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Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 10:02:00 - [1] U dont feel that there is a little bit inbalance by the Moros???? I know gallente is a drone race. if a dread can have pos killing high damage weapons and use this weapons agains smaller ships with right fitting is ok. but if he can have additionaly 1000+ dps just from drones additionally it feels a bit overpowered. Damn in this ship the ogre II's have over 220 DPS with maxed skills, and fighters(which are the primary weapon of a carrier) have max 125 on a bonused NYX?????????? Such things need to be nerfed not the GSC's and other bull***t what CPP makes!!!!
Alski Gallente Di-Tron Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.06.14 10:29:00 - [2] Originally by: Damned Force Damn in this ship the ogre II's have over 220 DPS with maxed skills, and fighters(which are the primary weapon of a carrier) have max 125 on a bonused NYX?????????? But the Moros can only have 5 of them (1.1kdps) whereas the Nyx can have up to 25 (3.1kdps) Still the moros is a good ship, and there is nothing wrong with a ship being good you know Agree they need to leave GSC mechanics alone though. -
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 10:47:00 - [3] Sorry i need to disagree. The moros is a damn good ship, even without drones is on equal with othe dreads. And additionaly have 1000+ DPS as defense, is too big advantage. If very needed should get +10% as every other ship to drone damage
Trass	Posted - 2007.06.14 11:15:00 - [4] Originally by: Damned Force is too big advantage Yes yes, and missiles should use cap, propulsion upgrades mods should be removed, amarr lasers should eat more pg, and all minmatar pilots should be removed ;P
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 11:21:00 - [5] Edited by: Damned Force on 14/06/2007 11:20:26 Originally by: Trass Originally by: Damned Force is too big advantage Yes yes, and missiles should use cap, propulsion upgrades mods should be removed, amarr lasers should eat more pg, and all minmatar pilots should be removed ;P That was the mostly noobish comment i ever heard CPP pls boost iq of Trass
0mega GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.06.14 12:27:00 - [6] Why is 1000dps with a range under 50km too big? The ship is a 2bn ISK target that can be held down by a couple of frigates. If its in siege mode you can kite out of drone control range and the Moros can't escape, as well as taking around a minute to lock conventional ships. If its not seiged it can be sensor damped and made useless. Ogre IIs cannot follow people all over a system like fighters, nor can more than 5 be used at once. All of this is on a ship that has to risk itself to deploy that DPS, whereas the Nyx can move about freely. The Moros is meant as a short-range capital defense platform, taking down small targets such as fighter drones threatening allied capitals. In this situation it is very well balanced. I get the impression you're all ruffled after being ganked by a pirate Moros in low-sec, which isn't the intended purpose but still easily countered.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 12:47:00 - [7] Originally by: 0mega Why is 1000dps with a range under 50km too big? The ship is a 2bn ISK target that can be held down by a couple of frigates. If its in siege mode you can kite out of drone control range and the Moros can't escape, as well as taking around a minute to lock conventional ships. If its not seiged it can be sensor damped and made useless. Ogre IIs cannot follow people all over a system like fighters, nor can more than 5 be used at once. All of this is on a ship that has to risk itself to deploy that DPS, whereas the Nyx can move about freely. The Moros is meant as a short-range capital defense platform, taking down small targets such as fighter drones threatening allied capitals. In this situation it is very well balanced. I get the impression you're all ruffled after being ganked by a pirate Moros in low-sec, which isn't the intended purpose but still easily countered. i dont sad that 1000+ dps under 50km is too big, i sad is to bit to other 2bn ship damages, which can put out max 300dps. So u have 1 ship in the whole class, which have in shrt range almost 4x so much damage as the others. And we dont speak just about the damage. I think everyone know that to kill an ogre II which get bonus from a domi is not so easy, not hard, but not so easy. u need some cycles from SB to kill. and this drone get +50% hitpoint in the domi. In the moros the same drone would get not just 250% bonus to damage, but to hitpoint too!!!!!!! And i see nothing wrong even with this, if the other dreads would get the same defence or attack capability. But let see the ships on max skills: Moros = +25% damage and +250% drone damage and hitpoint Phoenix = +25% rof and +25% kin damage(crappy, who the f**k made this damage for caldaris?) Revelation = +25% rof and -50% cap needed for launchers(crappy, who teh ..... for amarr. u should better fix they cap usage) Naglfar = +25 rof to launchers and +37,5 rof to projectiles and have +1 high slot(+1 weapon) If u have something in brain u should see that the amarr and caldari are much worst than the other 2 races, and the moros because this huge additional damage is much much better than any other!!!
Amy Wang	Posted - 2007.06.14 12:55:00 - [8] The Moros is highest dps dread, not only against smaller targets (which is a considerably advantage tho) but also against Pos using sentrys. There is nothing wrong with that per se, its just when you compare it to the other dreads that it gets obvious that there is an imbalance. Take the Naglfar as an example. 2 ship bonuses dedicated to its main weapons and an additional high slot (which comes at the expense of an medium or low that could be used for tanking/cap). You also need to train 2 BS sized weapon systems (projectile and torps) on top of that to use it properly so thats more sp investment as well. You would expect the Naglfar doing the most damage out of all dreads since it has 4 high slots for XL weapons and it would be fair as well for it to do the highest dps to make up for its weaker tank, but no, the Moros outdamages it due to the ridiculous drone bonus and it even gets a much bigger drone bay for free on top of that. Either the Moros needs to be put in line by converting the drone bonus to e.g. a tracking bonus and reducing the drone bay to a smaller size or the other dreads need a buff, especially the Naglfar.
0mega GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.06.14 14:06:00 - [9] Originally by: Damned Force i dont sad that 1000+ dps under 50km is too big, i sad is to bit to other 2bn ship damages, which can put out max 300dps. Do you even know what siege mode does?
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 14:51:00 - [10] Originally by: 0mega Originally by: Damned Force i dont sad that 1000+ dps under 50km is too big, i sad is to bit to other 2bn ship damages, which can put out max 300dps. Do you even know what siege mode does? Yes i know. i have a Phoenix and a Moros too on 2 different chars
JanSVK	Posted - 2007.06.14 14:57:00 - [11] Originally by: 0mega Originally by: Damned Force i dont sad that 1000+ dps under 50km is too big, i sad is to bit to other 2bn ship damages, which can put out max 300dps. Do you even know what siege mode does? In Siege mode you got 6x dmg to your weapons AND really big problems hitting or doing dmg to anything smaller than a BS and faster than 20m/s with capital weapons. T2 Orge has little problem hitting Cruiser with AB. Is this in about right?
Isis Dea Minmatar Aspi-Vore Xenosaders North Star Confederation	Posted - 2007.06.14 14:58:00 - [12] Originally by: Damned Force U dont feel that there is a little bit inbalance by the Moros???? I know gallente is a drone race. if a dread can have pos killing high damage weapons and use this weapons agains smaller ships with right fitting is ok. but if he can have additionaly 1000+ dps just from drones additionally it feels a bit overpowered. Damn in this ship the ogre II's have over 220 DPS with maxed skills, and fighters(which are the primary weapon of a carrier) have max 125 on a bonused NYX?????????? Such things need to be nerfed not the GSC's and other bull*t what CPP makes!!!! I smell a carrier pilot trying to be able to take on a Dreadnaught 1vs1. Originally by:** Amy Wang The Moros is highest dps dread, not only against smaller targets (which is a considerably advantage tho) but also against Pos using sentrys. There is nothing wrong with that per se, its just when you compare it to the other dreads that it gets obvious that there is an imbalance. Take the Naglfar as an example. 2 ship bonuses dedicated to its main weapons and an additional high slot (which comes at the expense of an medium or low that could be used for tanking/cap). You also need to train 2 BS sized weapon systems (projectile and torps) on top of that to use it properly so thats more sp investment as well. You would expect the Naglfar doing the most damage out of all dreads since it has 4 high slots for XL weapons and it would be fair as well for it to do the highest dps to make up for its weaker tank, but no, the Moros outdamages it due to the ridiculous drone bonus and it even gets a much bigger drone bay for free on top of that. Either the Moros needs to be put in line by converting the drone bonus to e.g. a tracking bonus and reducing the drone bay to a smaller size or the other dreads need a buff, especially the Naglfar. While the Moros does already face a range limitation, it also suffers a tracking limitation when in siege mode against anything moving more than 50m/s (maybe less). You also forget one VERY important thing with your two "under-power'ed" dreadnaughts. The number one way you kill a dreadnaught is to NOS it to death, a tactic long used by major alliances in 0.0 to kill POS sieging dreads. Both of your Dreadnaughts will not lose their prime weapons to this method, allowing them to still fire at battleship/carrier support that might arrive on scene. Hence you have GRAND advantage compared to the other two Dreadnaughts that have only a tank (Revelation) and Drones (Moros) to delay the kill. Hence, you don't need to Nerf it. ___
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 15:04:00 - [13] I have a carrier too, but i dont want to take down a dread, because carriers are not for killing dreads, they have not enough dps. But as i see u dont fly dreads, or u fly just 1 race. Because yes, the moros have no tracking in siege, and citadels are so slow they do the same damage to ships as the moros in siege mode. And u right the Dreads bigest enemy is NOS, but here comes the other thing again, the moros can fight nossing smaller ships with the drones and other ships cant. I know, i use it :)
Icome4u Caldari Dark and Light inc. D-L	Posted - 2007.06.14 15:58:00 - [14] /Signed ______ Originally by: Vyger If I lose connection while walking around a station will my avatar run off in a random direction and go hide in a corner?
murder one Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas	Posted - 2007.06.14 17:42:00 - [15] Moros is fine. Phoenix has capless weapons, Rev has a great (more cap efficient) tank, Nag, well, it has a little of everything (poor Minmatar). Nag w/ diff dmage types for it's guns is nice though. Because I said so...
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.14 19:21:00 - [16] What GSC nerf? Someone can point it to me (I have truble with patching the test version).
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.06.14 19:36:00 - [17] He is right though. I've flown the moros a few times in PVPOS and PVP and its way overpowered. +10% per level sounds more like it. Seeing 5 ogre IIs rip apart a fully T2 tanked megathron in less then a minute seconds is just WRONG.
LOUD NOISES	Posted - 2007.06.14 19:54:00 - [18] Originally by: Sokratesz He is right though. I've flown the moros a few times in PVPOS and PVP and its way overpowered. +10% per level sounds more like it. Seeing 5 ogre IIs rip apart a fully T2 tanked megathron in less then a minute seconds is just WRONG. vs a Phoenix which can alpha the megathron w/ its torps if it's webbed or moving slow.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 20:13:00 - [19] Originally by: LOUD NOISES Originally by: Sokratesz He is right though. I've flown the moros a few times in PVPOS and PVP and its way overpowered. +10% per level sounds more like it. Seeing 5 ogre IIs rip apart a fully T2 tanked megathron in less then a minute seconds is just WRONG. vs a Phoenix which can alpha the megathron w/ its torps if it's webbed or moving slow. If webbed, and painted, than can the Moros cause even more alpha than the Phoenix, and additionaly have the drones :) And the Moros dont even need to offer tank for painter and webber.
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.06.14 20:13:00 - [20] That moros was me, solo, out of siege, using drones only, with faction web/scram/3x sensorbooster. Phoenix needs support to do that.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.14 20:54:00 - [21] Originally by: Sokratesz That moros was me, solo, out of siege, using drones only, with faction web/scram/3x sensorbooster. Phoenix needs support to do that. Exactly and thats why is overpowered. The others posting here just fly Moros or even cant fly any dread, but i fly moros and phoenix too. so i know is overpowered, and i say this even if possible loose this advantage, because simply not ok so.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2007.06.14 23:09:00 - [22] There is no problem with the drone damage bonus in and of itself, the problem arises from the other dreads not having anything like it. (50% is too much also imo, should be like 20%) To the person who said that the moros needs to deploy to do it's DPS so thats why it's ok for it's heavies to do more damage than a max skilled Nyx your argument is flawed. The drone bonus on the Moros doesn't require it to siege to use. The Moros does MORE dps/drone with HEAVIES than a Nyx does with FIGHTERS. One pays 350k for 5 drones and the other (dedicated drone ship without guns like the moros) pays 100 mil for 5 drones doing far less DPS and with similar or less HP. (I think, haven't done the math regarding HP.) CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too. Originally by: CCP Tuxford I prefer dew over pepsi. I prefer beer over most things. Damn now I want beer.
Nisse Owned The Order of Chivalry	Posted - 2007.06.14 23:30:00 - [23] A problem with the drone damage bonus in my opinion, is that it makes most bigger ships(BS, cap ships) instaPWN frigs, hell i even saw intys getting badly owned by warrior II's... I just think since the drone changes(Changed interfacing from drone control limit to damage and hp bonus), frigs haven't had a chance against a ship with dronebay unless jammed or dampened to death
Alcatraz Jones	Posted - 2007.06.14 23:49:00 - [24] Edited by: Alcatraz Jones on 14/06/2007 23:50:30 Originally by: Damned Force Naglfar = +25 rof to launchers and +37,5 rof to projectiles and have +1 high slot(+1 weapon) If u have something in brain u should see that the amarr and caldari are much worst than the other 2 races, and the moros because this huge additional damage is much much better than any other!!! Split weapon system for the Naglfar, so first 2 bonusses, which are mutual exclusive for each high-slot, are in reality just 1. The extra slot is the 2nd bonus. Anyway the only dread that's really usefull in general pvp is the Moros, rest is for pos-killing and killing other capitals. Especially I've never seen a Naglfar camping a gate in low sec., a Phoenix though for whatever reason.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 05:19:00 - [25] Yes, the Naghflar bonus is just for the primary weapons, and so can't be taken as 2 bonuses. U see now the moros is badly overpowered.
Eleana Tomelac Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.15 09:58:00 - [26] Originally by: Damned Force Yes, the Naghflar bonus is just for the primary weapons, and so can't be taken as 2 bonuses. U see now the moros is badly overpowered. Why always nerf? Saying overpowered is just saying "nerf it"! What is needed is a boost to the naghflar. It should be, being a minmatar ship the most impressive turret/missile damage dealer at the expense of tanking (if it si not already). At lvl 4 and 5 in the ships skill, the "capital weapon hardpoint equivalent with ship bonus" is (keeping 1 slot for siege module) : phoenix : 4.5 launchers / 5 revelation : 3.6 turrets / 3.75 (but beams fo 16% more damage than railguns - with shorter range -, but is it still much under a phoenix, or is seems so) Naghflar : 5.35 turrets & launchers / 5.87 moros : 3.6 and +damage of 10 drones / 3.75 +damage of 12.5 drones Maybe the naghflar needs a boost for the damage, but a slight one (-7.5% rof on torps instead of -5%), it already has more firepower than the phoenix but is damn skill intensive like other minmatar ships, so, comparing two pilots with equal SP, the naghflar will tank less and make same (or less) damage (seems crap). The moros will not make more damage than others if outranged, and 60km (max skills in drones) is easyly outranged when takling about capitals and BS. Maybe... Learn tactics? -- Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast ! Happy owner of a Vexor Navy Issue and few ishkurs. The Vexor Navy Issue is much more fun than the Myrmidon !
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 10:20:00 - [27] Dont nerf the moros if u can balance the other dreads tp the level of moros
Amy Wang	Posted - 2007.06.15 10:26:00 - [28] Originally by: Alcatraz Jones Split weapon system for the Naglfar, so first 2 bonusses, which are mutual exclusive for each high-slot, are in reality just 1. The extra slot is the 2nd bonus. Ok, again, it is no "extra" slot, just look at the Naglfar. The 5th high slot is NOT a bonus, here is why: Moros: 4 high/5med/7low Naglfar: 5high/5med/6low Now if the Naglfar had 7 lows or 6 meds, then we would be talking, but with that layout its just inferior, using 2 ship bonuses and 1 slot more to do still less damage then the moros while having less cap or resists. Reducing the Moros drone bonus to a more balanced amount like 10%/lvl would ease that difference as would giving the Naglfar an additional slot, be it high, med or low, doesnt matter, just something.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 10:31:00 - [29] The unbalance is that the damage output of the moros is around the damage of other dreads, but have additionally huge damage from drones. How huge is this damage??? Imagine a normal carrier. The main weapons of a carrier are the feighters(drones). With max carrier skills, and max drone skills and all highs used for DCU's a carrier can use 15 feighters. This 15 feighters make 1500 dps.(Dont forget, from a primary weapon of a capital, with maxed skills and fitted just for this damage) The Moros with maxed skills can launch 5 drones. This 5(let say OGRE II's) can do a little bit more than 1100 dps. So a maxed skill primary weapon can do in extreme case 1500 dps(where the price for a fighter is around 19m and is much easier to kill) and the maxed skill NOT PRIMARY weapon on the moros can put out 1100 dps with 5 t2 drones(which have additional huge hitpoint and are far cheaper). And if your feighters are popped(this 15) u cant have a big backup, max 5 units, where the moros can have a lot of t2 ogres in the dronebay.
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.15 11:06:00 - [30] The Moros actually has poor DPS without drones. Ion Siege Blaster cannons have too poor a range to be useful for POS sieges, so you by default need to use Dual 1000mm Railguns which pretty much have the poorest DPS from a Capital weapon. The drones dont really make up for that. Heres a thought for ya, shoot its drones! It can only carry 4 waves of Heavies... I dont really see this 'imbalance' you're talkign about... -----
Zikka The Establishment	Posted - 2007.06.15 11:27:00 - [31] Originally by: Chronus26 The Moros actually has poor DPS without drones. Ion Siege Blaster cannons have too poor a range to be useful for POS sieges, so you by default need to use Dual 1000mm Railguns which pretty much have the poorest DPS from a Capital weapon. The drones dont really make up for that. Heres a thought for ya, shoot its drones! It can only carry 4 waves of Heavies... I dont really see this 'imbalance' you're talkign about... It gets a 250% bonus to both HP AND DAMAGE. So that means that your 5 ogre 2s are in fact THIRTY ogre 2s both in terms of damage you need to do and damage taken from them. But it's worse than that - because while I can one or two volley a dominix's heavy drones using precision missiles vs a Moros's drones that will barely dent their shields, so he just recalls them and launches more. Even if you do kill them he has drone bay sufficient to store a huge number of replacements. I agree with the others, the bonus should be changed to 20% or possibly even changed to 30% on damage only with no boost to hp.
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.06.15 11:35:00 - [32] Originally by: Zikka Originally by: Chronus26 The Moros actually has poor DPS without drones. Ion Siege Blaster cannons have too poor a range to be useful for POS sieges, so you by default need to use Dual 1000mm Railguns which pretty much have the poorest DPS from a Capital weapon. The drones dont really make up for that. Heres a thought for ya, shoot its drones! It can only carry 4 waves of Heavies... I dont really see this 'imbalance' you're talkign about... It gets a 250% bonus to both HP AND DAMAGE. So that means that your 5 ogre 2s are in fact THIRTY ogre 2s both in terms of damage you need to do and damage taken from them. But it's worse than that - because while I can one or two volley a dominix's heavy drones using precision missiles vs a Moros's drones that will barely dent their shields, so he just recalls them and launches more. Even if you do kill them he has drone bay sufficient to store a huge number of replacements. I agree with the others, the bonus should be changed to 20% or possibly even changed to 30% on damage only with no boost to hp. er fit smat bomb bye bye drones Originally by: Eris Discordia We break after X amount of threads, then we go wild and then we get our medication.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 11:49:00 - [33] Originally by: Lilan Kahn Originally by: Zikka Originally by: Chronus26 The Moros actually has poor DPS without drones. Ion Siege Blaster cannons have too poor a range to be useful for POS sieges, so you by default need to use Dual 1000mm Railguns which pretty much have the poorest DPS from a Capital weapon. The drones dont really make up for that. Heres a thought for ya, shoot its drones! It can only carry 4 waves of Heavies... I dont really see this 'imbalance' you're talkign about... It gets a 250% bonus to both HP AND DAMAGE. So that means that your 5 ogre 2s are in fact THIRTY ogre 2s both in terms of damage you need to do and damage taken from them. But it's worse than that - because while I can one or two volley a dominix's heavy drones using precision missiles vs a Moros's drones that will barely dent their shields, so he just recalls them and launches more. Even if you do kill them he has drone bay sufficient to store a huge number of replacements. I agree with the others, the bonus should be changed to 20% or possibly even changed to 30% on damage only with no boost to hp. er fit smat bomb bye bye drones U tried to kill with SB's an ogre II with +250% hp bonus??
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:04:00 - [34] Originally by: Damned Force Originally by: Lilan Kahn Originally by: Zikka Originally by: Chronus26 The Moros actually has poor DPS without drones. Ion Siege Blaster cannons have too poor a range to be useful for POS sieges, so you by default need to use Dual 1000mm Railguns which pretty much have the poorest DPS from a Capital weapon. The drones dont really make up for that. Heres a thought for ya, shoot its drones! It can only carry 4 waves of Heavies... I dont really see this 'imbalance' you're talkign about... It gets a 250% bonus to both HP AND DAMAGE. So that means that your 5 ogre 2s are in fact THIRTY ogre 2s both in terms of damage you need to do and damage taken from them. But it's worse than that - because while I can one or two volley a dominix's heavy drones using precision missiles vs a Moros's drones that will barely dent their shields, so he just recalls them and launches more. Even if you do kill them he has drone bay sufficient to store a huge number of replacements. I agree with the others, the bonus should be changed to 20% or possibly even changed to 30% on damage only with no boost to hp. er fit smat bomb bye bye drones U tried to kill with SB's an ogre II with +250% hp bonus?? yes i have killed figters too Originally by: Eris Discordia We break after X amount of threads, then we go wild and then we get our medication.
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:11:00 - [35] Edited by: Chronus26 on 15/06/2007 12:10:42 Ogre II + Moros bonus is still less HP than a Fighter, and Fighters get popped pretty quick under fire. HP means nothing with no resists and no regeneration. -----
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:13:00 - [36] Just killing fighters is much easier as to kill Ogre II's with +250% hitpoint :)
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:20:00 - [37] Originally by: Damned Force Edited by: Damned Force on 15/06/2007 12:16:31 Just killing fighters is much easier as to kill Ogre II's with +250% hitpoint :) And they cost 19m and u have no 3 full sets i can field 2 wings of fighters on a carrier i can field 2 and half wing on a mother ship please stop being a general troll Originally by: Eris Discordia We break after X amount of threads, then we go wild and then we get our medication.
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:31:00 - [38] Originally by: Damned Force Just killing fighters is much easier as to kill Ogre II's with +250% hitpoint :) Ogre IIs have LESS HP than fighters EVEN WITH the bonus. Looksey: (Assume Dread 5 (+250%) and Drone Durability 5 (+25%)) Ogre II: Base Shield HP: 269 Base Armor HP: 576 Base Hull HP: 1421 Total HP: 2266 With bonuses: Shield HP: 1177 Armor HP: 2520 Hull HP: 6217 Total HP: 9914 Firbolg Fighter: (Skill bonuses don't apply to fighters so only base stats count) Base Shield HP: 2500 Base Armor HP: 3000 Base Hull HP: 4500 Total HP: 10000 Ok, only slightly more. They have the same sig radius, and i've never seen anybody complain that Fighters are too hard to kill, so I don't see where your argument about their HP is coming from. -----
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:31:00 - [39] Originally by: Lilan Kahn Originally by: Damned Force Edited by: Damned Force on 15/06/2007 12:16:31 Just killing fighters is much easier as to kill Ogre II's with +250% hitpoint :) And they cost 19m and u have no 3 full sets i can field 2 wings of fighters on a carrier i can field 2 and half wing on a mother ship please stop being a general troll how u can fit 2 wings into the carrier? carrier can launch max 15 figters which doing 1500dps(on avarge, not counting the damage bonus for thanatos) how the hell u can put 30 fighters into a carrier which have max 100k m3 drone bay and 1 fighter is 5k m3. by me is that max 20 fighter. In the mothership u can launch max 25 fighters(sure they doo than more damage - 2500 dps). The mothership have 250k m3 dronebay max which means 50 figthers(and thats on the NYX with extra big drone bay)
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:34:00 - [40] Originally by: Damned Force Originally by: Lilan Kahn Originally by: Damned Force Edited by: Damned Force on 15/06/2007 12:16:31 Just killing fighters is much easier as to kill Ogre II's with +250% hitpoint :) And they cost 19m and u have no 3 full sets i can field 2 wings of fighters on a carrier i can field 2 and half wing on a mother ship please stop being a general troll how u can fit 2 wings into the carrier? carrier can launch max 15 figters which doing 1500dps(on avarge, not counting the damage bonus for thanatos) how the hell u can put 30 fighters into a carrier which have max 100k m3 drone bay and 1 fighter is 5k m3. by me is that max 20 fighter. In the mothership u can launch max 25 fighters(sure they doo than more damage - 2500 dps). The mothership have 250k m3 dronebay max which means 50 figthers(and thats on the NYX with extra big drone bay) Because a combat fit Carrier will be launching 10-12 fighters, not 15. Thats near enough 2 waves. Nobody sane would fit 5 Drone Control Units on a Combat Carrier. -----
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:45:00 - [41] Yes, but if u readed the whole thread u can see that we talked about max. if u launch just 10-12 than u have 1000-1200dps almost the same as the moros from drones, just u can lauch 2 time from a carrier and the moros can launch 4. and if the moros get drones popped, still have weapons what a carrier dont have, and if he lost the drones is much less money. I just say, that is not really the most ballanced thing that a dread can put out comparable damage with drones as a carrier
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:52:00 - [42] Originally by: Damned Force Yes, but if u readed the whole thread u can see that we talked about max. if u launch just 10-12 than u have 1000-1200dps almost the same as the moros from drones, just u can lauch 2 time from a carrier and the moros can launch 4. and if the moros get drones popped, still have weapons what a carrier dont have, and if he lost the drones is much less money. I just say, that is not really the most ballanced thing that a dread can put out comparable damage with drones as a carrier you'r bit silly now a combat fitted carrier is lunching 9-11 fighters. it wil have smart bombs and capital remotes fitted any one putting drones on a combat fitted carrier wil lose them so stupidly quick it wont realy matter Originally by: Eris Discordia We break after X amount of threads, then we go wild and then we get our medication.
Damned Force	Posted - 2007.06.15 12:56:00 - [43] Originally by: Lilan Kahn Originally by: Damned Force Yes, but if u readed the whole thread u can see that we talked about max. if u launch just 10-12 than u have 1000-1200dps almost the same as the moros from drones, just u can lauch 2 time from a carrier and the moros can launch 4. and if the moros get drones popped, still have weapons what a carrier dont have, and if he lost the drones is much less money. I just say, that is not really the most ballanced thing that a dread can put out comparable damage with drones as a carrier you'r bit silly now a combat fitted carrier is lunching 9-11 fighters. it wil have smart bombs and capital remotes fitted any one putting drones on a combat fitted carrier wil lose them so stupidly quick it wont realy matter U dont understood what i ment. Sorry, my english is a bit poor :(

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