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XSANATOS
Bane and Pain
Limited Expectations
1
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Posted - 2016.04.08 11:29:11 -
[1] - Quote
We know about the mechanics from the mobile depots and lots of guys enjoy them, i am too but there is the thing with the ability to scoop it into your cargo when the depot is in reinforced mode and then you can just deploy this again somewhere else.
This need a change, i will tell you why, in SoV null for example there is lots of guys living out in space without the need of a station to dock or a tower to store stuff from data and relic sites they made.
I know a lot of guys who doing so and now you would say "hey thats cool stuff, why change" but if you own sov and you have relic hunters in your space you get realy mad about them, not only because they do your relic and data sites, also because if you begun to hunt them they just log off or just store their stuff in a depot and fly around almost empty.
What i was doing alot was scanning down the mobile depots and reinforce them to get rid of this guys and take the ablity to store stuff away but most of the time when i come back to kill the mobile depot its just scooped and because this guys trolling you, they just take the mobile depot and deploy this in the same system or close by again.
I know you can destroy them when they come out from reinforced mode as long the shield is not recharged to i believe 50%, but everyone else know about that to...
What to change?
One solution can be the change from the ability to scoop a mobile depot when its in reinforce.
Or how about changing the ability to deploy it again after it was reinforced as long you dock on a station and repair it?
Another idea could be a change from the time for the shield reload after it comes out from reinforce to 24h or something like this to prevent guys from just put this mobile depot on another place and wait till the shield is recharged.
Next thing is the containers in space, why are this containers not to scan???
Same thing as with the mobile depots should be possible, because some of this guys i talked about just changing their possibilities to use Large Audit Log Secure Container or simple Giant Secure Container.
Problem with them is simply that the Large Audit Log Secure Container has 10 million EHP, common, why ??? And only 65m-¦ to move it, so very easy to use for an Astero Pilot on vacation in null to steal your relic and data loot.
This need to be changed to something realistic, 650m-¦ and 1 million EHP.
Containers need to be scannable! |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
794
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Posted - 2016.04.08 13:14:37 -
[2] - Quote
XSANATOS wrote:I know a lot of guys who doing so and now you would say "hey thats cool stuff, why change" but if you own sov and you have relic hunters in your space you get realy mad about them, not only because they do your relic and data sites, also because if you begun to hunt them they just log off or just store their stuff in a depot and fly around almost empty.
Did not have top read any farther than this to know this is a really bad idea.
Keeping day trippers(relic hunters) out of your sov space is your problem not CCP's.
Tracking them down and killing them, repeatedly if needed is your problem not CCP's.
If your corp / alliance / coalition cannot muster enough people to handle these day trippers that is your problem not CCP's.
If you corp / alliance / coalition cares so little about the space that they will not invest the resources(players) to prevent this again that is your problem not CCP's.
The problem here is not the mobile depot the problem is not enough players in your corp / alliance / coalition care about this so they do nothing about it and you cannot have changes to the game because your group does not care.
Ignoring my personal beliefs as stated above your idea would not change the situation anyway.
Mobile depot cannot be deployed because timer, no problem I have several more in my cargo hold specifically to handle this situation. So you still end up chasing the day tripper around your sov space and that casuses me to wonder what bad idea you would could up with then. |
XSANATOS
Bane and Pain
Limited Expectations
2
|
Posted - 2016.04.08 16:10:42 -
[3] - Quote
I believe you not getting the point of a daytripper and the guys who just living with to good oportunitys out there... |
Nazzarus
Grey-Wolf Inc.
Limited Expectations
0
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Posted - 2016.04.08 18:49:54 -
[4] - Quote
If you reinforce a mobile depot, it turns into a data site. Original owner can still scoop, anyone can attempt to hack it. 2 failed attempts and you are locked from trying again, tied to that ship (like drone reconnects) |
Praal
Bearded BattleBears
I N F A M O U S
52
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Posted - 2016.04.09 07:38:31 -
[5] - Quote
XSANATOS wrote:I know a lot of guys who doing so and now you would say "hey thats cool stuff, why change" but if you own sov and you have relic hunters in your space you get realy mad about them, not only because they do your relic and data sites, also because if you begun to hunt them they just log off or just store their stuff in a depot and fly around almost empty.
Here's a simpler method that doesn't involve CCP fixing it for you:
Wait for them in a site and kill them.
Also, wait for them at their depot and kill them.
Repeat until they realize it's far more efficient to move on to less dangerous areas (of which there's a lot). |
Rohan VanHeighten
Caldari Mustard Race
Local Is Primary
0
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Posted - 2016.04.09 07:50:02 -
[6] - Quote
I support the idea that depots should not be scoopable while in reinforced mode.
As it stands right now they are too effective a means of storing things in space with minimal risk - For example it's extremely common for people in fac war to use depots deployed in enemy militia lowsec to store spare fittings, scooped loot and much more in space knowing that if they are attacked they have a full reinforcement timer to simply come and scoop it, along with its contents.
You should not be able to have assets sitting in space, so safe and risk free.
Making them unscoopable while reinforced does not effect its function at all. What it does do is gives their owners reasons to not simply leave their assets (possibly expensive shinies, spare fittings etc) in space unguarded unless they are willing to risk their depots and its contents. Like all other assets in space, they must be guarded/removed or else.
Almost all other deployables are unusable or destroyed when attacked. POS mods become unusable and unachorable, MTUs are destroyed. All containers go pop. Why depots so strong.
A quote from pilgriminexile.wordpress.com written awhile back sums it up pretty much perfectly:
"Frankly, I think the invulnerability timer is overpowered. It is virtually impossible to destroy and loot the mobile depot of an even semi-attentive owner. All the owner has to do is warp to the depot, scoop it, scoop any dropped cargo and warp away. This can be done in under 30 seconds. I suppose in nullsec or j-space you could put a large warp disruption bubble around it, but you would still have to camp it for 48 hours straight. So, if you want to use it to store stuff, it is pretty safe to do so." |
Elyia Suze Nagala
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
98
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Posted - 2016.04.09 10:20:16 -
[7] - Quote
XSANATOS wrote:We know about the mechanics from the mobile depots and lots of guys enjoy them, i am too but there is the thing with the ability to scoop it into your cargo when the depot is in reinforced mode and then you can just deploy this again somewhere else.
This need a change, i will tell you why, in SoV null for example there is lots of guys living out in space without the need of a station to dock or a tower to store stuff from data and relic sites they made.
I know a lot of guys who doing so and now you would say "hey thats cool stuff, why change" but if you own sov and you have relic hunters in your space you get realy mad about them, not only because they do your relic and data sites, also because if you begun to hunt them they just log off or just store their stuff in a depot and fly around almost empty.
What i was doing alot was scanning down the mobile depots and reinforce them to get rid of this guys and take the ablity to store stuff away but most of the time when i come back to kill the mobile depot its just scooped and because this guys trolling you, they just take the mobile depot and deploy this in the same system or close by again.
I know you can destroy them when they come out from reinforced mode as long the shield is not recharged to i believe 50%, but everyone else know about that to...
What to change?
One solution can be the change from the ability to scoop a mobile depot when its in reinforce.
Or how about changing the ability to deploy it again after it was reinforced as long you dock on a station and repair it?
Another idea could be a change from the time for the shield reload after it comes out from reinforce to 24h or something like this to prevent guys from just put this mobile depot on another place and wait till the shield is recharged.
Next thing is the containers in space, why are this containers not to scan???
Same thing as with the mobile depots should be possible, because some of this guys i talked about just changing their possibilities to use Large Audit Log Secure Container or simple Giant Secure Container.
Problem with them is simply that the Large Audit Log Secure Container has 10 million EHP, common, why ??? And only 65m-¦ to move it, so very easy to use for an Astero Pilot on vacation in null to steal your relic and data loot.
This need to be changed to something realistic, 650m-¦ and 1 million EHP.
Containers need to be scannable!
Seconded |
Iain Cariaba
2906
|
Posted - 2016.04.09 11:09:18 -
[8] - Quote
Rohan VanHeighten wrote:I support the idea that depots should not be scoopable while in reinforced mode.
As it stands right now they are too effective a means of storing things in space with minimal risk - For example it's extremely common for people in fac war to use depots deployed in enemy militia lowsec to store spare fittings, scooped loot and much more in space knowing that if they are attacked they have a full reinforcement timer to simply come and scoop it, along with its contents.
You should not be able to have assets sitting in space, so safe and risk free.
Making them unscoopable while reinforced does not effect its function at all. What it does do is gives their owners reasons to not simply leave their assets (possibly expensive shinies, spare fittings etc) in space unguarded unless they are willing to risk their depots and its contents. Like all other assets in space, they must be guarded/removed or else.
Almost all other deployables are unusable or destroyed when attacked. POS mods become unusable and unachorable, MTUs are destroyed. All containers go pop. Why depots so strong.
A quote from pilgriminexile.wordpress.com written awhile back sums it up pretty much perfectly:
"Frankly, I think the invulnerability timer is overpowered. It is virtually impossible to destroy and loot the mobile depot of an even semi-attentive owner. All the owner has to do is warp to the depot, scoop it, scoop any dropped cargo and warp away. This can be done in under 30 seconds. I suppose in nullsec or j-space you could put a large warp disruption bubble around it, but you would still have to camp it for 48 hours straight. So, if you want to use it to store stuff, it is pretty safe to do so."
- Show info on depot.
- Check killboards for activity time of player who owns depot.
- Setup ambush for player at that time.
Not really that difficult.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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XSANATOS
Bane and Pain
Limited Expectations
19
|
Posted - 2016.04.09 14:27:31 -
[9] - Quote
Praal wrote:XSANATOS wrote:I know a lot of guys who doing so and now you would say "hey thats cool stuff, why change" but if you own sov and you have relic hunters in your space you get realy mad about them, not only because they do your relic and data sites, also because if you begun to hunt them they just log off or just store their stuff in a depot and fly around almost empty. Here's a simpler method that doesn't involve CCP fixing it for you: Wait for them in a site and kill them. Also, wait for them at their depot and kill them. Repeat until they realize it's far more efficient to move on to less dangerous areas (of which there's a lot).
Waiting for them in a site is what we are doing but this guys are clever enough to not touch a site where someone is in local from us !
Wait for them on the depot is not helping, tried this plenty times, not effective.
Repeat this means you do nothing else and you wanna do something else...
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Rohan VanHeighten
Caldari Mustard Race
Local Is Primary
0
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Posted - 2016.04.10 08:52:14 -
[10] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:- Show info on depot.
- Check killboards for activity time of player who owns depot.
- Setup ambush for player at that time.
Not really that difficult.
You responded to my post but didn't raise any sort of counter arguments for any of the points I made, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume not a troll. I'll break the points down for you, so its a bit easier this time.
So lets look at it a different way, and take the owner out of the equation
Say we just want to destroy depots (aka "just hunt them lol" is not a suitable answer)
Do you think they should have such a long reinforcement timer?
POCOs and POS's dont even have timers that long.
Should they be scoopable while reinforced?
There is not a single deployable besides depots that can be undeployed/used when reinforced.
Should players be able to store things in them, essentially risk free for at least 48 hours of guaranteed reinforcement timer protection?
What other deployable comes even close to being this op in terms of safe storage?? |
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Cataclysm Ven
Shield Nation
Limited Expectations
0
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Posted - 2016.04.16 01:28:08 -
[11] - Quote
The Mobile Depot mechanics should certainly be looked into by CCP. The Current mechanics don't seem to follow the risk/reward system found in other areas of Eve. Reinforcement timers are designed to create conflict and allowing a reinforced Depot to be scooped at any time during the 48 hour reinforcement does not create fights. The attacker must remain vigilant for 48 hours while the defender can be in and out in under minute. If pilots want to hide their space treasures in plain sight there should be some risk attached.
One part of a possible solution is already in game. The upgraded versions of the Mobile Depot are harder to scan down. The "Yurt" Depot is needs very high scanning skills in fully scan. But this is currently pointless as you can just move the cheap one if some one finds it.
Removing the ability to scoop during reinforcement would a be a quick fix.
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Cyrus Tybalt
Blap n Pew
5
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Posted - 2016.04.16 11:36:10 -
[12] - Quote
Nazzarus wrote:If you reinforce a mobile depot, it turns into a data site. Original owner can still scoop, anyone can attempt to hack it. 2 failed attempts and you are locked from trying again, tied to that ship (like drone reconnects)
IMO, all containers and deployables with cargospace should be hackable with a data analyzer.
The concept that you can just "leave" high value cargo in a flimsy little box in space completely unguarded, especially lawless space like null, low and w-space and expect it to be completely safe there all on it's own is a silly one to begin with.
Only POS with a protective forcefield should offer this luxury.
And I'm speaking as a "professional" daytripping relic hunter now. (But I never use mobile depots for storage, only for refitting) |
Cyrus Tybalt
Blap n Pew
5
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Posted - 2016.04.16 11:41:15 -
[13] - Quote
Cataclysm Ven wrote:The Mobile Depot mechanics should certainly be looked into by CCP. The Current mechanics don't seem to follow the risk/reward system found in other areas of Eve. Reinforcement timers are designed to create conflict and allowing a reinforced Depot to be scooped at any time during the 48 hour reinforcement does not create fights. The attacker must remain vigilant for 48 hours while the defender can be in and out in under minute. If pilots want to hide their space treasures in plain sight there should be some risk attached.
One part of a possible solution is already in game. The upgraded versions of the Mobile Depot are harder to scan down. The "Yurt" Depot is needs very high scanning skills in fully scan. But this is currently pointless as you can just move the cheap one if some one finds it.
Removing the ability to scoop during reinforcement would a be a quick fix.
During reinforcement I can agree that the ability to scoop should be negated.
I'd like to be able to quickly deploy and scoop for refitting the ship though.
Frankly, I don't understand why the Mobile Depot should have any cargospace at all. I think it should be more geared for refitting your ship without being docked rather than a practically free "storage hold" with reinforcement capabilities.
If you're gonna daytrip and live out in space that you don't own and hunting high risk relic sites, you should be forced to adhere to the limits of your ships cargohold if you want to store your loot safely. |
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