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Laboratus
Gallente
BGG
League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:41:00 -
[31]
The "Nefr teh c104k5z0rz!" screaming is just because more and more ppl have gotten smart and can avoid random gankage.
The ones screaming for nerfs just want to gank some afk ppl and feel mighty.
They don't realise that denying instant gratification (or boring the **** out of them)from your opponents is a critical part of pvp. For instant gratification I would rather suggest something designed for it, like wow, diablo or prn.
Besides, cloaking big ships is a standard in scifi. "A ship that small could not have a cloaking device."
Cloaking bigger ships to prevent scouts from getting excact numbers and troop positions is not only smart, but it improves the game experience for us all.
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P.S.
Post with your main.
Mind control and tin hats |
Karash Amerius
Amarr
O.E.C
Legionnaire Services Ltd.
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:47:00 -
[32]
its because isk farmers are using them too much.
That and perm local scouts.
Merc Blog |
Blue Pixie
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:49:00 -
[33]
There seems to be two motivations for nerfing cloaks.
The first is similar to the desire to war dec NPC corporations. They want the opportunity to readily attack/defeat other players, without exception. Anything that comes between them and a killmail is simply unacceptable.
The second are players who want to minimize their risk while maximzing profit. Cloaks are an impediment to that. They'll cite numerous rationales and excuses, but ultimately it boils down to not wanting to have to fly with an escort during mining/ratting operations, when that escort could instead be ratting/mining and thusly increasing their iskie collection rate.
Why it's suddenly become all the rage to complain about this now? Who knows? My guess would be that with EVE's increased playerbase, there's more objection to the game's disimilarities to other MMOs.
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Goumindong
Amarr
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:50:00 -
[34]
 Originally by: Derran
See, none of that answers my question. Anyone could be doing that a long time ago. Why is it only a problem now when nothing has really changed in regards to cloaking?
They have always been a problem, it just hasnt always been so obvious.
You can ask the same question of most things in the game. Why now for Titans? Did something about titans change? Nope, its just more easy to see now.
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Thou Shalt "Pew Pew" |
Ogul
Caldari
ZiTek Deepspace Explorations
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:50:00 -
[35]
The only sensible thing that has been suggested in all these threads was flagging afk people in local.
No fuel, no heat, no stupid timers - just an indicator for afking.
Elegance in simplicity.
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar
Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.05.25 17:51:00 -
[36]
omg nerf cloaking! i cant see my awesome ship with it activated 
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Wendat Huron
Lupus Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.25 18:08:00 -
[37]
Put your own alt in a popular ratting system around the clock when you're not on, that'll send the macroratters there into cloaking and making no profit. Not the solution but a bandaid.
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Veto. Academy
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.05.25 18:13:00 -
[38]
Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 18:12:19
Originally by: Ogul
The only sensible thing that has been suggested in all these threads was flagging afk people in local.
No fuel, no heat, no stupid timers - [/b]just an indicator for afking.[/b]
Elegance in simplicity.
THIS.....I could live with. THIS...is somewhat sensible. No keystroke input for 30 minutes...afk flag.
The rest of this thread is further tail-chasing. Go find another bandwagon to jump on  .
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way"
General George Patton USA
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Malena Panic
Acme Technologies Incorporated
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.05.25 18:25:00 -
[39]
Originally by: JeanClaude DuSoir
The only cloaks that are cheaper are the Covert Ops Cloaks.
Improved cloaks are down to >10M from a peak of 30M+, and Protos have entering the 'free module' range of >2M.
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Katana Sengoku
Minmatar
The Knights Templar
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.25 18:36:00 -
[40]
I agree... a lot of people only see one side of this debate. They think its about carebears whining, but in reality its about the pure combat and integrity of this game. It wasn't a problem before, because there were other trends being done by muppets.
Face it... many pvpers want to intimidate and dominate as much as possible. They look for ways 'outside the box' to make their own life easier, make their kills lazier, while disrupting their enemies more and more. Sure, its part of the game, but these lame tactics take away from the pure aspect of the game. The pure pvp, which makes this game so much better than anything out there.
Cloaks were originally used in scouting, many loved them for that purpose, but after a while, they realized the potential to disrupt a system... and then the potential to use cloaks for combat, other than just recon.
Cloaking is a problem... its the new trend, yet again, because its one of the greatest tactics that has the biggest advantage. Its an unbalance... and that is what griefers and gankers look for... some tactic they can manipulate and exploit time after time that can not be equally countered in relation to risk, reward, and gang size.
I'm all for combat, but until I see tactics that the game intends for us to use, not to exploit, then nerfs will always come.
Finally... combat, distruption, ownage... whatever... should not be based on countering someones afk cloaker by your own afk cloaker. That's just stupid. That's a BAD direction for this game if you are for that scenario.
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SiJira
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Posted - 2007.05.25 19:00:00 -
[41]
Edited by: SiJira on 25/05/2007 18:59:19
Originally by: Katana Sengoku
I agree... a lot of people only see one side of this debate. They think its about carebears whining, but in reality its about the pure combat and integrity of this game. It wasn't a problem before, because there were other trends being done by muppets.
Face it... many pvpers want to intimidate and dominate as much as possible. They look for ways 'outside the box' to make their own life easier, make their kills lazier, while disrupting their enemies more and more. Sure, its part of the game, but these lame tactics take away from the pure aspect of the game. The pure pvp, which makes this game so much better than anything out there.
Cloaks were originally used in scouting, many loved them for that purpose, but after a while, they realized the potential to disrupt a system... and then the potential to use cloaks for combat, other than just recon.
Cloaking is a problem... its the new trend, yet again, because its one of the greatest tactics that has the biggest advantage. Its an unbalance... and that is what griefers and gankers look for... some tactic they can manipulate and exploit time after time that can not be equally countered in relation to risk, reward, and gang size.
I'm all for combat, but until I see tactics that the game intends for us to use, not to exploit, then nerfs will always come.
Finally... combat, distruption, ownage... whatever... should not be based on countering someones afk cloaker by your own afk cloaker. That's just stupid. That's a BAD direction for this game if you are for that scenario.
you do realize that people can simply log off and use logon traps instead of using cloakers if cloak gets nerfed right ?
exploiters will find ways about any nerf
legit players should just roll over and take it to satisfy the guys who wont work to trick the cloakers in their system ?
having your own afk cloaker isnt the only way - its actually the worst way to defend against another afk cloaker
i will defend my right to use cloaks until the day i cancel my subscription - i will not tolerate any nerfs just because some people choose a similar gamestyle as mine to dominate others are too lazy and ignorant to try to counter it
____ __ ________
_sig below_
the jet cans are made so that people that dont mine can get free ore
miners ritually donate the ore to anyone wishing to take some |
Goumindong
Amarr
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.25 19:39:00 -
[42]
You have to have someone in system to know when to spring the trap Sijira.
log-on traps require many people working in tandem and hold in place lots of resources[since you cant have one person check an entire system at a time and then attack themselves]
If log-on traps were as strong as cloaks, they would be used all the time for low quality targets. They arent, there is a reason for that. Its because the time and effort required to get one to work makes it unreasonable to do for anything that isnt very valuable.
Cloaks allow pilots to be able to patrol an entire system[instead of a single point in the system] for targets of any value without any risk. And to be able to do so at their leisure, without tieing up any resources.
----------------------------------------
Thou Shalt "Pew Pew" |
SiJira
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Posted - 2007.05.25 19:44:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Goumindong
You have to have someone in system to know when to spring the trap Sijira.
log-on traps require many people working in tandem and hold in place lots of resources[since you cant have one person check an entire system at a time and then attack themselves]
If log-on traps were as strong as cloaks, they would be used all the time for low quality targets. They arent, there is a reason for that. Its because the time and effort required to get one to work makes it unreasonable to do for anything that isnt very valuable.
wrong
all i need to do is log on to check whats going on in the system and then i can log off again
and i didnt waste tons of isk sp or even nerf my ship to do so
Quote:
Cloaks allow pilots to be able to patrol an entire system[instead of a single point in the system] for targets of any value without any risk. And to be able to do so at their leisure, without tieing up any resources.
oh no not at all a persons entire time spent in a system isnt a resource at all
____ __ ________
_sig below_
the jet cans are made so that people that dont mine can get free ore
miners ritually donate the ore to anyone wishing to take some |
Malena Panic
Acme Technologies Incorporated
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2007.05.25 19:46:00 -
[44]
Originally by: SiJira
you do realize that people can simply log off and use logon traps instead of using cloakers if cloak gets nerfed right ?
That's a reason to address logon traps, not a reason NOT to address afk/permacloaking.
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Katana Sengoku
Minmatar
The Knights Templar
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.25 19:48:00 -
[45]
Originally by: SiJira
you do realize that people can simply log off and use logon traps instead of using cloakers if cloak gets nerfed right ?
exploiters will find ways about any nerf
legit players should just roll over and take it to satisfy the guys who wont work to trick the cloakers in their system ?
having your own afk cloaker isnt the only way - its actually the worst way to defend against another afk cloaker
i will defend my right to use cloaks until the day i cancel my subscription - i will not tolerate any nerfs just because some people choose a similar gamestyle as mine to dominate others are too lazy and ignorant to try to counter it
Afaik, logon traps are exploits... petionable... whether or not thats true, its still another lame expolited tactic that in no way keeps this game and its pvp pure.
I agree there will always be new exploits and new nerfs. Where would we be if nothing ever changed? Get real.
I was also speaking of countering an afk cloaker in your system, by afk cloaking in the cloaker's home system.
Oh, and if you don't tolerate nerfs, you should of already left. Which means... can I have your stuff? 
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Kaemonn
Forum Moderator
Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2007.05.25 20:06:00 -
[46]
Please use one of the existing threads to discuss this.
forum rules | [email protected]| Eve-CCG
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