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EVE is freeform play....for pirates, griefers, & unobtrusive carebears

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Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2007.07.01 09:56:00 - [31] The true carebears in this situation were the pirates. My definition of Carebear is: Someone who cannot adapt to game rules and situations and cries to CCP to "make it better". Fits very nicely with your story and it's painfully obvious who did the crying. Usually it's non-PvPers that cry the most because they've limited themselves to one style of play and feel they are helpless. The fact that they've done it to themselves is beyond them. But anyway, because of this people tend to think carebear only equals non-pvp types. Nope. Pirates, 0.0 "badasses", etc can be big ol' carebears as well. This is a nice example of it. As to the GM situation, this is something I'm very concerned with. Quick little story as a frame of reference: My kid plays WoW. Lately he's been having problems with people that get him worked up, he cusses them out, they report him to GMs. We've talked to him about his temper and he needs to learn to control himself, end of story. However, I reviewed one of his encounters and it became obvious that the other person was doing this intentionally with the objective of getting my kid banned. Ok, still not anyting much of interest. My kid still needs to control himself and if he loses his WoW account maybe it will be a good learning experience. But it got me to thinking. Of all the games out there, Eve seems like the most likely to spawn this meta-gaming use of GMs. Eve has such a high level of competition and so many grey areas when it comes to the rules. People using out of game mechanics such as alliance forums or ts servers, etc. It just seems like a foregone conclusion that GMs will get played. With all that in mind, my opinion of your encounter is: Not only did you do no wrong, but it was the pirates that should of got the warning. GMs need to be instructed better and taught not to be so niave. ------------------- WE'RE SORRY, SOMETHING HAPPENED
Cruthensis Gallente Farmer Killers United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:05:00 - [32] Some folks have posted that the OP did this to "help other carebears" and such. That might be the case, but there could be more subtle and selfish reasons for warning other players. If the station campers are deprived of targets for too long they'll likely move on to somewhere they can camp and gank more easily - which would solve the OP's initial problem and allow her to leave the station in her hauler. Valid and smart tactic imo. Pirates: haulers do not have a duty to sit there and get shot for your amusement. Try harder.
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:15:00 - [33] Edited by: Dec V on 01/07/2007 11:16:06 That was YOU spamming passari that night? OMG me and my corp mates were wetting ourselves laughing...words cannot comprehend how much of a noob you are. Come back to Passari please, we wanna show how much we love you Oh and him saying about a GM warning him. Well what he DIDNT mention in his lovely post is that he proceeded to drop cans outside the station and at the gates, which IS NOT allowed...so thats why you got told off a GM. Take your sob story elsewhere
FarScape III	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:21:00 - [34] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: FarScape III Edited by: FarScape III on 01/07/2007 02:05:30 I like some pirates I have nothing against the average pirate but You warned people, isn't that what were supposed to do with pirates, I mean that is the whole thing. I get warnings all the time, it seems normal to me. Obviously these pirates lied and made up a few things in their petition to the GM. And the GM fell for it. The GM should have had listened in on that system. You offered to prove it to the GM but who know what happened after that, he may just knew you were write and forgot a bought it. Personal though I would have direct messaged or started a convo with the new people who came in the system, maybe from the other side of the gate, that way the pirates would not of know what was going on. And maybe some cool dude would have pounced on them and gave them some competition with out them knowing it was coming. BTW good job on still being to have fun, sometimes and I mean sometimes there are some bad apples that take pirating too far. And by too far I mean not expecting someone to defend them selves. In my system pirates come there but they do not Grief, they pirate, if there is not a good fight to be had then they leave or do something else. Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Dylosia Well Astro that is the thing isn't it. Those pirates attacking me and trapping me in a station for an evening triggered these events. Not saying its wrong if they want to set in tech 2 BSs and shoot at transports and industrials exiting a station all evening (from an eve standpoint anyway). I just wanted to fight back and I found a way. Lysit these are the pirates/griefers though I sincerely doubt you'll be able to engage them as they prefer haulers and stay close to stations. Dragonsoul Omega Kilos Carratiker Podruski Malachi Nefzen Apophisxp By the way this is the actual character that tried to warn people off and the above players told the GM was bothering them. I named them too closely. That's hardly the point. I found it amusing that your thought process was to help the general occupants of EvE when you actually harmed the gameplay of a large group. It's the "pirate bad" mentality that makes me wonder if you can't see that "pirates" are on their computers playing eve for fun too. I'm not saying your actions were wrong, just saying if your intentions were to make eve fun for others, then you didn't suceed. Astro Pirites SHOULD expect for people to reteliat, it is part of the game, would they complain too if he came back with a gang and killed them all. Those pirate should of applauded the injenuity of this play but instead they cried abought it. what a joke. they make REAL pirates weep and look stupid. IMO they stoped being pirates once they whined to a GM, how pethetic. Right, do you understand now? Oh, I wasn't saying they were smart, good, or anything else. But just how pirates should expect people to retaliate, carebears should expect to be blown up if they go into low sec. Make sense? It was more of a general-nitpick statement than directed towards the situation at hand. Astro If the OP petitioned a GM abought what the pirates were doing then you would be wright but that did not happen so you a wrong. :) A Minmater City... Cool! My Skills
Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:28:00 - [35] Originally by: Dec V Oh and him saying about a GM warning him. Well what he DIDNT mention in his lovely post is that he proceeded to drop cans outside the station and at the gates, which IS NOT allowed...so thats why you got told off a GM. Take your sob story elsewhere. That changes it quite a bit. Whole story ftw. ------------------- WE'RE SORRY, SOMETHING HAPPENED
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:32:00 - [36] Thanks Roy, it kinda touched a nerve with me this thread and im glad ive seen it so I can correct it. It just goes to show just how certain groups and GM's get bad reputations in EvE with topics like this. I can't abide liers.
Jenai'na	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:45:00 - [37] Edited by: Jenai''na on 01/07/2007 11:44:20 how many cans did he drop ? one with a written warning on it? yea that should be petitioned straight away. it must have caused insane lag. edit: btw thanks for the heads up. i came through the system and your warning made it easier for me to identify the threat.
Korotani Caldari Love and Rockets	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:48:00 - [38] I applaud your actions Mylosia, I hope you achieve success next time that happens.
Juniper	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:57:00 - [39] I wish I'd seen your warning. I bought a carrier from Passari last night, stupidly on my part though I didn't have any modules - just a few fighters. No bother I thought... I'll just undock and go collect some. Wrong decision! Once it became obvious that I was toast (they wanted 2 billion in ransom... as if!), I ejected & flew to the nearest station. The stupid pirates then passed up a glorious opportunity for a free carrier, and promptly blew it up... leaving me with a nice insurance payout (meaning I hadn't really lost that much). Then more arrived demanding my pod... and couldn't figure out why it wasn't there. Sometimes, the carebears win. Or at least have a good laugh in the process.
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 11:58:00 - [40] Originally by: Jenai'na Edited by: Jenai''na on 01/07/2007 11:44:20 how many cans did he drop ? one with a written warning on it? yea that should be petitioned straight away. it must have caused insane lag.quote] No, he dropped a lot of cans, making it very hard to undock as you were bumped around because of them. Seriously I know we are pirates but stop making us the bad guys just because the fact we are pirates doesn't mean we can only use blob tactics and that we resort to giving abuse. All of us have huge amounts of pvp experience and love fighting against the odds. A lot of us have been playing eve a long time and have seen this guys behaviour before. Does it bother us, no. He can carry on if he wants to, its his choice as a player. Dropping cans that cause lag and disrupt the system is however petitionable, and we were right to do so. You got a problem with this, take it up with a dev.
Mallick Northern Intelligence Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:16:00 - [41] WHAT? YOU DIDN'T GET THE MEMO? DROPPING CANS IS ILLEGAL AND A BANNABLE OFFENCE!
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:19:00 - [42] Originally by: Juniper The stupid pirates then passed up a glorious opportunity for a free carrier, and promptly blew it up... I don't know whether to laugh or cry. - You keep using that word . . . I do not think it means what you think it means
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:27:00 - [43] Originally by: Juniper I wish I'd seen your warning. I bought a carrier from Passari last night So you needed a noob posting in local to see there were pirates in the system? People like you just shouldn't be flying carriers, and we are the noobs attacking a carrier just a few battleships? God I LOVE carebears
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:32:00 - [44] LMFAO some of the evemails my corp have got now OMFG IM CRYING HAHAHAH
Juniper	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:40:00 - [45] Originally by: Dec V So you needed a noob posting in local to see there were pirates in the system? People like you just shouldn't be flying carriers, and we are the noobs attacking a carrier just a few battleships? God I LOVE carebears The guy who demanded 2 billion (ridiculous opening offer btw) had a positive sec status... I had no way of knowing he was in league with the pirates (although maybe if I read the forums a bit more I would have been... he's quite a "popular" figure on here it seems), and there wasn't anyone there when I originally docked (just a minute previously). I admit that I was a noob in letting my carrier get blown up, but it WAS funny watching you all squirm afterwards. Obviously I'm not the only long time noob playing EVE if you can't figure out that blowing my carrier up after I ejected was just blowing away 1 billion worth of potential bounty. As to your comment that "people like me shouldn't be flying carriers" - well, why the hell not? I've no way of knowing that until I try it, and when new features / ships come into the game I like to try them to see if I can make use of them. That's what I play the game for. ... I just make things.
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 12:51:00 - [46] It may of not even been us, I can't remember my corp killing a carrier recently. Who and what corp was it
Juniper	Posted - 2007.07.01 13:00:00 - [47] Actually you're right, now I check it... there were a few corps involved, but yours wasn't one of them. My apologies. ... I just make things.
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 13:03:00 - [48] I didn't think it was. I posted back cos I know we did shoot at a carrier a couple days ago, but I can't remember killing one, and I know for sure that we wouldn't pop an empty carrier.
Alis Aquilae	Posted - 2007.07.01 13:27:00 - [49] That is why people should wait for a whole story before immediately assuming a GM is at fault. Still a bit too much paranoia for my tastes.
Selena 001	Posted - 2007.07.01 13:27:00 - [50] Originally by: Dec V Well what he DIDNT mention in his lovely post is that he proceeded to drop cans outside the station and at the gates, which IS NOT allowed...so thats why you got told off a GM. Take your sob story elsewhere. If you, or that GM thinks dropping a can outside every station and every gate in a system is NOT allowed, why dont you take your vigilence into hi-sec and start creating countless petitions when your touring? I'm sure both you and that GM would enjoy spending hours together banning people for can spam and recruitment ad's. Seriously... sometimes it appears that GM's make rules up as they go along. GM X : "IMHO I dont think thats allowed..." PLAYER : "TBPH I dont care what, in your honest opinion, should be allowed. GO LOOK AT THE RULES and tell me what, if anything, I'm doing wrong" GM X : "Sry, I'm a bit busy, who would you like to settle for a ban while I check?" Click - Forget PLAYER : "Wha..." Disconnected ___________ NATIONAL SARCASM DAY!!
Station Dweller	Posted - 2007.07.01 13:38:00 - [51] Originally by: Mylosia So I roll into Passari lastnight to sell some minerals. Yeah its lowsec, but I'm in a blockade runner. Couple of reddish looking guys outside the station, but I'm here so I dock, sell and undock. I'm locked and warp scrambled ( a lot) and getting pounded by a couple of BSs blocking the station exit. Redock with 40% damage. The two players who delivered the beating snicker about wrecking hits in local. Trying to bait me into spewing impotent rage into local for amusement or they are really proud of those hits. Not sure. Well, what to do now? Plans for the evening seem shot as I can't be on my merry way in one piece. No way I can contend with these guys guns. I think about the expanded definition of pvp from ccp recently and it comes to me. Information warfare. I log on an alt and make for Passari. Once there I broadcast a message in local. "Warning! Marauding pirates are about camping Lai Dai and other stations." I get a lot of "no duh" and "ohhh nooeess" from the local pirates. I remain quiet until a new person enters the system and I broadcast again. After warnings provided for the new comers to the system they start with the insults. I remain quiet except for my warnings. People trapped in station start talking in local and I switch to convos to help them out as I am hanging around the station at 300km+ doing my best to evade the pirates. They podded me a couple of times, but I'd moved my clone to in system. This goes on for a few hours with insults and misinformation flooding the local chat from the pirates. I helped a couple of people get away and warned others off. I felt pretty good about this as I kept they evening of gaming from being ruined. Eventually the pirates fell quiet and dispersed and it was getting late for me to, so I called it a night. Logged on today, broadcast my warning once for anyone in system. Lots of moans and cursing came from the same players that were there lastnight along with a threat that a GM would "gas" my spamming ass. I took this as an idle threat as they really have no grounds to report me until I got the GM eve mail telling me to stop or there'd be repercussions. I replied with exactly what I was doing and invited the GM to come witness it. No reply and hours have passed. So am I a spammer or an unorthodox antipirate? Yes I was repeating a message in local with slight variation, but only when new people came in system. The system keeps between 15 and 10 players, so I didn't need to post my warning very often. I stayed in space where I could be persued as well. Did I spam or did the pirates get a GM to take care of their problem for them? So I guess its still possible to tank the sentries outside stations even after the new patch? Thought they were gonna make that a bit harder. Oh well....
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:05:00 - [52] Originally by: Selena 001 Originally by: Dec V Well what he DIDNT mention in his lovely post is that he proceeded to drop cans outside the station and at the gates, which IS NOT allowed...so thats why you got told off a GM. Take your sob story elsewhere. If you, or that GM thinks dropping a can outside every station and every gate in a system is NOT allowed Your a complete idiot, if you had bothered to READ my posts you would find that he didnt drop "1 can" he dropped loads of cans, plus it was outside a station so that when people undocking they were bouncing everywhere PLUS it wasn't even my corp that petitioned him, it was another guy (although I do AGREE with the petition). I'd love to see you do a better job than a GM.
Gibbal Slogspit Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:06:00 - [53] 1. BIFFS (Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids) have stated they didnt have anything to do with the carrier destruction. 2. None of the pilots you stated were the ones that petitioned, I've been given a name that begines with T and ends in S, so if your memory is so good Mylosia...please name the person that fits that criteria, T-----S.
JADE DRAG0NESS Minmatar Night Hawks	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:09:00 - [54] Considering we only have Dec V's word for it concerning cans being droped i personally feel that didnt ahppen its a bit like Goonswarm saying BoB got an ISD member banned because he was bumping there dreads intentionally. "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:16:00 - [55] Edited by: Dec V on 01/07/2007 14:20:22 Edited by: Dec V on 01/07/2007 14:19:04 Edited by: Dec V on 01/07/2007 14:16:48 Some guy warning of pirates in local isn't a petitionable offence, and nobody from my corp said it was. I doubt he would of been warned for this off a GM, GM's are professional and even though people may complain time to time I think they do an excellent job. He was dropping cans, and im speaking on behalf of my corp here so...beleive what you want and form your own opinions. Just adding my side of the story. Also I know who started the petition, we didn't ask him too, we didn't know about it until he told us. The name does begin with T and ends in S but I ain't naming him cos he may wish to remain anonymous
Galla Net	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:18:00 - [56] A bit offtopic - generally, words about "ruining PVP for pirates" make me laugh. Camp of 5-6 BS with support and sometimes carrier/mothership vs 1 single ship? And you call it PVP shooting harmless transports and noobs? Pathetic. Actually, in real, any system should have the info about the pirates currently active. In the age of information ans spaceflights its should be easy to get this stats, without an alt jumping in before you :) Now you faced how it works. And IMHO pirates exploit with high CC rating should be fixed a long ago. Since EVE map is static lowsec will became overcrowded soon enough. And changes will come. So enjoy while you still can :)
Dec V Minmatar Buffed Rumpuss Zit Dids	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:25:00 - [57] Ive pvped a lot, ive been in huge fleets with big alliances and that I DONT call pvp, I call it boredom. We shoot other players because we can, whether they have a big gang or they are in transport ships. There are loads of pirate corps that are excellent pvpers, Veto corp and Murder Death Kill just a couple.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:50:00 - [58] You did nothing wrong. In fact you did good for the non-aggressive community. Keep it up friend. If those red blinking people can call GM to warn you about local spamming, you can also call GM to warn them for griefing you. Camping you for hours and hours to spoil your time in the game and making you feel like quitting. What comes around can also go around. --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Kali is for KArebearLIng. I 100% agree with Avon. Female EVE gamers? Mail Zajo or visit WGOE.Public in-game.
Selena 001	Posted - 2007.07.01 14:58:00 - [59] Originally by: Dec V Your a complete idiot, if you had bothered to READ my posts you would find that he didnt drop "1 can" he dropped loads of cans, plus it was outside a station so that when people undocking they were bouncing everywhere PLUS it wasn't even my corp that petitioned him, it was another guy (although I do AGREE with the petition). I'd love to see you do a better job than a GM. Fair Do's.... I missed the 'S' you put on. Thanks for the personal attack tho, it really gave weight to your point And whats with the "OOOH we cant do anything" thing you've adopted all of a sudden? Cans in your way in low-sec? Whatever are we to do?! * Hint : Target, F1, F2, F3, F4 * If you can tank a sentry gun to gank a player, you can tank it to destroy their cans... if you dont want to then diddums ___________ NATIONAL SARCASM DAY!!
Ira Theos	Posted - 2007.07.01 15:27:00 - [60] The Local Chat channel is a Public channel...... that means anyone can use it.... Posting info on pirate locations is "Intel"...... and posting it in the Local Chat is proper counter- intelligence activity with respect to anti-piracy. Any GM who says otherwise needs to be sent to an EVE re-education camp.

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