Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Factor Benz

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Originally by: Wylker

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Originally by: Factor Benz

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Originally by: Wylker

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Originally by: Factor Benz

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There was never an order given to crash any website. If you have magical "goon friends" telling you otherwise than you should probably stop listening to their sensationalist tripe. If you were in any way worth talking to I'm sure Mittani would already be doing so. Perhaps you can open a back channel via one of your multiple goon contacts.

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Yeah im sure it was just coincidence that 2938742398743928 different people posted in 208934023984093284 different threads a link to a goonswarm hosted file. Every single post was either by someone wearing a GS tag or a noob corp alt. Something stinks, and I think its your arguement.

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Ah yes, you have cleverly dismantled my arguement with reason, logic... er wait, nope just a personal attack disguised as.. something. Again, why would hundreds of posts show up within 5 minutes of eachother all from goons or from their alts? <--- is that more clear for you? I can try smaller words if that would help. And no, I'm not above flaming the **** out of you for being intentionally obtuse.

I would say "you seem like an intelligent lad" to preface this, but you don't. There's a major difference between ordering a website to be crashed and people posting on said website. I don't expect you to be able to tell the difference, but I would expect someone with an ability to reason to do so.

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People posting on a website do not constitute an order to crash said website. When you can change logic and make it otherwise you'll have a point. Until then you'll just continue to look like a silly lil goose.

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I remember hearing from a Finnish goon, that there is quite a few ex-RAZOR1911, and few "known" hackers in GS. That implies to me that they KNOW how DDOS attacks can be made, and one form which I know is called forum spam. As knowing this, and "ordering" (I do NOT know if the order was given, but as the evidence is starting to come up from all around, it seems that it is concluded that there was a call that people should post) people to do such thing with their mains/alts, constitutes as a DDOS attack against the forums.

So I come to my point now:

There is members who knows how to DDOS in GS.

There is a valid reason to suspect that these members have indulged their knowledge to those, who have the power to make people do such thing.

There is a more or less proof about Login/Logoffing in middle of fights, which ALSO constitutes as DDOS attack towards LOGIN SERVER.

There is proof of ships with thousands of Bookmarks in cargo, to cause tremendous lagbombs when exploding. A attack similar to DDOS, by gamemechanic flaws.

SOOOO.

This is my conclusion: Goons have members who know how to DDOS inside the gamemechanics, and without being directly accusable by their knowledge of internet/game structure.

I Myself dispise all of those actions, and see em as a cowardly way to accomplish something nothing more than RUINING A GAME.

As some of goon said: We just want to ruin the game!

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Originally by: Lana Bird

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Do you guys at CCP actualy think one second what your actions mean to the reputation of your corporation or their identiti before you do such stupid stuff?

Want to kill your own game or are you just stuck on stupid?

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Originally by: Pan Crastus

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Originally by: Lana Bird

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Do you guys at CCP actualy think one second what your actions mean to the reputation of your corporation or their identiti before you do such stupid stuff?

Want to kill your own game or are you just stuck on stupid?

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Meh ... They are playing a game they designed the way they like it and you are paying both for the game and their salaries. It's a win-win situation for them :)

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Originally by: Blacklight

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To be honest

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Originally by: Won Swunglow

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I predict several more months of BoB silence to follow, allong with this all being deleted and forgoton about, until the next time it happens.
Lets just face facts, were all human and open to corruption

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Originally by: Shivalla

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I remember hearing from a Finnish goon, that there is quite a few ex-RAZOR1911, and few "known" hackers in GS.

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Originally by: Tharrn

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Originally by: Blacklight

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To be honest I'm more interested how CCP intend to deal with a particular element of the player base who think that just because their personal drama llama is on the loose it's then ok to spam these forums to the degree that they have to be taken down to deal with it.

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Sorry, but a 'direct MSN line to your friends at CCP' is just wrong. If they'd be professionals they'd ask you to go the way EVERYONE has to go (aka petitions) and would close the chat.

End of the story.

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Originally by: Fivo Asia

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Why not! I believe SOE just deleted the last 4 years of forums retention from their past mistakes. CCP should follow the leader!

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Tharrn

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Originally by: Blacklight

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To be honest I'm more interested how CCP intend to deal with a particular element of the player base who think that just because their personal drama llama is on the loose it's then ok to spam these forums to the degree that they have to be taken down to deal with it.

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Sorry, but a 'direct MSN line to your friends at CCP' is just wrong. If they'd be professionals they'd ask you to go the way EVERYONE has to go (aka petitions) and would close the chat.

End of the story.

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yes if you wanted to meet your friends in the pub for a pint you would send them a petition!!!!!

like i said earlier probably every alliance in this game has direct contact with CCP get over it. If this was none BOB related it would be a non issuse

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Originally by: zombu2

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now we have 72 pages and still nothing grow up and accept that there will be always corruption in or out of this game thats the way it is

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Originally by: Tetsujin

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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If this was none BOB related it would be a non issuse

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You are deluded. There are 76 pages of people posting their opinions and concerns and I'm sure many of them don't care which group is involved, only that there is a potential involvement.

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Originally by: Damon Ra

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Edited by: Damon Ra on 26/05/2007 19:20:12

Originally by: CCP Arkanon

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I think this thread also illustrates perfectly that we neither censor nor do we try to silence our customers.

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ORLY?

What about the first thread that appeared here in the forums yesterday that was immediately removed and the bans that were handed out to anyone who even mentioned this issue here or in-game? So you are saying no threads were deleted (censored), and no one was banned (silenced)?

Wasn't it exactly the the censorship and attempt to silence players that unleashed the threadnaught and created the necessity for this, a now epic thread?

I have no affiliation to any side of this debate, but I was whorum foring when this all went down yesterday and saw *exactly* how CCP handled things. If you want to convince me that CCP does not attempt to censor or silence its customers, I want some of that kool-aid they are giving you first.

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Originally by: Fubarski

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If boB was concerned about what was building at that POS, I'm pretty sure they'd know.

So the whole "dev" jumping into the corp to fix something could have been exactly that. Regardless of if it was requested, noticed or not, looking over the game IS their job.

On top of that, someone with "real ultimate power" wouldn't even need to join the corp to see any in game information. No, really... They wouldn't have to worry about fiddling with roles, or even load the game to do so.

This kind of over-dramatization, without proper reasoning, or thought processes behind it remind me more, and more, every single day, of the WoW forums.

Maybe... just maybe... the Dev was actually, you know... fixing a bug. And it could have been a bug you didn't see yourselves.

Fubar

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Tetsujin

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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If this was none BOB related it would be a non issuse

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You are deluded. There are 76 pages of people posting their opinions and concerns and I'm sure many of them don't care which group is involved, only that there is a potential involvement.

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No you are deluded 50 pages of this post are your allaince mates posting on alt, trust me i have seen this a long time before you eve started plaing eve from my own alliance about how bob cheat etc, sooner or later you will understand they beat you because they are better.

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Originally by: Fubarski

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If boB was concerned about what was building at that POS, I'm pretty sure they'd know.

So the whole "dev" jumping into the corp to fix something could have been exactly that. Regardless of if it was requested, noticed or not, looking over the game IS their job.

On top of that, someone with "real ultimate power" wouldn't even need to join the corp to see any in game information. No, really... They wouldn't have to worry about fiddling with roles, or even load the game to do so.

This kind of over-dramatization, without proper reasoning, or thought processes behind it remind me more, and more, every single day, of the WoW forums.

Maybe... just maybe... the Dev was actually, you know... fixing a bug. And it could have been a bug you didn't see yourselves.

Fubar

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Originally by: Elmo Noguchi

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Edited by: Elmo Noguchi on 26/05/2007 19:27:07

Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Tetsujin

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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If this was none BOB related it would be a non issuse

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You are deluded. There are 76 pages of people posting their opinions and concerns and I'm sure many of them don't care which group is involved, only that there is a potential involvement.

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No you are deluded 50 pages of this post are your allaince mates posting on alt, trust me i have seen this a long time before you eve started plaing eve from my own alliance about how bob cheat etc, sooner or later you will understand they beat you because they are better.

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So anyone who posts here who disagrees with you is a goon?

How do you know this?

The sad thing about this is that the last sentence is right. BoB does seem to be better. Too bad that doesn't matter anymore and never will. The goons will never "sooner or later understand," because in their minds you guys are cheaters. The jury is still out, but it certainly seems more likely than not.

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Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane

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Edited by: Bartholomeus Crane on 26/05/2007 19:29:45
Arkanon asked us for time so he can give us an answer to the allegations.

Given previous experience I don't expect it to be an answer I'm gonna like.

I'm willing to give him, and thus CCP, a chance though. A last one.

I just paid for this month. I'll only be logging on to switch skills, I'm setting long ones.

If I don't like Arkanon's answer it will be my last month.

There's nothing I dislike more than cheaters, and I don't see the need to play in a rigged game.

Maybe it is time to move on ...

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Originally by: nickky01

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Edited by: nickky01 on 26/05/2007 15:12:39

Originally by: Malloc Memrel

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This is the first and probably only post on eve-o I'll ever make, as I've never been much of a "Game X Forums" kind of guy, but I had to say this.

As an ex-Blizzard employee, I am flabbergasted at the extent to which developer presence contaminates the player pool. With WoW there wasn't a line between our player accounts and our personal accounts- there was a wall, a moat, a spike-filled trench, and electrified barbed wire. You so much as tried to enter a developer command into the console, you'd be kicked from the server, your account would be flagged, and unless you had a really damn good rason for attempting to bring developer capabilities into the game your ass was fired. You told no one anything about the game behind the curtain, you never told anyone in-game that you even worked for the company, or your ass was fired. The impetus for crossing that line in eve is entirely beyond me.

And don't start for a second with "We need to see how things work." Rubbish. You've got one of the most robust test servers known to MMOs, you've got ridiculously fluid interaction from your player base (At least from the bottom-up) and if nothing else you could have internal servers to try things on. Having anyone with even the possibility of developer powers in the public server is nothing short of madness. Having powers above and beyond normal players, or having access to information beyond the average player, is akin to putting water in chocolate- a single drop can cause a whole batch to sieze and it's ruined just like that.

"But what about GMs?" you ask. Fair enough, they need certain powers to set things right. But they should only ever exist in the game when no other option presents itself. They should be invisible, intangible, a last resort for a coding malfunction or dispute that requires GM omniscience to solve. They should not be people but a service, identifiable only to the point that they can be held accountable for their actions. If you tried to log in as a GM account anywhere but at Blizzard's GM center, hell, if you even hinted that you had a GM account, you'd be canned so fast your head would spin. That CCP would willingly and intentionally contaminate the public player base with what amounts to demi-gods with varying degrees of moral fortitude just boggles my mind.

The thing is, I know some CCPers here on the american side of things, people I've worked with in the past, and I just feel so sorry for them. I just want to say to them, "What the hell is going on over there? What kind of people are you working for?" but I know it isn't their fault.

Bottom line, CCP doesn't care. What exactly they don't care about, I'm not sure; it could be that they don't care about people being in a position to abuse powers beyond what normal paying customers can do, or it could be that they don't care about the effect establishing an Old Boy's Club with their closest pals has on the rest of the game, or it could be any number of things. But the inevitable conclusion is that there is some aspect of the past and current troubles that they are simply turning their noses up at.

The sad thing is, I left WoW for EvE because despite all the work I had put into it, EvE struck me as the superior product. Ironically, I was half wrong and half right. Eve has the potential to be a superior product, but this kind of customer relations seems to spit in the face of everyone who wants to play a game with a firm set of established rules applicable throughout the playerbase.

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from here

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Elmo Noguchi

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Edited by: Elmo Noguchi on 26/05/2007 19:27:07

Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Originally by: Tetsujin

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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If this was none BOB related it would be a non issuse

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You are deluded. There are 76 pages of people posting their opinions and concerns and I'm sure many of them don't care which group is involved, only that there is a potential involvement.

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No you are deluded 50 pages of this post are your allaince mates posting on alt, trust me i have seen this a long time before you eve started plaing eve from my own alliance about how bob cheat etc, sooner or later you will understand they beat you because they are better.

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So anyone who posts here who disagrees with you is a goon?

How do you know this?

The sad thing about this is that the last sentence is right. BoB does seem to be better. Too bad that doesn't matter anymore and never will. The goons will never "sooner or later understand," because in their minds you guys are cheaters. The jury is still out, but it certainly seems more likely than not.

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ok as you have been around for under 24 hours i will ignore your pointless comments.

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Originally by: Emrod

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Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Jonas Vance

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Originally by: Shivalla

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Originally by: Stahlregen

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Originally by: Viktor Bout

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Goons go and play POTBS. In POTBS you have a Dev whos a member of SA/Goons. You are searching for an excuse to leave eve coz you ruined nearly every mmporg youve joined exept eve. You assimilated nearly every corp in your area and you still cant win this game. You cant win by blobbing and you cant win by leaving drama bombs. Zerg away...

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NO DAMNNIT!

We're going to ruin this game if it's the last thing we do!

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Hmmm... And now I can see it all clearly.

You are RUINING THE GAME for us all. Stop. Please.

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And by "Us all" you mean BoD. Cry more pleaze. Your tears make me laugh.

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By us all, I mean the whole EVE-ONLINE community of players.

As it has been said many times b4, these un-constructive trolls and flames, are only making this thread, and for example CAOD in sense utterly disappointing. And in general the WHOLE COMMUNITY feels sick and tired of people who aims to break the community.

You sir, aint helping.

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Eve community gonna still alive after this scandale anyways. But i am begin to think that some powerfull members of this same community have fear of something hum...but what...who know ?!

And yes the communty of Eve feel sicks, true....sick about people like you trying to make morale post and try to defend cheater.Thats disgusting!

We dont need to see what BOB have to say about this because we dont care about your silly opinions....we want to see the reaction of the direction of CCP and only them.

We want a TRUE investigation.

We want that the corrupt GM or DEv or whatever their high position in this Game can't be kick out and be judge about their silly actions against all the Eve community by take game mecanic for their personal purpose againts or for help another player/corp/alliance ingame,whatever the names!

We want justice for the case for the ISD employee Raekhan who have kick out for strange reason by the intervention of some Bob ego maniacs member who take their friendly relation with some DEvs to made unsual move in this game.

and finally WE PAY TO PLAY THIS GAME AND WE WANT TO KNOW WHY WE STILL CONTINUES AFTER WHEN CCP always try to denied everything!

Its not about win or loose a forum war, ingame war or another personal stuff...its only because the community its sick about all of this strange behavior in the CCp team with some palyer/corp or alliance ingame.

its just all about this you moron!

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