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EVE is freeform play....for pirates, griefers, & unobtrusive carebears

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Mylosia	Posted - 2007.06.30 22:52:00 - [1] So I roll into Passari lastnight to sell some minerals. Yeah its lowsec, but I'm in a blockade runner. Couple of reddish looking guys outside the station, but I'm here so I dock, sell and undock. I'm locked and warp scrambled ( a lot) and getting pounded by a couple of BSs blocking the station exit. Redock with 40% damage. The two players who delivered the beating snicker about wrecking hits in local. Trying to bait me into spewing impotent rage into local for amusement or they are really proud of those hits. Not sure. Well, what to do now? Plans for the evening seem shot as I can't be on my merry way in one piece. No way I can contend with these guys guns. I think about the expanded definition of pvp from ccp recently and it comes to me. Information warfare. I log on an alt and make for Passari. Once there I broadcast a message in local. "Warning! Marauding pirates are about camping Lai Dai and other stations." I get a lot of "no duh" and "ohhh nooeess" from the local pirates. I remain quiet until a new person enters the system and I broadcast again. After warnings provided for the new comers to the system they start with the insults. I remain quiet except for my warnings. People trapped in station start talking in local and I switch to convos to help them out as I am hanging around the station at 300km+ doing my best to evade the pirates. They podded me a couple of times, but I'd moved my clone to in system. This goes on for a few hours with insults and misinformation flooding the local chat from the pirates. I helped a couple of people get away and warned others off. I felt pretty good about this as I kept they evening of gaming from being ruined. Eventually the pirates fell quiet and dispersed and it was getting late for me to, so I called it a night. Logged on today, broadcast my warning once for anyone in system. Lots of moans and cursing came from the same players that were there lastnight along with a threat that a GM would "gas" my spamming ass. I took this as an idle threat as they really have no grounds to report me until I got the GM eve mail telling me to stop or there'd be repercussions. I replied with exactly what I was doing and invited the GM to come witness it. No reply and hours have passed. So am I a spammer or an unorthodox antipirate? Yes I was repeating a message in local with slight variation, but only when new people came in system. The system keeps between 15 and 10 players, so I didn't need to post my warning very often. I stayed in space where I could be persued as well. Did I spam or did the pirates get a GM to take care of their problem for them?
Lady Natacha Minmatar Water and Power	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:00:00 - [2] Edited by: Lady Natacha on 30/06/2007 22:59:54 Ask your friendly GM how often you can post warnings in LOCAL before it is considered SPAM.
MotoTsume Gallente Clan Black Scorpion	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:02:00 - [3] i see nothing wrong in what you where doing It's just a game........Or is it?????
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:02:00 - [4] Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 30/06/2007 23:02:34 Originally by: Mylosia [...] Did I spam or did the pirates get a GM to take care of their problem for them? Well, as long you broadcasted your message only when new people coming into the local channel, and as long the pirates where there camping, you should be OK. Spamming is not allowed, but to fight campers with giving adequate warnings to bypassers should be fully within the rules. I guess that is why the GM decided to not take action. Piracy is a absolutely legal and accepted "profession", but so is anti-piracy. And information is really a very good weapon. That is why many alliances like to use spies. Information can win wars. So no, I dont think you did anything wrong. It might have earned you a few life time enemies though Originally by: Eldo Davip PORTRAITS OMFG WOOT. WE R GONIG FOR MROE BREEE!!!!11
Selene Le'Cotiere Amarr Dark Oracle Enterprises	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:04:00 - [5] LOL... I'd say the pirates got the GM's to do their job for em. In my most humble opinion, Local chat is this. It's the radio transmissions that can be picked up readily in a system, without having to go to relay on sub-space communication when communicating with corp mates in other regions. All you were doing was providing intel for other inhabitants of the system to know where the active pirates were. So often I see systems shut down the minute a pirate enters the area, out of a fear of attracting their attention. So, personally,I applaud you and your actions, in making the best of a potentially bad situation.
Kasilof	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:07:00 - [6] What you where doing certainly sounds reasonable to me. Warning other travelers of the pirates is admirable. Now if you resorted to name calling or insulting the pirates a GM probably should take action.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:07:00 - [7] GM made a mistake, but the pirates were probably creative with the details. - You keep using that word . . . I do not think it means what you think it means
Ddredar	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:16:00 - [8] I would have joined you with the Anti-Pirating if i had been in system with you. Quote: GOTTA HAVE MORE COWBELL BABY!!!
smashsmash	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:24:00 - [9] i wish people could play the game without needing a GM to mediate everything. i sometimes, like most eve players, put up with personal attacks and insults in game and never waste time by reporting it to a GM. reporting someone for warning other people about pirates is absurd compared to a lot of the unreported crap-talk that should be dealt with instead. no good deed goes unpunished, i guess.
Caligulus Caldari Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:39:00 - [10] Honestly, CCP should just implement a spam gagger mechanisim. If you spam the system say 10 times in 30 seconds with the same text you get gagged for the next 60 seconds. If you continue to spam then that gag extends exponentially (for that channel). Give Channel creators the option to designate if a channel is public or not to enable or disable respectively that gag mechanic. Then you wont see pirates abusing GM's by running to them when someone's ruining their day. Especially since who knows what lies the pirates told that GM to make the GM tell Mylosia to stop. Did the GM do a follow up? Of course not. But they should.

Lysit Kaune Minmatar Phoenix Division FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:44:00 - [11] Name said pirates and Im sure helpfull the community people will help them move along.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.06.30 23:47:00 - [12] Personally i wouldn't mind if someone warned people, if they didn't spam the same message with no effort. If they write a different type'ish thing to say, or heck, throw a warning directly towards players, it's all good. So yeah, i have a problem with being serious, but it's the almost smallest problem i have.
AstroPhobic Minmatar STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.07.01 00:52:00 - [13] I find it amusing how you "felt good about this as I kept the evening of gaming from being ruined" when you ruined the pirate's PvP, who also log onto EVE to have fun. Astro
Dylosia	Posted - 2007.07.01 01:35:00 - [14] Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely.
AstroPhobic Minmatar STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.07.01 01:46:00 - [15] Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro
William Hamilton Caldari THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.07.01 01:55:00 - [16] Well, there's nothing wrong with what you're doing, but keep in mind you may be cutting into your own profits by helping others to deleiver the same items you are....
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Academy Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.07.01 01:59:00 - [17] The Passari area sounds like its gone a bit downhill lately. I might have to sell my condo there "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
FarScape III	Posted - 2007.07.01 01:59:00 - [18] Edited by: FarScape III on 01/07/2007 02:00:12 I like some pirates I have nothing against the average pirate but You warned people, isn't that what were supposed to do with pirates, I mean that is the whole thing. I get warnings all the time, it seems normal to me. Obviously these pirates lied and made up a few things in their petition to the GM. And the GM fell for it. The GM should have had listened in on that system. You offered to prove it to the GM but who know what happened after that, he may just knew you were write and forgot a bought it. Personal though I would have direct messaged or started a convo with the new people who came in the system, maybe from the other side of the gate, that way the pirates would not of know what was going on. And maybe some cool dude would have pounced on them and gave them some competition with out them knowing it was coming. BTW good job on still being to have fun, sometimes and I mean sometimes there are some bad apples that take pirating too far. And by too far I mean not expecting someone to defend them selves. In my system pirates come there but they do not Grief, they pirate, if there is not a good fight to be had then they leave or do something else. A Minmater City... Cool! My Skills
Jimer Lins Gallente Sanctuary	Posted - 2007.07.01 02:10:00 - [19] You adapted, they didn't. They went to the GMs with a petition, which was a waste of the GM's time IMO. Congrats, I think you won. SEARCh- we find sites for you!
AstroPhobic Minmatar STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.07.01 02:11:00 - [20] Originally by: FarScape III Edited by: FarScape III on 01/07/2007 02:05:30 I like some pirates I have nothing against the average pirate but You warned people, isn't that what were supposed to do with pirates, I mean that is the whole thing. I get warnings all the time, it seems normal to me. Obviously these pirates lied and made up a few things in their petition to the GM. And the GM fell for it. The GM should have had listened in on that system. You offered to prove it to the GM but who know what happened after that, he may just knew you were write and forgot a bought it. Personal though I would have direct messaged or started a convo with the new people who came in the system, maybe from the other side of the gate, that way the pirates would not of know what was going on. And maybe some cool dude would have pounced on them and gave them some competition with out them knowing it was coming. BTW good job on still being to have fun, sometimes and I mean sometimes there are some bad apples that take pirating too far. And by too far I mean not expecting someone to defend them selves. In my system pirates come there but they do not Grief, they pirate, if there is not a good fight to be had then they leave or do something else. Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro Pirites SHOULD expect for people to reteliat, it is part of the game, would they complain too if he came back with a gang and killed them all. Those pirate should of applauded the injenuity of this play but instead they cried abought it. what a joke. they make REAL pirates weep and look stupid. IMO they stoped being pirates once they whined to a GM, how pethetic. Right, do you understand now? Oh, I wasn't saying they were smart, good, or anything else. But just how pirates should expect people to retaliate, carebears should expect to be blown up if they go into low sec. Make sense? It was more of a general-nitpick statement than directed towards the situation at hand. Astro

Stink Eye	Posted - 2007.07.01 02:19:00 - [21] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro You have an excellant future as a political spin doctor. Remember not to let critical thinking ever get in your way.
AstroPhobic Minmatar STK Scientific	Posted - 2007.07.01 02:26:00 - [22] Originally by: Stink Eye Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro You have an excellant future as a political spin doctor. Remember not to let critical thinking ever get in your way. I'm truly sorry that you have such a narrow point of view. Astro
Jaikar Isillia The Vinlanders Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.07.01 06:35:00 - [23] Originally by: Stink Eye Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro You have an excellant future as a political spin doctor. Remember not to let critical thinking ever get in your way. QFT.
Gealbhan Caldari The SAS The Kano Organisation	Posted - 2007.07.01 07:16:00 - [24] Sounds like they reported you and added some lies to the story. The GM shoulda stuck around and checked it out instead of just firing off a warning. Real brave pirates there. "Ohhh that mean carebear is telling on us! waaahhhh" "Concentrate all your fire on one target, when it is destroyed, move on to the next. That is how you secure victory". - Tactica Imperium.
Vito Parabellum Fivrelde Corp	Posted - 2007.07.01 07:35:00 - [25] Originally by: AstroPhobic That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro He made the game more fun for people that otherwise would be ganked by this subset that log in to make life miserable for this first group. If that was his goal, then he sure as hell succeeded. Personally I think there's way too many petitions about foul language. Can't take the f-word, yet call yourself a hardarsed pvper? Eh eh eh. But no wonder the standard operating procedure is to open the petition box, after all it works very well, as this case seems to point out. A lazy GM that issued a warning before checking the logfiles, hmmm. If what you say is true that is. ------ When you say "no one's perfect", Chuck Norris takes this as a personal insult.
Tyranne Amarr	Posted - 2007.07.01 07:44:00 - [26] Originally by: Jaikar Isillia Originally by: Stink Eye Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro You have an excellant future as a political spin doctor. Remember not to let critical thinking ever get in your way. QFT. QFT x2.
Kyozoku Mutiny.	Posted - 2007.07.01 08:19:00 - [27] Edited by: Kyozoku on 01/07/2007 08:21:17 Frankly they're noobs who have no clue how to pirate effectively. There's constant isk flowing between litiura and piekura but they spend all day camping that station for scraps like idiots.
Peen Long Caldari The Fantastically Pantless Sporkmen	Posted - 2007.07.01 08:43:00 - [28] Honestly I'd see if you can petition the GM. If a GM can't be bothered to investigate then they aren't doing their job. What you were doing is in no way spamming or metagaming or anything that can be concieved of as "wrong", ESPECIALLY since those pirates can block you if they are sooo worried about seeing you talk in local. They were obviously mad that you were ruining their fun, though of course it was their choice to ruin yours. If I were you I'd do it again in a heart beat. Pirates aren't "bad", they have a right to play the way they want. And YOU have every right to discourage that play just as they were discouraging yours. To summarize: Passing intel to others is NOT an offense or breaking of the EULA. I'd petition it asking if you have some form of warning lodged against your account, that it be removed.
MuffinsRevenger EmpiresMod Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.07.01 09:13:00 - [29] Originally by: Jimer Lins You adapted, they didn't. They went to the GMs with a petition, which was a waste of the GM's time IMO. Congrats, I think you won. Ding ding! we have a winner!
Feng Schui Minmatar The Ninja Coalition New Eve Order	Posted - 2007.07.01 09:48:00 - [30] personally, if i was the GM, i would have listened in on local.. and if the griefers (not going to call them pirates.. they fail at that)... added false details to the petition, I would have suspended them for 30 days for opening a false petition. My opinion is my own, not of my corp or my alliance. If you have problems, we can have a "who can do L4 missions faster" duel >:)



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