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CCP Garthagk	Posted - 2007.04.25 23:02:00 - [1] Due to an incident earlier this evening that caused some load on Tranquility that we weren't very happy about, I've had to disable the character sheet (XML export) functionality on MyEVE. This means that EVEMon and other third party tools are not updating right now. A fix is in the works, but will not be in place until tomorrow. You can expect full functionality to be restored by 1700 GMT tomorrow (Thursday). I'm sorry for the inconvenience I know this causes. -------------- Garthagk - CCP Web Cell To err is human to really ***** up takes admins. -Hellmar

Anders Chydenius Phoenix Industries	Posted - 2007.04.25 23:07:00 - [2] Additionally, the EVEMon team is working as fast as we can to get a new version out that uses a friendlier method to get your data. It will be out when it is finished - we have 2 or 3 outstanding issues to resolve, and then we will get it out just as soon as its ready, but we would rather have a little gap in everyone's ability to use EVEMon than release a critically flawed version. ------ {o,o} (__(\| -"-"- EVEMon - The open source Jamaican wiseman.
Garan Tormas	Posted - 2007.04.26 02:26:00 - [3] Once again, thank you very much for the update Garthagk! I noticed it wasn't working, logged into the forums, and there is information right in front of me telling me what's wrong and when it can be fixed. That's all I ask. The time when I and others get annoyed is when no information is forthcoming. I hope CCP appreciate your skills in customer management :-)
Trilori Caldari Shrugged Atlases Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.04.26 04:40:00 - [4] Edited by: Trilori on 26/04/2007 04:37:38 well this is HORSECRAP! evemon has never worked since CCP took the XML pages down and it STILL didn't work during the "ramp up" phase and it didn't work EVEN AFTER that so why bother?! I only got to download my XML file that one time but haven't since because I expected evemon to get it for me and it doesn't update often enough as it used to. I think this is a buttload of crap, get the CLIENT to download the file then let evemon read the hard data there. And btw, I have tried getting help from evemon and I wouldn't go back there again! Most of their forum posts are so old it needs to have the MOLD scrapped off!
WhitePhantom Gallente Edenists	Posted - 2007.04.26 05:16:00 - [5] Originally by: Trilori Edited by: Trilori on 26/04/2007 04:49:58 Edited by: Trilori on 26/04/2007 04:37:38 well this is horsecrap, evemon has never worked since CCP took the XML pages down and it STILL didn't work during the "ramp up" phase and it didn't work EVEN AFTER that. I only got to download my XML file that one time but haven't since because I expected evemon to get it for me and it doesn't update often enough as it used to. BTW I did try getting help from evemon, help from them was beyond reach. Big freaking deal, they changed how often your characters xml file updates, its better then getting rid of the feature don't you think? Get upset over something more serious then a freaking additional and optional feature they are trying to improve upon.
Nvali Inactive Hardeners	Posted - 2007.04.26 05:17:00 - [6] I hope CCP understands that at this point I'm not willing to play the game without Evemon. I probably spend more time planning skill swaps than I do in the game, and any load that puts on the server has to be less than the load of me actually logging in, so it's a net win for them. ---
Mal Plox Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.04.26 05:27:00 - [7] I'd like to take this opportunity to express my gratitude to both EVE Dev team and EVEMon developers for giving us two wonderful products to play with and for speedily addressing issues that do, and will, inevitably arise. Keep up the good work :)
Akita T Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.04.26 05:31:00 - [8] Edited by: Akita T on 26/04/2007 05:28:15 Well, appreciate the update. Not nice, but meh, can survive. [nitpick mode] Of course, EVE-Mon wouldn't be next to mandatory if we had some form of skill queueing or skill dual training as promised since $DEITY knows when... And of course, there's no logical reason why the XML export machine should overload the TQ cluster as long as it has a 6-hour delay between data fetches from the TQ skill database for any single character... unless somehow today is opposite day or something like that, and "logical" means something else. _ MySkills \| Module/Rig stacknerfing explained
Lee Hyori	Posted - 2007.04.26 06:07:00 - [9] Wow, as I read every post, I find myself agreeing wholeheartedly with each, in spite of the mixed feedback. I do very much appreciate the heads up on all this, but the new system is quite frustrating, as I'm running numerous skills under 6 hours on multiple characters. I'm sure it doesn't need repeating, but EVEmon is as much a part of the game for me and many others as actual space combat. A few months back, EVE stopped pulling data for a week or so and I stopped playing entirely. It's just not the same game without EVEmon. I'm not going to be a drama queen and say that I'll quit if you don't do what I want, but I hope CCP recognizes how important an aspect of the game EVEmon is and what the impact of these sub-optimal skill pulls is. Can anyone (CCP, EVEmon, or community) explain if there are plans to improve the current system, what those plans are, and generally when they can be expected. I know I'm asking for a lot, but that's what customers do. Annoy the hell out of the company they patronize. :)
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2007.04.26 06:37:00 - [10] Move speedy G, move! *****s whip - - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - - ISD will never find me... In my signature!
Zee Zen	Posted - 2007.04.26 06:38:00 - [11] Isn't anyone curious what the 'incident' was? It must have been fairly serious - more than just everyone using evemon again. I blame the haxorz. Sincere thanks to ccp and the evemon team for putting so much effort into something arguably ancillary to the game. It's pretty cool that you guys are working together. Suggestion for people with multiple chars: use Google calendar or a tool that will email you at scheduled times. Or a post-it on your monitor. There is nothing magical about evemon, it just takes slightly more effort now.

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire	Posted - 2007.04.26 07:27:00 - [12] Can we expect another nice math forumula to do cool stuff with?! Keep it up G! Help me help you .

Vactet Immortalis Silens	Posted - 2007.04.26 07:29:00 - [13] If i was CCP..id work very closely with the Evemon folks into finding out some way to FULLY INTEGRATE Evemon's abilities into the game. As it stands, EVemon is REQUIRED (Not by some rule but by its own usefulness and capabilities) to train smart. I dont see why they cant integrate evemon into the game in some fashion so that it still has its out of game abilities. And hey..maybe then they could get this xml thing worked out better. This all seems like the bookmark thing again to me. "Oh..uh its causing lag! Yep lag. So here..let us try to fix (Read: BREAK) it" CCP...heres a quote for you "If it aint broke dont fix it" And i know i am going to be immediately flamed by folks saying "oh there was some big problem that blah blah" You..can sit and rotate. Fix the problem, once and for all and then LEAVE..IT..ALONE. Yeesh. Sometimes the world needs to be kicked in the face to stop drooling on itself like an ignorant child. ::Im paid to talk, not to be civil. Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed.
Arimus Darkhart Caldari Sane Industries Inc.	Posted - 2007.04.26 07:36:00 - [14] I think people are forgetting if you correctly configure evemon to take into account your clone abilities at least you can get an idea of how long skills will take to train - just use the plan functionality rather than 'live'. I'm sorry, I love Evemon and use it extensively, but if people can not keep track of dates without a complex bit of software (does the word diary ring any bells?) then ..... I know for short skills you'll end up with a lot to keep track of but as short skills are best trained while logged in then that's not so much of an issue... -- Users are like a virus - each causing a thousand tiny crises until the host finally dies.
Xaroth Brook Minmatar Doomcraft Mech Ops Syndicate	Posted - 2007.04.26 07:53:00 - [15] Originally by: Nvali I hope CCP understands that at this point I'm not willing to play the game without Evemon. I probably spend more time planning skill swaps than I do in the game, and any load that puts on the server has to be less than the load of me actually logging in, so it's a net win for them. wait, so you're not actually PLAYING the game? can i have your stuff? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Xaroth Brook [Datacore - Quantum Physics] x 40
Inquisitor Berthez Arcana Imperii Ltd. The Cartel.	Posted - 2007.04.26 09:41:00 - [16] Sigh not again... Why is that all happening just when I have a lot of shorts skills to train. It's a b!tch to keep track. Well, I can forgive it IF you don't start with that ramping BS again. Oh yeah, feed the damn hamster for once . Ö
Basileus	Posted - 2007.04.26 10:03:00 - [17] Isn't this a post for the Information Portal? Maybe it would be a good idea to keep all threads relating to server status, outages, etc. etc. in that Portal?
Tortilla Smasher The Stain Project The Cartel.	Posted - 2007.04.26 12:12:00 - [18] I like general more, thanks. -- This is a signature. Un-hijacked since forever *emo-tear
Scilent Enigma Minmatar Venture X	Posted - 2007.04.26 12:19:00 - [19] Although this is a bit inconvenient I am happy that you take decisive action in this regard, the stability of TQ is more important. Thanks for the update and keep up the good work.
Barbaro55a Caldari Os Lobos Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2007.04.26 12:44:00 - [20] Guess i'll have to get stuck into RL again now. I think the boss can notice the diff when Evemon is down, i get more work done. Cheers for the update, keep up the work..... .......................................... We come in Peace, FIRE AT WILL---Blog

CCP Garthagk	Posted - 2007.04.26 18:12:00 - [21] EVEMon versions 1.0.x and 1.1.x have been disabled. Until they release a new version with some updates to their algorithm, EVEMon will no longer function. I have been working with them to get them everything they need and they are getting close to a solution - but it's not ready just yet. Until a new version of this tool is released, you can still go to the My Character portion of MyEVE and export your XML manually for EVEMon. Again, I'm sorry for the inconvenience. I have a devblog due out next week. At that point I'll elaborate on why this has "suddenly" started breaking and why the choice was made to abandon the existing versions of EVEMon. I will also talk about the APIs going forward and ways we are going to make this sort of problem a non-issue. -------------- Garthagk - CCP Web Cell To err is human to really ***** up takes admins. -Hellmar

Ubiquitous Photon	Posted - 2007.04.26 18:45:00 - [22] Fair enough. I remember the exact same problems happening with Character Manager before it, and it will obviously be quite a load on the servers, which is a bad thing(tm). I think its all fine so long as it actually gets fixed permanently this time, but then I presume thats what this is about. I, for one, welcome our new Web Cell overlords.
SamuraiJack Caldari Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.04.26 19:46:00 - [23] info is much appriciated. relayed to our boards. Keep up the good work. SJ. CLS Co-CEO and Standings Director =-
MellaRinn Exit 13 Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.04.26 20:48:00 - [24] thanks for the update 8) Click
Tonto Auri Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.04.26 22:23:00 - [25] Originally by: CCP Garthagk EVEMon versions 1.0.x and 1.1.x have been disabled. Until they release a new version with some updates to their algorithm, EVEMon will no longer function. I have been working with them to get them everything they need and they are getting close to a solution - but it's not ready just yet. Until a new version of this tool is released, you can still go to the My Character portion of MyEVE and export your XML manually for EVEMon. Again, I'm sorry for the inconvenience. I have a devblog due out next week. At that point I'll elaborate on why this has "suddenly" started breaking and why the choice was made to abandon the existing versions of EVEMon. I will also talk about the APIs going forward and ways we are going to make this sort of problem a non-issue. I know that frequent pestering to game database from webserver can cause real issues.. But are You never thinking about caching of requests at webserver side? I know that so many requests always ask for more or less but enough stable data. You can save about 80% of interserver exchange if You implement that type of caching. And of course You can save more traffic and braincells by removing all that useless page-building javascript from webpages and enable server-side page compression. -- .
Lebowske M. Corp M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.04.26 22:38:00 - [26] Yes, it's a good move. Temporary move. Again - why is the game network sharing resources/network with the web & services as the character data? At some stage the problem will reappear again, when you reach a new critical mass? Wouldnt it be wiser to separate the game network from the other services? But again - thats an action that requires a lot more consideration and planning. I hope thats part of your plans ;) Still - all in all - good information flow during the service change. Keep up the good work ;) -------------------- - It's better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you're an idiot, rather than opening it and removing all doubt.
Tolomea Gallente 5th Front enterprises New Eve Order	Posted - 2007.04.27 01:48:00 - [27] Originally by: ToxicFire Originally by: WhitePhantom Originally by: ToxicFire I once again state, if it ain't broke don't fix it, the character sheet has been fine until someone tried to change it even if was a little demanding of tq it was stable. Clearly it was NOT working, because they had to change it, and they just waited till they had a SOLUTION! It was working fine for months until they started changing things with the patch the previous week, no one ever complained people were able to check there skills, evemon the original eve character manager were both developed around that deployment of the character sheet and both worked fine. Im not talking about the short term screw ups that have happend again since they apparently fixed what they broke before. You are correct in asserting that as far as the players could tell it was working fine. But you are naively assuming that that is all that matters. The correct definition of "working" for something like Evemon is that it "provides the information the players want in a way that doesn't adversely affect the server". From everything that's been said by the devs I think it should be abundantly obvious that due to some artifact of how the info is produced by the servers it does adversely affect the servers and that is what they are attempting rectify. Would you change your tone any if Garthagk said the online character sheet was never intended to be used like this so it was never implemented in a robust way and as a result a fairly large portion of the server lag recently has been caused by the ever increasing Evemon usage? Because that's where it looks like this is going.
Pilk Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.04.27 04:08:00 - [28] Originally by: Tonto Auri I know that frequent pestering to game database from webserver can cause real issues.. But are You never thinking about caching of requests at webserver side? They do. Examine the "timeInCache" attribute: <character timeInCache="10438" timeLeftInCache="3589562" name="xxxx" characterID="xxxx"> Originally by: Tonto Auri I know that so many requests always ask for more or less but enough stable data. You can save about 80% of interserver exchange if You implement that type of caching. I'm not sure what static caching would solve. If you're training BS V, but some time during the hour that the data is cached, you spend 10 minutes getting Drones to I (yeah, you were slacking), when the server queries, no amount of caching is going to avoid the fact that you now have to re-fetch all the character sheet data. Now, if the problem is the DB load, you can extrapolate some information and put more intelligence in the character sheet. For example, you can work out the current rate of SP/hour. Then you only have to fetch the current number of SP for the last-known-to-be-training skill. If it's off by more than some small delta, you re-fetch everything, otherwise, you can stop there. Now, this won't catch the case where you are training at (for simplicity's sake) 600 SP/hour, plug in some implants, train something else for 5 minutes, clonejump (or get podded) to a no-implant clone, and it all lines up perfectly such that you're training at 600 SP/hour again and have the same amount of SP in your currently-training skill that you'd have had if nothing happened. As such, once a day (perhaps during DT?), you'd have to re-fetch the whole sheet. I'm sure there are other caching mechanisms that would work, too, this is just the one off the top of my head. Originally by: Tonto Auri And of course You can save more traffic and braincells by removing all that useless page-building javascript from webpages and enable server-side page compression. JavaScript is entirely client-side; it causes no load on the server, barring dynamic generation. And server-side page compression only helps if the problem is Internet network bandwidth (which I doubt). It's almost certainly either DB load, interconnect network load, or MyEve CPU load. --P
WhitePhantom Gallente Edenists	Posted - 2007.04.27 04:40:00 - [29] Edited by: WhitePhantom on 27/04/2007 04:40:15 Originally by: ToxicFire Originally by: WhitePhantom Originally by: ToxicFire I once again state, if it ain't broke don't fix it, the character sheet has been fine until someone tried to change it even if was a little demanding of tq it was stable. Clearly it was NOT working, because they had to change it, and they just waited till they had a SOLUTION! It was working fine for months until they started changing things with the patch the previous week, no one ever complained people were able to check there skills, evemon the original eve character manager were both developed around that deployment of the character sheet and both worked fine. Im not talking about the short term screw ups that have happend again since they apparently fixed what they broke before. I again will say the following: Clearly it was not working for them, and there is more about the situtation we don't know, just because they waited to disable doesn't mean something wasn't wrong. Just because there isn't threads saying it wasn't working, doesn't mean there were not other issues, "working" can describe a balanced load on the server. Like I said clearly they waited till they had a solution, otherwise we might have had to wait longer then 5 days last week. Of course I am thinking like a programmer, where you don't just rush in a break support for a program like they did before the character sheet. Sometimes you have to break support if the program itself is broken, which I support fully as a programmer myself.
Summer River	Posted - 2007.04.27 07:24:00 - [30] Am I the first to suspect that this has something to to with the exploit mentioned in the the Player News Centre? Linkage

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