doesn't make you statements any less incongruous. -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.11 12:54:00 - [21] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane The idea that CCP manually stops and starts implant drops to create price fluctuations sounds ludicrous to me, especially since the mission drop system introduces variations in drop frequency all by itself, automagically. Ludicrous it may be, but it happens nonetheless. You have absolutely no prove for that statement what-so-ever now do you? Have no proof that drop rates vary? The proof is the shortage of hardwires in Empire. Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane I also can not help but notice that you've severely edited your original post so it collaborates with your later reply. Pretty fatuous, I must say. Unfortunately for you, it doesn't make you statements any less incongruous. Heh. You're behaving a little belligerently, given that my comments were intended to be helpful. I edited my first post, once for a spelling error and once more to clarify a point I was making regarding the "by design" observation. I realised that my first wording did not allow for developer error as part of the said design process. It does now, but the gist is still the same. The lack of hardwires is strictly due to developer changes to drop rates (be they actual loot drops or mission offer loot drops, for clarity ). Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
guyutte	Posted - 2007.01.11 13:46:00 - [22] Nex Angelus do you have the +5 armor hit points increase implant?
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.01.11 14:39:00 - [23] I got me a slaveset "immediately" when pirate implants were introduced. Since then I have been looking for a zet4000. I'm pretty sure that this implant does not exist. It doesn't drop and have never dropped either. Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Toaster Oven	Posted - 2007.01.11 15:22:00 - [24] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane The idea that the ZET400 and ZET4000 are overpowered is laughable as well, especially since the Zainou 'Gnome' KYA1000/KYA2000, i.e. the +3%/+5% shield recharger rate implants, which basically does the same thing but for shields, are still available. Um no, they aren't comparable at all. ZET400 is comparable to a low-grade Crystal Gamma. I have never seen a ZET4000 apart from on Sisi. Anyhow the ZET400/4000 don't really fit in with current armor tanking implants generally supporting HP boost + repair time reduction. Whereas shield tanking implants favor repair amount bonus + passive recharge increase. So I wouldn't be too surprised if the drop rates never get bumped up dramatically. It's a good thing I have a few of them stockpiled in my hangar (no they aren't for sale)
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 16:48:00 - [25] Great, thread moved to the ships and modules forum ... why? Anyone's guess. I mean, it could have understood the skill forum (where other implants are discussed) or the missions forum (where these implants are dropped), but I'm truly at a loss as to what exactly ships and modules have anything to do with this? Good way to bury the issue though ... At any rate, in reply to Toaster Oven (great name BTW). General rumour in the forums has it that the ZET4000 was indeed never dropped at all. I've searched back to 2003 and found only WTBs and never WTSs. Not absolute truth, but in absence of a CCP statement the best we can do. The statement that the ZET400 (at least) is incomparable with the KYA1000 I have to disagree with to a certain extent. For this we have to compare the Zainou 'Gnome' series hardwire implants to the Inherent Implants 'Noble' series hardwire implants. If you do you'll see that the Gnomes decrease powergrid for shield upgrade modules, increase shield capacity, reduce shield transfer capacitor use, increase shield recharge rate, and decrease turret CPU need. The shield capacity increase is comparable to the ZET500's armour HP increase. The shield transfer capacitor use reduction with the ZET200's reduction in remote armour repairer capacitor use. For the decrease in powergrid for upgrade modules the ZET300 provides an increase in hull HP, a poor trade I think most of you would agree. Which leaves use with a turret CPU reduction which indeed is incomparable to anything provided by the ZET series, and the shield recharge rate increase of the KYA1000. One might argue that the KYA1000 is comparable with the ZET100's reduction of repair duration. But the problem is, obviously, that this reduction is paid for by an increase in CAP use, where this is not the case with the KYA1000. It should be clear that the KYA1000 is a much better implant for those inclined to shield tank than the ZET100 is for those who armour tank. Rather the ZET400, with its increase in armour repair amount would be a better match. Ofcourse, shield capacity recharge rate is not the same as armour repair amount, but armour unfortunately doesn't repair itself automagically. Need I remind everyone that to get the benefit of this implant as well, one needs to use a armour repairer first, thus expending CAP again. In summary (because the above maybe quite long): If you're an armour tanker your main interest in hardwire implants might be the Inherent Implant 'Noble' series. In comparison to the shield tankers favourite, the Sainou 'Gnome' series, the 'Noble' series compares unfavourably already. Removing the comparable ZET200 and the ZET500, the 'Noble'-series trade an increase in hull HP to a fitting advantage to shield upgrades (a poor trade in my view), while they have to expend CAP by using a module to benefit from the tanking increase of the ZET100 and ZET400 whereas the 'Gnome'-series gain a free (from CAP) shield tanking benefit and a turret CPU fitting advantage. Without the ZET400 (or the ZET4000) however, the balance between these two implant series is completely skewed towards the Sainou 'Gnome' series. Without the ZET400 (or the ZET4000), looking only at hardwire implants, EVE favours shield tanking over armour tanking. There is no logical reason for CCP to have halted the ZET400 (or the ZET4000) from dropping As such I postulate that the lack of ZET400/ZET4000's is a mistake (probably made during one of the mission nerf episodes). But feel free to disagree ... One question remains: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Leandro Salazar Aeon Industries Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2007.01.11 16:55:00 - [26] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 11/01/2007 16:53:31 Pretty sure it is due to another agent offer table fkup. They did exist in small but reliable quantities until the big offer screwup last spring/summer. (Inadvertently) removing pretty much everything except for the attribute implants was a really brilliant move of CCP Offer DB needs fixing almost as badly as logoffski and Khanid ships. So I expect to see one... not any time soon --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
Bartholomeus Crane Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.01.11 17:18:00 - [27] Dear Tommy TenKreds. In your first and original post you alluded that CCP consciously and purposefully stopped and started mission drops (of implants in this case) with the sole reason of influencing market prices for such items. As a summary you applauded this by stating that this was how you earned your isk in EVE. After summarily calling that allusion ludicrous, you backtracked and sidetracked both at the same time, particularly by editing your original message. Now we are meant to believe that 'by design' can mean 'per accident' as well. Congratulation, you just redefined a word. As proof for your untenable position your provide the fact that there are none of the items under discussion available, showing your aptitude for pepitio principii as well. It is clear that no logical fallacy is a stranger to you. One can only shudder at the attempt at design you apparently undertake, especially where these attempts include concious and purposeful errors as part of the process. I just hope you're not an architect. At any rate, having run out of tin foil hats and patience, I wish you luck on your dictionary rewrite in the sincere hope that this thread may be refrained from your further endeavours. -- Drone users unite! Support drone whinage
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2007.01.20 19:44:00 - [28] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane Dear Tommy TenKreds. In your first and original post you alluded that CCP consciously and purposefully stopped and started mission drops (of implants in this case) with the sole reason of influencing market prices for such items. As a summary you applauded this by stating that this was how you earned your isk in EVE. After summarily calling that allusion ludicrous, you backtracked and sidetracked both at the same time, particularly by editing your original message. Now we are meant to believe that 'by design' can mean 'per accident' as well. Congratulation, you just redefined a word. As proof for your untenable position your provide the fact that there are none of the items under discussion available, showing your aptitude for pepitio principii as well. It is clear that no logical fallacy is a stranger to you. One can only shudder at the attempt at design you apparently undertake, especially where these attempts include concious and purposeful errors as part of the process. I just hope you're not an architect. At any rate, having run out of tin foil hats and patience, I wish you luck on your dictionary rewrite in the sincere hope that this thread may be refrained from your further endeavours. sigh You clearly fail to understand the use of "Ö" as an indicator of irony. Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk Is there anything other than ISK you might be interested in?
OrangeAfroMan Minmatar Suffoco Noctis Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2007.01.20 22:48:00 - [29] Edited by: OrangeAfroMan on 20/01/2007 22:46:33 Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane In summary (because the above maybe quite long): If you're an armour tanker your main interest in hardwire implants might be the Inherent Implant 'Noble' series. In comparison to the shield tankers favourite, the Sainou 'Gnome' series, the 'Noble' series compares unfavourably already. Removing the comparable ZET200 and the ZET500, the 'Noble'-series trade an increase in hull HP to a fitting advantage to shield upgrades (a poor trade in my view), while they have to expend CAP by using a module to benefit from the tanking increase of the ZET100 and ZET400 whereas the 'Gnome'-series gain a free (from CAP) shield tanking benefit and a turret CPU fitting advantage. Without the ZET400 (or the ZET4000) however, the balance between these two implant series is completely skewed towards the Sainou 'Gnome' series. Without the ZET400 (or the ZET4000), looking only at hardwire implants, EVE favours shield tanking over armour tanking. There is no logical reason for CCP to have halted the ZET400 (or the ZET4000) from dropping As such I postulate that the lack of ZET400/ZET4000's is a mistake (probably made during one of the mission nerf episodes). But feel free to disagree ... One question remains: is this ever going to change? And if not, why not? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Implants, with the exception of Pirate implants, play a very small role in PvP. The truth of the matter is that EvE currently favors Armor tanking in most PvP situations (Mid slots open, high base EM resist, most PvP ships tend to be lowslot heavy, etc). The fact that the ZET400 is essentially non-existent is hardly a reason to make such a big deal. -And the day that EvE starts getting balanced around PvE is the day I cancel all accounts. Nos - Time for a Change
ookke	Posted - 2007.01.20 23:00:00 - [30] CY-2 seem to have the same fate, haven't seen them a lot recently either on market.

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