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Dajjal
Amarr
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:14:00 -
[1]
as procliamed by a GM tonight - continually logging in and out every few seconds is declared valid and legal
so next time you face odds you arent too happy with - feel free to log in and log out as often as necessary to ensure your ship is impossible to target even after succesful probing - just make sure u log in for the minimal amount of time
as endorsed by Xander0000000000 (over 50 relogs in a 1/2 hour)
EVE has, and has had, the potential to be more than the standard MMO fare but allowing utter nonsense like this just makes a mockery of the whole character of this game
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Marquis Dean
Demise and Vestige
9th Fleet
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:19:00 -
[2]
You heard it here first: people abuse game mechanics!!!
I had no idea!
---
 Originally by: Wild Rho
I'm having a hard time getting over the irony of spelling "dumb" wrong.
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Alphamarine
Minmatar
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:35:00 -
[3]
I have been playing this game for well over 3 years and I too witnessed this, all I can say is I hope that I never see anything as pathetic as what I witnessed by this Finfleet guy tonight.
This went on for over 30 minutes, we probed him down and he flew off, probed down and flew off, because this person was only in game for a few seconds everytime we caught him we could not lock him.
Utterly pathetic way of using ingame mechanics as an "I win button"
CEO Rage Academy |
Trem Sinval
Sinval Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:47:00 -
[4]
What's more pathetic: this guy logging in and out constantly, or you two wasting a half hour on a target you obviously were not going to nail down?
Just whip out some suicide alts, have a go at Jita for a bit, that'll make you feel better.
- Trem |
Alphamarine
Minmatar
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:51:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Alphamarine on 10/06/2007 21:50:46
You never felt like nailing a cheat at all costs?
We were waiting for the petition response
CEO Rage Academy |
Visionsz
Caldari
Midas Tycho
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:51:00 -
[6]
I can't believe you have attention spans of 30 minutes  
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Nanobotter Mk2
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:52:00 -
[7]
Quote:
as procliamed by a GM tonight - continually logging in and out every few seconds is declared valid and legal
so next time you face odds you arent too happy with - feel free to log in and log out as often as necessary to ensure your ship is impossible to target even after succesful probing - just make sure u log in for the minimal amount of time
as endorsed by Xander0000000000 (over 50 relogs in a 1/2 hour)
Why would you be surprised? this is the same company that supports killing your self to make money exploiting their poorly implmented loot rights system.
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Cpt Pugwash
Rubra Libertas Militia
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Posted - 2007.06.10 21:55:00 -
[8]
This is standard practice for Xelas ratters
Some people will do anything to get ahead, allowing such abuses to continue will ruin Eve.
Movies: Make Mine a Bob Light
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Sean Hernandez
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Posted - 2007.06.10 22:26:00 -
[9]
Would you be able to get him with an interceptor and Smartbomb?
Just 1 hit to give him the aggro timer.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? |
Jelmer
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Posted - 2007.06.10 22:57:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Sean Hernandez
Would you be able to get him with an interceptor and Smartbomb?
Just 1 hit to give him the aggro timer.
He had aggro from earlier and each time he logged back in, the aggro timer reset. BUT - since he logged in and instantly dropped connection, he was in emergency warp in and out all the time, hence being in essence invulnerable.
That, to me, is wrong. Not fair play, exploit, unsportsmanlike, childish.
Oh, and he was even proud of it and verified it in local after we had left...
Jelly
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knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:00:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sean Hernandez
Would you be able to get him with an interceptor and Smartbomb?
Just 1 hit to give him the aggro timer.
he had agro, before he logged he was agroed, thats why we started to scan for him. We found him to, a few times. We even bubbled him. However when he comes out of warp hes already logged off, so he warps out of bubbles and he cant be locked.
As long as he keeps logging in/out until we get tired a leave its imposable for him to lose his ship. However the GMs confirmed a few times tonight that its perfectly ok. Although they didn't seem willing to share why.
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:01:00 -
[12]
Edited by: knifee on 10/06/2007 23:00:17
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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Velsharoon
Gallente
Endgame.
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:05:00 -
[13]
Im suprised if finfleet will tolerate it. speak to the ceo?
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knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:19:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Velsharoon
Im suprised if finfleet will tolerate it. speak to the ceo?
I think a mail was sent to him, and in fairness to Finfleet this behaver isn't representative of their corp as a whole.
I think what upset people the most was after it became obvious that we couldn't catch him and petitioned all we got back was 'no its fine, get over it. closed' from the the GMs.
anyway in true ADHD style. i'm now playing POTBS and cant really be bothered with it anymore. especialy as some1 just sank my ship :(
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:20:00 -
[15]
Edited by: knifee on 10/06/2007 23:19:19
:/ i only pressed the button once :( even the forums dont like me today
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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Camilo Cienfuegos
EP0CH
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Posted - 2007.06.10 23:21:00 -
[16]
What about the urban myth of logging in an alt to drop you off grid? Where does this fall?
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Fix Caldari Fix Insurance |
Alphamarine
Minmatar
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.11 12:19:00 -
[17]
Honestly though CCP, this is someone using game mechanics as an "I win button." Of course you cannot force someone to stay logged in, but how can it be fair if this person is knowingly doing it to save his ship and knows it makes him invunerable?
That was our kill, in essence he was already dead, however this missuse of game mechanics changed the outcome and the future in EVE life. His ship should have died, his pod should have died, we should have been able to pick up his loot therefore interacting with the commerece side of the game, he would have had to buy a new ship, new modules either building them himself or buying from another. I ask again how can this be fair if using this trick changed all these outcomes?
CEO Rage Academy |
Maniva Lakona
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Posted - 2007.06.11 12:25:00 -
[18]
It's bullsh*t that's what it is.
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Switchbl4d3 ii
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Posted - 2007.06.11 12:26:00 -
[19]
what ship type?
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SasRipper
DIE WITH HONOUR
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Posted - 2007.06.11 12:42:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Marquis Dean
You heard it here first: people abuse game mechanics!!!
espically those with gm tools
*snip* Sas has spoken this tread shall be locked. |
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Jelmer
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Posted - 2007.06.11 13:19:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Switchbl4d3 ii
what ship type?
Raven, probably ratting fittet.
Jelly
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.06.11 13:50:00 -
[22]
Why does he even bother logging out and back in anyway and not just manually warp around the system ?
After a few logouts/logins he's bound to end up in a place where you're NOT waiting for him, and then he could manually warp anywhere.
_
New char creation guide | Module/Rig stacknerfing explained |
Berand
Shadow Of The Light
R i s e
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Posted - 2007.06.11 14:02:00 -
[23]
That's lame as hell. Both on the part of the pilot and on the part of the GMs for not doing something about it.
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WredStorm
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2007.06.11 14:16:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Akita T
Why does he even bother logging out and back in anyway and not just manually warp around the system ?
After a few logouts/logins he's bound to end up in a place where you're NOT waiting for him, and then he could manually warp anywhere.
Yeah, I can't see how logging in and out constantly helps him at all in comparison to just manually jumping around. Can you explain what it accomplished for him in more detail?
Wred
-----
Think out of the box, consider passive shield tanking your Myrmidon, you'll be pleasantly surprised! |
Erfnam
Time Cube Syndicate
Legionnaire Services Ltd.
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:07:00 -
[25]
The problem you are faced with is the fact that you can't lock fast enough. Easily solution, bring smartbombs. That should give you more than enough time to probe him a second time and tackle him.
Sales: Capital Ships | Covetors Delivered - Bulk/Package/BYOM |
Christari Zuborov
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:12:00 -
[26]
That's really pathetic.
The game mechanics involving PvP really need to be addressed. There are other MMOs who have addressed actions identical to these as it was realized it was bad for the game.
There is nothing more demoralizing than to feel as if you're being cheated. Whether this involves a corp being fed BPO/BPCs, a player abusing a game mechanic for their gain, or developing a 3rd party program to make you invulnerable.
This goes far further than one person doing something in poor form, this strikes at the core of this games 'integrity' issue, and true to form expressed in the past also, the GMs care not.
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JADE DRAG0NESS
Native Freshfood
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:21:00 -
[27]
How completly lame this is the kind of thing id expect a BoB clone to do.
"Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god."
-- Jean Rostand |
knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:23:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Erfnam
The problem you are faced with is the fact that you can't lock fast enough. Easily solution, bring smartbombs. That should give you more than enough time to probe him a second time and tackle him.
He had agro before he logged the first time, and every time he logged in/out the timer reset to 15min.
However for what ever reason (emergancy warp mechanics perhpas) he couldn't be locked, or bubbled, or even bumped.
At the end of the day, if he had stayed online and warped around the system i would have cared less, it would have just been chalked up to a decent pilot playing the game and escapeing. This nonsence was just patheic though, and the responce of the GMs just made most of our gang wonder what the point is. Dont like the fight.. just cheat. The GMs say its fine.
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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Ez kill
The Staff
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:30:00 -
[29]
To address some of the people above:
He logged with aggro - fair enough, we've got 15mins to probe him.
We complete the scan and warp to the result - mid warp the guy pops up on local for a split second then disappears. We get to the ship and he is unlockable, unbumpable in fact your ship travels straight through him as if he isn't there. He warps off.
We probe again, warp to result - guy logs in and out again. Same result - ship is at 0km for well over 20 seconds and we cannot do anything.
The person in question was logging in and out as fast as he could load the client, and was never in the game for more than a fraction of a second.
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Beef Hardslab
The 5 Amigo's LLC.
NxT LeveL
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:40:00 -
[30]
Hmm maybe smartbomb battleship would do the trick? No lock required, seems to hit other things that are unlockable (probes).
Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve:
Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii
Podding my own alt in a gatecamp while drunk, he was carrying a hauler full of tech II goods, Oops.
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Awox
Digital Fury Corporation
Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:46:00 -
[31]
OMG do you people ever read? What good is a Smartbomb battleship going to do? Do you know how much damage you need to do to kill a battleship when you factor in resists? :S
Forget about smartbombing and other crap. Focus on the fact CCP refuse to police their game if it means upsetting the bottom line.
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BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it) |
Sean Hernandez
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:48:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Jelmer
Originally by: Sean Hernandez
smartbomb - D'oh
Yadda Yadda Yadda
Oh, and he was even proud of it and verified it in local after we had left...
Jelly
Our survey said he is a [insert expletive here]
Thanks for clearing that up for me - didn't realise. So did he just wait until local was empty to finally log back in - or until you were gone?
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? |
Test84984949
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:50:00 -
[33]
Blah, and its stuff like this that keep pushing me away from Eve. I mean the mechanics are there and people are going to abuse them, but for CCP to come out and pretty much condone such a behvior hurts. I mean....by mechanics an entire alliance could take a Sunday stroll through Jita, and shut down all of Eve in the process. Pilots don't do this because they KNOW what will happen even though this is nothing against game mechanics. Common sense people, and respect are the key.
Doesn't bother me that much though like it should....through all the allegations and junk of late I'm going back and playing the games that I've ignored for the past three years because I've been busy grinding away at Eve thinking that I was grinding on the same level playing field, and getting myself ready to make my mark in the universe...
Like this title that I started last week, some may laugh but this game I passed up to play Eve...not apples to apples and not as much at stake than Eve but WoW its fun! hint the game
I'll continue to pay my 4 account for a while though, and to all you "Can I have your stuff" ..no you can't because I'm taking it with me.
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Beef Hardslab
The 5 Amigo's LLC.
NxT LeveL
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Posted - 2007.06.11 15:53:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Awox
OMG do you people ever read? What good is a Smartbomb battleship going to do? Do you know how much damage you need to do to kill a battleship when you factor in resists? :S
Forget about smartbombing and other crap. Focus on the fact CCP refuse to police their game if it means upsetting the bottom line.
Oh I don't know, could have been you posting "Damn we chased him for a half hour and finally killed him" instead of "Damn we chased him for a half hour and got nothin".
Of course it's bull****, but honestly are you surprised?
Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve:
Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii
Podding my own alt in a gatecamp while drunk, he was carrying a hauler full of tech II goods, Oops.
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knifee
Caldari
Rage Academy
oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2007.06.11 16:02:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Beef Hardslab
Of course it's bull****, but honestly are you surprised?
you know.. i was surprised :( maybe that makes me a bit naive but honestly i expected that given Xander was still doing this as we petitioned, they would do something about it.
To the guy who asked if he logged back in once we left.. yes, as soon as the main gang had gone he logged back in. Then smaked the cpl people that were still there. A genuine credit to Finfleet.
www.eve-dev.net - making a good thing better
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Montague Zooma
Imperial Dreams
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.11 16:14:00 -
[36]
Think of this incident as a maturity test.
Everyone failed.
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TechnoMag
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.06.18 13:06:00 -
[37]
And where was your comments when a AAA/RA dread caught at a pos do same **** login/loggout until he was at a safe position???
Or where was your comments when i writed here many times about this RA tactics?
yeah its a known bug everyone know... and ra was the people who discovered and abused many times
EULA 7. CONDUCT
A. 1. You may not take any action that imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on the System. |
Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2007.06.18 13:15:00 -
[38]
Originally by: TechnoMag
And where was your comments when a AAA/RA dread caught at a pos do same **** login/loggout until he was at a safe position???
Or where was your comments when i writed here many times about this RA tactics?
yeah its a known bug everyone know... and ra was the people who discovered and abused many times
It's lame, regardless of whoever is doing it. RA, BoB, State War Academy, The Pope, whatever. I hope CCP fixes it, and soon.
--------
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Ashraaf
Infinite Improbability Inc
Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2007.06.18 14:27:00 -
[39]
Somethings that bother me it's that eve go more and more for mecanism than playing.
Win or Survive, or kill at all cost transform a good game to something far less amusing
Maybe CCP have to think about "Push mecanism to limit" this is a great challenge for the game
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Nesa
Antares Fleet Yards
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.18 17:57:00 -
[40]
From what I've seen in the last 6 months, Eve has degenerated into this. Everyone is looking for a way to out-survive impossible odds. They will use over powered modules, they will go POS bowling, they will log out / in if it will save them. People will petition it, and 9 times out of 10 the response when told that 'it's not an exploit' will be to start using the tactic rather than actually try and get it fixed. It's a pretty sad state of affairs, and even though I've seen it alot more recently than in the past, it does seem to be a trend encouraged by some of the more 'successful' long term players and alliances.
I mean, if you experienced something like this, and hadn't already invested that much time in the game... you'd quit on the spot. Because there's so many ways to cheat death, there's becoming a big divide between the people that get killed in PvP, who then have to go and work hard for more isk, and those that just PvP all the time, because they hardly ever lose anything, they will just cloak/log if in trouble. It goes against the spirit of the game, because for every item there is supposed to be a counter, for each tactic, a counter tactic. We're now seeing tactics for which there is no counter. It's pretty sad and I know many who have played the game since the start who have left over it.
It's a bad day for the game when there are 2 choices, 'exploit' or lose to those that do. Because you know unless they have an fix in the pipeline it won't be ruled an exploit. By the time fixes arrive the next one is already at epidemic stage...
And damn. I need a faster computer... no way I could log in that many times in 1/2 hr.. :o takes me at least 90 seconds, I'd so be dead if I tried that.
Worst thing I ever did was get caught with a fleet @ downtime (so I didn't log off just downtime hit) come 3am I forget about it, and need to login to give someone a message.... :o ooops... Camp was still up and I didn't even notice I was being shot at until I hit structure (damn windows covering stuff).
I think I need to petition to put a bar on my acct that automatically logs me off @ midnight for my own protection. I only ever seem to lose ships by being stupid @ stupid hours of the night...
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Jimer Lins
Gallente
Sanctuary
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Posted - 2007.06.18 18:15:00 -
[41]
I don't understand what advantage this conferred- isn't it more effective to warp all over the system, crap a bunch of midwarp bookmarks and lead the probers on a merry chase all over creation until you can hit a gate and GTFO?
I have a hard time fathoming how this could be useful. It does sound completely lame, though.
Oh, and the ewarp out of bubbles thing is going to be fixed in the next patch, so if you run into this after Tuesday you can bubble him up and nail him.
SEARCh- we find sites for you! |
Mhaerdirne Solveig
Combustion Industries
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Posted - 2007.06.18 18:34:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Nesa
Everyone is looking for a way to out-survive impossible odds.
this is human nature
please tell me you expect nothing else
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Hyperforce99
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.06.18 18:38:00 -
[43]
WARNING!!! RANT TOWARDS USERS BELOW!!!
ALSO INCLUDING A WAY TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM!!!
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You people say you want these issues sorted and I agree with it... but how about some idea's hu...
YOU KEEP SAYING THAT CCP NEEDS TO FIX THE ISSUE BUT YOUR FOGETTING THAT THERE ISN'T MUCH THEY CAN DO ABOUT IT!!!
Simple, CCP added the 15 min battle timer so people could scan them out, a good scaning expert can do this in under 2 min... maybe 3 - 4
now this guy is abusing the emergency warp system to prevent you from scanning him down, and I agree, thats pretty sad... unless your talking about empire space you could allways drop a bubble or a interdictor sphere... if your talking about empire space then I'm affraid theres not a lot you can do.
I agree its rediculious but tell us a way how to fix this without nerfing half of eve's log in system, leaving ships in space in this game WITHOUT emergency warp would be to rough...
you say the GM's need to kick (or even so rough as BAN) people when they do this, CCP can't, theres no rules in the ULEA that state they can't repleat log-in, offcourse its suspecious but even CCP at this point has no solid ground to act uppon. Besides if one GM tells you he can't act that doesn't mean the whole of EVE's devs are to be scolded for it.
A way this could be fixed would be to disable emergency warp for 2 min if a character logs in and out more than say 6 times in a period of 10 min. Would this satisfy your whining... it might.
In any case I find it just plainly unfair that people call CCP a bunch of money-grabbing bastards... they work hard to keep this game going and one person (T20) doing something wrong in the past doesn't make the whole of CCP like T20.
CCP people are also humans and they can't just go and BAN customers for doing something as low as log-in tactics, its lame, its stupid, it could be fixed with the described fix, but CCP devs arn't gods and unless you give them a way to SOLVE issues they might overlook them. This tactic is new, before it would just be people that logged off, now scanners are introduced it changed to lame people that log-in/out.
IF YOU WANT SOMETHING SOLVED GIVE IDEA'S NOW INSULTS...
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BluOrange
Gallente
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
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Posted - 2007.06.19 06:57:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Hyperforce99
YOU KEEP SAYING THAT CCP NEEDS TO FIX THE ISSUE BUT YOUR FOGETTING THAT THERE ISN'T MUCH THEY CAN DO ABOUT IT!!!
...
I agree its rediculious but tell us a way how to fix this without nerfing half of eve's log in system, leaving ships in space in this game WITHOUT emergency warp would be to rough...
Why?
Isn't eve intended to be cold and harsh? Isn't this supposed to be the opposite of Hello Kitty Online?
Oh, while I'm here, I'd just like to say that I spent half an hour yesterday trying to kill Beef Hardslab, and he had the decency not to log out. The fact that he didn't lose his ship is because he had a tactic he was using that wasn't an exploit. It pains me that playing the game properly exposes people to greater risk than gross, obvious abuses of mechanics that exist to cushion the blow.
If your game is supposed to be dark and harsh, I say 'take away the cushions'.
Recruitment FAQ |
Lady Gadiva
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.06.19 09:33:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Lady Gadiva on 19/06/2007 09:32:57
Wasn't able to kill a non-combat ship (ratting raven) in a 3 on 1 gank situation.....must go to the forums and complain.
I love true PVP. Ganking Ravens is just good for stroking your killboard ego but we've all done it.
As far as I'm concerned if a Raven gets away from being ganked by logging or cloaking I really couldn't care less. Now if 3 of us jumped into a gate with 3 hostiles in combat ships and they logged or cloaked I would be pretty angry. But perhaps not enough to petition it.
I'm not endorsing it. It is lame beyond measure. He should just a fit a cloak so you can create a thread about how cloaking ravens are so lame because we really don't have enough of those either.
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R3dSh1ft
Dark Knights of Deneb
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:25:00 -
[46]
this happened to me with a stabbed absolution. solution would be: once you engage in combat (as he had) you no longer e-warp on CTD. done. then you can't complain about your connection problems or anything as you choose to be in the game for the next 15 minutes and if you can't be you lose your ship.
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DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine |
E Vile
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Posted - 2007.06.19 10:33:00 -
[47]
EVE has, and has had, the potential to be more than the standard MMO fare but allowing utter nonsense like this just makes a mockery of the whole character of this game
I totally agree.
"The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering."
Shohadaku New York Metal
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MuNieK
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:07:00 -
[48]
hmm... maybe i shall come back to World of Warcraft then... so there is nothing like 30 seconds logging out when not in safe area?
Lol Eve devs seems to be even more ******** then WoW's ones... -.-' pathetic - and i was about to buy this game
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Malevolyn
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:32:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Montague Zooma
Think of this incident as a maturity test.
Everyone failed.
Just thought I'd quote this.
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Pimm
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:34:00 -
[50]
Originally by: BluOrange
Isn't eve intended to be cold and harsh? Isn't this supposed to be the opposite of Hello Kitty Online?
One of the great things about this game is it can be as calm and mundane as mining or action packed and intense as PvP. Now I see people say stuff like "Unsportsmanlike", you have to laugh at that one. Three against one is not sportsmanlike no matter how you look at it. Did he abuse game mechanics maybe, it will be up to CCP to decide. So file a petition and move on.
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Tekumze Wolf
Minmatar
Blueprint Haus
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.19 11:44:00 -
[51]
I'd put in another timer.
If you log off and log in within the aggression timer you will be refused another login for x minutes.
x=Number of logins within the same aggression timer.
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Glumpumpkin
House Elf Liberation Front
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:04:00 -
[52]
This sounds to me like an overblown, though not isolated incident.
Some people have such a strong sense of self-preservation that they're willing to meta-game in order to save their ship.
The problem you have with this guy logging is the same problem I have with everyone and their mother fitting protocloaks to their ships. They don't ever want to engage anything that isnt a rat or a vastly inferior gang, so they cloak and crtl+q, cloak and safespot, cloak and go open another can of cheez puffs.
But as frustrating as this is- people cloaking, people logging, I don't let it bother me. I've gotten as many kills taking advantage of the panic and stupidity of these metagamers as I've lost to their borderline exploitation.
Sure, shooting a logged of ship is totally unrewarding and dull, but when it drops a pile of faction loot and I get to mock the pod pilot once he logs back on for being a metagaming sissy it is immensely gratifying.
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kill0rbunny
Alpha-Hirogen
Phoenix Allianz
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:05:00 -
[53]
Don't make jokes about bunny's.
Bunnys are kewl.
I pew therefore I am.
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Xaarist
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:30:00 -
[54]
some comments:
1st: i will discuss this incident between the directors. no speculations on the outcome.
2nd: there are methods to counter this, especially if he had aggro, which you confirmed. if you don't know how to use them it is entirely your fault. i am not stating this in favour of our member, who's behaviour i consider lame, especially if it is true he was bragging in local about it.
3rd: thanks to RA, KOS, and GOON for being excellent teachers at this. be it logging off and on 100 times or teaching us how to kill them regardless of what they did.
i am interested in any chat logs of the incident. the members behaviour regarding logging is lame in deed, but not an exploit. smacktalk or provocations in local is a violation of corp rules though, and will be dealt with if proven.
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Your signature image exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie |
Glumpumpkin
House Elf Liberation Front
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Posted - 2007.06.19 12:52:00 -
[55]
Hey Xaarist you forgot to mention the part where despite the actions of a few individual metagamers in an alliance of 4000, RA, Goons, and KOS still managed to kick you out of all of your space AND have registered your alliance name as one of our own corporations.
You also forgot to mention the part where Finfleet pilots exploited POS aggression bugs to scan out and kill pilots who logged off in Detorid, sometimes hours after they logged.
I hope you enjoy being completely irrelevant.
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cflux
Caldari
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.06.19 13:06:00 -
[56]
Edited by: cflux on 19/06/2007 13:07:50
Originally by: Glumpumpkin
Hey Xaarist you forgot to mention the part where despite the actions of a few individual metagamers in an alliance of 4000, RA, Goons, and KOS still managed to kick you out of all of your space AND have registered your alliance name as one of our own corporations.
And a despite actions of an individual player in a corporation of 300 members, you try to make it sound that we are not in full understanding what happened in the last year?
Quote:
You also forgot to mention the part where Finfleet pilots exploited POS aggression bugs to scan out and kill pilots who logged off in Detorid, sometimes hours after they logged.
Complete garbage. First of all, scanprobe does not tell if a pilot is bugged or not - if such happened it means we scanned a ship, found it AFK or logged with agro and killed it. If pilot was bugged such case is petionable and that way it can be reinbursed. Are you honestly claiming, that every covert-ops pilot should petition or convo hostile corporation before they can kill a ship in space, just to make sure CCP's game has not bugged? Or keep somehow track of 400+ people in local when pilot might have logged off? I think at this point we can fairly say that you are trolling and there is not a single alliance or corp ingame that even tries to do such imagenary thing.
Quote:
I hope you enjoy being completely irrelevant.
Thank you, we do.
--
Regarding the original complaint of FinFleet's pilots actions:
As Xaarist told, we are very interested in seeing the logs regarding the smacktalk - that is something we truly hate and actions will be taken on that. What it comes to internal matters of manners with individual pilots, much better result is achived by contacating our directors than trying to make a public smere campaing out of actions of one, especially when it comes from entity that is close to parties that tought us how to do this and how to counter it.
Pretty much all of our hostiles can tell that we fight upfront and quite honestly, taking losses and dealing them to others. Some might even say we have very high standards of values and honor in this corp. Sadly, as all corporations we do not have 24-7 big brother director coverage on single pilots who might be drunk, stoned, bored or feeling like giving back tactics they see on combat operations. Game Mechanics is something CCP has to address - not the playerbase, but still we are forced to become e-honor police due CCPs problems. That is not what I'm paying for, but you can take it granted that such issues are delt very seriously in the corporation if need arises.
--
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Xaarist
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.06.19 13:27:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Glumpumpkin
Hey Xaarist you forgot to mention the part where despite the actions of a few individual metagamers in an alliance of 4000, RA, Goons, and KOS still managed to kick you out of all of your space AND have registered your alliance name as one of our own corporations.
You also forgot to mention the part where Finfleet pilots exploited POS aggression bugs to scan out and kill pilots who logged off in Detorid, sometimes hours after they logged.
I hope you enjoy being completely irrelevant.
maybe some day you will understand what i was talking about, and what not. our point is made and our position clarified. results will be presented to involved parties only.
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Your signature image exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie |
cheesyhead
Minmatar
Cruoris Seraphim
Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.06.19 13:58:00 -
[58]
haha, i had something like this before, we were probing a freighter pilot (after we killed its support ) and he was doing this so-called bunny hopping. We send duzons of petitions with all the same reply, its not an exploit, move on... we did manage to get on him a couple of times, but we couldnt lock even when he hadnt logged of yet, so we petitioned that, this time though, i think the devs responded and made him luckable or the player made a mistake and we locked him, bubbled him, aggroed him, shot him, popped him, podded him, he then logged on in a station, so its not always hopeless. ccp does listen. :P
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Agent Li
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Posted - 2007.06.19 14:10:00 -
[59]
Am I the only one who, after seeing people show up in local (in a system that was previously empty), hit the cloak and move in a random directions?
I've seen people show up, looking for me. Not that they managed to find me.
At least I'm not logging off (which I think is lame).
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"Don't be afraid to take advantage of your enemy's weaknesses. Becasuse winning is everything after all." |
captain brainway
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Posted - 2007.06.19 14:20:00 -
[60]
it took over 14 alliances to oust LV, RA and pets achieved an objective no-one can deny that, the same can be said for RA logging, complex exploting, goonswarm using edited ui, t20, etc etc.
to the point, he did not exploit as confirmed by a GM, get over yourselves or dont let the door hit you on the way out, just because its a game doesnt mean its exclusivly for children and there child like tantrums.. GL to him, apart from the smack that is, being ganked and avoiding being ganked he used game mechanics.
more and more this game is changing to evewhine online.
LV are extracting there revenge, just not under the LV banner.
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MuNieK
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:12:00 -
[61]
Originally by: captain brainway
more and more this game is changing to evewhine online.
hmm those so called "whines" are the alarm for game developers - or at least should be... Im totally noob on my 14-days trial here, wondering "to buy" or "not to buy" this game and when i see posts like yours like "omg noob l2p this exploit is not exploit" makes me sick... cause i dont want to pay for game where only people wich know how ot abuse such BUGS or FOOLISH GAME MECHANICS may be considered as "non noobs" and everyone who whine about exploiting is considered as "fool" (i already noticed those word in this topic describing one of "whining" player)... For fair-play and challenge there is no room for exploits' abusing, and compromises about which exploit is possible to avoid and wich one is not - everything shall be reported to tech team and fixed. And if eve developers cant code 10-20 seconds logging off time then they are just lame. And if you say its better the way it is now - you are lame aswell, wanting to aquire some set up goals by your complexes by exploiting any **** in games. God... maybe i really should just end with all those subscription fee's leeching games with **** insetad of payed moderating, administrating, developing teams... hey, wake up this is screwed how it is. make developers take a look at it AND MAKE IT PLAYABLE with challenge, or try to heal your complexes second way.
p.s.
pardon me my english
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Jelmer
Minmatar
Core Domination
Big Bang Quantum
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:32:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Xaarist
Edited by: Xaarist on 19/06/2007 12:40:34
Edited by: Xaarist on 19/06/2007 12:36:31
some comments:
1st: i will discuss this incident between the directors. no speculations on the outcome.
2nd: there are methods to counter this, especially if he had aggro, which you confirmed. if you don't know how to use them it is entirely your fault. i am not stating this in favour of our member, who's behaviour i consider lame, especially if it is true he was bragging in local about it.
3rd: thanks to RA, KOS, and GOON for being excellent teachers at this. be it logging off and on 100 times or teaching us how to kill them regardless of what they did.
4th: making a post on eve-o about such things every time it happens will lead nowhere. complain about it directly the next time, it makes not only our pilot look stupid, but you guys, too.
i am interested in any chat logs of the incident. the members behaviour regarding logging is lame in deed, but not an exploit. smacktalk or provocations in local is a violation of corp rules though, and will be dealt with if proven.
edit: sending mails to Klezz will not get you anywhere since he is out of the game for a while. send them to me instead, i will forward them to directors boards.
Xaarist, I actually tried to convo/mail Demitron of your corp, who was online and in the next system to get a witness from your corp to the behaviour, but no reply.
I have no ill feelings against you in person, but I admit I fail to see what, apart from bubbles, which was tried, we could have done, since the emergency warp made it impossible to get a lock on the guy even when he was next to my ship. And trust me, my locking time in that ship is not long, as I was there as tackler.
You should know me and my corpmates well enough to know we speak the truth. Logs will have to come from someone else, as I had moved on to another system when he bragged about what I would chose to call an abuse of game mechanics.
Jelmer
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Xaarist
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.06.20 07:04:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Xaarist on 20/06/2007 07:03:58
Originally by: Jelmer
I have no ill feelings against you in person, but I admit I fail to see what, apart from bubbles, which was tried, we could have done, since the emergency warp made it impossible to get a lock on the guy even when he was next to my ship. And trust me, my locking time in that ship is not long, as I was there as tackler.
believe me, we had a hard time "testing" how to counter it, it took us almost 6 hours with an average of 6 people, and we found out IT IS POSSIBLE to counter it, and this is why it is NOT considered an exploit. if you lack the skills or imagination to find it out, it is your problem. that's what i wanted to say with my second point. it still is lame tactics, but not exploiting. and in some replys in this thread you can already see what the use of your expression "exploit" has done. some people actually think it is a bannable exploit, which it isn't. it does not make it better, but at least our member did not violate the EULA. you can compare it to scamming or disrespecting a 1vs1, it is lame but not against EULA.
i am still waiting for proof, without any i will rather believe my own member than my enemies, as would everyone else.
and about demitron: if a hostile asks me to jump into the next system to witness something, yeah, what would you expect behind that gate? clue?
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Your signature image exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie |
Richard Aiel
Caldari
The Funkstars Guild
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Posted - 2007.06.24 00:27:00 -
[64]
I JUST petitioned a GM and got the same answer as the OP... "logging in and out of the game is legal"
Im sending a follow up letter asking if logging in/out JUST TO AVOID DYING is also legal.
But I havent gotten a response yet
"The environment plays a big part but EVE is a "PvP" game." Oveur (Its not a MMORPG after all - I sent Oveur a email to update the main page) |
Darth Moo
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Posted - 2007.06.24 00:28:00 -
[65]
Thats horribly dishonorable but if its legal then all's fair...
moo!
If its not an exploit then its fair game |
Admiral Seafort
DarkStar 1
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Posted - 2007.06.24 01:46:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Admiral Seafort on 24/06/2007 01:44:49
Plenty of lame things are permitted, in EVE and throughout the real world. It doesn't make them any cooler, it just makes the person(s) who do(es) it (a) douche(s).
Though I should say that CCP would do well to look into certain behaviors that do not function as intended. They are the final judges as to whether the emergency warp function was intended for this purpose.
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It is well that war is so terrible. We should grow too fond of it. |
Cpt Branko
Guardian Heroes
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:16:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Admiral Seafort
Edited by: Admiral Seafort on 24/06/2007 01:44:49
Plenty of lame things are permitted, in EVE and throughout the real world. It doesn't make them any cooler, it just makes the person(s) who do(es) it (a) douche(s).
Though I should say that CCP would do well to look into certain behaviors that do not function as intended. They are the final judges as to whether the emergency warp function was intended for this purpose.
Ehhh... That's why CCP can make rules to make things not only lame, but illegal.
Metagaming to get risk-free PvP should not be legal. That's the basic argument here. I'm all for removing emergency warp when you've got aggro, anyway. What's the point of emergency warp, anyway?
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Saori Rei
Gallente
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
The Cartel.
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:24:00 -
[68]
Not sure if it is me, but it seems that this tactic has become a lot more common recently. Not sure what brought it on specifically. I understand -why- people do it but I think it is cheating, childish and close to an exploit if not -an- exploit.
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Mr Smartypants
Amarr
Dragon Mining And Fighters Inc
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Posted - 2007.06.24 02:45:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Mr Smartypants on 24/06/2007 02:47:12
Is this behavoir of Bunny-Hopping the cause of Tranquility's latest technical 'hicup'?
I think its a dishonest losers tactic personally, but hey what do I know Im just a 14 Day trial guy who is already aquainted with those types of meta-exploiters (not in my Corp ). Im not keen on rolling over for them but at this stage what can I do.
As the previous trial user stated, why would anyone consider playing and putting a lot of dedication into Eve if those types of characters and the ability to ab-use game mechanics go unchecked.
 But just to poke the embers here, should I look forward to seeing the games stability rapidly decline because Bunny-(wabbit)-Hopping is considered the norm and a clever tactical use of the <Esc> key?
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Darth Moo
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Posted - 2007.06.24 04:30:00 -
[70]
bunny hopping ftw
moo!
If its not an exploit then its fair game |
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Pyrostasis
Caldari
Ctrl Alt Elite
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Posted - 2007.06.24 04:38:00 -
[71]
Forgive me, Im more or less new to the whole pvp stuff when it comes to probing and what not... but from what it sounds like... several of you were hunting one guy down... where he more or less has no chance of fighting back as he is out numbered, yet your frustrated that you have no chance in killing him.
Seems to me he is doing too you exactly as your doing to him. Neither of you have a chance.
Now, I agree he is exploiting and thats cheap, approved or not... however, blobbing a guy down imo is cheap to. Maybe Im just from a different school, but I prefer fair fights... not insta killing someone to pad my killboard.
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FarScape III
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Posted - 2007.06.24 04:57:00 -
[72]
Originally by: knifee
Originally by: Sean Hernandez
Would you be able to get him with an interceptor and Smartbomb?
Just 1 hit to give him the aggro timer.
he had agro, before he logged he was agroed, thats why we started to scan for him. We found him to, a few times. We even bubbled him. However when he comes out of warp hes already logged off, so he warps out of bubbles and he cant be locked.
As long as he keeps logging in/out until we get tired a leave its imposable for him to lose his ship. However the GMs confirmed a few times tonight that its perfectly ok. Although they didn't seem willing to share why.
Probably because you can suicide gank and actually get paid for concord destroying you doing a criminal act.
But I would never so called alt-q or bunny hop because my name would be mud in those parts. And what is the point of playing the game when there is no sport in it?
IMO he did not win anyways so no I win button, he is now going to look like a moron in those parts. How is that wining?
A Minmater City... Cool!
My Skills |
Darth Moo
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:19:00 -
[73]
Originally by: FarScape III
what is the point of playing the game when there is no sport in it?
QFT
like blobbing ppl to death...
etc
etc
etc
moo!
If its not an exploit then its fair game |
Richard Aiel
Caldari
The Funkstars Guild
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:21:00 -
[74]
Well, according to the guys here:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=543031
Its an easy fix so whats the problem?
"The environment plays a big part but EVE is a "PvP" game." Oveur (Its not a MMORPG after all - I sent Oveur a email to update the main page) |
Haks'he Lirky
8th
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:39:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Alphamarine
Utterly pathetic way of using ingame mechanics as an "I win button"
Please tell me how he won by doing this?
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Pyrostasis
Caldari
Ctrl Alt Elite
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Posted - 2007.06.24 05:59:00 -
[76]
More like a Dont get blobbed button =)
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Lone Solo
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.06.24 06:09:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Visionsz
I can't believe you have attention spans of 30 minutes
Well actually studies have shown that a male mind thinks about sex on average once every 30 sec, this meens thay got to think about sex 60 times while hunting him and that cant be dull :)
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