EVE Search - *Suggestion* How to resolve this damn circle of credibility gap?

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

*Suggestion* How to resolve this damn circle of credibility gap?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
BoBoZoBo Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:00:00 - [31] Edited by: BoBoZoBo on 18/06/2007 15:01:02 The player based audit council is a joke. If CCP REALLY wanted to hid something, I doubt it would be difficult for a whole company who invented the game and subsequent code to hide something from a few players who come by and take a peek every once in a while. If it were that easy, corporate corruption would be all but non-existent. It quite easy to guise things from (especially) part time and non-professional auditors. WITH THAT BEING SAID. I have never had a problem with CCP in the trust department. I have not seen any proof of any misdoing.. or any results proving it. Just a bunch of whiners sad they cant "win". I think it is BRILLIANT on their part to do this. Its good publicity. You go CCP! ========================= Minister of Propaganda - Operator 9
Ares Lightfeather Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:18:00 - [32] Edited by: Ares Lightfeather on 18/06/2007 15:17:34 Originally by: Gaven Blands Edited by: Gaven Blands on 18/06/2007 14:42:18 When they said "Keep saying it!!! It will make it true!!!" "Keep saying it!!! It will make it true!!!" "Keep saying it!!! It will make it true!!!" "Keep saying it!!! It will make it true!!!" "Keep saying it!!! It will make it true!!!" I thought they meant that the allegations would be made true. But I see that they meant that CCP would convince you all that nothing is wrong. They kept saying it, and now you all believe them. It was a good trick. I knew I should have read more of Kieron's stuff, it was just that it was so condascending I couldn't stomach reading another word. Please keep telling me none of it is true. I want to be mindwashed as well. Except that CCP said it was wrong a few times. I fail to see how that somehow 'mindwashes' you. These stupid threads about the so-called conspiracy are up 3 or 4 times a week, and apparently have been for months. Guess which side falls into the "mindwashing" category ?
Salliene Gallente RennTech Hell Hounds	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:32:00 - [33] Originally by: Dark Shikari You made me lose the game. Damnit. I get it!
Zombak Caldari Shooshpunk	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:36:00 - [34] Originally by: Akita T Because EVERYBODY who's not against BoB or NOT of the opinion that "BoB is BoC or BoD" is an alt of a BoB member, apparently ? If you say so. Quote: woosh goes the clue Please dont play with clues, they get stuck in the fan system Shoo!
Obivan Efa The Machines	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:42:00 - [35] Some words added to OP. As for pro BOB forces... They say that all this corruption scandals are extreamly overrated... maybe they are right... if so then independent investigation will prove it and will bring them in a verdict of not guilty... Such investigation will calm down forum spam war as well. ____________________________ Die, but perish! - viking's war-cry
Herculite Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:51:00 - [36] Originally by: Zombak Originally by: Akita T Because EVERYBODY who's not against BoB or NOT of the opinion that "BoB is BoC or BoD" is an alt of a BoB member, apparently ? If you say so. Quote: woosh goes the clue Please dont play with clues, they get stuck in the fan system I can post with color too! But it does not mean I have anything important to say, much like yourself.
Drunk Driver Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:52:00 - [37] I feel sick.... Can you mix rocket fuel with corn mash and drink it? Oh, I'm farting fire.....
DeTox MinRohim Madhatters Inc. M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.06.18 15:54:00 - [38] zzZZ.. grumpff... huh! what?... There was a problem? Damn... rrmmzzZZzz... ------ This sig space is Read-only ! omgalink
Zombak Caldari Shooshpunk	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:01:00 - [39] Originally by: Herculite I can post with color too! But it does not mean I have anything important to say, much like yourself. Dear Akita T, please keep posting with same character. All those colors and different forum avatars make my head hurt :( Shoo!
dhav kincaide Caldari Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:04:00 - [40] At this point, I think it's pointless to go back and audit what has been done: either way you shake it, it's a no-win situation for CCP. Even if a positive audit comes back, there will still be drones of naysayers and anti-CCP people howling that the audit was rigged, documents were shredded, weapons of mass distruction... wait.. sorry, wrong conspiracy. Anyhow, you get the idea. Instead of going ape with some massive audit, CCP needs to put what happened in the past, and work to start fresh from this point forward. Come forward with some tangible goals for transparency in the system, and work on some BPR as it pertains to CS and community relations. (no, that's not a new blueprint type, it's business process reengineering. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_process_reengineering ) Maybe have a GM or three from other companies come in and compare notes on what's happening, and what might work better. Start fresh, and build from there. -dhav kincaide QI nooblet
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:06:00 - [41] Originally by: Zombak Originally by: Herculite I can post with color too! But it does not mean I have anything important to say, much like yourself. Dear Akita T, please keep posting with same character. All those colors and different forum avatars make my head hurt :( I'm sorry to dissapoint you, but this is my main, and this is the only char I ever post with on the forums. I'm also NOT affiliated with ANY alliance whatsoever (neither major nor minor), I'm a forum hoe' and utter carebear. Feel free to think otherwise though. _ New char creation guide \| Module/Rig stacknerfing explained
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:07:00 - [42] Originally by: dhav kincaide At this point, I think it's pointless to go back and audit what has been done: either way you shake it, it's a no-win situation for CCP. Even if a positive audit comes back, there will still be drones of naysayers and anti-CCP people howling that the audit was rigged, documents were shredded, weapons of mass distruction... wait.. sorry, wrong conspiracy. Anyhow, you get the idea. Instead of going ape with some massive audit, CCP needs to put what happened in the past, and work to start fresh from this point forward. Come forward with some tangible goals for transparency in the system, and work on some BPR as it pertains to CS and community relations. (no, that's not a new blueprint type, it's business process reengineering. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_process_reengineering ) Maybe have a GM or three from other companies come in and compare notes on what's happening, and what might work better. Start fresh, and build from there. Hum, DB refresh anyone ? ----- History is made by whinners Originally by: DB Preacher (...) Ignore what the coalition muppets are saying on their forums (...)
Zombak Caldari Shooshpunk	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:12:00 - [43] Originally by: Akita T I'm sorry to dissapoint you, but this is my main, and this is the only char I ever post with on the forums. I'm also NOT affiliated with ANY alliance whatsoever (neither major nor minor), I'm a forum hoe' and utter carebear. Feel free to think otherwise though. Thank you very much, sir for your post! My head hurts less now. Shoo!
Obivan Efa The Machines	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:17:00 - [44] Originally by: dhav kincaide At this point, I think it's pointless to go back and audit what has been done: either way you shake it, it's a no-win situation for CCP. Even if a positive audit comes back, there will still be drones of naysayers and anti-CCP people howling that the audit was rigged, documents were shredded, weapons of mass distruction... wait.. sorry, wrong conspiracy. Anyhow, you get the idea. Instead of going ape with some massive audit, CCP needs to put what happened in the past, and work to start fresh from this point forward. Come forward with some tangible goals for transparency in the system, and work on some BPR as it pertains to CS and community relations. (no, that's not a new blueprint type, it's business process reengineering. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_process_reengineering ) Maybe have a GM or three from other companies come in and compare notes on what's happening, and what might work better. Start fresh, and build from there. There is no need to dig a hole past grave.. only a few meters maybe.. anyway.. As about "we don't believe to that crappy audit company they all are corrupted"... well it should be independent company with a great reputation. The methology of audit should be known to public and results as well... all inside type of private CCP's information (adresses, names, bills, credit cards and so on)should be covered by the cotract. Anyway this is much better then 9 players revision. Better thing is to combine players revision and audit company. And this audit should include in some monitoring period to check all these MSN and current favoritism blames. ____________________________ Die, but perish! - viking's war-cry
Ovno ConSyquence Amarr The Plebians	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:24:00 - [45] Originally by: Zombak Originally by: Akita T Because EVERYBODY who's not against BoB or NOT of the opinion that "BoB is BoC or BoD" is an alt of a BoB member, apparently ? If you say so. Quote: woosh goes the clue Please dont play with clues, they get stuck in the fan system Guess what i'm not bob, i'm not a bobbit and i'm not a bob alt, and yet i'm still tired of all this crap Just give it up and get on with the game!!!!! There was more but i don't want to get banned for being abusive...
Thesas Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.06.18 16:32:00 - [46] The reason this topic will not die is because this topic is alive and well among many people I know of at least. I think there are those who are still looking for a definitive statement from CCP, which addresses the question of favoritism and inappropriate dev/gm involvement in Eve. A statement of policy. You can argue that policy exists but show me a link to it and I for one would shut up, forget it, make my choices and let it go. If CCP would speak to those things with assurances, then this topic might die. The policy needs stating. If there is no policy then there needs to be one. People.. many, some, few, one or two at least, maybe ten or twenty, who knows how many, need to hear it. Perhaps even a lot of people. Wanting this to go away will not make it go away, and what happened is less important than how things will be. CanÆt you see that?
Obivan Efa The Machines	Posted - 2007.06.19 07:47:00 - [47] Yep... A lot of noise and mud but little sence. Third party independent side for audit is a fresh idea I think - that will show the truth and restore trust. ____________________________ Die, but perish! - viking's war-cry
Chainsaw Plankton	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:00:00 - [48] a) whats the drinking age in iceland b) is it true there are alot of pretty ladies in iceland c) can i have ginger babies? if a and b are to my liking i may just want go do some "investigating" and possibly work on letter c. brown + blond = ginger right? that and i kind of like the yellow text
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:06:00 - [49] Originally by: Thesas The policy needs stating. If there is no policy then there needs to be one. The policy HAS been stated. Several times over already. In devblogs, in the forums, just about EVERYWHERE you can think of. The "t20 case" was an exception (and a distant past one), and I won't dwell on the badly beaten mashed horse because, well, just because. The policy is simple. CCP staff members (devs, GMs, ISD, bughunters, volunteers, you name it), you are NOT allowed to help yourself ("your main") NOR help any friends you might have in ANY way that would give them ANY advantage over the general population. Bottom line, you must tread every player request exactly the same, no matter who makes that request. A department for "Internal Affairs" has been created, and CCP Arkanon is the leader. The team has been investigating, and is investigating continuously any reports of favoritism, and actively seeking out even non-reported misbehaviour. The punishment for breaking the policy is even simpler. At best, employment termination. At worst, add a damages claim lawsuit on it, according to terms in NDA or other forms of contracts signed by the offender with CCP. _ New char creation guide \| Module/Rig stacknerfing explained
Edania Caldari Ordo Adeptus Astartes	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:06:00 - [50] they way to solve it is to not keep bringing it up on the forums every 20 seconds the issue exists everyone knows this much like racism sexism for example, everytime someone campaigns for equality people who arent racist sexst ageist abilityest whatever get exposed to the idea, just let the prejudiced people die of old age there becoming fewer as time goes by naturally. let this issue die of old age too your post has bought a non issue to some people to there attention congratulations you have furthered the problem. Quote: my Clone was excelent, i just had too many skillpoints
CiNi FireStar Inc FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:08:00 - [51] Originally by: Dark Shikari I think at this point most players don't give a crap and want to get back to playing the game. Thread was won right here.
Obivan Efa The Machines	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:18:00 - [52] Arcanon is an interested party. He can't be unbiassed. ____________________________ Die, but perish! - viking's war-cry
Galya Tuvern Gallente Momentum. The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:39:00 - [53] Edited by: Galya Tuvern on 19/06/2007 08:40:33 I posted this on VN Boards a few days ago link...I edited it a bit "I am impressed by CCPÆs willingness to hold democratic elections and to entertain the concept of having an oversight committee (OC). Because CCP has not released any specific information, that I am privy to anyway, regarding this matter I can only conjecture like everyone else as to what CCP envisions the role of this oversight committee to be. I should hope from an ethical standpoint it is more than looking over logs in an effort to discern if any inappropriate action has taken place. I would envisage, if CCP were serious about this OC that the committee and CCP would need to determine what the OCÆs role would be with respect to a number of issues, such as: 1. Ensuring privacy, privacy of players(both IG and OOG), corporations, and alliances and protecting IP rights. 2. Protecting/ensuring the integrity of the gaming experience. This could be achieved through such things as increased transparency, monitoring logs and IG Dev activity. As well as providing a voice through which the community can interact with CCP on a professional level. 3. Ensuring a standard of care is being met by CCP to the gaming community and holding CCP to a standard that requires them to respond to the OC in a manner that has been set down in guidelines. (If this committee is to be anything more than a PR puppet show stunt then accountability must be ensured). 4. Requiring that conflict of interest issues be immediately brought the attention of other committee members, CCP, and perhaps the Eve community at large because transparency in this endeavour is paramount. Particularly so because of past indiscretions and inaction by CCP regarding unethical behavior. 5. Developing guidelines that define what things like standard of care means, protection of privacy, methods of effecting the oversight (Caliwyrm suggested impromptu inspections etc), defining what the OC does for both the community and CCP, defining how long people can serve on the committee, defining what a conflict of interest is, methods of grievances, how to remove a member who has committed an unethical act, the list goes on. Now, I can guess what you are likely thinking, 'does she ever STFU??...she's nuts ; this is only a game after all'. However, CCP and the Eve community are setting the standards for other gaming communities and companies to follow. Furthermore, as stated by many members, this could turn out to be nothing more that a puppet show--merely in existence to create the illusion of oversight, protection, and transparency when in fact all it is doing, as Missfumble states, is appealing to the ôtinfoil masses.ö If this OC turns into a group of people who do little more than execute witch hunts through old logs and drink and carouse then both CCP and this community has failed to give the proper consideration and weight to what is being proposed. This is the opportunity for this gaming community to make history and set the bar for other gaming and other online communities in general. CCP is presenting Eve players with the novel opportunity to democratically elect our best, brightest, and most dedicated players to a committee that should not only provide monitoring and feedback regarding actual IG activity, but also, should promulgate acceptable ethical and practical guidelines within a framework of transparency and accountability. It is my opinion that the last bit is crucial to this committeeÆs success and reception in the Eve community. If there were more clearly defined repercussions for ethical misconduct then perhaps there would be no need for a committee at all...This is our chance to call on CCP and hold them to their word, letÆs not say, ôthis committee will do nothing,ö rather, letÆs ensure that this committee can do something positive for our online gaming exper Don't ask me I'm not the keeper of the Mommy Milk!
Sergeant Spot Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:09:00 - [54] This reminds me of the whole "Burning Jet fuel can't melt steel stupidity". Idiots say it, and it IS indeed factually true, and the idiots cease thinking. (Burning jet fuel burns plenty hot enough to make steel lose over half its structural strength, even if not hot enough to "melt" it....) Quit with the CCP bashing conspiracy crap already. What feeble points exist that were true have been dealt with. Play nice while you butcher each other.
Galya Tuvern Gallente Momentum. The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:44:00 - [55] Edited by: Galya Tuvern on 19/06/2007 09:52:36 Edited by: Galya Tuvern on 19/06/2007 09:52:19 Originally by: Sergeant Spot Quit with the CCP bashing conspiracy crap already. What feeble points exist that were true have been dealt with. Would we all agree that CCP themselves have called attention to the matter of questionable activity by proposing the committee in the first place? If so, then CCP feels it is an issue that should be addressed. Therefore, shouldn't the Eve community be part of that dialog and subsequent solution? If so, then open public discussion is of primary importance is it not? I do agree with you 100% that "bashing" is inappropriate in any form...constructive criticism and create solutions are things that will benefit everyone. Note: (by 'questionable activity' I mean to refer to what you refer to as "feeble points" but I could be in error here and you are meaning something else; if so, I apologize for the misquote) Don't ask me I'm not the keeper of the Mommy Milk!
Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:51:00 - [56] I blame Dan Brown. ------------------- WE'RE SORRY, SOMETHING HAPPENED
Obivan Efa The Machines	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:03:00 - [57] Originally by: Galya Tuvern constructive criticism and create solutions are things that will benefit everyone. Agree ____________________________ Die, but perish! - viking's war-cry
Glengrant Minmatar TOHA Heavy Industries FROST Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:21:00 - [58] I see the whole thing as mostly a matter of a vocal minority getting each other really excited. I never bought the whole "CCP is behind BoB" crap. That's silly to begin with. And quite possibly self-serving in some cases. I also have yet to see any real evidence of continuing misdoings by CCP. 1 real case ("what was that idiot thinking?") and a few anecdotal allegations don't make CCP a crooked company (out to destroy their own game and company? Again: silly). What I saw a lot of is people getting into lynch mob mode over things they have no real facts about. Mostly allegations, assumptions and other stuff that have not much use in reasonable debates. Did CCP handle everything perfectly - nope. But they are humans, have a lot of other stuff going on at the same time - and I assume will sometimes have been simply been surprised by the ferocity of some of the allegations. No RL auditing is needed IMHO. And BTW - the cost for that process - where do u think the money is coming from? Right - our subscription money. So it's either less money to invest in Eve improvements ("we had to postpone the next round of hardware upgrades as we had to budget several million for a 3 month audit") or higher subscriptions. Feel free to have your own priorities - on my list audits don't even appear on the list. Glengrant p.s. Not working for CPP, not a part of BoB - or even one of their enemies. I'm utterly uninvolved and very much disinterested in wheether any big alliance has an extra BPO or not.
Kharadran Sullath Caldari	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:21:00 - [59] The logic suffers an epic failure right from the beginning. On the issue of the BoB-conspiracy, it's just not there. And, being a lover of logic, I've started to ignore this inexistent issue. In fact, it's about as likely as anyone but Kurt Cobain killed Kurt Cobain. ------ --Don't get saucy with me Bernaise!--
End Solution Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:21:00 - [60] have the community ever been told how much isk was made on those bpo`s and what impact they had to the game. as in isk etc generated plus deaths by em. no and that is why the topic wont die i supose. if ccp could clearly say.. this much isk was made people would see that it was nothing, if any at all.

Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.