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Why does most everyone dislike destroyers?

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RoaK Varr	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:01:00 - [1] Are they really that bad a ship? Could it be they are in the gray zone between frigate and cruiser? IÆm thinking of playing one just for the challenge.
Yarek Balear The Initiative	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:04:00 - [2] Most people dislike them because EVE focuses so much attention on tanking these days and Destroyers are paper thin. They can be extremely effective anti-frig support vessels in fleets though (particularly the Thrasher I believe)...
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:06:00 - [3] Originally by: RoaK Varr Are they really that bad a ship? Could it be they are in the gray zone between frigate and cruiser? IÆm thinking of playing one just for the challenge. Mostly because they are a set of skills that do not give a path to a higher level ship. You don't need DD to fly a cruiser, BC, BS, etc. Are they bad ships? No. They are great for burning through level 1s and carefully through level 2s. They are fragile (less so since Revelations gave them a 67% HP boost) but take good skills to fit full weapon lists. They also have zilch for tanks, you WILL take damage. But they are great for their intended purpose, which is riping through frigates Their new "niche" is as a dedicated salvaging ship. Nothing works as well as a DD as a salvager, they very high prices you are seeing for them are directly related to how well they do this job. Basically, if you are runnign level 1s and are interested, buy one. You will use it later for salvaging and looting because your ships for level 2-4 missions are too slow and take too long to loot/salvage with. <-----------> MMORPG == Massively Moronic Online Raw Powergaming Grief fests.... LowSec != NoSec
Privan Kharolis Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:37:00 - [4] Another problem is many people jump into them too early to fly them effectively. To be effective in, short of medium guns, need the skills to effectively fly a Battlecruiser. High skills in bonuses to hitpoints and anything to help what tank you can fit. Likewise a Gallente or Amarr destroyer needs great capacitor management skills. So if you try and fly a Destroyer as a upgrade from a Frigate then you're going to suck and hate the thing. Also you can grab a Tier 2 cruiser and fit it for only an extra million or so over a Destroyer.
Daos Leghki Paxton Industries	Posted - 2007.01.22 06:50:00 - [5] When someone asks me about Destroyers, 99% of the time, it's a newbie looking to move up from their Frig. These ships do very poorly as a "stepping stone" ship because they require many skills to fly them effectively. Also, they tend to be mostly for PVP. That said, if you're using them for frig popping, they are great. But, most of the time, people aren't looking for frig popping, but for an intermediate between Frigate and Cruiser.
Nhoj Sllew Amarr Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:36:00 - [6] they're awesome for stealing killmails
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.01.22 07:41:00 - [7] Originally by: Nhoj Sllew they're awesome for stealing killmails even intercepter pilots moan about not getting on podmails.
Laboratus Gallente BGG	Posted - 2007.01.22 08:17:00 - [8] They are awesome for popping frigates, but anything else frigates do better... ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats
Sanzorz Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:15:00 - [9] Destroyers aren't bad for level 1 missions or some certain level 2. I moved up to Destroyer from frigate, because they have alot more firepower. Basicly I got my Coercer and bought beam lasers for sniping. It worked very well. 8 sniping guns also allowed me to take on 0.4 rats like cruisers quite early. Destroyers are also needed to train for Interdictors afaik. The only thing that prevents me from using pulse lasers on Destroyers is due to their sig radius. --- Currently flying a PvE geared Crusader and Prophecy
goodby4u Logistic Technologies Incorporated Free Trade Coalition	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:41:00 - [10] Mainly because this ships are made for uber gankage to frigs but have trouble with bigger stuff because its tank is weak. Generally i dont fly them,but i do sometimes and i cant complain,its lovely when you can nearly alpha strike a frigate(bar AFs)from 50km+flying a ship that costs 1mil __________________________________________ Yes it is great being amarr.
Andreya	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:46:00 - [11] The cormorant and thrasher are great ships to have, especially in fleet battles. a cormorant can shoot 90km with amazing tracking, 7 150mms 2 sensor boosters, 2 tracking computers MAPC these cormorants can instalock most ships, they smash through intys regardless of their speed (90km away) and great for podding people... also usefull for shooting drones off your teamates Thrasher,similar setup, but fit the 280s, even if you have to fit MAPCs. but fit gyros in the lows when you can this shoots 50km or so, but does a alpha strike of 1000 damage or so, this will instalock and insta pop a shuttle and its pod. also blows away intys, two volleys can take out alot of intys both amazing ships, and even better to have in a fleet. destroyer gangs are fun, i had 5 destroyers jump brutix and kick its a$$, just remember cormorants and thrashers have enough mid slots to fit tracking disruptors and dampners... fit with autocannons or hybrids with nos, and kill the targets drones first. then the target
Sokratesz Guardians of Hell's Gate Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:46:00 - [12] Do a DPS calcualtion on the average interceptor / assault frig, repeat on destroyers and interdictors. See? that's why people fly them Basilisk Fitting Link
Talen Kross Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.01.22 09:54:00 - [13] What?! Loads of people love destroyers. Mr. Crow, meet my associate Mr. (domination-enhanced-tracking) Thrasher. Expensive? Yes, but not as expensive as a pimped crow, and a snake set.
Forando Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.01.22 11:04:00 - [14] I loved flying Destroyers as a new player. Sure it was exiting to upgrade ship from a frigate, new gear and more guns! It does allow you to try out new things as a new player and daze through level 1 missions to the point where it actually gets boring. What it lacks in of player interaction in level 1 missions, will be handed to you in level 2 missions; Get ready to manage your cap, have a finger in the repper and.. That said, the destroyer class has some important things against it. Although you have loads of high slots you can fit for damage, the damage you can do is not that big compared to target you are in a destroyer. In other words, your signature radius is HUGE compared to the damage you can do and it will be tricky evade damage. It has low armor and limited capacitor, so if you're using energy or hybrid weapons you.. well, just try to avoid being blood-beamed by vampire since you'll be dry in no time. In a one vs. one, it will require some fine skill and you'll most likely have to outsmart your opponent if you want to come out on top - The destroyer is no 'I-WIN' button! - but in smaller gangs, it can be a nice asset, particular if you have someone to watch over you with logistic drones or remote reppers. Destroyers are nice to put on drone/frigate duty. And don't forget it's tech II version, the interdictor, which can blow bubbles as a bonus - Everybody just love bubbles! But if you seek a cheap ship to for some one vs. one PvP, I'd go with a tech 1 frigate with some ok mid/low slot layout over the destoyer, and if you have money in your pocket you could be better off with cruisers. Enjoy, and fly safe!
RuleoftheBone Minmatar UK Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.01.22 11:47:00 - [15] Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 22/01/2007 11:45:08 Thrasher gang tackler/frig buster fun: 7x200mm AC (emp s/fusion s) 1xsml nos MWD 7.5km scram Web Nano (ducks behind flame suit) Gyrostab Fast with a nice damage output. If you get targeted by something heavy you are dead pretty quickly...but as long as you get in under the targets guns rippity rip
Mar vel Caldari H.Y.D.R.A. GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:04:00 - [16] Um,, b/c they have they have no sig radius bonus to protect them. Destroyers die almost instantly to everything @ cruiser level and above, and everyone knows it. Want to increase the use and effectiveness of a Destoryer: Drop the sig radius to somewhere between that of an Inty and an AF, and give them a solid tank. Now they become incredibly useful. Otherwise - they're the kind of ship that your gang/fleet would show up with two dozen of and expect to fly home with 2.
Benco97 Gallente Multiverse Corporation	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:13:00 - [17] I don't know where this "Destroyers automagically die against cruisers" mentality is coming from, a destroyer CAN kill a cruiser you just have to be careful, it wouldn't exactly be fair for the price if Dessies could own cruisers. They are not a stepping stone from frigs to cruisers though, so I guess they get bad reputation from the newbies jumping in them.. I love mine, it's fun and exciting to fly, i've never seen the fun in sitting there with a tank so thick your enemies just get bored and go home. "MY GOD KEEP THIS AWAY FROM BENCO97!!!!!" - Constantine Arcanum
Christopher Dalran	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:15:00 - [18] Edited by: Christopher Dalran on 22/01/2007 19:11:46 Use it in a gang and stick near someone with a medium remote repper and all your tanking problems bite the dust, just treat yourself as a mobile 8 small turrent platform assigned to the person with the remote repper and focus on resist(no repper) and simply protect from frigates/drones.
Harotak Legion of Lost Souls Ivy League	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:15:00 - [19] They are alot of fun and can be effective in groups. I wish CCP would move a couple highslots down to mid/low and ditch the rate of fire penalty though. Would make it easier to fit a plate/extender and a hardner for a bit of a tank without losing any dps, only alphastrike.
Deva Blackfire Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:20:00 - [20] Originally by: Benco97 I don't know where this "Destroyers automagically die against cruisers" mentality is coming from, a destroyer CAN kill a cruiser you just have to be careful, it wouldn't exactly be fair for the price if Dessies could own cruisers. Only if you are attacking mining/noob pilot cruiser. ANY pvp fit cruiser WILL kill destroyer. You have sig almost as large as cruiser, you are almost as slow as cruiser. His guns can track you no problem, and then... you deal less damage and have less armor/resists than average mr cruiser. Also - try attacking NPCing caracal with t1 heavy missiles in dessy. 3 salvos and bye bye - not sure if you will even get to half of his shields...
Nicholai Thomasovich Caldari Acerbus Vindictum	Posted - 2007.01.22 19:40:00 - [21] As mentioned before, the lack of real firepower, lack of any tank, lack of speed, and terrible sig radius really kill the destroyers. Handy for Level Is and Salvaging, and that's about it. Pretty much anything a destroyer can do, a frigate can do better.
Lidana	Posted - 2007.01.22 20:18:00 - [22] Edited by: Lidana on 22/01/2007 20:15:27 As a note, one of the devs mentioned in a thread reasonably recently that destroyers were meant to have a signiture radius nearer that of a frigate than a cruiser. So you never know in Revelations 1.Soon you might even get a change
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.22 20:25:00 - [23] Destroyers are pretty niche. Big enough to die to anything with real firepower, small enough to not do a particularly impressive amount of damage. It's not that they're _bad_ exactly, it's just if you're flying one, you'd probably be better off in another ship, either a cruiser or a frigate.
Havok Pierce Gallente	Posted - 2007.01.23 09:38:00 - [24] Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby Their new "niche" is as a dedicated salvaging ship. Nothing works as well as a DD as a salvager, they very high prices you are seeing for them are directly related to how well they do this job. Destroyers are nice for salvaging (if only because you can stack so many salvagers on it), but they lack cargo capacity, which becomes more important when 0.0 salvaging. Enter the Exequeror. Salvaging has given this ugly workhorse a new lease on life, with its (with cruiser 4) stock 840m3 cargo space, which is easily bumped to 1Km3! Start with your preference of salvagers to tractor beams (2/2 works well for me) Follow it up with a minor shieldtank (2 large shield extenders + 1 resist) and a 10MN MWD, and your choice of lowslots (I prefer 1 nano/Istab, 1 expanded cargohold, 1 damage control). Accelerates decently, 5k+ shield HP means it'll take a few hits before you need to warp out. The spacious cargobays also mean that you'll be able to go longer when salvaging (especially when snagging 0.0 battleship cans, which are usually chock full of stuff). With a destroyer, you'd best have a secure can very close at hand (such as the same belt), whereas the exe will be able to salvage through 5-10 battleship wrecks w/o issue. With MWDing to each wreck and salvaging 4, I can usually get the wreck salvaged before I leave range. I then touch the MWDs to give myself a boost to the next wreck. Honestly, try this ship out if you can for salvaging instead of the common destroyer.
Havok Pierce Gallente	Posted - 2007.01.23 09:39:00 - [25] Originally by: James Lyrus Destroyers are pretty niche. Big enough to die to anything with real firepower, small enough to not do a particularly impressive amount of damage. It's not that they're _bad_ exactly, it's just if you're flying one, you'd probably be better off in another ship, either a cruiser or a frigate. T2-fitted Thrashers deal some sick damage, btw. I was on the recieving end of one of those x.x
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.01.23 18:24:00 - [26] It's long range and superb tracking (it has both an inherent range bonus AND a tracking bonus, neat) means that the destroyer is an excellent weapon against frigates, drones and pods. I've seen corps use it (with excellent effect) as a support vessel for cruisers and battleships (the Trasher seems to be the most common destroyer in this role due to it's large alpha and good number of mids). However destroyers are not all that useful for mission-running and ratting. Good for level 1s, but the only mission where they really outpreform regular frigates is Worlds Collide. Just: a. Try to draw as little attention as possible. b. Keep it aligned and ready to warp off.
Freyda Gallente Ships of fools	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:09:00 - [27] The best destoryer pilot I ever saw, used to jump in 5-10 seconds after his gang mates at 70 km. With T2 rails and high skills he sniped the heck out of the enemy inties and af's. It worked well time and time again. As a frigate sniper it is a truelly awesome platform. But that's about the only decent pvp use I have seen for one. You need really good skills to use it as that too, as well as gang mates that understand how to fit you into their tactics. Sadly few gangs think outside the box, so if it can't gank and tank they never really bother with them.
Shandling Minmatar Disband Phoenix Supremacy	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:27:00 - [28] The ability to fly an Interdictor will make you incredibly useful to 0.0 Alliances. If you can fly a Dictor and not do much else, they'll still love you, and a good Alliance will provided you with what you need for free/very low cost for their operations.
Galen Silas Gallente Mean Corp	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:02:00 - [29] Edited by: Galen Silas on 24/01/2007 16:00:04 Dessy's are very ncie ships, I will admot there more effective in a bigger gang, Dessy's mized with tackling frigs is nice. For instance my gang consisted of 3x Thrashers 2x Catalysts 1x cormorant, merlin, rifter we locked a deimos down at a stargate we camped waiting... we went through him as if he had nothing for a tank at all, he didnt have time to get even one rep off there was so much dps on him. In order for destroyers to be useful theyd o need to be setup right, there better when they have tacklers with them so they can use there mid slots for something other than webby jammer, for instance a good midslot combo for the catalyst is a 1mn AB and Tracking Distruptor II. While your highs are loaded with light neutron II's put a tank in your lows or all damage mods. There is a wide range of possibilities but even against a cruiser or two, an experienced Dessy squad can ruin them. Dessies aren't dead, most people are just to familiar to one style of fighting, that they instantly assume a destroyer is qualified for it, when they are a specialized boat, usually for fleets.
Ominus Decre The Older Gamers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:18:00 - [30] I have been playing about 13-14 months now and the Coercer is my primary ship. The Coercer can easily solo 3/10 complexes, ratting in a 0.1 system and lvl 2 missions. With great care you can also solo in 4/10 plexes. In 0.0 you'll struggle to find a comparable tank which matches a respectable damage output to break the tank on RAT bs's. PaPer thin? Is 3600 armor paper thin? I don't use that set up for PvE although it's easily otainable for anti-frig warfare in fleet ops. My preference is something like: 7 Medium Pulse II's (scorch) / 1 nos AB II 400mm rolled plate / small armor rep II Destroyers require good skills to allow their worth to fully materialize. The riggings give them an incredible upper hand although due to the cost of a rig it is next to stupid to put something like it on anything cheaper then 100m chasis. 400dps is easy to obtain in a Coercer with the appropriate skills and fittings. :) PvP, ditch the AB and fit a web to the Coercer. The Coercer is primarily a support ship and not a lone-gun. (too bad EON hasn't had any decent write up's on ship types - hopefully someone who's compotent will pick up where the last idiot failed) Perversion:
Don K untaught Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.01.25 23:10:00 - [31] I fly a frlycatcher my self. And dam I love that shib(Interdictor). But yeah, I did not like the t1 destroyer.
Phish1 Liberty Forces Ratel Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.25 23:25:00 - [32] thrasher 4TW!!!!! as a pilot that flys primerily frigs and destroyers (T1 and T2) they are sexable. im used to popping fast, so destroyers arent a worry, they have enough HP for me to kill an inty most of the time without goung boom before the inty leaves or pops, and in a gate camp you WILL kick serious frig butt.
mallina Caldari Infinitus Odium Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.26 01:05:00 - [33] Edited by: mallina on 26/01/2007 01:01:43 t2 fit 8x DLB Coercer has plenty of firepower and tracking at decent range. in gangs, it WILL make short work of the frigs and inflict heavy damage upon cruisers, but out of gangs it dosent do much except, well, die
Father Weebles Repo Industries	Posted - 2007.01.26 02:45:00 - [34] thrasher ftw "Welcome to EVE, where inflation is out of control."
Szprinkoth Sponsz ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.26 03:57:00 - [35] Originally by: Sienis Edited by: Sienis on 24/01/2007 16:39:15 its a great support ship, not to forget its TII version. i wished ISS' kb was public, then i could show u some mails from a guy who ganked loads of ships in his sabre during the iss/iac war. You mean CHONGUS? Yep, it was a Sabre. I remember after one fleet engagement between IAC and ISS on a gate a few jumps from ZIXC-7 we retreated a few jumps only to drop in on a CHONGUS camp. I think he killed a few pods and ships before we managed to get away... and this was a sizable fleet
Viktor Fyretracker Caldari Worms Corp	Posted - 2007.01.26 04:10:00 - [36] Destroyers are cool but they still need a little bit of love. sadly that love wont come thanks to the disaster that is AFs. see if destroyers get the needed love they would be better then an AF and the AF lobby is stronger then the destroyer lobby.
Foulis Minmatar Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.01.26 04:53:00 - [37] Originally by: Sienis Edited by: Sienis on 24/01/2007 16:39:15 poor dmg output? Thrasher: 7x 280mm arties 2x tracking comp, 1x sb 2x gyros (not 100% sure on the setup at the moment) its a great support ship, not to forget its TII version. i wished ISS' kb was public, then i could show u some mails from a guy who ganked loads of ships in his sabre during the iss/iac war. its a great ship, but u have to know how to use it. most people prolly lack that knowledge... edit: not sure if it was a sabre... maybe caldari interdictor? not important anyways.. Essentially my thrasher setup, but I like to use dual web instead of dual tracking comp (works better for 15km and less, which is where alot of inties go when you solo). ---- Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari NO WORDS IN THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE ARE SPELLED WITH THE NUMBER "8" IN THEM GODDAMNIT!
mematar The Raven Warriors	Posted - 2007.01.26 07:46:00 - [38] Originally by: Foulis Originally by: Sienis Edited by: Sienis on 24/01/2007 16:39:15 poor dmg output? Thrasher: 7x 280mm arties 2x tracking comp, 1x sb 2x gyros (not 100% sure on the setup at the moment) its a great support ship, not to forget its TII version. i wished ISS' kb was public, then i could show u some mails from a guy who ganked loads of ships in his sabre during the iss/iac war. its a great ship, but u have to know how to use it. most people prolly lack that knowledge... edit: not sure if it was a sabre... maybe caldari interdictor? not important anyways.. Essentially my thrasher setup, but I like to use dual web instead of dual tracking comp (works better for 15km and less, which is where alot of inties go when you solo). QFT! Same setup I use too, except I have MAPC instead of other Gyro II because of only AWU lvl 3, and I prefer to use 2 webs and tracking computer instead of 2 tracking computers too. This thing will shred ceptors apart!
Deacon Hasp Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.01.26 09:23:00 - [39] /me hugs his thrasher. 6x 280 T2, 1x250 T2 (awu4 ftl ) 2x SB T2, 1x TC T2 2x gyro T2 cepter pilots will cry about your lock speed
Mezitt	Posted - 2007.01.31 19:09:00 - [40] I just started playing EVE two weeks ago, and I need some help. I have an Amarr Coercer. I finally started Level 2 missions. (It took me forever to get to this step, I think because the agent corp I latched into was Caldari, so my initial standing was low, but I'm not sure.) I've tried and tried, but I cannot seem to beat the boss mob of my second: a Dire Pithi Demolisher. I use a Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thurster, a Small Armor Repairer II, Tracking Enhancer I, Energived Adaptive Nane Membrane I, and a 400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I. My regular setup for high slots is 7 Dual Light Pulse Laser I with 7 Radio S crystals, and a Salavager I, but that leaves me with an optimal range very close to the NPC's. I haven't been successful trying to go toe-to-toe with him. I tried using a higher damaging crystal that requires moving in closer, but I take so much damage while trynig to get in range. I also tried switching to 280mm Prototype I Siege Cannons, of which I can only use five at a time, with the longest range standard ammo (carbon, I think). That setup works, in that I can kite him forever and not die, with my capacitor recharging quickly enough that my Small Armor Repairer II can keep up with his missile damage forever, but my howitzers aren't doing enough damage to keep pace with his regeneration. Is the problem my skills? I spent a lot of my training time on Learning / Refining, so my fighting skills are dubious: 1 - Electronic Warfare 2 - Electronics 1 - Electronics Upgrades 1 - Long Range Targeting 1 - Signature Analysis 3 - Survey 1 - Targeting 1 - Energy Emission Systems 2 - Energy Grid Upgrades 1 - Energy Management 1 - Energy Systems Operation 5 - Engineering 1 - Shield Operation 1 - Shield Upgrades 1 - Controlled Bursts 2 - Gunnery 1 - Motion Prediction 1 - Sharpshooter 1 - Small Energy Turret 2 - Small Projectile Turret 1 - Weapon Upgrades 2 - Industry 1 - Jaspet Processing 1 - Kernite Processing 3 - Mass Production 2 - Mining 1 - Plagioclase Processing 2 - Pyroxeres Processing 1 - Refinery Efficiency 5 - Refining 2 - Scordite Processing 1 - Veldspar Processing 4 - Analytical Mind 3 - Eidetic Memory 1 - Empathy 5 - Instant Recall 1 - Iron Will 4 - Learning 3 - Logic 1 - Spatial Awareness 1 - EM Armor Compensation 3 - Explosive Armor Compensation 4 - Hull Upgrades 2 - Kinetic Armor Compensation 5 - Mechanic 4 - Repair Systems 2 - Salvaging 2 - Thermic Armor Compensation 1 - Missile Launcher Operation 1 - Rockets 1 - Afterburner 1 - Navigation 1 - Warp Drive Operation 1 - Cybernetics 3 - Laboratory Operation 2 - Research 3 - Science 2 - Connections 3 - Social 3 - Amarr Frigate 1 - Amarr Industrial 1 - Destroyers 3 - Spaceship Command 2 - Trade If the problem is my skills, which ones will have the most impact for this fight, for the least amount of learning time? I'm down to my last million after both splurging on implants, and buying tons of different configurations in order to beat my last mission, so starting over with a new ship isn't really an option, at least not this week. Should I be looking at specific hardeners / membranes? What is the perfect Coercer setup to beat this specific mob? Thanks in advance for any and all help.
Emperor D'Hoffryn No Quarter. C0VEN	Posted - 2007.01.31 19:41:00 - [41] Edited by: Emperor D''Hoffryn on 31/01/2007 19:42:52 Edited by: Emperor D''Hoffryn on 31/01/2007 19:37:48 Originally by: Mezitt I just started playing EVE two weeks ago, and I need some help. I have an Amarr Coercer. I finally started Level 2 missions. (It took me forever to get to this step, I think because the agent corp I latched into was Caldari, so my initial standing was low, but I'm not sure.) I've tried and tried, but I cannot seem to beat the boss mob of my second: a Dire Pithi Demolisher. You are fighting guristas....That specific gurista is a tech2 ship...not the same as a harpy but based on it. Here are its stats: Shield: 725hp Resistances: EM: 85%, Expl: 79%, Kin: 64%, Therm: 72% Shield Boost Chance: 35%, Amount: 58hp, Duration: 5 second(s) Armour: 450hp Resistances: EM: 85%, Expl: 79%, Kin: 64%, Therm: 72% Armour Repair Chance: 35%, Amount: 0hp, Duration: 10 second(s) you are doing the WORST damage types possible. You can either try fitting for more damage (killing your tank) trying nos (reduces but does not eliminate the npc's tank) fitting ACs to your ship (less fitting reqs then lasers, and your choice of damage types) or moving to amarr space and using amarr agents, and fighting sanshas...where you will have no problems at all. edit you can try howitzers again, if you need the range, but use this ammor: http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/shipequipment/ammunitioncharges/projectileammo/standardammo/small/182.asp titanium sabot s it does the most kinetic damage of all the ammos. And remember, projectiles are not about optimal range, but about falloff...your range is longer then you think. Originally by: Snuggly It's just so great to have an actual reason to not die, incentive is fantastic!
Saarin	Posted - 2007.01.31 20:04:00 - [42] Yep... you chose the wrong pirates to fight with Energy weapons.... You can mess around and find a different fit and still take a loooooong time to kill them, or ya can go and find an Amarr agent in Amarr space.
Almarez	Posted - 2007.01.31 20:51:00 - [43] Here is the thing. Training up destroyer skill is only useful if you want to use interdictors. So many people don't like to take the time. Aside from that, they are very weak ships. In my experience, there are many frigs that can easily take down a destroyer by themselves rather easily. Cruiers have no issues with them. Even with the hit point boost they are still rather thin and cannot take much damage. Also, they are very hard to modify. The Coercer (Amarr) has one mid slot. So you can fit just an ab/mwd, webber, or warp disrupter but not more than one. The Comorant (Caldari) has one low slot, so it limits the damage mods that can be added for the guns. The Catalyst (Gallente) is slightly more flexible with 2 mid and 3 lows but that still doesn't leave much flexibility. Finally, the Thrasher (Minmitar) has 2 lows and 3 mids. So none of these really allows for the flexibility to take down fast flying frigs while surviving at the same time. Considering there are so many cruisers that go for only a couple million isk more that can handle that task so much better people usually opt to train for those. Especially since training cruisers skill to level 5 opens up so many possiblities for T2 ships.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2007.01.31 22:34:00 - [44] Originally by: Almarez Aside from that, they are very weak ships. In my experience, there are many frigs that can easily take down a destroyer by themselves rather easily. Cruiers have no issues with them. Even with the hit point boost they are still rather thin and cannot take much damage. You don't have to take damage when you 1 volley frigs I love popping inties faster than they know what happened in a destroyer. CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too.
Mezitt	Posted - 2007.01.31 22:51:00 - [45] Edited by: Mezitt on 31/01/2007 22:53:02 Quote: trying nos (reduces but does not eliminate the npc's tank) What's a nos? Quote: fitting ACs to your ship AC is...? Auto Cannon or Artillery Cannon? I have a set of 250mm Light Artillery Cannon I, but the range on them wasn't as good as the howitzers. I can try them again with the ammo you recommended. Quote: projectiles are not about optimal range, but about falloff...your range is longer then you think. Can you elaborate? I don't know how falloff or range vs. damage system works. Is there a guide somewhere? Thanks.
O'olish Amaneh	Posted - 2007.01.31 23:30:00 - [46] What's a nos? Nosveratu, energy vampire, can be found under engineering equipment. ACs are autocannons. As for the ammo type i'll talk about that after falloff. I don't know how falloff or range vs. damage system works. Is there a guide somewhere? Yes there is a guide, don't have the direct link but it's in the FAQ. Optimum range, this is the distance where your guns to full damage to a stationary target.(not taking tracking into account). Falloff is half the range where your damage falls from 100% to 0%. So your maximum range is: (Optimum + 2xFalloff). The range modifiers for projectile ammo, only applies to optimum range. Since the falloff range on projectiles is large compared to the optimum the range modifiers actually have little effect, especially on autocannons. Therefore for T1 use emp most of the time.
Krulla Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.01.31 23:43:00 - [47] The problem with destroyers is, people assume they are the natural progression from frigates, and thus noobs jump into them. Destroyers are not, by any means, noob ships. They require a lot of gunnery and support skills to use effectively. They are fearsome damage dealers in frigate wolfpacks. Sigs are for noobs.
Ratey	Posted - 2007.02.01 01:29:00 - [48] Originally by: Krulla The problem with destroyers is, people assume they are the natural progression from frigates, and thus noobs jump into them. Destroyers are not, by any means, noob ships. They require a lot of gunnery and support skills to use effectively. They are fearsome damage dealers in frigate wolfpacks. Yeah, that happened to me, lost one Thrasher then went to cruisers. Much later on, when interdictors hit the scene I had to get one. Sabre w/ 7x 200mm II and Hail ammo can give me 250 dps (add 1 rocket launcher) With IS in the lows, it goes over 4800ms. I usually cruise around with cloak, salvager, 3x 200mm IIs and 2x rocket launchers works fine on angel BC rats. Not really set up for pvp.
Caios Caldari	Posted - 2007.02.01 01:33:00 - [49] they float like a bee, sting like a butterfly at least comparatively speaking. salvaging, on the other hand, is a different matter.
6Bagheera9 Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.01 01:54:00 - [50] Destroyers are 100% gank ships and are thus harder to fly and don't fare well solo againist anything they can't kill in one or two vollys. They are also somewhat SP intensive as you need to maximize tracking, range, and alpha strike in order to be really effective. That being said, they are great anti-tacklers for gangs, ideal for ganking shuttles/pods, and capable of destroying expensive tech II frigs at low cost to yourself. Personally I think they need more mid/low slots to support tracking/tackling gear and field a better tank to compensate for their slower speed and larger signature radiss relative to frigates. An alternative would be to make them faster and lower their signature radius. Destroyers should not be great tankers, RL ones aren't, but they should at least be able to mount a repper without gimping your damage or ability to track, lock, or webb/scram. Interdictors are completely different animals are crucial to 0.0 PvP. Everyone cheers when a friend dictor pilot shows up.
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2007.02.01 02:34:00 - [51] As said above me, destroyers are gank ships, I don't think that the speed or the sig radious is the issue, it is that damn 25% Rof penalty that they have. 'dictors don't have them, but you have to fit undersized uns on them becuase they are all PG gimped.
Tiberyya Za Gallente Bellum Aeternus Storm Armada	Posted - 2007.02.01 04:01:00 - [52] 1) The bonuses non-Minmatar destroyers have are to range, but sniping removes the most valuable defensive asset of small ships, transversal. Range is also the least use against its target quarry, small ships, as they can cover the distance most easily. 2) As Audri Fisher said, the problem is the 25% penalty to rate of fire, making them effectively have only 6 small turrets. Only the Thrasher has a damage bonus. Compare frigate * Kestrel V: 4 weapon slots x 1.50 damage mod (kinetic) = 6 Destroyer * Cormorant V: 6 weapon slots x 1.0 damage mod = 6 Cruiser (medium weapons do twice the damage of a small) * Osprey V: 4 weapon slots x 2 x 1.0 damage mod = 8 equiv. small slots * Caracal V: 5 weapon slots x 2 x 1.25 damage mod = 12.5 equiv. small slots 362x120 pixels. 23.55KB

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