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DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:51:00 - [61] Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: DarkMatter Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 16:45:05 Quote: The buyout is the reserve? I'm missing something here, I thought there was no reserve, just a minimum and a buyout? Just like any real auction, the buy it now price is your reserve until you deem otherwise... Once someone bids, the buyout price goes away, and the reserve is the minimum... If the DEV's had any ******* clue at all, when you entered the buyout price, by default that would become your reserve until you retype in that box whatever you want as a price to part with that item... So you put up an auction where the minimum valid bid is the same as the maximum valid bid? Go look at a buy it now ebay auction please... Building the homestead
Raivi Explosion Matrix	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:54:00 - [62] It would make no sense for the Buyout to always be the same as the Reserve. Why would anyone ever bid on a auction with a buyout then? ----------------------------------------- Explosion Matrix: Our Name Makes No Sense
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:57:00 - [63] Originally by: DarkMatter Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: DarkMatter Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 16:45:05 Quote: The buyout is the reserve? I'm missing something here, I thought there was no reserve, just a minimum and a buyout? Just like any real auction, the buy it now price is your reserve until you deem otherwise... Once someone bids, the buyout price goes away, and the reserve is the minimum... If the DEV's had any ******* clue at all, when you entered the buyout price, by default that would become your reserve until you retype in that box whatever you want as a price to part with that item... So you put up an auction where the minimum valid bid is the same as the maximum valid bid? Go look at a buy it now ebay auction please... I have absolutely no idea what you're on about? How can your reserve equal your buyout? In the case there is no auction, only direct purchase. Which is irrelevant, as, AFAIK, there is no reserve in the Eve-O auctions? - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:57:00 - [64] Originally by: Raivi It would make no sense for the Buyout to always be the same as the Reserve. Why would anyone ever bid on a auction with a buyout then? As I said, go look at an eBay buy it now auction. Some are that price only. Some are that price which is lower than the reserve if you BUY IT NOW. Neither of which a minimum bid is the reserve... I'm saying by default it is that price, and you manually change the reserve to whatever you want after... No more billion ISK stuff going for 1 ISK... Building the homestead
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:59:00 - [65] Quote: How can your reserve equal your buyout? In the case there is no auction, only direct purchase. Which is irrelevant, as, AFAIK, there is no reserve in the Eve-O auctions? Exactly, which points to the bad coding! Instead of a robust system, CCP gave us a broken one.. Building the homestead
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:59:00 - [66] Originally by: DarkMatter Originally by: Raivi It would make no sense for the Buyout to always be the same as the Reserve. Why would anyone ever bid on a auction with a buyout then? As I said, go look at an eBay buy it now auction. Some are that price only. Some are that price which is lower than the reserve if you BUY IT NOW. Neither of which a minimum bid is the reserve... I'm saying by default it is that price, and you manually change the reserve to whatever you want after... No more billion ISK stuff going for 1 ISK... Yes, ebay supports direct purchase using buy it now. This has nothing to do with anything, as Eve-O implements this using a seperate contract, Item Exchange, which is not the mechanic this thread is about. Also, do Eve-O auctions have reserve capability or not? - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:00:00 - [67] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 15/03/2007 16:57:51 Originally by: DarkMatter Quote: How can your reserve equal your buyout? In the case there is no auction, only direct purchase. Which is irrelevant, as, AFAIK, there is no reserve in the Eve-O auctions? Exactly, which points to the bad coding! Instead of a robust system, CCP gave us a broken one.. No, it points to not supporting reserves in auctions, so what? All reserve would allow you to do in this case is emulate Item Exchange, and have safety net for people too stupid to read/write correctly? - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:05:00 - [68] Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 17:02:21 Originally by: Crumplecorn Edited by: Crumplecorn on 15/03/2007 16:57:51 Originally by: DarkMatter Quote: How can your reserve equal your buyout? In the case there is no auction, only direct purchase. Which is irrelevant, as, AFAIK, there is no reserve in the Eve-O auctions? Exactly, which points to the bad coding! Instead of a robust system, CCP gave us a broken one.. No, it points to not supporting reserves in auctions, so what? All reserve would allow you to do in this case is emulate Item Exchange, and have safety net for people too stupid to read/write correctly? HELLO, McFLY? What exacly do you have to do in EVE to avoid this scam??? YOU HAVE TO ENTER A MIN BID THE SAME AS THE BUYOUT or none at all if I'm not mistaken. Which is what? Esentially a SALE/Item exchange. By default, when you type in a buyout, your min bid should be entered in as that price until you change it... All auctions have a buyout, reserve, min bid an even min bid interval... CCP simply did not code it properly... Building the homestead
Jaggeh Gallente Furious Angels	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:11:00 - [69] lawl no cure for stupidity --------------------------------------- Furious Angels are recruiting Carpe Pugya Pyga - Seize the Buttocks
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:13:00 - [70] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 15/03/2007 17:12:03 Edited by: Crumplecorn on 15/03/2007 17:11:01 Originally by: DarkMatter HELLO, McFLY? Hi. o/ Originally by: DarkMatter What exacly do you have to do in EVE to avoid this scam??? Apparently, have a clue. Originally by: DarkMatter YOU HAVE TO ENTER A MIN BID THE SAME AS THE BUYOUT or none at all if I'm not mistaken. Which is what? Esentially a SALE/Item exchange. The latter, and that's actually what you have to do to fall victim to the scam. Originally by: DarkMatter By default, when you type in a buyout, your min bid should be entered in as that price until you change it... No it shouldn't. People might (and I know this is crazy, bear with with) actually want to use the auction system to have an auction, not to directly sell something, and they may not want a minimum bid on it, maybe they are happy with the default. If you make the default equal to the buyout, what you have is an overcomplicated item exchange by default. Guess what, if you try to sell something worth 500M and the best buy order is 1 ISK, it's going to say 1ISK in the little box! Ohnoes! Originally by: DarkMatter All auctions have a buyout, reserve, min bid an even min bid interval... Negative. Originally by: DarkMatter CCP simply did not code it properly... This is a design, not coding, issue anyway. - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:19:00 - [71] Minimum bid is atarting bid, not reserve... In the EVE auction however, it is... Which is wrong... Building the homestead
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:23:00 - [72] Originally by: DarkMatter Minimum bid is atarting bid, not reserve... In the EVE auction however, it is... Which is wrong... Eve auctions have no reserve, which is fine... - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
Ebedar Gallente Primary Intelligence	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:30:00 - [73] Same guy tried to scam me, heh. Anyway, private Item Exchange contracts only cost 10,000 ISK to set up and can be claimed anywhere. Jaa'dhu: On The Run - Part 1 & Part 2
RaWBLooD	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:34:00 - [74] i am dumbfounded with how many people dont realize what an AUCTION IS.
Gift Amarr Loot Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:35:00 - [75] Thanks for the warning, it takes guts to admit you made a mistake on these forums. Alot of little flamers about just waiting to insult someone. Pirates of Eve, Join channel "Pirate" Today!
RaWBLooD	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:36:00 - [76] Originally by: Gift Thanks for the warning, it takes guts to admit you made a mistake on these forums. Alot of little flamers about just waiting to insult someone. excuse me ? it takes guts to admit that you dont know what an auction is ? how about common sense ? (which is the least common denominator for intelligence)
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:36:00 - [77] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 15/03/2007 17:34:27 Originally by: Gift Thanks for the warning, it takes guts to admit you made a mistake on these forums. Alot of little flamers about just waiting to insult someone. STFU NOO... Wait, no, sorry, jumped the gun a bit, so tense sitting here waiting for ~~noobs~~ gutsy people of lesser intelligence to flame. - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:38:00 - [78] Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: DarkMatter Minimum bid is starting bid, not reserve... In the EVE auction however, it is... Which is wrong... Eve auctions have no reserve, which is fine... Then CCP would not have said it's not working as intended... The DEV who setup this contract system made a mistake... So it's time for them to fix it already... Building the homestead
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:40:00 - [79] Originally by: DarkMatter Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: DarkMatter Minimum bid is starting bid, not reserve... In the EVE auction however, it is... Which is wrong... Eve auctions have no reserve, which is fine... Then CCP would not have said it's not working as intended... The DEV who setup this contract system made a mistake... So it's time for them to fix it already... I believe they said they are making changes, I don't think they said anything about it not working right. Simply, they wildly overestimated the intelligence of the playerbase, and now need to add a few extra layers of MOM and POP Brand Retard Proofing. People being too stupid to use it does not constitute it being broken. - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:51:00 - [80] Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 17:49:38 Quote: I believe they said they are making changes, I don't think they said anything about it not working right. Not working as intended pretty much means it's broken, lol... Maybe it's the air over there in Iceland, but they don't know how an auction works I guess, and it shows in their first attempt to make a contract system in-game... If you enter 500,000 in any box in an auction, sorry, but the item can't go fo any less than that unless you do more work to make that happen... And putting in a starting bid does not constitute a resereve This is not the first time thie UI has ****** ppl over... Building the homestead
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:52:00 - [81] Heheh. Mom and pop retard proofing. Why is it people who don't understand what 'minimum bid' means are the ones who find freaking officer spawns and 10 billion isk BPOs their corps give them? WHY WHY WHY!? stomps his foot It's not fair I tell you. ITS NOT FAIR! - - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - or automatic signatures - - - - - - - - "186,282 miles per second; It's not just a good idea, it's the law."
Fafnir Drake Gallente Boob Heads	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:08:00 - [82] Edited by: Fafnir Drake on 15/03/2007 18:04:36 I'm new to this game but have some first hand knowledge of how to get yourself scammed via other MMOs. My offical stance? Ya want x items. I'm setting min bid same as buyout. Tax be damned. Take it or leave it. Sorry for ya tho. Scammers are scum. ------ "A wise man once told me never to argue with an idiot. They will bring you down to their level, and then beat you with experience."
Exlegion New Light Schism.	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:09:00 - [83] Edited by: Exlegion on 15/03/2007 18:10:12 Wow! Lots of flaming because he came into the forums to help others avoid his mistake. Relax folks. DUSKULL isn't whining, he's not dumb, he's not an ass, he's not [insert whatever demeaning term you'd like to use here] just because he may not fully understand the auction system in Eve. He got burnt for it. He said he'll recover and is warning. If you're way 'above the norm' in I.Q. then just go on to another thread more in line with your caliber of intelligence and don't waste your precious time on this one. Simple? You would think. No need to insult him.
RaWBLooD	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:52:00 - [84] Originally by: DarkMatter Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 17:49:38 Quote: I believe they said they are making changes, I don't think they said anything about it not working right. Not working as intended pretty much means it's broken, lol... Maybe it's the air over there in Iceland, but they don't know how an auction works I guess, and it shows in their first attempt to make a contract system in-game... If you enter 500,000 in any box in an auction, sorry, but the item can't go fo any less than that unless you do more work to make that happen... And putting in a starting bid does not constitute a resereve This is not the first time thie UI has ****** ppl over... if people cant figure out what an auction is...
RaWBLooD	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:53:00 - [85] Originally by: Exlegion Edited by: Exlegion on 15/03/2007 18:10:12 Wow! Lots of flaming because he came into the forums to help others avoid his mistake. Relax folks. DUSKULL isn't whining, he's not dumb, he's not an ass, he's not [insert whatever demeaning term you'd like to use here] just because he may not fully understand the auction system in Eve. He got burnt for it. He said he'll recover and is warning. If you're way 'above the norm' in I.Q. then just go on to another thread more in line with your caliber of intelligence and don't waste your precious time on this one. Simple? You would think. No need to insult him. no need to defend him either then.
Exlegion New Light Schism.	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:58:00 - [86] Edited by: Exlegion on 15/03/2007 18:58:11 Originally by: RaWBLooD Originally by: Exlegion Edited by: Exlegion on 15/03/2007 18:10:12 Wow! Lots of flaming because he came into the forums to help others avoid his mistake. Relax folks. DUSKULL isn't whining, he's not dumb, he's not an ass, he's not [insert whatever demeaning term you'd like to use here] just because he may not fully understand the auction system in Eve. He got burnt for it. He said he'll recover and is warning. If you're way 'above the norm' in I.Q. then just go on to another thread more in line with your caliber of intelligence and don't waste your precious time on this one. Simple? You would think. No need to insult him. no need to defend him either then. I'm not claiming to be anything. But it's a little disheartening to see so many "I'm so smart this could never happen to me" people bashing other players for their mistakes. It really isn't necessary. People make mistakes. Well, atleast us mortals do anyway . Ex
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.03.15 19:06:00 - [87] Originally by: DarkMatter Edited by: DarkMatter on 15/03/2007 17:49:38 Quote: I believe they said they are making changes, I don't think they said anything about it not working right. Not working as intended pretty much means it's broken, lol... Maybe it's the air over there in Iceland, but they don't know how an auction works I guess, and it shows in their first attempt to make a contract system in-game... If you enter 500,000 in any box in an auction, sorry, but the item can't go fo any less than that unless you do more work to make that happen... And putting in a starting bid does not constitute a resereve This is not the first time thie UI has ****** ppl over... 'Not working as intended' are your words, unless you have a relevant linky? There is a different between how you think an auction works, and what the general definition of an auction is. This difference is not an issue for anyone but you. If you put 500000 in the minimum box it can't go for less than that, if you put it in the buyout box, that only sets the buyout, it's still an auction and still has a minimum. There is no reserve in these auctions, so stop talking about them. This has nothing to do with the UI. It is extremely simple. Minimum bid, and the amount that ends the auction immediately. That's all there is too it. Wanting reserves, wanting to do an item exchange using the auction system, these things are irrelevant. The system does what it is currently designed to do just fine. - If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine.
Lemen Meringue Cult of Lemen	Posted - 2007.03.15 19:16:00 - [88] I take it you can't just delete the auction after a bid has been placed?
DarkMatter Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group	Posted - 2007.03.15 19:16:00 - [89] Quote: The system does what it is currently designed to do just fine. Why would they be talking about changing it then? You don't change something if it's not broken, so they must think it's broken, like I do... Like I said, scamming should require risk vs reward & skills that need to be trained, just like every other profession... Otherwise, it's not valid gameplay, but broken mechanics... Building the homestead
DUSKULL	Posted - 2007.03.15 19:24:00 - [90] WOW loads of response. Basically once it is set and someone has placed a bid then you can't retract it so if you do make a mistake its tough. Regards the flaming, thats fine and regards my I.Q. I have a degree as well as other high qualifications and have a proffesional job. It's good to flame and its good to think you are brighter than others but one day you may fall for a scam and think jeeez I wish someone would have mentioned that. My mistake in all of this is nothing to do with understanding auctions, its the fact that I trusted someone. I use Ebay loads and it works fine. I have never sold a car for ú10 instead of ú10,000. Lets leave the thread as I intended. One to warn people who where not sure of how the contratcs work as I myself didnt and secondly if this has saved one person in EVE the same fate as me , then for that I am happy.

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