What happens to moons in lowsec and NPC null then?

Why do you want one of the few remaining conflict drivers removed?

An excellent question.

If moongoo production was tied to Sov, then it would limit the conflict drivers by making it easier for a large blobbing empire to capture a single system rather than grind through the POSes mining. Plus, more critically: what happens to NPC null and Low Sec? You would have to set up a separate mechanic to deal with Sov null versus all others - and that is not efficient.

Why remove high value moon goo from NPC null or Low Sec? If you are going to remove any part you may as well remove all of it. The current set up is best as far as keeping the mining separate from system ownership. If you tie moon mining to system ownership, then you auto-magically make the bigger richer.

Edit to add: now, perhaps you are the owner of a small Null Sec system, I can understand your frustration if you have PL or CFC or whomever the big bully is with a POS on the only R64 moon in your sov system. Guess what, nothing prevents you from removing that POS except for your fear of their retaliation. Here is a suggestion: keep your ear to the ground, get some friends to help you, and when that big nasty is occupied somewhere else, hit them below the belt and take that moon for yourself.

But you see the real problem with tying moon goo production to system ownership is that it will perpetuate and further fuel the renter empires.

It would make sense because the larger alliances who rely on Supercaps to take moongoo for their alliance doesnt live in space, as it is right now an alliance moves into a region where there are no other large entities and take all the moons, without anyone living there being able to defend against it.

By having sov as a requirement to be able to live in the space you force people to take sov there, and live in it, otherwise they'll be harassed constantly by smaller entities either looking for a fight or a system.

Kind of like the current system works with sov.

Being able to drop a huge supercap blob on a pos doesnt show that you live in the space, only that you have a stupid amount of older players with nothing better to do, rather that isk goes to the corp/alliance holding the system.

So what happens to moons in lowsec and NPC null?

And who says the larger alliances don't use their space? Have you actually looked at sov indexes before?

Of course nothing to stop anyone from simply denying an owner a certain spot by constantly kicking th POS off.

I've always liked this approach best - you own nothing, really, until the resource is yours and your flag is firmly planted. In the case of Moon Goo, that is the bubble of a POS dancing in starlight.

But a coalition that only has supercaps holding all the moons in a region is fine because no one can fight them, while they dont have any sov themself, does that seem fine?

Anyone with enough supercaps that they dont have to worry about sov, but only take the moons

What happens to moons in lowsec and NPC null then?

Why do you want one of the few remaining conflict drivers removed?

I think the second option (though more difficult for everyone) lends to much more interesting player to player interactions. So many choices for the grunt who finds a deposit. It would make lifelong friends and enemies at every turn of a deposit. Monopoly would be exchanged for depth and interesting game interactions.

But why would anyone risk a fleet for a moon that has a high chance of not paying for their losses even if they win?

And what do you think it'd do to the T2 market?

moon goo shouldn't be tied to sov, moons should simply deplete over time, and take a month or so to refill. Having to constantly search for new moons would be a conflict driver.

Unless moon scanning changes, this would be awful.

Plus moving these days is a *nightmare* ... forced regular relocation would be hell on earth for everyone.

Which, nowadays, is nobody.

Unless moon scanning changes, this would be awful.

Plus moving these days is a *nightmare* ... forced regular relocation would be hell on earth for everyone.

While i do see your point, serependity, i still dont like it, the systems of eve might has as many as a hundred moons, even if you're a small alliance holding a few systems thats still a huge-ass amount of moons.

I think you're totally missing the point of depletable and non static moon goo.

It would no longer be meant to be controlled by one group so you wouldn't have to keep moving to control it all, if it spawned in the system / area where you hold sov then you mine it. Scanning all of eve to control all of the goo would truly suck making it unreasonable for a large group to control it. It would go to locals who can handle scanning their local moons.

You're looking at it from the current mega coaltion 'controlling it all' perspective. The point is to make the monopolies impractical but be a boon for local sov holders active in their systems.

It would only be awful for the current controllers of the goo. I'm trying to recall a saying.... 'we're not trying to ruin moon goo, we're trying to ruin YOUR moon goo' Something like that

No, I'm looking at it as a local ready to cut myself when the goo cycle changes AGAIN and I need to see what is coming out for the reactions AGAIN then adjust them AGAIN.

Dear it'd be awful.

By awful I think you mean not passive.

I could see where the more rare a goo is - the more often it depletes. The more common - the less it depletes. Common stuff could be found everywhere and in abundance.

And yeah, it's starting to sink in - you won't be able to set up your production chain based on 'owning' an R64 moon. You may have control of one in your back yard for 8 months or so, but then you'd have to swap if you wanted to keep producing. If R64 were on an 8 month cycle, r32 on 12 and so on it would be fine. If you're complaint is "I'll have to change everything every 8 months" then sorry, but I'm not feeling a lot of emotion for you. (4 times every 3 years - that's a pretty weak complaint)

It would seperate out the gathereing/processing of moon materials from the production of finished products. You'll have to interact w/ other players to get from moon stuff to T2 stuff.

My favorite proposals for moon goo are as follows:

1. Active mining of moons by player ships. The total amount of moon goo possible from a moon would stay the same as it currently is in game, but players would have to get out in space to get it. Each moon regenerates like an ice belt.

Players can mine a moon from anywhere in its orbit - so players who take the time to burn mining spots off the moon beacon get a measure of increased safety. In the alternative, the moon could be more like a gas cloud, where there are multiple nodes which can be mined at. They are all visible, but not necessarily warpable, by warping to the moon beacon

The moon mining module acts as a one-minute Bastion type module - the ship is stuck in space for a minimum of one minute if it wants to moon mine. Any ship can fit the moon mining module, but mining frigates, mining barges, exhumers, the Orca, and the Rorqual all get bonuses to mining amount. The bigger the ship, the larger the bonus.

- Pros
Ships out in space doing things
Decentralized moon goo
Benefits individual players rather than simply being alliance income
Opens up real ninja moon mining operations - way better than siphons

- Cons
Not very engaging game play, but no worse than current mining

2. Moon mining becomes another form of PI. People can establish moon mining colonies on the moons. They collect their goo either through launching it into orbit or from a POCO.

Enable orbital bombardment so that people can destroy moon mining facilities on the moons.

- Pros
Decentralized moon goo
Benefits individual players rather than simply being alliance income
Players can optimize moon goo extraction operations
Ships would be in space at POCO's, rather than inside POS shields, and therefore more vulnerable than currently
Like POS's POCO's can still be attacked, reinforced, defended, etc.
Opens up ninja Moon Interaction operations (establish your mining colony on the moon, launch it into orbit rather than using the POCO)

- Cons
PI is not the most interesting game play, but it is arguably less troublesome than mining.

Someone hasn't scanned moons in bulk.