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Kugutsumen
Dirty Secrets Emporium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:34:00 -
[1]
Disclaimer: The content of this post is taken and translated from the German EVE-O forums, and is therefore not considered a 'third-party linking' source. Official EVEO content. = ) http://www.eve-online.de/forum/viewtopic.php?p=116536#116536
The landscape of power in EVE has been undergoing a lot of changes lately, and doing so at an accelerating pace. With what appears to be BoB and D2, and all the combined corporations each name represents facing off in the North, with Redswarm Federation, and an ever increasing number of alliances joining them, facing off against Lotka Volterra in the South.
One of these alliances, have people who work for an Official EVE Online site, and who have cross referenced IPs and log ins to that official site, against IPs and Logins for their Alliance TS, and completely eliminated several spies when doing so.
Want to know more? Keep reading.
 Originally by: Blacklight
I have until recently, due to some of my spies all getting ganked at once by various different circumstances, had one of the most comprehensive spy networks in BoB and I want to get it bult back up again.
If you have alts in other corps/alliances can you convo me in game to talk to me about it please.
Those of you with spy alts please also follow this simple set of rules:-
1. Never tell anyone other than yourself and myself that you are running a spy.
2. Never directly refer to any intel you have in corp or alliance comms, always distance yourself from what you know.
3. Never let anyone use that account.
So if you can help me rebuild my spy network let me know please.
I cannot stress how important it is to never tell anyone in game about it even your best online mates, just keep it quiet and feed the intel.
Quote:
5:10:07 PM Agent: d2 owns the german message board
5:10:09 PM Agent: eve-online.de
5:10:29 PM Agent: their they took the IP adresses of bob members and matched them against those in the d2 forums
5:10:52 PM Agent: thats the reason the spy was revealed
5:11:17 PM k: german eve-o forum?
5:11:23 PM k: d2 use hackers ?
5:11:53 PM Agent: d2 owns the board (x-trader members are admins) - one of these admitted that they matched the IP adresses
5:12:29 PM Agent: so they came on teamspeak where the spy was and kicked him *g*
From the German forums, translated for all of you loyal secret seekers:
Originally by: "Matuk Jelak"
It is a fact that XT uses this forum and the IP adresses of the users to match them against the d2 alliance forum. This is how my alt got uncovered. - by Matuk Jela / BNC - 11.01.2007 9:51
After 8 pages of flame war.
Originally by: "Clizz"
my research revealed that this incident happend (sadly) - ovaron asked one of the staff members who has access to the webserver and the database to give him the IPs of some persons. the staff member told ovaron to talk to me but he refused and he finally got the IPs from an account in this forum. they matched the IPs against multiple forums (e.g. the d2 alliance board) which led to this result.
whats left for me is to say the truth (regardless if ovaron will be angry about this) and I hope that we can get back some credibility for eve-online.de. Ovaron asked me to keep quiet about this but due to all the effort I made for this forum in the last years, I decided to make this public. I personally feel some kind of abused now and so is the member who gave out the IPs.
I want to apologise and hope that this incident won't happen again in the future - otherwise, we could just rename this forum into d2 board.
clizz - 15.01.2007 11:13
Note: X-trading are founding members of TRUST and D2.
Interesting, wouldn't you agree? A bit more...
Quote:
6:49:59 k: who posted that german stuff?
6:50:10 Agent: clizz, afaik he is xtrader-member
6:50:19 Agent: its from the public boards
6:50:24 Agent: so its well known anyway
6:50:52 Agent: official german eve-o forum
6:51:12 Agent: there are 3 bob members in this thread so they already know
6:51:14 k: they admitted that on the eve-o forum?
6:51:19 Agent: yes
6:51:26 k: and noone said anythin?
6:51:45 Agent: well the bob guys were kind of angry and we had some internal rabble about this
6:53:34 Agent: http://www.eve-online.de/forum/viewt...=116536#116536
6:56:48 Agent: so, this is the original accusation: "Es ist eine Tatsache das XT dieses Forum hier betreibt und somit zugriff auf die IP Adressen der User haben, diese haben sie mit dem d2-Ally Board abgeglichen. So ist mein Alt aufgeflogen." Translated it is a fact that xt uses this forum that they have access to the IP adresses of the users and they matched these against the d2 alliance board, that is how my alt got revealed
6:58:56 k: clizz replied that he did?
6:59:11 Agent: yes - after around 7 pages of flaming and denying
Don't forget, your isk keeps the secrets flowing. Donate to k today.
--
Kugutsumen
CEO, Dirty Secrets Emporium
"By way of deception, thou shalt do war" |
Tomas Ysidro
Caldari
Contraband Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:45:00 -
[2]
Interesting indeed
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fiber0pti
Dereliction of Duty
Bad Company.
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:49:00 -
[3]
Well, that's quite scandalous.
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Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
easyCredits
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:51:00 -
[4]
What happened is not that surprising. But to be honest, in the past we had people boasting about their out of game abilities to hack killboards, get illegal forum, killboard, TS etc. access.
Now we see the evolution when things technicaly out of game mechanics, are not only allowed but even encouraged. Remember, no one was forced to register their accounts on eve-online.de and only IP-adresses were checked with IP adresses of D¦ members.
Whoever is now crying out loud, should keep in mind that they are themselves not without guilt.
Huitzilopochtli did not like my Sig :(
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Drokar Gazer
Exanimo Inc
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:52:00 -
[5]
wow.
________________________________________
Drokar Gazer
Not the sig your looking for. Move along.
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Emrod
Amarr
Legion Du Lys
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:54:00 -
[6]
Its dont surprise me....
and don't be surprise too that at the end of 2007, Eve 0.0 territory gonna be own by one or 2 superpower..
the question its...who its gonna be!
to be continued
LDLQ, the Quebec touch in TCF since 2006 |
Fred0
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:56:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Fred0 on 28/01/2007 08:52:58
What a ****storm. Honestly wonder what happened here. 
This will probably spill over and build a few rl grudges regardless though. Such a shame.
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Svett
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.28 08:58:00 -
[8]
So they used an offical eve-online resource to get private IP addresses. That seems a bit much, in fact it should get some bans. Thats uncool stuff right there. How do you know they didn't just get IP's after all.
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Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:03:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Svett
So they used an offical eve-online resource to get private IP addresses. That seems a bit much, in fact it should get some bans. Thats uncool stuff right there. How do you know they didn't just get IP's after all.
Seems so.. the site is on CCP's name, so this is really bad. Do players also have the same access on eve-online.com? |
Kesh McCall
Caldari
Malkalen Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:09:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: Svett
So they used an offical eve-online resource to get private IP addresses. That seems a bit much, in fact it should get some bans. Thats uncool stuff right there. How do you know they didn't just get IP's after all.
Seems so.. the site is on CCP's name, so this is really bad. Do players also have the same access on eve-online.com?
The ISD and their volounteers have it afaik. And they are players aswell ...
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MonkSEALPup
Momentum.
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:12:00 -
[11]
As an inconsequential member of D2 I would like an answer as to what happened here. If it is as seems, this a bit out of line. But, as is typically the case, there are some facts that haven't seen the light of day yet. Bueller?
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Kugutsumen
Dirty Secrets Emporium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:28:00 -
[12]
For those who private messaged or eve-mailed me saying it is a fan site:
Offizielle deutsche EVE-Online Seite means Official German EVE-Online Site.
Whois output:
Quote:
Domain data
[17]Domain: eve-online.de
[18]Latest update: 31.10.2006
Domain holder
The domain holder is DENIC's contractual partner and hence holds the
material rights to the domain.
[19]Domain holder: CCP hf.
[20]Address: Grandagarour 8
[21]Postal code: 101
[22]City: Reykjavik
[23]Country: IS
--
Kugutsumen
CEO, Dirty Secrets Emporium
"By way of deception, thou shalt do war" |
Attak
Trioptimum
FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:31:00 -
[13]
BoB uses out of game methods to spy, D2 uses out of game methods to catch spies. Not sure what the big controversy is.
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:35:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 28/01/2007 09:31:07
Originally by: Kesh McCall
Originally by: Sinlare
Seems so.. the site is on CCP's name, so this is really bad. Do players also have the same access on eve-online.com?
The ISD and their volounteers have it afaik. And they are players aswell ...
I'm certain ISD would never abuse their power. 
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Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:37:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Attak
BoB uses out of game methods to spy, D2 uses out of game methods to catch spies. Not sure what the big controversy is.
You're missing the point where players get access to the official userdatabase of a CCP owned website. |
c0rn1
Seraphin Technologies
S.E.R.A
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:37:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Attak
BoB uses out of game methods to spy, D2 uses out of game methods to catch spies. Not sure what the big controversy is.
The Difference is that eve-online.de should be a neutral entity. If they would check IP adresses of the BoB board they got with their spies against their own IPs, then it'd be fine, but not using a NEUTRAL, from CCP supported webpage to acquire the IPs and use it for ONE-SIDED purposes.
x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
Life's a waste of time ... |
Avernus
Gallente
Imperium Technologies
Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:43:00 -
[17]
I think everyone is familiar with how uncomforting it can be to have spys in your alliance, and I've seen folks use methods to try to match up IP's using forums and TS etc in the past in an effort to track down infiltrators, but the thought of it being done through a CCP forum (if my understandings is correct), makes me rather uncomfortable.
Blog |
Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:44:00 -
[18]
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Gabba
Species 5618
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:47:00 -
[19]
BoB uses their forum mods on eve-o to remove Kugutsumens blogs when they are harmfull to them.
Just assign a empty D2 account as your scapegoat and all is well.
Play to win any way possible wasnt it? We are the best in everything we do and we will win any way possible? Should make future fanfests a lot more fun.
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LiquidSteele
Veto. Academy
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:48:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Avernus
I think everyone is familiar with how uncomforting it can be to have spys in your alliance, and I've seen folks use methods to try to match up IP's using forums and TS etc in the past in an effort to track down infiltrators, but the thought of it being done through a CCP forum (if my understandings is correct), makes me rather uncomfortable.
I agree, infact myself and everyone else should stop posting on CCP run forums straight away
Sincerly,
LS |
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Druida
Caldari
The Huns
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:48:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Druida on 28/01/2007 09:51:44
O.o
Such actions like this are against everthing we believe as a eve player.
for me this is cheating / exploit.
Since eve-online.de registrat is under CCP, i hope that the same GM/ISD rules will be used.
GameMasters & ISD
One thing is using alliance forums, corp webpages to try to get spys, that i can accept.
But using oficial CCP resources to change EVE in their own advantage...thats sick..... Im very ****ed off as a player about this.
pew pew
Yarrr o/
Druida
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Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:51:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Attak
BoB uses out of game methods to spy, D2 uses out of game methods to catch spies. Not sure what the big controversy is.
No, BoB use social engineering to spy.
That may lead them to be given access to OOG resources (forums / TS /Vent), but that is very different to hacking those resources directly.
This is actually quite a worrying turn of events .. although nowhere near as worrying as the OP's actions.
He should have been banned by now.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Ather Ialeas
Amarr
Karjala Inc.
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:51:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Svett
So they used an offical eve-online resource to get private IP addresses. That seems a bit much, in fact it should get some bans. Thats uncool stuff right there. How do you know they didn't just get IP's after all.
You can always go sing YMCA to their TeamSpeak if you dislike what they do
Oh wait, that's actually uncool too.
---
Mandatory disclaimer: These are my thoughts, not my corps/alliances.
---
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Gabba
Species 5618
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Posted - 2007.01.28 09:59:00 -
[24]
Trying to win/lose with honor went out the window so now everyone is going as low as they can to get the edge. DDOSing TS servers is the new way to win a war.
The only people that will hold 0.0 are people willing to lower themselves to that level. Glorious times ahead, but i think ill take the sideline 
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Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:05:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Gabba
Trying to win/lose with honor went out the window so now everyone is going as low as they can to get the edge. DDOSing TS servers is the new way to win a war.
The only people that will hold 0.0 are people willing to lower themselves to that level. Glorious times ahead, but i think ill take the sideline
You have some serious paranoia problems, get a checkup. |
El Covah
Die Diener Melkors
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:06:00 -
[26]
I was always under the impression that eve-online.de is a privately run forum board and not an official CCP resource. However if you look at this you will note that CCP owns the domain, but it is fully player driven.
The german community is a very strong one ingame, and this website is one of the best community sites ever. The moderation is great and you have a lot of more freedom of speech than here.
Btw. What D¦ did there lead to loose all their reputation for me. They are not "the good guys" or anything else, just nothing better as this kind of players I am very common with which do not hesitate to cross the RL/game border very far to get an advantage in the game. Forum information like IPs or RL names are RL stuff and in no way connected to the game. People using this are just loosers in RL and also unable play a good game. In the end this type of characters will also loose in EVE.
*New sig coming soon* |
Shin Ra
BURN EDEN
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:08:00 -
[27]
Interesting read. Pathetic opinions thereafter.
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Shirei
Minmatar
Cutting Edge Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:12:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
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Malachon Draco
eXceed Inc.
INVICTUS.
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:13:00 -
[29]
Heh, brilliant move.
I can't blame D2. If spying is allowed, then counterspying also needs tools to be effective. If that takes a bit of inventive use of IPs and resources, so be it. I have sympathy for any counterspying effort because I consider spies despicable.
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Dragutinovic
Caldari
Storm Thesis
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:23:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
So if i understand you right ... Someone in Xtraders basicly owns the IP/site , therefore no rule is broken ?
oh and Go D2
_____________
Recruit me !
Im back !
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Shirei
Minmatar
Cutting Edge Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:25:00 -
[31]
Don't put words in my mouth.
All I said is, it is a fan-site (although one that got the right to use the eve-online.de domain from CCP), unlike what some people in this thread said.
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c0rn1
Seraphin Technologies
S.E.R.A
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:25:00 -
[32]
Edited by: c0rn1 on 28/01/2007 10:23:16
Originally by: Malachon Draco
Heh, brilliant move.
I can't blame D2. If spying is allowed, then counterspying also needs tools to be effective. If that takes a bit of inventive use of IPs and resources, so be it. I have sympathy for any counterspying effort because I consider spies despicable.
Yeah, very brilliant to use the website which just sits right on a CCP owned DNS, so it should remain untouched and neutral. Guess this will have strong consequences. Most likely the rights will of the current Admins will be removed and the DNS-Entry changed into the void.
Originally by: Shirei
Don't put words in my mouth.
All I said is, it is a fan-site (although one that got the right to use the eve-online.de domain from CCP), unlike what some people in this thread said.
Trust me, before getting access to DNS they had to sign an NDA.
x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
Life's a waste of time ... |
Ilmonstre
Minmatar
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:26:00 -
[33]
don't be such babies.
the spy got caught so tough luck get over it and start over again.
and it has been said they will use any way to gain a advantage to win from the opponent and as noted before no hacking was involved since its only registered by name and all the managing if the site is done from the same location as xtraders.de
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Dragutinovic
Caldari
Storm Thesis
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:28:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Shirei
Don't put words in my mouth.
All I said is, it is a fan-site (although one that got the right to use the eve-online.de domain from CCP), unlike what some people in this thread said.
Didnt ment it as such m8 , just gettin a bit confused about it
Besides whats teh big deal ? If BoB does something nasty its ok if someoen else might be doing nasty they demand teh banstick , in GNW they didnt even got a warning about a certain action so i suggest the BoB horde hush .
_____________
Recruit me !
Im back !
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jsman99
Maza Nostra
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:30:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Svett
So they used an offical eve-online resource to get private IP addresses. That seems a bit much, in fact it should get some bans. Thats uncool stuff right there. How do you know they didn't just get IP's after all.
Didnt someone said all is fair in love and war?
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jsman99
Maza Nostra
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:32:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Attak
BoB uses out of game methods to spy, D2 uses out of game methods to catch spies. Not sure what the big controversy is.
No, BoB use social engineering to spy.
That may lead them to be given access to OOG resources (forums / TS /Vent), but that is very different to hacking those resources directly.
This is actually quite a worrying turn of events .. although nowhere near as worrying as the OP's actions.
He should have been banned by now.
wtf ?? this is a joke bob did exactly the same thing SPARE US THE DRAMA.!!
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Lowa
Gallente
North Star Networks
Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:36:00 -
[37]
Interesting. Dont like this kinda stuff but yeah, interesting. 
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
Question is; does that make it better or worse? I tend to lean on the second option...
I pretty much hate all spying and once it had started (even so little) I knew it would
grow and become much more complicated. And dirty. Cant say I like to be correct this time.
/Lowa
What if the truth was something else? |
maedden
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:36:00 -
[38]
All I have to add is that I am sad for clizz who does his best to provide a service for the german speaking community.
Sad that apparently all sides try to abuse this and use it for their propaganda instead of being grateful for the work that he and his team put in.
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Cmd Woodlouse
Cataclysm Enterprises
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:36:00 -
[39]
1st: The spy which came from the german BoB player "Matuk Jela" was not revealed due to Ovarons actions, but by the acts of another german BoB player called "Chrony".
On a personal note: i hope that this spiral doesnt get any lower - the ghosts that i called...
But i also hope that there will be soon capable ingame possibilities to catch spies. Right now as it is, its nearly impossible to do so w/o any form of outgame actions... 
--------------------------------
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INZi
coracao ardente
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:37:00 -
[40]
lol. i r in ur forumz haxing your ipz
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Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:38:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Lowa
Interesting. Dont like this kinda stuff but yeah, interesting.
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
Question is; does that make it better or worse? I tend to lean on the second option...
I pretty much hate all spying and once it had started (even so little) I knew it would
grow and become much more complicated. And dirty. Cant say I like to be correct this time.
/Lowa
So true, it's sad.. and all those that defend it. |
Ogul
Caldari
ZiTek Deepspace Explorations
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:38:00 -
[42]
Stop whining, spyz0rs. This is the world you created.
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Shirei
Minmatar
Cutting Edge Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:39:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:37:43
Originally by: c0rn1
Trust me, before getting access to the DNS they had to sign an NDA.
You know that based on what information exactly?
IIRC, eve-online.de was used by this forum before the domain was owned by CCP. So for all we know CCP might simply have allowed them to continue using it after they secured the rights to their trademark domain name.
Obviously, something like this is not very nice at all, and CCP is perfectly in the right to not allow them to continue using their domain anymore - but I doubt there are any EULA or legal implications.
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V0idz
Herrscher der Zeit
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:44:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Ogul
Stop whining, spyz0rs. This is the world you created.
true.
---------
EVE is like the "Fisherman's Friend" of MMOs.
If it's too hard, you are too weak. |
Bwal
Caldari
Constructive Influence
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:45:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Bwal on 28/01/2007 10:42:13
Quote:
It is important to note that unlike the US, under European Union law IP Addresses are considered to be personal data as defined by article 2(a) of Directive 95/46/EC " 'personal data' shall mean any information relating to an identified or identifiable natural person ('data subject'); an identifiable person is one who can be identified, directly or indirectly, in particular by reference to an identification number or to one or more factors specific to his physical, physiological, mental, economic, cultural or social identity; " Also see Directive 2006/24/EC.
In association with Time Codes, IP Addressing information will always identify unique ISP account holders unless there is translation of that information.
It is important that this significant difference in legal status is appreciated, since Websites that provide for third party interception of IP addressing information and Traffic Data, without Website visitor consent, are committing a criminal offence in the UK by virtue of the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000, where through the requirements of European Council Decision 2005/222/JHA such Website owners face serious sanctions, including the winding up of their businesses, being debarred from running a business, and more than 2 years imprisonment.
You are infringing on my rights regarding the usage of my IP address for your personal use in third party matters. This is against the law and you are liable. I suggest CCP sort this matter out before it escalates
"Pain makes man think.
Thought makes man wise.
Wisdom makes life endurable." |
Baun
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:46:00 -
[46]
If there is any legitimate complaint here at all it should be directed to the operators of the website for giving out that information, not to D2 for using it once obtained. Nothing that they did was any more "meta gamey" than methods employed by everyone to both spy and protect themselves from spies, in game and out.
The Enemy's Gate is Down
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jsman99
Maza Nostra
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:46:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: Lowa
Interesting. Dont like this kinda stuff but yeah, interesting.
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
Question is; does that make it better or worse? I tend to lean on the second option...
I pretty much hate all spying and once it had started (even so little) I knew it would
grow and become much more complicated. And dirty. Cant say I like to be correct this time.
/Lowa
So true, it's sad.. and all those that defend it.
Yeah i felt the same for bob who had to hax the ASCN vent/TS whatever. roflmao as their skills were inadequate to win in a fair fight.. what a joke you guys are..
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thesulei
Syndicate Technologies
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Posted - 2007.01.28 10:56:00 -
[48]
I would think that CCP owns the eve-online.de domain as a "just in case" strategy, to be able to pull the plug on it should they find that it contradicts their interests.
The website itself is clearly player-run and doesn't convey any other truth. Thus, in my book, it is ok what D2 did.
Get over it bobbits.
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Maltere
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:01:00 -
[49]
Unidentified characters cannot post in this forum. Please show your corp/alliance before posting. Please email [email protected] if you have any questions - Karl Chroimcer
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Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:07:00 -
[50]
Originally by: jsman99
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: Lowa
Interesting. Dont like this kinda stuff but yeah, interesting.
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
Question is; does that make it better or worse? I tend to lean on the second option...
I pretty much hate all spying and once it had started (even so little) I knew it would
grow and become much more complicated. And dirty. Cant say I like to be correct this time.
/Lowa
So true, it's sad.. and all those that defend it.
Yeah i felt the same for bob who had to hax the ASCN vent/TS whatever. roflmao as their skills were inadequate to win in a fair fight.. what a joke you guys are..
I doubt bob hacked anything, people falsely accusing are just as sad as people who hax. |
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D2O HeavyWater
Amarr
Synergy.
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:08:00 -
[51]
lol superb. Unlucky BoB
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Druida
Caldari
The Huns
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:10:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Druida on 28/01/2007 11:08:42
Originally by: Maltere
Bob got owned. Now they cry. Awww
why ppl here must turn everthing to bob?
This is about the abuse of confidential information under a oficial CCP domain name.
This topic is not about Bob or D2 or any alliance!
So Wake up!
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jsman99
Maza Nostra
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:11:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: jsman99
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: Lowa
Interesting. Dont like this kinda stuff but yeah, interesting.
Originally by: Shirei
Edited by: Shirei on 28/01/2007 10:08:29
Like most international eve-online.* forums, the domain is owned by CCP, but all content (including web-hosting etc.) is provided by players. If you do a nslookup on eve-online.de, you will find that it uses the same IP as www.xtraders.de.
Question is; does that make it better or worse? I tend to lean on the second option...
I pretty much hate all spying and once it had started (even so little) I knew it would
grow and become much more complicated. And dirty. Cant say I like to be correct this time.
/Lowa
So true, it's sad.. and all those that defend it.
Yeah i felt the same for bob who had to hax the ASCN vent/TS whatever. roflmao as their skills were inadequate to win in a fair fight.. what a joke you guys are..
I doubt bob hacked anything, people falsely accusing are just as sad as people who hax.
Poeple who play in the forums are as sad as people who mine in a titan
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Dragutinovic
Caldari
Storm Thesis
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:11:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Druida
Originally by: Maltere
Bob got owned. Now they cry. Awww
why ppl here must turn everthing to bob?
This is about the abuse of confidential information under a oficial CCP domain name.
What ever bob did before was not under any CCP domain.!!
So Wake up!
Ingame is not under CCP domain ?
_____________
Recruit me !
Im back !
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Lobo13
Gallente
Beyond-Redemption
Koroshiya Buntai
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:14:00 -
[55]
Escalation
Under construction. If you look close enough you can see the little men building it.[.B.R.] |
jernej
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:14:00 -
[56]
Have rules or laws been broken? |
Xendie
Forsaken Empire
The Forsaken Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:14:00 -
[57]
im guessing that some ppl will get slapped with legal actions.
not neccesarily the persons who were given the IP's but the ones that gave them out who worked for CCP moderating a CCP registered domain.
i hope that they shut down eve-online.de and force the germans to learn english and learn how to follow the eula and to follow the laws.
if not ban them and jail the bastids.
Quote:
Nertzius > having fun being incompetitent?
Quote:
jake sisko > its f-e's bob dev alt making lag
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Druida
Caldari
The Huns
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:14:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Druida on 28/01/2007 11:11:31
Originally by: Dragutinovic
Originally by: Druida
Originally by: Maltere
Bob got owned. Now they cry. Awww
why ppl here must turn everthing to bob?
This is about the abuse of confidential information under a oficial CCP domain name.
What ever bob did before was not under any CCP domain.!!
So Wake up!
Ingame is not under CCP domain ?
Humm can you get confidential player information like IP address INGAME? No.
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Oleifr
Caldari
The X-Trading Company
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:15:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Kugutsumen
For those who private messaged or eve-mailed me saying it is a fan site:
Offizielle deutsche EVE-Online Seite means Official German EVE-Online Site.
Whois output:
Quote:
Domain data
[17]Domain: eve-online.de
[18]Latest update: 31.10.2006
Domain holder
The domain holder is DENIC's contractual partner and hence holds the
material rights to the domain.
[19]Domain holder: CCP hf.
[20]Address: Grandagarour 8
[21]Postal code: 101
[22]City: Reykjavik
[23]Country: IS
btw. you are violating german laws...
to get the information above you had to read this text and clicked the accept button under this text...
Quote:
The domain "xxx-xxxxxx.de" has already been registered.
If you want further information about the holder of this domain, its special contacts and its technical data, you will first have to agree to the following Terms and Conditions of Use:
Terms and Conditions of Use
All the domain data that is visible in the whois search is protected by law. It is not permitted to use it for any purpose other than technical or administrative requirements associated with the operation of the Internet or in order to contact the domain holder over legal problems. You are not permitted to save it electronically or in any other way without DENIC's express written permission. It is prohibited, in particular, to use it for advertising or any similar purpose.
By clicking the "Accept" button, you give an assurance that you have a legitimate interest in the data and that you will only use it for the stated purposes. You are aware that DENIC maintains the right to initiate legal proceedings against you in the event of any breach of this assurance and to bar you from using its whois query.
you saved it electronical here to this forum, think about it..
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Xendie
Forsaken Empire
The Forsaken Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:17:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Oleifr
Originally by: Kugutsumen
For those who private messaged or eve-mailed me saying it is a fan site:
Offizielle deutsche EVE-Online Seite means Official German EVE-Online Site.
Whois output:
Quote:
Domain data
[17]Domain: eve-online.de
[18]Latest update: 31.10.2006
Domain holder
The domain holder is DENIC's contractual partner and hence holds the
material rights to the domain.
[19]Domain holder: CCP hf.
[20]Address: Grandagarour 8
[21]Postal code: 101
[22]City: Reykjavik
[23]Country: IS
btw. you are violating german laws...
to get the information above you had to read this text and clicked the accept button under this text...
Quote:
The domain "xxx-xxxxxx.de" has already been registered.
If you want further information about the holder of this domain, its special contacts and its technical data, you will first have to agree to the following Terms and Conditions of Use:
Terms and Conditions of Use
All the domain data that is visible in the whois search is protected by law. It is not permitted to use it for any purpose other than technical or administrative requirements associated with the operation of the Internet or in order to contact the domain holder over legal problems. You are not permitted to save it electronically or in any other way without DENIC's express written permission. It is prohibited, in particular, to use it for advertising or any similar purpose.
By clicking the "Accept" button, you give an assurance that you have a legitimate interest in the data and that you will only use it for the stated purposes. You are aware that DENIC maintains the right to initiate legal proceedings against you in the event of any breach of this assurance and to bar you from using its whois query.
you saved it electronical here to this forum, think about it..
maybe he is german and cant read english.
Quote:
Nertzius > having fun being incompetitent?
Quote:
jake sisko > its f-e's bob dev alt making lag
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Nahual
Gallente
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:18:00 -
[61]
So much to say and then all these internet lawyers are going to bring up the law (which i doubt even one of them will be legally right  ).
Your spy got owned, it happens, get over it, your friends still have spies. If people started this in the first place, don't complain when it comes to bite you in the ass.
-----------------------------------------------
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Sinoh Necromonger
The Weasels of Doom
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:20:00 -
[62]
Well, tbh I haven't really seen an AWFUL lot of crying from BoB on this matter, but I can sort of see the point of figuring it is not on.
eve-online.de although player run IS the property of CCP, the domain belongs to them (probably due to the outcome of a pre legal action agreement between CCP and the previous owner) and as such the domain's operator should definately be under some sort of rules and guideleines as to what is deemed inkeeping with CCP' gaming ethics.
If I visited that site and saw (for instance) "CCP and EvE is rubbish - Official Website" on the title of it, you would be sure that CCP would take the domain off them for using CCP's property against them.
From what I see, they are indeed using an official resource against CCP's playerbase, which is just as bad.
Shades of grey, but if I were CCP I would be reviewing their rights to host this domain.
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Bwal
Caldari
Constructive Influence
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:25:00 -
[63]
Yes laws have been broken see above post also ...
Quote:
Council Framework Decision 2005/222/JHA
of 24 February 2005
on attacks against information systems
THE COUNCIL OF THE EUROPEAN UNION,
Having regard to the Treaty on European Union, and in particular Articles 29, 30(1)(a), 31(1)(e) and 34(2)(b) thereof,
Article 2
Illegal access to information systems
1. Each Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that the intentional access without right to the whole or any part of an information system is punishable as a criminal offence, at least for cases which are not minor.
2. Each Member State may decide that the conduct referred to in paragraph 1 is incriminated only where the offence is committed by infringing a security measure.
Though can can argue it wasnt an attack directly, it was an attack on your public right regarding your personal information which covers your IP address.
"Pain makes man think.
Thought makes man wise.
Wisdom makes life endurable." |
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Serathu
Forum Moderator
Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:32:00 -
[64]
Thread cleaned.
May I remind you that you should adhere to the Forum Rules, the CAOD Rules and the Clarification to them. Please avoid all trolling and off-topic posting from here on in.
Thank you.
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Irrilian
Eve University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:49:00 -
[65]
Communication over the net is about as private as writing messages on postcards. If people are particularly concerned about attempting to maintain some form of privacy then they should perhaps consider using an anonymizing proxy, Tor or some such.
PIs and Forensic Accountants: adding risk vs reward for scams and thievery |
Kcel Chim
Caldari
Arcane Technologies
The Five
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:50:00 -
[66]
this is hardly a stunning blow to BoB's spy network.
It only uncovered the few spies which used the german eve-o forums and the d2 forums ignoring the blessing of proxys or anonymizers.
Quiet low to abuse a ccp ressource to gather info in my opinion but im sure ccp themself or via a petition by bob directors (if they are interested in the case at all) will make a judgement call about it.
The most ironic outcome would be that the site loses its "official" status and domain and hence would have damaged the german community as a whole - which doesnt consist of only d2 members.
Thank you d2 and i guess. Good turn is that Cmd. W. will have a hard time to ride the moral high horse when it comes to d2 forum and ts spying in the future.
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Wrangler
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Posted - 2007.01.28 11:54:00 -
[67]
Hi,
http://www.eve-online.de is a fansite and not a CCP run EVE site. I don't know why I we seem to own the domain, though I will try to find out, since it's sunday I doubt I will until tomorrow.
Wrangler
Assistant Community Manager
EVE Online
Contact Support - Contact Moderators - Report Bug - Submit News Leads - Knowledge Base
Player Guide - Policies - Join ISD - Fan Submissions - DevFinder LiteÖ |
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