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Eragon Thiestant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.08.01 17:14:09 -
[1] - Quote
As the title says, I am wondering if there is ever going to be Tech 2 tier 3 battlecruisers, like the Talos, Oracle, Tornado, ect. Just wondering if there are actually any plans for said things or if it is something that is never going to happen.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
17165
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Posted - 2016.08.01 17:18:55 -
[2] - Quote
what would a t2 variant of any of these ships offer?
Better the Devil you know.
=]|[=
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Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
1681
|
Posted - 2016.08.01 17:26:27 -
[3] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:what would a t2 variant of any of these ships offer?
Fitting bonus to citadel weapons, obviously. |
Neph
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
Heiian Conglomerate
417
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Posted - 2016.08.01 17:39:35 -
[4] - Quote
T2 resist profile. tbh I kind of feel that the Attack BCs are basically already almost T2 ships.
~ Gariushi YC110 // Midular YC115 // Yanala YC115 ~
GÇ£Sitasutone nabeliwatsa-shogi; Otre Jaitovalte hessami-ettogi useuus sufat. Eika, hakkit garuketsi.GÇ¥
-Yakiya Tovil-Toba-taisoka
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Legion
17766
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Posted - 2016.08.01 17:39:41 -
[5] - Quote
Sentient Blade wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:what would a t2 variant of any of these ships offer? Fitting bonus to citadel weapons, obviously.
Hull mounted giga cannon. The ultimate in point and shoot. |
Eragon Thiestant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.08.01 18:02:18 -
[6] - Quote
I mean personally I think they should be able to fit mini doomsday devices, would work nicely imo.
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Sonya Corvinus
Static-Noise
Upholders
423
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Posted - 2016.08.01 18:03:16 -
[7] - Quote
Let's try to balance the ships we have before adding more |
Serene Repose
2570
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Posted - 2016.08.01 18:04:09 -
[8] - Quote
I think these gents are referring to the battle cruiser that can fire large weapons.
The battlecruiser certainly presents itself as the ideal weapon. Small to big ships, big to small ships. Medium guns with frigate stopping potential. Enough medium guns to go nose to nose with battleships...if only....and there has always been a tad of a shortfall - a hair more tank, a tad more weapon capability...cap/pwr...a slot here or there.... I've always found this interesting.
In a way, I guess, you can say the BC pays for being on that line. Instead of being the swatter of choice, it threatens to be the clumsy uncle who'd be fabulous if he'd stop falling down. Allowing the T3 cruiser to have dominion over the BC still sticks in my craw. I'd certainly prefer flying a form of a 'cane that could thump a Loki, to flying a Loki.
Could be choosing to mod the BC instead of the cruiser T3-style woulda made a monster, but isn't that what we all really want the BC to be, THE MONSTER??? Instead it's in a niche where you almost grab it, but change your mind...not enough this....or that.
Unless...you want a sniper...or a command ship...then....I've always said we need a specific command ship for each race, instead of the T2 BC filling this role. The BC is your brawling middleweight given office duties...or, the dirty job.
Instead of making a T3 BC, I'd suggest they totally create another ship for command ship, and convert the sets of T2 BCs to purely combat roles. No ECM. No oversized weapons. No command module boosts. Tank and spank. Scoot and shoot.
We must accommodate the idiocracy.
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Legion
17766
|
Posted - 2016.08.01 18:05:23 -
[9] - Quote
Sonya Corvinus wrote:Let's try to balance the ships we have before adding more
Seems the only way to get right of the balance legion and cancer is to bring out an even more powerful ship line. |
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers
Fidelas Constans
86
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Posted - 2016.08.01 18:54:29 -
[10] - Quote
I take it the Balance Legion has certain biases towards specific ship classes.
But either way, given we've already got Tech 3 Destroyers and Cruisers, I would imagine that the opportunity is there for Tech 3 Battlecruisers (or new tech 2 battlecruisers), or even Tech 3 Battleships. Those would be the ones with the mini-Doomsdays a la Drifter Battleship. If I can't fly a Drifter Battleship someday, at least give me one of those. |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
1171
|
Posted - 2016.08.01 18:58:32 -
[11] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Sentient Blade wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:what would a t2 variant of any of these ships offer? Fitting bonus to citadel weapons, obviously. Hull mounted giga cannon. The ultimate in point and shoot.
No pointing required. Fixed cannon with a 180-¦ angle. Obliterates everything close by but is no more than a little psshh in 5 km distance. Repulsion like an earthquake. One gun mounted in front, on in rear. Every shot sends you a thousand km away. Tears the ship apart when fired simultaneously.
Finally a suicide ag weapon for hs.
Remove insurance.
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Isajah
Girl Friends Please Ignore
League of Unaligned Master Pilots
9
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Posted - 2016.08.02 06:41:37 -
[12] - Quote
Remember Wing Commander Prophecy, when they magicly strapped a huge plasma gun crystal to the ship? That crystal would also fit nicely into the middle space of the Naga.
Me wants Comet mining
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Mephiztopheleze
Laphroaig Inc.
841
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Posted - 2016.08.02 07:05:51 -
[13] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:what would a t2 variant of any of these ships offer?
Basically more of the same that Attack BCs offer currently: HUGE damage at a relatively low cost in both ISK and SP coupled with minimal tank and fairly low mass.
That last one is of great concern for wormhole dunking. You can throw a surprising number of Attack BCs through a wormhole to engage targets of opportunity without risking getting stranded by mass limits. Personally, I'd like to see CCP do a little more work on Battleships before tending to BCs.
The Talos, Oracle and Tornado are all in a pretty good place IMHO.
Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze
This is my Forum Main. My Combat Alt is sambo Inkura
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Valkin Mordirc
2252
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Posted - 2016.08.02 07:51:42 -
[14] - Quote
I don't think currently there is a need for a tech 2 ABC. Just rebalance of the current ship line would be nice. The T3D's need to be reworked, T3C's are still in need of a balance pass. The Balance Legion need to reworked. The Exploit Pirates need small tweaks, mainly the Gila.
#DeleteTheWeak
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Pinkylein
Rolling Static
Sleeping Dragons
21
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Posted - 2016.08.02 11:53:57 -
[15] - Quote
Think for a t2 -attack battlecruiser there could be some extended effect on how it works.
It already can use large weapons. But how about this:
- Can MJD itself every 5 min over 100km range.
- Can change into a stationary mode (maybe something like the t3d-modes you can change in between).
- Mode-Switch has no cooldown, but the switching itself takes 35s. from basic level
- In stationary mode, it cannot move at all and cannot warp.
- Cannot cloak while beeing in stationary
Factionbased-Skill-Bonus
Something like 4% of shield/armor damage resists
5% Damage per Skilllevel
SpecificShipClassBonus
10% Decrease of Mode-Switching Time per level (to a max of 20,6s if i calculated it correctly)
37,5% increase of jump-range based on basic level for every skilllevel (to a max of 250km).
Role Bonus:
- -xxxx % CPU/PG requirements for large weapons
- Shooting not in Stationary mode gets a -50% tracking bonus and -75% damage bonus.
- Shooting in stationary mode gets a 25% tracking bonus, a 50% targeting range bonus, a 200% optimal range bonus and 250% rate of fire bonus.
Basic +3 to Warpcorestab
You can compare it with a stationary artillery, that can be used for tremendous damage once it's set up, but vulnerable whilst shooting as it's sitting as a duck and not very useful for normal fights due to it's decreasing damage bonus for not beeing in stationary.
Just a small idea. |
Roenok Baalnorn
Sadistically Sinister
268
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Posted - 2016.08.02 12:48:40 -
[16] - Quote
Sonya Corvinus wrote:Let's try to balance the ships we have before adding more Ships dont need balancing, people just need to learn how to fit and fly them and how to counter them. Any ship in this game can be countered with another ship in this game that equals balance.
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Memphis Baas
1862
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Posted - 2016.08.02 12:58:06 -
[17] - Quote
So, T2 ships are super-specialized versions of T1 ships. And changing modes is in the realm of T3 not T2.
IMO, the attack battlecruisers should have been T2 from the beginning, because "attack" is a super-specialized role. Example HAC vs. T1 cruiser, AF vs. frigate.
So I'd be ok with CCP turning the current ships into T2 ships (upping the skill prerequisites and forcing everyone to train more, but keeping the power of the ships the same), and then I'd be ok with CCP giving you some T3 version with a gimmick ability. |
Elmund Egivand
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
1279
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Posted - 2016.08.02 13:02:07 -
[18] - Quote
Give them all Wave Motion Guns.
A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
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Chopper Rollins
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
1460
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Posted - 2016.08.02 13:34:42 -
[19] - Quote
T2 doesn't mean OMG UBER it means Fleet Role.
First devise a role in fleets for the ABC with a T2 resist profile.
Then predict how the ship will actually be used by players.
My tornado can already handle a few nibbles from gate n station guns, so the T2 ABC would probably end up being the multiboxed gatecamp ship of choice.
Can't really see a place for this.
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
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Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1156
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Posted - 2016.08.02 14:54:17 -
[20] - Quote
As long as the T2 Naga can mount Torps, I'm all for it.
That said, if you want a T2 Fleet role, push the ships further. Make them all bonuses to close combat weapons with Caldari favoring Torps to keep them unique. Keep hp low so the T2 resists do not push the ships over the edge. Make them fast in a straight line but with bad turning/agility. Make them get close, do high DPS and hope they can get out. |
Lugia3
Total Insecurity
Psychotic Tendencies.
1507
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 15:09:12 -
[21] - Quote
Role bonus:
250% Small Blaster rate of fire
1000% Small Blaster optimal range
Gas small ships.
"CCP Dolan is full of shit." - CCP Bettik
Remove Sov!
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Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1158
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 15:26:07 -
[22] - Quote
Lugia3 wrote:Role bonus:
250% Small Blaster rate of fire
1000% Small Blaster optimal range
Gas small ships.
Why not use a destroyer? Far cheaper. |
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
1690
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 18:24:26 -
[23] - Quote
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:Lugia3 wrote:Role bonus:
250% Small Blaster rate of fire
1000% Small Blaster optimal range
Gas small ships. Why not use a destroyer? Far cheaper.
Do you realllllyy want to see a destroyer with neutrons doing 750 dps at 70km with near perfect tracking? |
Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1161
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 18:40:22 -
[24] - Quote
Sentient Blade wrote:Lady Ayeipsia wrote:Lugia3 wrote:Role bonus:
250% Small Blaster rate of fire
1000% Small Blaster optimal range
Gas small ships. Why not use a destroyer? Far cheaper. Do you realllllyy want to see a destroyer with neutrons doing 750 dps at 70km with near perfect tracking?
Depends.... Am I the one flying or or the one fighting it?
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Serene Repose
2572
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Posted - 2016.08.02 18:42:44 -
[25] - Quote
The role for an ABC...most interesting part of the discussion. The role for the BS? Also interesting. Having a role for the BS (sans the HAC) pulls the ABC into a role. The idea being pulling the larger subcaps back into the game. Lookit what someone just said about small guns, and turning a BC into a dessy....whatevah....small ships own the game right now. THAT'S the discussion.
Bring the BS back into the game, brings the BC back into it. Give us BCs withOUT command ship buffs, but usable combat role buffs, (or features.) If the gankers want to spend their lives buying and suiciding dessies, fine. If the low-expectation crowd wants to small gang roam in frigs, fine.
Expanded warfare? Give us the tools. We'll do the rest. Promise. Screw the capital ship debacle. Flying planets. BSs and BCs is where the real action SHOULD be. Give the noobs something to train for, not something to juke.
We must accommodate the idiocracy.
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Valkin Mordirc
2269
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 21:08:38 -
[26] - Quote
Pinkylein wrote:Think for a t2 -attack battlecruiser there could be some extended effect on how it works.
It already can use large weapons. But how about this:
- Can MJD itself every 5 min over 100km range.
- Can change into a stationary mode (maybe something like the t3d-modes you can change in between).
- Mode-Switch has no cooldown, but the switching itself takes 35s. from basic level
- In stationary mode, it cannot move at all and cannot warp.
- Cannot cloak while beeing in stationary
Factionbased-Skill-Bonus
Something like 4% of shield/armor damage resists
5% Damage per Skilllevel
SpecificShipClassBonus
10% Decrease of Mode-Switching Time per level (to a max of 20,6s if i calculated it correctly)
37,5% increase of jump-range based on basic level for every skilllevel (to a max of 250km).
Role Bonus:
- -xxxx % CPU/PG requirements for large weapons
- Shooting not in Stationary mode gets a -50% tracking bonus and -75% damage bonus.
- Shooting in stationary mode gets a 25% tracking bonus, a 50% targeting range bonus, a 200% optimal range bonus and 250% rate of fire bonus.
Basic +3 to Warpcorestab
You can compare it with a stationary artillery, that can be used for tremendous damage once it's set up, but vulnerable whilst shooting as it's sitting as a duck and not very useful for normal fights due to it's decreasing damage bonus for not beeing in stationary.
Just a small idea.
ABC's were not given MJD for a reason. Long range weapons plus a 250km GTFO card is way to OP.
#DeleteTheWeak
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Eragon Thiestant
Trump 2016 MAGA
3
|
Posted - 2016.08.02 22:31:37 -
[27] - Quote
Valkin Mordirc wrote:Pinkylein wrote:Think for a t2 -attack battlecruiser there could be some extended effect on how it works.
It already can use large weapons. But how about this:
- Can MJD itself every 5 min over 100km range.
- Can change into a stationary mode (maybe something like the t3d-modes you can change in between).
- Mode-Switch has no cooldown, but the switching itself takes 35s. from basic level
- In stationary mode, it cannot move at all and cannot warp.
- Cannot cloak while beeing in stationary
Factionbased-Skill-Bonus
Something like 4% of shield/armor damage resists
5% Damage per Skilllevel
SpecificShipClassBonus
10% Decrease of Mode-Switching Time per level (to a max of 20,6s if i calculated it correctly)
37,5% increase of jump-range based on basic level for every skilllevel (to a max of 250km).
Role Bonus:
- -xxxx % CPU/PG requirements for large weapons
- Shooting not in Stationary mode gets a -50% tracking bonus and -75% damage bonus.
- Shooting in stationary mode gets a 25% tracking bonus, a 50% targeting range bonus, a 200% optimal range bonus and 250% rate of fire bonus.
Basic +3 to Warpcorestab
You can compare it with a stationary artillery, that can be used for tremendous damage once it's set up, but vulnerable whilst shooting as it's sitting as a duck and not very useful for normal fights due to it's decreasing damage bonus for not beeing in stationary.
Just a small idea. ABC's were not given MJD for a reason. Long range weapons plus a 250km GTFO card is way to OP.
Well the way that it could be balanced is that it wouldn't be able to boosh while being in stationary mode, outside of that sure.
.
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Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
981
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Posted - 2016.08.02 23:37:04 -
[28] - Quote
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:Sentient Blade wrote:Lady Ayeipsia wrote:Lugia3 wrote:Role bonus:
250% Small Blaster rate of fire
1000% Small Blaster optimal range
Gas small ships. Why not use a destroyer? Far cheaper. Do you realllllyy want to see a destroyer with neutrons doing 750 dps at 70km with near perfect tracking? Depends.... Am I the one flying or or the one fighting it?
That's between you and your wallet.
"Tomahawks?"
"----in' A, right?"
"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."
"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
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Serene Repose
2581
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Posted - 2016.08.03 00:06:23 -
[29] - Quote
Every class has long-ranged weapons. Every race has specialized sniper capability. Why are we discussing "long-ranged weapons" in a convo about battle cruisers? Folks aren't hung up on the ONE that can mount large guns...the ultimate glass cannon, are they?
Each race has at least THREE battle cruisers. What is this, some sort of astigmatism?
My comments have to do with the OTHER (apparently) BCs not an object of fixation...the T2s called "Command" something or others. Make THOSE into brawling combat ships. I wasn't talking about the cute little ship we were tossed which appeals to gankers, mainly.
No...wait...we are tailoring to two-dimensional thinking. SORRY!
We must accommodate the idiocracy.
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
830
|
Posted - 2016.08.03 03:32:25 -
[30] - Quote
Roenok Baalnorn wrote:Sonya Corvinus wrote:Let's try to balance the ships we have before adding more Ships dont need balancing, people just need to learn how to fit and fly them and how to counter them. Any ship in this game can be countered with another ship in this game that equals balance.
I would argue that certain minmatar ships need a fittings nerf (svipul, sleipnir, talwar) and that therr certainly is a need for some work on balancing. Particularly with the corax/2mids/torp&cruise throwers and probably at this point a removal of the concept of slippery pete tengus.
How you achieve that last one is a matter of debate but I'd suggest just make the nullifier sub give no slots and no fittings. |
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