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R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:35:00 - [1] Take too long to kill, even when tower is dead. 100 BS Fleet takes upto an hour to kill off modules after the pos itself is dead. Boring. Waste of ammo. Pointless timesink. End this rubbish CCP, thx. DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Tarminic Black Flame Industries	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:38:00 - [2] Which modules are you referring to specifically? ------------ ULTIMATE LAG SOLUTION IBTL! IBDS/DC! IBTC! 1st in a BoB post! And other such forum tom-foolery.
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:39:00 - [3] Cynogen - ridiculous HP Even small guns, far too much HP. ***** boring ** DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Hyldabrand	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:39:00 - [4] Edited by: Hyldabrand on 16/07/2007 19:38:54 100 man BS fleet? Surely you can bring 200!!
Market garden	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:39:00 - [5] Get Dreads
Hyldabrand	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:40:00 - [6] Cyno prevention in place sounds like
Tarminic Black Flame Industries	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:40:00 - [7] Can't you just unanchor and take the structures yourself once the POS is down? ------------ ULTIMATE LAG SOLUTION IBTL! IBDS/DC! IBTC! 1st in a BoB post! And other such forum tom-foolery.
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:41:00 - [8] Edited by: R3dSh1ft on 16/07/2007 19:42:19 Its just boring, Dreads even more time cos small modules have low sig. Spamming small guns around pos, make your enemy waste time and ammo for cheap module! Can't unanchor - suggest this to Devs DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Callistus Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.07.16 19:44:00 - [9] Agreed, this is a major and unneeded timesink. CCP introduced this large amount of hull HP to prevent the guns being destroyed before the tower is taken down. They need to increase the resistance bonus that the tower provides and reduce the raw hull HP of the guns. Originally by: Market garden Get Dreads (post with your main) Would be nice if the guns didn't have such low sig radius. A Phoenix does the same damage to a pos gun in siege as it does out of siege. -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Gutsani D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.07.16 20:18:00 - [10] isnt the resistance on hull already 90% ? i said this months ago btw, they wanted the guns out of the pos to provide "tactical warfare", they created a HUGE timesink.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.07.16 20:19:00 - [11] Lower HP by 10 times, raise resistance to 99%... same amount of time to kill guns when the POS is online, but far less time when its offline. 23 Member EVE Video makers: save EVE-files bandwidth! Use the H.264 AutoEncoder!
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.16 20:22:00 - [12] Originally by: Dark Shikari Lower HP by 10 times, raise resistance to 99%... same amount of time to kill guns when the POS is online, but far less time when its offline. Give this man a job DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Tarminic Black Flame Industries	Posted - 2007.07.16 20:23:00 - [13] Originally by: Dark Shikari Lower HP by 10 times, raise resistance to 99%... same amount of time to kill guns when the POS is online, but far less time when its offline. This could have the adverse effect of making POS guns too easily repaired mid-siege. ------------ ULTIMATE LAG SOLUTION IBTL! IBDS/DC! IBTC! 1st in a BoB post! And other such forum tom-foolery.
Gutsani D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.07.16 20:25:00 - [14] Originally by: R3dSh1ft Originally by: Dark Shikari Lower HP by 10 times, raise resistance to 99%... same amount of time to kill guns when the POS is online, but far less time when its offline. Give this man a job not exactly, once cyno jammers are in place that will solve nothing. cyno jammers have well over 15m structural hitpoints, more then the pos. you would have to kill it; or the pos; using battleships. and we all know how easy/doable that is .. you would lose billions in the attempt.
BlackHorizon Caldari Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 08:47:00 - [15] Edited by: BlackHorizon on 17/07/2007 08:50:04 CCP please fix this. I don't care how, but it should NOT take two to five times longer to kill the modules than the actual starbase after the starbase has been destroyed. Alliances have begun to spam small modules.
pardux The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 09:11:00 - [16] indeed :\|
Thicky McThick	Posted - 2007.07.17 09:25:00 - [17] I agree about reducing the small guns hit points only if attacking ships have their hp reduced by 50% whilst engaging, you want structures more vulnerable, how do you feel about your ships?
Bluestealth Minmatar BlueLabs	Posted - 2007.07.17 09:36:00 - [18] Originally by: BlackHorizon Edited by: BlackHorizon on 17/07/2007 08:50:04 CCP please fix this. I don't care how, but it should NOT take two to five times longer to kill the modules than the actual starbase after the starbase has been destroyed. Alliances have begun to spam small modules. I am guessing to keep you from anchoring your own tower.... it that is their goal.... I believe that used to be classified as an exploit if done with Giant Secure Cans
Rafein	Posted - 2007.07.17 09:42:00 - [19] OMG, it's a use for Amarr ships. Now ammo!!! Yeah, hopefully gets fixed. Should jut go neutral, and become stealable, when the tower goes down.
Distrans The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 10:07:00 - [20] Originally by: Callistus Originally by: Market garden Get Dreads Would be nice if the guns didn't have such low sig radius. A Phoenix does the same damage to a pos gun in siege as it does out of siege. Target painting. Maybe the Minmatar Recon bonus is not that crappy after all.. áááááááááá
Callistus Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.07.17 11:40:00 - [21] Originally by: Tarminic Originally by: Dark Shikari Lower HP by 10 times, raise resistance to 99%... same amount of time to kill guns when the POS is online, but far less time when its offline. This could have the adverse effect of making POS guns too easily repaired mid-siege. Not at all. Guns are disabled when they hit structure, but to online them again they have to be at 50% shields (or something similar). With high hull resists no one bothers taking the guns further into structure while the tower is still up. In either case the time to repair the guns armor and shield, and re-online them, remains the same. -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 11:43:00 - [22] Originally by: Thicky McThick I agree about reducing the small guns hit points only if attacking ships have their hp reduced by 50% whilst engaging, you want structures more vulnerable, how do you feel about your ships? Hi Mr. Alt. Please recycle yourself. Thankyou. DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
max bygraves	Posted - 2007.07.17 11:56:00 - [23] I think its ok as it is mr R3 USE DREADS
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 12:44:00 - [24] Originally by: max bygraves USE DREADS WTS: Reading comprehension skill DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Deep Six Illuminati Inc. Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:15:00 - [25] The thing I love about eve-online forums, most of the people that respond telling you how to do things have never done it themselves so really have no clue what it takes to solve the issue in question. Here are a couple info-bits about POS warfare as it stands now. - It takes longer to kill the guns than the POS, especially if they are gun spammed which seems to be the tactic that most are using. Last POS we took out took about an 1.5 hrs to kill and 6+ hrs to kill the guns. This was even after many of us swapped out our BS's for smaller ships to get more DPS on the smaller guns. - Dreads and BS's hit about as hard as light missiles on a small gun due to sig radius - Target painters can not be activated on guns.. So in my opinion the OP is right and I am not sure how CCP hoped this would make POS warfare more fun, but it has taken a long boring task and made it an even longer boring task. Thanks,
max bygraves	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:16:00 - [26] Originally by: R3dSh1ft Originally by: max bygraves USE DREADS WTS: Reading comprehension skill There is no such skill mr r3.
Sith8 The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:34:00 - [27] Agreed... takes way too long to kill.
max bygraves	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:37:00 - [28] Originally by: Sith8 Agreed... takes way too long to kill. you would aggree with him though, your his m8.
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:39:00 - [29] Originally by: max bygraves Originally by: Sith8 Agreed... takes way too long to kill. you would aggree with him though, your his m8. max bygraves, Member of state war academy since 2007.04.18 No other histroy. At least, post with your main DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Draec Sjet Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 14:52:00 - [30] It's true, it took us all day to take out a Cyno Generator Array, a fleet of around 100 battleships most of whom had drones on it too, it was like shooting a medium POS. why does something that costs so little take so long to take out? yes, dreads would have taken them out quicker, but you don't field them unless you really have to and unless CCP wants to make warfare even more about Dreads then this should be addressed asap.
galadran Caldari Shadowed Souls	Posted - 2007.07.17 15:15:00 - [31] Just to clarify something. Guns have 90% structural resists. Is this while the tower is online or all the time? Its this intended or a bug?
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.07.17 15:25:00 - [32] Originally by: Draec Sjet Edited by: Draec Sjet on 17/07/2007 14:54:19 It's true, it took us all day to take out a Cyno Generator Array, a fleet of around 100 battleships most of whom had drones on it too, it was like shooting a medium POS. why does something that costs so little take so long to take out? yes, dreads would have taken them out quicker, but you don't field them unless you really have to and unless CCP wants to make warfare even more about Dreads then this should be addressed asap. What's more, the POS we attacked was blatantly using this to his advantage as he'd filled it with Small Artie Batteries, which took hours to take down, along with all the other POS modules. As you can't anchor a POS there until you've removed all of these, this is practically en exploit for it to take as long as possible to remove a POS. Actually, while I see the point of it taking too long, I disagree with automatically calling people using lots of small guns exploiting. Once the cynojammers come in, there is little reason to put large guns on a POS that has the cynojammer. It only faces an attack by BS and smaller ships, and therefore using 20-30 small and medium guns makes much more sense than only a few large guns. ------------------------------------------------ Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.
MKingery Minmatar Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 15:50:00 - [33] Originally by: galadran Just to clarify something. Guns have 90% structural resists. Is this while the tower is online or all the time? Its this intended or a bug? afaik they don't have resists, just crap-tons of hit points. and this is all the time. one of the proposed fixes is to drastically slash their over all hit points in favor of POS granted resists, that subsequently go to 0 as the tower dies. with out the ability to target paint them, un-anchor them, or destroy them in a timely manner, i can't help but think ccp again, decided something was a good idea before testing it in any sort of serious way. honestly, if a structure the size of a frigate needs MILLIONS of hit points in order to 'balance' something else i think this indicates a core problem that should be fixed. but this is ccp, so grab some neosporin and band-aids!
Tyrrax Thorrk Amarr Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.07.17 16:13:00 - [34] Serious balancing issue, needs to be sorted. PS; don't want to run deathstar on every moon ? Just put smalls up, as many small guns as possible, remove the fuel, moon out of commission -_- http://eve.klaki.net/
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.07.17 16:27:00 - [35] To me it would only make sense that after a POS is destroyed, anyone can unanchor and pick up surviving modules like small guns. It also solves the useless time-sink problem. ____ The Illusion of Freedom \| The Truth about Slavery
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.17 22:48:00 - [36] Bump for dev input DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
max bygraves	Posted - 2007.07.18 01:05:00 - [37] Originally by: R3dSh1ft Bump for dev input lol this is my main mr R3.
R3dSh1ft Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.07.18 10:14:00 - [38] Originally by: max bygraves Originally by: R3dSh1ft Bump for dev input lol this is my main mr R3. Then no offence, but you don't appear to have the necessary experience to have an opinion on this, with your 3 months in the state war academy - unless they have drastically improved the course material Just for clarification purposes, this has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with SIEGING THE POS. By this point, the control tower has been destroyed, THE DEFENSE HAS FAILED. Destroying the 'junk' left over at the POS is just a roadbump before putting up your own - in fact NOBODY can anchor a pos there (not even the defending party) until the currently anchored modules are destroyed or moved. I am trying to get a big timesink with no purpose removed, this does not alter the face of POS warfare other than to make it less tedius for BOTH parties. DKOD - an awesome synchronised killing machine
Hohne Antares Fleet Yards SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.18 12:24:00 - [39] As I understand it no one can unanchor them once the POS is destroyed. Which means there's 0 incentive to destroy them UNLESS you must put a POS there yourself. Eventually we're going to find alot of space crowded with disused guns. And as was pointed out, they make a far better timesink than the towers themselves... for less.... If the person who owns the tower can't even unanchor them, where's the incentive to destroy them, alot of time for no result?
Thicky McThick	Posted - 2007.07.18 18:27:00 - [40] Originally by: R3dSh1ft Originally by: Thicky McThick I agree about reducing the small guns hit points only if attacking ships have their hp reduced by 50% whilst engaging, you want structures more vulnerable, how do you feel about your ships? Hi Mr. Alt. Please recycle yourself. Thankyou. You could hear the rubbing of hands and the joy of the pos killers as they knew structures were going outside shields, Oh dear not as easy as you thought! Why should every pos owner have to put up with it being a sitting duck , and going pop in a few hours just for your fun. You want a pos down, then work for it.

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