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Princess Jodi
Vendetta Underground
Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.08.21 15:36:00 -
[61]
Eve is not fair. What I'm hearing is that the OP wants to be able to kill a 35 Billion isk ship with a Frigate. Get 35 Billion isk worth of ships together, and I'm sure you'll kill a mothership. Probably Alpha-Strike it. I neither sympthasize nor condone any changes to the current mechanics.
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Arngorf
Minmatar
x13
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Posted - 2007.08.21 21:17:00 -
[62]
If capital ships could be keeped from jumping out I would accept it.. tho i really would like to see the old pvp back...
Take this video of someguys from my corp baiting and masterly powning some guys who thought they had a chance.
Linkage
Its absolutly impossible to do intel on these mofos walking in the cheap "backdoor"
-Arngorf
________________________________________________
FORMER!!! I said FORMER Pirate...
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Wayward Hooligan
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.08.21 21:43:00 -
[63]
Nothing wrong with people dropping carriers on other people.
I've been carrier dropped twice in 0.0.
Once by BoB, once by Xenobytes(something along those lines anyways).
Lost a Domi and a Harb. No biggie. My own damned fault for not knowing how to deal with it.
Basically I got outplayed those two times.
First:
Tackled a BoB Myrmidon and started droning it. Fight went on for 20 or so seconds. Then pop cyno and 2 other ships jumped through a gate at the same time. I died to a well executed trap.
Second:
Skirmishing with 8 or 9 in gang for a about half an hour in enemy system. They manage to get more numbers than us and we pull out. One of our BS gets tackled coming through the gate so we go back to help.
Arazu scrams us and pops a cyno. We try to kill it but he is being remote repped by carrier. Not enough DPS in our gang to break the Arazu. Half the gang manages to MWD away from Arazu and warp out. I'm too dumb and get 2xVaga + Arazu + Nidhoggured.
The above is EXACTLY how caps are supposed to be used. They give a HUGE advantage to whoever has the balls to drop one on their enemy. This is also how caps are killed. Bait em out and have 10 dictors + 30 BS gang 3 jumps out to kill em when they show up.
We got a Wyvern this way. Caps and pvp are more fun this way than the standard SUPER BLOB tactics most cap heavy alliances use.
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Khan Dhu
Khan Dhu Research and Cloning
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Posted - 2007.08.21 22:02:00 -
[64]
Edited by: Khan Dhu on 21/08/2007 22:02:56
The problem with capital scramblers is the mothership will be able to jump out before the carrier/dread/whatever gets a lock on it. Probably even be able to get fighters back before it has to, as well.
The only way around this would be to give carriers incredible lock times, which would create just another game-breaking issue. 
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MrJordanIOI
Minmatar
The Lantern Mining Corporation
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Posted - 2007.08.22 14:40:00 -
[65]
 Originally by: Khan Dhu
Edited by: Khan Dhu on 21/08/2007 22:02:56
The problem with capital scramblers is the mothership will be able to jump out before the carrier/dread/whatever gets a lock on it. Probably even be able to get fighters back before it has to, as well.
The only way around this would be to give carriers incredible lock times, which would create just another game-breaking issue.
Honestly - having cap scramblers wouldnt necessarily mean the lock time would be a prob.
Some remote and local sensor boosters on the capital using the scrambler would help.
But we would need a friggin cap sized scrambler in the first place and I hope there is one on the horizon so I can take my revenge on the Mothers*** that snogged me a couple of days ago *evil grin*
IOI
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=567889&page=1#8..I just checked the subscription numbers, |
PostWithYourMain
Main Corporation
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Posted - 2007.08.22 15:40:00 -
[66]
Allow dictor bubs in low sec
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CCCP lalalalalla
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Posted - 2007.08.22 15:53:00 -
[67]
Motherships should have never been introduced to this game, no need for a solo wtfpwnbbq ship. Cant believe ******** people can't see it is a solo wtfpwn ship. Titan is not a wtfpwn ship, it has a purpose, a mothership does not.. it just wtfpwns... So CCP should get rid of motherships and increase the titan mineral price and bpo price x 4. The titan is way to easy to get isk wise...
We dont need a bunch of wtfpwn ships in eve.. tyvm
wtfpwn ftl, teamwork ftw, wtfpwn in a battleship is cool though
Polaris needs to be nerfed.. wtfpwn.. Nerf speed(mini) it is also wtf********, might as well give them 2 au/s speed. wtfpwn.
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DHB WildCat
BURN EDEN
Terra Incognita.
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Posted - 2007.08.22 16:08:00 -
[68]
I think what the op is trying to say is that Super Caps are being used now to fight numbers less than 5.
My 2 experiences with this was when Evil Thug jumped his titan and MoM on 3 Burn Eden ravens.
Then when IAC dropped thier NYX on one Burn Eden Raven. I think people are afraid that EVE is turning into a SuperCap game, and that most Battleships even in groups of 2 are now in danger of having Super Caps dropped on them eveywhere they go.
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CCCP lalalalalla
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Posted - 2007.08.22 16:23:00 -
[69]
Capships should not be a solowtfpwn.. remove the mothership from eve 
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DubanFP
Caldari
Four Rings
D-L
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Posted - 2007.08.22 16:23:00 -
[70]
Originally by: CCCP lalalalalla
Capships should not be a solowtfpwn.. remove the mothership from eve
"Looks at name"
BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN.
___________
Xanstin> Your sig is full of really, really crap self quotes.
DubanFP> Happy now that i have your quote included? |
Da Ram
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Posted - 2007.08.22 21:15:00 -
[71]
Originally by: PostWithYourMain
Allow dictor bubs in low sec
Sadly that is a bad option leading to semi-exploits and a lot of petitions.
I see where you are coming from and perhaps if someone is really keen to implement a workaround until a proper solution is found;
Simply make it so that dictor bubbles in low sec ONLY sto capitals ;)
The only change would be to exclude any ships BUT capitals from the effect.
Not elegant, but a workaround that may work really.
Ram
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Arngorf
Minmatar
x13
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Posted - 2007.08.24 06:08:00 -
[72]
lets introduce the Death Star to this game..
________________________________________________
FORMER!!! I said FORMER Pirate...
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General Apocalypse
Amarr
The Merchant Marines
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Posted - 2007.08.24 07:23:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Aodha Khan
Originally by: Jin Entres
5. It is possible for a well piloted gang of a dozen battleships to kill a mothership.
What's to stop the mothership jumping out? In low sec it's pretty impossible to kill a mothership.
It's an 'I win' button.
You got to be kidding right ?
put 24 neuts on the mom and it's cap will vanish in 1-2 cycles .
Dreads will do the rest .
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Ashaz
Mindstar Technology
United Confederation of Corporations
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Posted - 2007.08.24 08:49:00 -
[74]
Edited by: Ashaz on 24/08/2007 08:52:00
Originally by: Del Narveux
But just being expensive shouldnt make it uber, one still needs to have to think about tactics and strategy and all that. 5 frigates can take down most BS, 5 BS cant do too much to a MS (and 5 vs a carrier would be pushing it).
beeing more expencive should make it _better_ wich it does.
5 BS will be eaten alive probably, unless you fit realy good tanks.
Bring 5 speedy cruisers instead and laugh at the silly fighters.
If your gang is not strong enough to take down the ship, you can atleast kill some fighters.
each kill is about 20 mil isk lost to the carrier pilot. And once it's out of fighters, what's it gona do? bump you?
iDrone |
Ashaz
Mindstar Technology
United Confederation of Corporations
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Posted - 2007.08.24 09:10:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Aodha Khan
Originally by: 000Hunter000
U drop the MS and wtfpwn his ass all over space. Is it fair? no way! is it eve? definitly!
Eve was supposed to be about risk v reward. With a 0% chance of losing this really is a game spoiler. I could get a mothership if I sold all my assets, somehow I don't think there would be much fun in thoughtless no strategy battles where I cannot lose.
I would love to see a statement on this from CCP and what they are going to do about it.
He risks a 20-30 bil ship.
That's not risk enough for you?
Maybe your lone battleship as a bait? 
iDrone |
Ashaz
Mindstar Technology
United Confederation of Corporations
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Posted - 2007.08.24 09:26:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Malcanis
(...) you're not crying about Moms being unfair. You're just crying because you don't have one.
Very well put. This pretty much sums it all up.
iDrone |
A'tarius
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.08.24 09:50:00 -
[77]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
I think what the op is trying to say is that Super Caps are being used now to fight numbers less than 5.
My 2 experiences with this was when Evil Thug jumped his titan and MoM on 3 Burn Eden ravens.
Then when IAC dropped thier NYX on one Burn Eden Raven. I think people are afraid that EVE is turning into a SuperCap game, and that most Battleships even in groups of 2 are now in danger of having Super Caps dropped on them eveywhere they go.
I hope your not still bitter about it
And I didnt drop the Nyx on one BE raven. I dropped it on I think it was 4 or 5 ravens. All sensor damping cloaking ravens. And I of course dropped it on the price raven (the cnr).
It happens, there's always bigger fish. For IAC its 0utbreak, they dropped 2 Nyx and 11 carriers on 2 freighters and then clone jumped 10 people (not sure about that amount, I wasnt there) to one of their Nyx.
That also shows you that the tactic can be used against you as well. If I where to drop my Nyx on an 0utbreak gang I could very well risk getting 2 Nyx and 11 carriers (and most likely more on standby) on me. Add the fact that most likely their dictor pilots wont be far off, it could turn nasty fast.
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Ashaz
Mindstar Technology
United Confederation of Corporations
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Posted - 2007.08.24 11:04:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Buyerr
"i win" bottoms,
I wants one! 
iDrone |
Kovid
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.08.24 11:46:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Aramendel
1. High sec PvP is not really terribly important.
Excuse yourself and stop this thinking. When the war dec fee is paid it is no holds barred 23/7 in every system, including empire. I know it's easy to forget life in empire when you have been out in 0.0 for a while as it doesn't seem very necessary. I did when I was out there.
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An informal Star Fraction FAQ |
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Iyanah
Minmatar
Mining Munitions and Mayhem
R i s e
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Posted - 2007.08.24 12:08:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Saltire
Yes, titans may take the support fleet out of a war but mother ships are taking the small gang pvp out of eve.
case in point - our alliance E N I G M A has recently deployed into a northern region, mainly around taisy/obe. Our purpose was to get away from syndicate for a bit (lack of targets, people not daring to fight without 10:1 advantage)
we have found the blob has been replaced by motherships, dropping every time there may be a threat from 1-2 ships.
another case in point - A corp mate of mine in a megathron was attacked by an older pilot in a nosdomi, our pilots tank was failing fast but still the domi drops a carrier on him as he enters hull. Same pilot later took on an abso in a new mega, the absolution pilot dropped a wyvern MS and a Carrier on him.... Have people in eve lost the ability to PVP?
Motherships are 99% safe in lowsec and something needs to be changed about them, make them able to be scrammed. An addition to this is that any ship activating a cyno should lose the ability to run any mods instantly, including its warp scrambler.
your oppinions?
oh an please dont come back at me with screams of 'ADAPT!! YOU GET MORE MOTHERSHIPS THAN OTHER GUYZ = WIN YEAH?'
as lame as these tactics may be, you have to admit the "OMFG OVERKILL" is quite funny. it's like firing a DDD to take out a single t1 frigate - funny as hell, but honestly, it's a bit lame if that's your serious battle plan.
==========================================
Iy
please remember: I AM a sarcastic ******* and nothing i say has ever represented the thoughts or feelings of my corp, alliance, or anyone really. read |
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Guardians of the Dawn
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.08.24 12:17:00 -
[81]
That is why I support T2 Battleships to be oversized HACs, Something that in small groups can stand and fight super capitals. Well can take 1 of their extra bonus dedicated to 99% reduction on CPU usage of super capital warp scramblers.
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
Scouteye
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.08.24 12:25:00 -
[82]
Those of you who dont fly carriers or motherships and calling for their nerf need to read up a little on carriers and motherships.
When you jump into a system you have 30% cap left, no mater the distance of jump. It then takes, using a T2 fitted archon as example, 6-7 minutes to get your cap back to jump level so you can jump out.
Thats 6 or 7 minutes to get a few nosing ships and neutralising ships in there and strip its cap and kill it. A mothership cant be scrambled but it can be bumped by a fly, park a BS in front of it and go to town, its going no where fast.
Also, some people say that the amount of isk and skilling involved in flying a carrier or mothership doesnt give it the right to be uber, well it flaming well does, all that effort for all that gain. if these things didnt count they would have fitted a DD on an ibis!
Tactics people, tactics. If you get jumped on run or consider how you ended up in a position to be jumped on with no means of escape.
Adapt, over come and think. Capital pilots fly ships capable of mass distruction but should they lose it, which then certainly can, they will lose VAST VAST VAST amounts of isk, thats the risk they take.
When your killing an ibis with your hac tomorrow consider his how he feels about you. Its what yor complainign about cap pilots.
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cuteboylookingatyou
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Posted - 2007.08.24 12:28:00 -
[83]
Edited by: cuteboylookingatyou on 24/08/2007 12:27:42
Originally by: Kagura Nikon
That is why I support T2 Battleships to be oversized HACs, Something that in small groups can stand and fight super capitals. Well can take 1 of their extra bonus dedicated to 99% reduction on CPU usage of super capital warp scramblers.
You would like HABs to become available? These would have to have very limited capacitor or something to even make sense to implement something so powerful.
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Test99
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Posted - 2007.08.24 12:50:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Ashaz
Originally by: Aodha Khan
Originally by: 000Hunter000
U drop the MS and wtfpwn his ass all over space. Is it fair? no way! is it eve? definitly!
Eve was supposed to be about risk v reward. With a 0% chance of losing this really is a game spoiler. I could get a mothership if I sold all my assets, somehow I don't think there would be much fun in thoughtless no strategy battles where I cannot lose.
I would love to see a statement on this from CCP and what they are going to do about it.
He risks a 20-30 bil ship.
That's not risk enough for you?
Maybe your lone battleship as a bait?
There is a risk in deploying an MS in Lowsec ?
Sorry but LOL.
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Leroy Payne
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Posted - 2007.08.24 13:36:00 -
[85]
Lets look at the history of a few things that have been nerfed:
The nanodomi/phoon. Now these wer ships that to get right you needed to splash at least 300mill, and were basically easily killable by any gang with a huginn or rapier in it. I argued against the nano-nerf. It happened anyway.
The Nosdomi / curse. Now Nos is considered overpowered and gets a kick in the teeth next patch. I argued against this change. It still happened.
Now if anyone honestly thinks the nanodomi or nosdomi were anything like the kind of winbutton a lowsec mothership is - well I'd heartily disagree for one.
Basically following past trends something is gonna happen. It's been made clear by CCP's actions time and time again that ships that even approach the status of 'solo pwnmobile' get nerfed.
Talking about how much a mothership costs in isk or skill training is irrelevant. The day this game becomes a game where skillpoints and isk alone can guaruntee survival is the day this game loses its best element.
So all you motherships owners can harp on about jealousy or whatnot and refuse to have a rational debate about the issue - instead making personal comments about those who criticise, well get used to the idea your mothership is going to get nerfed.
It's simply a matter of time, I doubt the issue is even up for debate.
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Leroy Payne
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Posted - 2007.08.24 13:43:00 -
[86]
Originally by: cuteboylookingatyou
Edited by: cuteboylookingatyou on 24/08/2007 12:27:42
Originally by: Kagura Nikon
That is why I support T2 Battleships to be oversized HACs, Something that in small groups can stand and fight super capitals. Well can take 1 of their extra bonus dedicated to 99% reduction on CPU usage of super capital warp scramblers.
You would like HABs to become available? These would have to have very limited capacitor or something to even make sense to implement something so powerful.
well they put the mothership in didnt they? I don't believe that has limited capacitor, and its basically being used like an undampable unjammable unscrammable t2 battleship in lowsec engagements.
Oh and whoever said "oh its easy all you have to do is gather 24 heavy neuts within 6 minutes" is having a laugh.
back to my original point - if the nanodomi was overpowered because it was too much to ask a gang to get a huginn to deal with it, then a mothership is a joke.
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asgghsfdgsgsg
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Posted - 2007.08.31 13:01:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Leroy Payne
Originally by: cuteboylookingatyou
Edited by: cuteboylookingatyou on 24/08/2007 12:27:42
Originally by: Kagura Nikon
That is why I support T2 Battleships to be oversized HACs, Something that in small groups can stand and fight super capitals. Well can take 1 of their extra bonus dedicated to 99% reduction on CPU usage of super capital warp scramblers.
You would like HABs to become available? These would have to have very limited capacitor or something to even make sense to implement something so powerful.
well they put the mothership in didnt they? I don't believe that has limited capacitor, and its basically being used like an undampable unjammable unscrammable t2 battleship in lowsec engagements.
Oh and whoever said "oh its easy all you have to do is gather 24 heavy neuts within 6 minutes" is having a laugh.
back to my original point - if the nanodomi was overpowered because it was too much to ask a gang to get a huginn to deal with it, then a mothership is a joke.
Why it isn't like it is hard to alpha strike a mothership with 24 battleships.
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III LightBringer
Okkelen Grave Robbers
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Posted - 2007.08.31 13:54:00 -
[88]
So... Motherships are so big and mean??
set up 2-3 battleships with a tank + remote rep ... bate in the mothership, get the 20-something fighters on one of the ships, help heal him, and BAM-BAM-BAM the smartbombs killing 400+ million isk of un-insured property....
3 injector-domis with smarties, large transfers / NOS would cost less to loose than 4 fighters...
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ttrrwafsfamfjkasjf
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Posted - 2007.08.31 14:43:00 -
[89]
Originally by: III LightBringer
So... Motherships are so big and mean??
set up 2-3 battleships with a tank + remote rep ... bate in the mothership, get the 20-something fighters on one of the ships, help heal him, and BAM-BAM-BAM the smartbombs killing 400+ million isk of un-insured property....
3 injector-domis with smarties, large transfers / NOS would cost less to loose than 4 fighters...
Is this in theory or have you attempted this with positive results?
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Ivor Gunn
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Posted - 2007.08.31 14:46:00 -
[90]
Originally by: III LightBringer
So... Motherships are so big and mean??
set up 2-3 battleships with a tank + remote rep ... bate in the mothership, get the 20-something fighters on one of the ships, help heal him, and BAM-BAM-BAM the smartbombs killing 400+ million isk of un-insured property....
3 injector-domis with smarties, large transfers / NOS would cost less to loose than 4 fighters...
uh.... huh.
Never actually tried this vs. a pilot with half a brain, have you?
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