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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2004.01.27 03:44:00 -
[31]
Honestly?
I dunno. I'm known to be fairly neutral in political standing. Guess I could always try to fly to Fountain and see who'd shoot me first 
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Blare
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Posted - 2004.01.27 06:03:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Blare on 27/01/2004 06:04:42
At this time, probably the first one who saw you, although FA was pretty good about the passes. 1M for a day isn't bad at all IMHO, as you'll make it back in about 30-45 minutes. And before the War for YZ started, you were decently safe from rats. (aside from occational spartan trouble.)
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Drutort
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Posted - 2004.01.27 06:26:00 -
[33]
 Quote:
"Right now it is a bit fuzzy but it is still quite clear in the differences between a pirate/alliance."
If you are a miner / producer based in empire space, there is absolutely no functional difference.
If you go into 0.0 alliance space, alliance players will kill you if they can.
If you go into 0.0 pirate controlled space, pirates will kill you if they can.
95% of the time, they (both) will pod you.
Their function from that perspective is the same - they are trying to stop you from going where you want / need to go. They will both take whatever loot they can from your wrecked ship. Which one is worse, the one that needs the loot they take or the one that doesn't?
Paint whatever colors on it you like, it's still the same thing happening with the same result. It's just the way the game is played.
ThatÆs because you disregard any authority a set of individuals try to enforce in a area, you believe that you can do whatever you wishà the funny thing is you cant if someone is controlling an area, if the city is run right you cant go doing whatever you like, if the area is off-limits to everyone and if the cops see you and had a sign up warning you that any people beyond this area will be shot or killed then, you would say they are no better then pirates or the criminals?
GET REAL
You just disregard whatever the individuals do or say, and then you complain that they end up doing the same thing to you which is killing? But was it the same? Yes the end result is the destruction of your ship, or clone, and IRL it would be the end of your life or badly injured etcà the point is regardless that the end resulted the same, it doesnÆt make the individuals the same.
support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo
my MoBlog |
drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2004.01.27 09:28:00 -
[34]
Quote:
I've highlighted the relevant info above. The thing that you missed was the alliances will _only_ kill you in 0.0 controlled space. Rats on the other hand will kill you anywhere, even 1.0 if they can get away with it.
Does that explain away why celestial apoc were camping gates in pf-346 and orvolle (0.4) last week? You say a pirate moves gates, but you moved through several regions, to camp some other alliances gates. Sitting 70km out from the station, in a 0.4.
I have no problem with it, per se, it's just that you say that doing such things is the work of the pirate, and yet you do it yourself. The only real difference is the target matter. Pirates just get more targets.
There really is not so much between you and I. Once you realise this, we can all coexist, like a big fightin' Brady Bunch.
btw, Inkz was bang on the money. That's the same reason I do it.
.
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Psy Corp
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Posted - 2004.01.27 09:38:00 -
[35]
remember its PA not NVA 
I Have The Power Of The Mighty Lo.0lipop..
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Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2004.01.27 11:39:00 -
[36]
There is no difference between pirates and alliances. Both take what they want by force and can only be deterred by force (or isk).
The only nuance that applies is that alliances stick to one place and pirates do not.
The one exception are the alliances with open space. They should be compared with empires, trying to police rather then claim space...
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2004.01.27 11:45:00 -
[37]
Quote:
"The thing that you missed was the alliances will _only_ kill you in 0.0 controlled space. Rats on the other hand will kill you anywhere, even 1.0 if they can get away with it."
Alliance pilots would just as soon claim 1.0 space if we could 
And we would just as soon kill eenmies in unclaimed 1.0 if we could get away with it...
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
darth solo
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Posted - 2004.01.27 12:25:00 -
[38]
Quote:
I like to kill stuff, label it what you like i don't really really care.
amen, i seem to have to justify it.
why oh why didnt i chose the rats path:(
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Ivana Killya
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Posted - 2004.01.27 17:16:00 -
[39]
theres still time darth 
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Skillz
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Posted - 2004.01.27 17:25:00 -
[40]
Quote:
ThatÆs because you disregard any authority a set of individuals try to enforce in a area, you believe that you can do whatever you wishà the funny thing is you cant if someone is controlling an area, if the city is run right you cant go doing whatever you like, if the area is off-limits to everyone and if the cops see you and had a sign up warning you that any people beyond this area will be shot or killed then, you would say they are no better then pirates or the criminals?
You are the criminal and we are the authorities.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Christopher Xen
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Posted - 2004.01.27 18:03:00 -
[41]
Quote:
I mean pirates just protect and defend gates while alliances do that to entire regions. So what is the difference? Should alliances now be looked down upon as pirates are? Seems to be a double standard to me.
No Differance in action, Just in justificational delusions.
They do it to "protect" territory by killing innocent people who dont know, and are jsut trying to explore. Sometimes they toll and when you get to much profit they usually kill you and steal the rare loot you got from NPC hunting, assuming you and your friends can pull it off. Or eventually demand a large percentage of what you mine.
"Pirates" are for more honest. Were gonna kill you unless your in our alliance or have a pre arranged nap. We dont hide behind falsely justified killings.
With alliances there is too much grey matter that usually ends up with the weaker side dead, and also you factor in political intrigue.
With the FE and "Pirates", Its all Black or white. your with us you live, not with us enjoy the clone jump or pod ride home, depending on how merciful we feel.
Once your in with pirates, usually you prosper far greater than anyother taxing alliance where the dominant corps are full of self interest and profiteering.
Nothing wrong with doing that, but pirates of the FE at least follow along the "code" which equally divides wealth to ALL corps Industrial and PVP, and in times of little to no need, the industrial corp's profit sky rockets.
Example: HUFF Tech. Huff was in most major alliances and got pretty much pushed around and kept down in low sec space. When Huff left stain and joined the FE they had few members, and less than adequate resources. But with hard work, dedicated members, excellent management, and the Empires freedoms, Huffs success and profits skyrocketed. And today enjoys many luxuries that the empire has to offer.
Alliances? well its hard to compete and mean anything when the lead corps have 150-200 members and give less than a crap about a 20 member corp. Alliances rarely take the interest in helping corps build up, and rarely support them militarily unless it involves fighting something or someone that threatens even the mightiest corp in said alliance.
but with an alliance, if your squeemish and like getting pushed around and dont want to get your hands dirty...its probably best for you.
In the FE...Well do what you want, go where you want, mine where and what you want, and heh, kill any outsider that dare stand in your way, we dont judge you. Every one in eve is arrogant and sinful, we just dont cloak ourselves behind charters rules and ethics, we were our colors out in the open and are proud of the empire and will fight to the bitter death to keep it alive.
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Crias Taylor
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Posted - 2004.01.27 19:12:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Crias Taylor on 27/01/2004 19:12:55
Quote:
I mean pirates just protect and defend gates while alliances do that to entire regions. So what is the difference? Should alliances now be looked down upon as pirates are? Seems to be a double standard to me.
I say no, they would still be shutting down their borders if there was no pirates to control resources.
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Maud Dib
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Posted - 2004.01.27 19:28:00 -
[43]
There is no good. There is no bad. There just is. We all use the best means we have to get whatever it is we want. Just assume everybody want to shoot you.
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Gyrn Fzirth
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Posted - 2004.01.27 22:07:00 -
[44]
Quote:
Quote:
I've highlighted the relevant info above. The thing that you missed was the alliances will _only_ kill you in 0.0 controlled space. Rats on the other hand will kill you anywhere, even 1.0 if they can get away with it.
Does that explain away why celestial apoc were camping gates in pf-346 and orvolle (0.4) last week? You say a pirate moves gates, but you moved through several regions, to camp some other alliances gates. Sitting 70km out from the station, in a 0.4.
I have no problem with it, per se, it's just that you say that doing such things is the work of the pirate, and yet you do it yourself. The only real difference is the target matter. Pirates just get more targets.
The difference we are hunting outlaws. Noobs and other non-rat corp members passed just fine through pf-346 etc. It's only the rats we're after. If you want a RL example of the justification of this, just watch law enforcement at work - they set up stings in areas the criminals think they are safe, they blockade (roadblocks, anyone?)they knock down doors of private residences, they sometimes shoot and sometimes kill in the course of attempting to bring the criminal elements to justice.
Quote:
There really is not so much between you and I. Once you realise this, we can all coexist, like a big fightin' Brady Bunch.
Heh. Nice thought, though untrue, Greg ;)
Quote:
btw, Inkz was bang on the money. That's the same reason I do it.
Fair enough
===============
Killboard: http://www.celeskills.com
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Lockheed
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Posted - 2004.01.27 22:49:00 -
[45]
Quote:
Quote:
I mean pirates just protect and defend gates while alliances do that to entire regions. So what is the difference? Should alliances now be looked down upon as pirates are? Seems to be a double standard to me.
simple answer-NO THERE IS NO DIFERENCE
longer answer- the only thing is that the pirates are honest about what they are doing while the alliances try to put everything in velvet.
They both extract a toll - pirates do it at the gate, alliances do it in the (clause) of mining permits.
Oh and u shouldnt listen to some of those peeps answering u here, because unlike most here iv been in an alliance and im a pirate now.
That means i can make a comparison, i dont GUESS like most of the peeps here.
Help keep carebear population under control!!!!POD U LATER
From a pirate trying to confuse people.
________________
On a pale horse. |
Lockheed
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Posted - 2004.01.27 22:55:00 -
[46]
Quote:
"The thing that you missed was the alliances will _only_ kill you in 0.0 controlled space. Rats on the other hand will kill you anywhere, even 1.0 if they can get away with it."
I really haven't had any problems from pirates in > 0.0 space. For the most part the only thing I see are frigate rats or newb rats.
And yes, there are a few systems that pirates have staked out as their own that are above 0.0 Aurohonen, Oroville, probably some others.
They are just run-of-the-mill your average low sec system. There's nothing I need there that I can't get somewhere else, probably cheaper.
Alliances, otoh, have all the valuable ores and stations located in 0.0 blocked off. You might be able to get to the ore from empire space with good planning and prep, but trying to use their stations would be suicide. They control the valuable ores and hence the economy. Hence, the real reason they are there.
-Sinikad
go sit in Fd-mlj tell me what warning you get. I think you get a warning... an alarm clock on your clone.
alliances have a proceedure for you to become part or pass through.
While the pirates are high 5ing each other via teamspeak on how fast they locked and killed a frigate.
If you cant see past those old dead amarian lidz, then dont bother speaking.
________________
On a pale horse. |
sutty
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Posted - 2004.01.28 00:27:00 -
[47]
See i belive the problem lies in the word pirate. That word is thrown around way to much in this game.
Player alliances are not pirates ( unless they consist of player pirates like FE )
Take FA for example, they kill people when they have been warned to leave there space. they dont just kill them because a.) they can and b.) for profit.
I think there is a few corps in the game that shouldn't carry the labble pirate but more savages look at m0o they attack alliances and other corps, they dont really gate camp much and there cant be much profit in fighting alliances compared to the losses.
I think the community has made the word pirate the term for "bad guy" which kinda is confusing
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Tenacha Khan
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Posted - 2004.01.28 00:59:00 -
[48]
Quote:
I think the community has made the word pirate the term for "bad guy" which kinda is confusing
Well when you actually look at it, thats what a pirate is, a unlawful captain. You can have the good pirates, kinda like the bad guys which you root for in the movies, then there is the evil pirates, who are like the serial killers who everyone hates......both are pirates
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Nimrodel
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Posted - 2004.01.28 02:25:00 -
[49]
I think there are two sides to this
There are Nice alliances Where they keep an area clean from Potential threats and where N00b pirates can pay an alliance and farm under that alliances protection...
But there are alliances that CLAIM regions and Shoot anyone found there .. THESE ARE WORSE PIRATES
There are also pirates who if you pay the bounty will let you pass / enter a region in saftey or they will ask for the classic 'your money or your life' These players / pirates have a much harder job than alliances(pirates) like NVA, as they must ask for isk while in combat.. Alliances just kill..
I Went to curse region once (lone BS) to find 2-3 alliances Asking me for silly amounts of isk.. then again with a friend 2x BS's .. No-one challanged us we crused thro.... attack the weak on there own
In terms of being attacked I have been shot more times by alliances than pirates who I occationaly hunt for fun
PvP is part of the game. People enjoy PvP, pirating is a good reason to PvP and stopping/hunting pirates is another.
If you dont enjoy PvP stay in empire space!
---------------------------------------------
Nimrodel
Dark Force User
Joint Espionage & Defence Industries
---------------------------------------------
Your Medium YF-12a Smartbomb hits Rusty Cloud, doing 0.0 damage. |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.01.28 02:32:00 -
[50]
OMG Nimrodel j00 state the obvious. It's called ranting... BANNZ0R
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Presidio
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Posted - 2004.01.28 03:25:00 -
[51]
It's really simple, if you want to go to an area infested with rats, you have no choice, you will be attacked.
To have access to a 0.0 alliance controlled space you do have a choice: you can join the alliance.
That's a real difference between pirates and player alliances.
-
"Passivity is fatal to us. Our goal is to make the enemy passive."
Mao Tse-tung
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.28 03:41:00 -
[52]
"It's really simple, if you want to go to an area infested with rats, you have no choice, you will be attacked.
To have access to a 0.0 alliance controlled space you do have a choice: you can join the alliance.
That's a real difference between pirates and player alliances."
... Of course, that's conveniently omitting the option to join the rats in first case, which makes that particular difference pretty much null and void. ;s
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Ranya
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Posted - 2004.01.28 05:45:00 -
[53]
Quote:
I mean pirates just protect and defend gates while alliances do that to entire regions. So what is the difference? Should alliances now be looked down upon as pirates are? Seems to be a double standard to me.
We are all bored of your trolling now.
Get yourself an intelligence implant. |
StoreSlem
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Posted - 2004.01.28 05:50:00 -
[54]
Quote:
Edited by: Vlad Impaler on 26/01/2004 22:53:09
Quote:
Is there a difference between Vlad Impaler and a troll?
So a debatable subject then becomes the troll of the hour? You must be one of those persons in an alliance.
EDIT: You ass
But you already are the troll of the week.
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PropanElgen
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Posted - 2004.01.28 06:06:00 -
[55]
Edited by: PropanElgen on 28/01/2004 07:51:13
Quote:
Quote:
So a debatable subject then becomes the troll of the hour? You must be one of those persons in an alliance.
EDIT: You ass
But you already are the troll of the week.
Hey StoreSlem, are you gonna fight today?
All the angels and the puny men of god looked away...
Frightened to death by the evil that was born on that day!
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2004.01.28 06:13:00 -
[56]
Seriously I guess:
The difference between pirate/alliance/mercenary/pirate hunter:
Justification
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Sinikad
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Posted - 2004.01.28 07:48:00 -
[57]
Quote:
Quote:
I really haven't had any problems from pirates in > 0.0 space. For the most part the only thing I see are frigate rats or newb rats.
go sit in Fd-mlj tell me what warning you get. I think you get a warning... an alarm clock on your clone.
alliances have a proceedure for you to become part or pass through.
While the pirates are high 5ing each other via teamspeak on how fast they locked and killed a frigate.
If you cant see past those old dead amarian lidz, then dont bother speaking.
FD-MLJ is pirate controlled, and is 0.0 I never said you could just wander through pirate space and not get killed. What is your point??
I'm certain that if i contacted some of the pirates in a known pirate system and prearranged a big isk transfer, they would be happy to let me pass.
That's exactly how most alliances work.
Again, what is the functional difference to me? They both work exactly the same from my point of view. I have never paid either group though, and don't intend to pay either. If you kill my ship, you get paid, otherwise you're SoL.
In point of fact, I've done literally dozens of runs through oroville, pf-346, and fd-mlj without getting shot at. I'd say 98% of the time I go through there nobody even locks me down. Even Merlin with his mighty drone fleet in pf-346 hasnt managed to lag me enough to get a lock.
I've got it bookmarked. Lots of crokite to be had in cloud region.
-Sinikad
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Covaenda
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Posted - 2004.01.28 09:03:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Covaenda on 28/01/2004 09:06:19
Its just me or do some people want to remove "evil" from the game?
Pirates are scums, they suppose to be bad to everyone and just think about themself. The stories about eve-u sometimes talk about people murdering, cheating, spying and so on but here it sound like that is noobish and need to be removed..
Large corps want to control waste areas of space and no doubt use any way to prevent others from using that area even if that ends up with killing them. There are no law outside empire space just the strongest survie.
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PAPA
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Posted - 2004.01.28 10:34:00 -
[59]
let get this straight the only POLICE in this game r concord all others r wannabees,
why shouldnt u be able 2 go anywhere and mine?
the chance of running in 2 pirates on the way or in 0.0 is maybe 3%
the chance of running in 2 an alliance on the way or in 0.0 is 100% so who is gonna kill you do you think
u can dress it up any way u want but thems the facts
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StoreSlem
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:38:00 -
[60]
Quote:
Edited by: PropanElgen on 28/01/2004 07:51:13
Quote:
Quote:
So a debatable subject then becomes the troll of the hour? You must be one of those persons in an alliance.
EDIT: You ass
But you already are the troll of the week.
Hey StoreSlem, are you gonna fight today?
yeah.
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