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It is my opinion that Amarr need to be changed for the better.

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Moraguth Amarr Rangers	Posted - 2007.02.11 22:07:00 - [31] Okay, maybe i do mean to hijack this thread, sorry. If we really wanna go into the awesomeness of never having to buy ammo for amarr, I think that one other race needs a massive un-nerf. that's right, gallente. If for some reason, after i disconnected, my lasers exploded... i would be royally ****ed. Granted, large drones are cheaper than my mega pulses, but still. I know some might say that ballances out cause they can have a wave of heavies, mediums, and lights in their hold (for some of the bigger ships) so they can be effective against all class ships, but still. THE HORROR. Back on the topic of crystals: I love not having to buy ammo. I can use my cargo for looting/salvaging, AND i can stay in deep 0.0 being a hermit without having to go back to a station for a VERY long time. I only have to go back if i get found and destroyed, or if i disconnect too many times and my drones are gone. It is really demeaning when you've just killed off 6M isk in bounties worth of BSs, and you have to logoff cause you can't kill the frig that is warp jamming you cause your drones got killed when you disconnected earlier that day. yeah, suckage. good game
Megan Maynard Minmatar RONA Deepspace Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.02.11 22:30:00 - [32] Originally by: mechtech This is an "out there" idea: Wait for the patch that adds heat and overheating to modules (it is currently in development), and give lasers the ability to cause heat in the opposing ships modules. Maybe even let lasers target specific areas of a ship to overheat (weps, tanking equipment, ect.) That would be fun to use, and make the race more unique... awesome idea, i approve.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.11 22:38:00 - [33] A 10% reduction of the grid cost of all lasers would be a good start. Dulce et decorum est pro imperator mori
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.11 23:01:00 - [34] Edited by: Goumindong on 11/02/2007 22:59:05 Originally by: Dark Shikari Amarr problem is simple, and similar to what you stated. Almost all Amarr T1 ships have only one bonus, because of the cap usage bonus that doesn't actually do anything except help them use their own weapons. Solution is simple: Lower all laser base cap usage by 35%, and replace all those bonuses with something useful. Amarr is good again. That doesnt solve the problem. At 35% the cap use is still too high[40% at least would be nessesary, 45-50% would be better]. As well, lasers really do have other problems, especialy tech 1 lasers. The second half of the laser problem is that lasers, unlike all other turret systems do not have viable downfitting options. The difference between Heavy Pulses and Focused Medium Pulses is greater than the difference between Electron Blasters and Neutron Blasters[which is greater than the difference between 180mm ACs and 425 ACs], and the powergrid saved is less. There isnt even anything close to an ion/220 equilvelent. This trend continues accross all ranges of weapons, large, small, short and long. Another problem for Amarr is their long optimal range for their short range guns. This seems counter intuitive, but because Amarr depend on doing damage before other ships get close[typicaly at a gun damage disadvantage over blasters and autocannons], the range reductions on tech 1 ammo result in larger penalties. I.E. if a tech 1 amarr ship is shooting at a tech 1 Gallente ship, the Gallente ship looses 1.5km from using antimatter and the amarr ship 7.5km from using multifrequency. The 7.5km would turn into about 3-5 seconds of extra firing the amarr could do before the Gallente got to him. While the 1.5km would be 1 second. I.E. Tech 1 ammo choices penalize amarr more than any race. These three items, combined with the lack of real bonuses on amarran ships, as well as the almost useless "utility" high slot[as it typically cannot be fitted due to CPU or PG constrains] make up the majority of the Amarr tech 1 defecit. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.02.11 23:08:00 - [35] Originally by: Queen Lo I mean jees, try tachyon sniping in an abaddon. Those babies use almost 100 cap per shot if iirc. Put 8 of those on with heatsinks, with a rof of around 8 seconds, and that is 100 cap /sec just for the guns alone. Too much. No way. Abaddon cap recharge blows. The ship can have a helluva alpha strike but it is out and down for the count in practically no time. I use an Abaddon when missioning and with 3 cap rigs and two Cap Recharger-IIs I can just hold my cap steady shooting my guns (dual modulated heavy energy beams) and running my active tank w/out the single armor rep running. Once my armor rep gets going the cap slowly dwindles to zero. I cannot imagine what Tachs would do to that. My beams use 21 cap per shot. Tachs use 95. So, 168 cap per volley versus 760! I don't think so.
PutShoe OnHead Not Even Doom Music	Posted - 2007.02.12 00:29:00 - [36] Originally by: Scav Silver Edited by: Scav Silver on 11/02/2007 21:19:10 How does a "light" based wpn cause EM dmg?? Light is just visible EM radiation.
Redback911	Posted - 2007.02.12 00:39:00 - [37] Just boost the actual capacitors of Amarr ships, then change the Laser capacitor bonus to damage, ROF, tank etc. Job done.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.12 01:27:00 - [38] Originally by: Redback911 Just boost the actual capacitors of Amarr ships, then change the Laser capacitor bonus to damage, ROF, tank etc. Job done. Doesnt work, it would make amarr have ridiculous tanks with blasters or autocannons ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
diabolic clone Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.12 01:43:00 - [39] To the OP As an amarr newb I think the solution is not to boost amarr. It is to nerf every other race as hard as amarr were nerfed. Almost ALL our ships are laser gunboats and lasers are scaled down to be fit on every ship in game and sustainable (to an extent) on amarr ships. Anyway I like amarr ships but I'll be disapointed if they got just a cap bonus like apocalypse or cap recharge I'll just get nos'd anyway or run my rep too long
SonOTassadar The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.12 02:23:00 - [40] Originally by: diabolic clone To the OP As an amarr newb I think the solution is not to boost amarr. It is to nerf every other race as hard as amarr were nerfed. Almost ALL our ships are laser gunboats and lasers are scaled down to be fit on every ship in game and sustainable (to an extent) on amarr ships. Anyway I like amarr ships but I'll be disapointed if they got just a cap bonus like apocalypse or cap recharge I'll just get nos'd anyway or run my rep too long I don't think this is a good idea. The other races, save for broken things like the Nos-domi (which is really only good for 1v1 or small gang fights) and everything being nano'ed to hell and back now, are relatively balanced. Just like some other folks were saying about how they weep when they use Tachyons -- a 50% reduction in cap use would put them much closer to on par with their railgun counterpart (425mm). Now you don't have people complaining about their cap running out just from firing guns (how dumb is that?). Combine that with controlled bursts level 5, and you still are using around 36 cap a shot per turret -- my Invulnerability Field uses less cap (How dumb is that?). It is my opinion that the other races are fairly close to being balanced, but Amarr are just the ugly duckling of the bunch. From a developer standpoint, it would be easier to buff 1 race and work on fixing them through 2-3 patches (which they have to do in every major patch, anyways), than it would be to nerf the other 3 races, and work on balancing that mess. ----- Griffin -- 100,000 ISK ECM - Multispectral Jammer Is -- 20,000 ISK Standard Missile Launcher Is -- 10,000 ISK War target sobbing over losing a fight in his T2 fitted Battleship -- priceless
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.02.12 03:15:00 - [41] Originally by: PutShoe OnHead Originally by: Scav Silver Edited by: Scav Silver on 11/02/2007 21:19:10 How does a "light" based wpn cause EM dmg?? Light is just visible EM radiation. OMG YOUR CORP NOTHING IS SAFE FROM NEDM! Half Assed Rhymage
Lithalnas Amarr Hadean Drive Yards Archaean Cooperative	Posted - 2007.02.12 03:24:00 - [42] grant amarr lasers a target painting bonus? I mean if your using a target painter which is probably a medium beam laser with radio s anyways why not just have lasers give a target painting effect? It would solve some of the problems. Second is greatly increase tracking speed, i cant hit anything with pulses or beams because they transverse too much or are too small. ------------- Midshipman Lithalnas - Logistics Division - Hadean Drive Yards
SonOTassadar The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.12 06:14:00 - [43] Originally by: Lithalnas grant amarr lasers a target painting bonus? I mean if your using a target painter which is probably a medium beam laser with radio s anyways why not just have lasers give a target painting effect? It would solve some of the problems. Second is greatly increase tracking speed, i cant hit anything with pulses or beams because they transverse too much or are too small. Ummm...that's the point of all turrets. A battlecruiser isn't designed to hit an interceptor, and target painting would not help against battleship class ships. ----- Griffin -- 100,000 ISK ECM - Multispectral Jammer Is -- 20,000 ISK Standard Missile Launcher Is -- 10,000 ISK War target sobbing over losing a fight in his T2 fitted Battleship -- priceless
Mastin Dragonfly Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.12 07:37:00 - [44] Imho the fitting requirements for the top lasers are the problem, especially for t1 frigates/cruisers. You simply can't fit them, even if you have some powergrid left it won't be enough to make a sensible setup. That goes even for tech 1 lasers, forget using the tech 2 version.
Bugszor Caldari The Redeeming Age	Posted - 2007.02.12 08:36:00 - [45] i am a Caldari pilot flying Amarrian ships. why? cause amarians are different then the rest. people keep saying they're nerfed and bad and stuff. i do have to say. i run from nosdomis noss are a pain in the ass for amarr. and amarr has some MAYOR fitting problems. but how come. at the time that you talk about problems. i shoot down a raven with ease? check this out. abaddon has 8 highslots. ever frigging thought of fitting 4 heavy diminishings and 4 mega modulated? USE YOUR WEAKNES AS A ADVANTAGE! noss the foockers dry and keep yours running. now dont go blabbing about "yeah but they wil still shoot me!!" boy. if you cant take out a active tanked raven without cap in the time he gets through your armor. you should stop paying for eve and go play in traffic. (dont forget to gimme ur stuff) i've been flying amarr for 2 years now. i gatecamp with it PERFECTLY. why? with my skills my optimal range is 15 km with multispec on my mega modulated wich means. optimal range when they jump in. lol no really.. the only thing that should be nice for amarr is a PGU reduction so we can atleast fit our highslots good while still having a normal tank that is all. PS: Get a bhaalgorn. its not expensive and ahs the 50% cap reduction and even noss bonus! maybe then you stop whining. OR.... get 3 cap rigs. i did it without any cap rigs i just had my tank uppened so i had lowslots over for RCUt2 :) amarr is a pain in the beginning. but when bitten through that hard time. you have a race that no one can understand cause we just rule. period :) ------------------------------------ Dont make me bug you... Originally by: Nex Angelus Perhaps it was a Bugszor
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.12 08:46:00 - [46] Idea: Let the Amarr load cap booster charges into their lasers in a limited quantity to reduce/eliminate capacitor use.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.12 08:52:00 - [47] Originally by: James Duar Idea: Let the Amarr load cap booster charges into their lasers in a limited quantity to reduce/eliminate capacitor use. Aside from the problems of writing that into the game, cap booster charges arent exactly small. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Breed Love FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.12 09:28:00 - [48] Oh, another buff Amarr thread It's fine, learn2play Originally by: Wrangler We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want both anti-social and social players to grief each other!
Redback911	Posted - 2007.02.12 09:44:00 - [49] Originally by: Bugszor check this out. abaddon has 8 highslots. ever frigging thought of fitting 4 heavy diminishings and 4 mega modulated? USE YOUR WEAKNES AS A ADVANTAGE! noss the foockers dry and keep yours running. period :) Dont ever let me catch you using that setup. Abaddon was made to kill stuff, not pansy about. Fit 8 guns and that Raven will be smoke without even turning your repper on. Nosdomis the same, bring on dual rep tank it dont matter, abaddon kills all.
X99 Z990	Posted - 2007.02.12 09:47:00 - [50] Amarr ships are great, lasers are the problems. I think it would do well for them to scratch the 10% cap usage for lasers "bonus" and reduce the cap usage on them. "but they have in build damage!" ; as it stands lasers arent more powerful than other turrets anyway and take a hell of a lot to fit, how many restrictions do they need? Amarrs fitting advantage for lasers should be their powergrid not the bonus. Its often blown out of proportion how bad lasers are against armor. On most t2 ships and decent tanked ships all resistances are about the same and lasers cut through shields much faster so they can get to work on the armor sooner than other turrets. EANM + DC ect.. They do slightly ruin things for lasers i cant think of what can be done about them without ruining active hardener tanks. --- Advantage of scratching the 10% cap usage bonus would be giving amarr ships a bit of versatility or whatever they are lacking currently, its annoying rather than having a good variety of ships we have ships trying to compete with eachother. The ships themselves are great, they have good cap, good powergrid, good tanks but it will be just so much nicer to see a second notable bonus in place.
Dred'Pirate Jesus Amarr Imperial Warehousing Industries	Posted - 2007.02.12 10:01:00 - [51] Originally by: Moraguth If we really wanna go into the awesomeness of never having to buy ammo for amarr, ...... Back on the topic of crystals: I love not having to buy ammo. I can use my cargo for looting/salvaging, AND i can stay in deep 0.0 being a hermit without having to go back to a station for a VERY long time. I only have to go back if i get found and destroyed, or if i disconnect too many times and my drones are gone. It is really demeaning when you've just killed off 6M isk in bounties worth of BSs, and you have to logoff cause you can't kill the frig that is warp jamming you cause your drones got killed when you disconnected earlier that day. yeah, suckage. Unfortunately as convinient as no ammo use is for pve its the major reason Amarr are gimped pvp wise without uber skills and exspensive T2/Faction fits.. Ammo for Amarr is cap and in pvp cap is life.. Guess were that leaves us in a firefight with both the tank and the gank eating it up.. Dred'Pirate Jesus.. Not a Dev or BoB alt ..or am I?
Bugszor Caldari The Redeeming Age	Posted - 2007.02.12 10:03:00 - [52] Edited by: Bugszor on 12/02/2007 10:03:28 Originally by: Redback911 Originally by: Bugszor check this out. abaddon has 8 highslots. ever frigging thought of fitting 4 heavy diminishings and 4 mega modulated? USE YOUR WEAKNES AS A ADVANTAGE! noss the foockers dry and keep yours running. period :) Dont ever let me catch you using that setup. Abaddon was made to kill stuff, not pansy about. Fit 8 guns and that Raven will be smoke without even turning your repper on. Nosdomis the same, bring on dual rep tank it dont matter, abaddon kills all. wanna try? your abaddon versus mine. :) u'd be dead with cap and i'll be slowly shooting you to smithereens my friend. face it. without cap you're useless in your abaddon. edit:typos ------------------------------------ Dont make me bug you... Originally by: Nex Angelus Perhaps it was a Bugszor
diabolic clone Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.12 10:52:00 - [53] Originally by: Bugszor Edited by: Bugszor on 12/02/2007 10:03:28 Originally by: Redback911 Originally by: Bugszor check this out. abaddon has 8 highslots. ever frigging thought of fitting 4 heavy diminishings and 4 mega modulated? USE YOUR WEAKNES AS A ADVANTAGE! noss the foockers dry and keep yours running. period :) Dont ever let me catch you using that setup. Abaddon was made to kill stuff, not pansy about. Fit 8 guns and that Raven will be smoke without even turning your repper on. Nosdomis the same, bring on dual rep tank it dont matter, abaddon kills all. wanna try? your abaddon versus mine. :) u'd be dead with cap and i'll be slowly shooting you to smithereens my friend. face it. without cap you're useless in your abaddon. edit:typos lol heavey nos range 26 kilometers tachyon II 40km Amarr ships have huge mass, unless you fit a microwarp drive and kill your cap/tank I doubt you'd have a chance since it is unlikely your fight would start at that close of a range unless you jumped in on eachother at a gate.
Max Godsnottlingson Amarr Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2007.02.12 11:19:00 - [54] Edited by: Max Godsnottlingson on 12/02/2007 11:16:49 You know. I've been in Eve right from the start, and have never played anything other then Amarr, and generally only ever fly Amarr ships. Sure, they both have their weaknesses, but I'd not have them anyother way. That is the challenge of playing Amarr for me. Remember. Any Amarr ship that has a drone bay or missile launcher hard points doen't have to be limited to EM/Thermal damage. Nor is it manditory to fit lasers to Amarr ships, granted it may take some lateral thinking to get them working well, but a loadout of Projectile turrets on an Amarr ship can cause some nasty damage.Especially against a player pirate, who hunts Amarr, and who is tanked against EM/Thermal damage, It can be a very, very nasty surprise
Dred'Pirate Jesus Amarr Imperial Warehousing Industries	Posted - 2007.02.12 11:41:00 - [55] Edited by: Dred''Pirate Jesus on 12/02/2007 11:38:15 Originally by: Max Godsnottlingson Edited by: Max Godsnottlingson on 12/02/2007 11:16:49 You know. I've been in Eve right from the start, and have never played anything other then Amarr, and generally only ever fly Amarr ships. Sure, they both have their weaknesses, but I'd not have them anyother way. That is the challenge of playing Amarr for me. Remember. Any Amarr ship that has a drone bay or missile launcher hard points doen't have to be limited to EM/Thermal damage. Nor is it manditory to fit lasers to Amarr ships, granted it may take some lateral thinking to get them working well, but a loadout of Projectile turrets on an Amarr ship can cause some nasty damage.Especially against a player pirate, who hunts Amarr, and who is tanked against EM/Thermal damage, It can be a very, very nasty surprise Indeed.. Just imagine the look on a Blasterthron pilots face as he mwds up to a geddon and finds himself nossed webbed and scrambled with BS sized AC ripping him to shreads as the uber tank you can fit with projectiles shrugs off his blasterboat with ease.. Dred'Pirate Jesus.. Not a Dev or BoB alt ..or am I?
Clurk Brodon CthulhuFhtagn	Posted - 2007.02.12 12:11:00 - [56] Amarrs are so great they need to fit AC to be effective.
Tisanta Amarr Dragonfire Intergalactic Crusaders of Krom	Posted - 2007.02.12 12:18:00 - [57] hehe i will tell you why amarr is a nice race.. ( im an amarr pilot) abaddon 8 tach II, 3 damage mods ( death to anything in fleet!) pilgrim.. death to anything with 3+ of these ships curse.. solo doom! intys.. catch me if you can enough PG to fit atleast 50/50 nos/guns small but valuble drone bays! consider this situation.. abaddon with 8 tach II is having a hard time killing a rohk.. ( lol.. like that would ever happen) abaddon calls for backup.. [enter the curse!] curse engages and sucks the rohk dry.. bye bye tank. abaddon rapes the rohk in seconds --- Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
Mastin Dragonfly Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.12 15:21:00 - [58] Originally by: Tisanta hehe i will tell you why amarr is a nice race.. ( im an amarr pilot) abaddon 8 tach II, 3 damage mods ( death to anything in fleet!) pilgrim.. death to anything with 3+ of these ships curse.. solo doom! intys.. catch me if you can enough PG to fit atleast 50/50 nos/guns small but valuble drone bays! consider this situation.. abaddon with 8 tach II is having a hard time killing a rohk.. ( lol.. like that would ever happen) abaddon calls for backup.. [enter the curse!] curse engages and sucks the rohk dry.. bye bye tank. abaddon rapes the rohk in seconds Yay, now find something positive about any non-battleship tech 1 amarr ship besides the a-typical arbitrator.
Onchas Erivvia The Andromeda Directorate SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.12 15:30:00 - [59] Originally by: Taedrin Amarrs problem is not with their ships, but with their guns. Their ships are just about the best armor tankers out there. The problem is entirely with lasers. Lasers just aren't useful enough against armor. IMO the best way to handle Amarr is to change them from dealing EM/Thermal damage to EM/Explosive. If by "handle" you mean "uber them out to be the best thing on wheels", yeah, I guess that is a way to do it. EM/Explosive? Seriously? Please. If you really want to follow your line of reasoning, just upping the Thermal part of their damage-dealing a tiny bit would help them get through armour without making them able to melt everything in sight. ------------------------------------------ 'Teh Onchinator' Personal Assistant to MrsPitman
C4rnage	Posted - 2007.02.12 15:35:00 - [60] Sure I love my zealot, but only 4 turrets an no drones for instance going against a deimos or cerb or ishtar I mean it seems a little imbalanced, but dont get me wrong Zealot is an awesome HAC.

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