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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.29 18:51:00 -
[31]
"Oh and what price would you suggest? Maybe, [cough]-[cough], mineral value? Oh my that's already been done"
Up to you, really; try mineral value if that suits you, or try to charge more and see if the market can bear it. Supply and demand, right? (and supply is going seriously down from what i hear)
"Agent missions risk free?"
There's risk in sitting in station, asking for mission after mission and clicking 'decline' when you don't get courier mission for couple of jumps with tech.2 rewards, or a 'kill 20k rat' mission with similar bonus?
"This game is all about balancing risk/effort vs. reward."
Yes; i don't consider a reward of 1-2 mil in tech.2 parts for doing few jumps in frigate through empire space balanced. Do you?
(that's from personal experience btw, not a hearsay)
"That is of course not counting the introduction of level 4 agents.... we call them level 3 but some of the missions now require gangs of people to complete. Unless you were lucky enough to get a battleship or a pile of dough before CCP decided to change the rules."
Couple of battleship kill missions are hardly introduction of 'level 4' agents. And no, they don't require gangs of people to complete.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:12:00 -
[32]
I will agree that I felt mission rewards were a bit skewed. But after this 2nd adjustment I'm not sure if they decided this time to go as absolutley one direction as opposed to when Castor first came out.
As to cruising... well standing drops were supposed to cure that. Big to do about that pre-castor and post-castor. You know that expiring of a mission offer thing? Is that working out or will CCP be adjusting that as well.
 Quote:
Yes; i don't consider a reward of 1-2 mil in tech.2 parts for doing few jumps in frigate through empire space balanced. Do you?
The missions, and the rewards, have far too much randomness in it. Which is a good and bad thing.
The bad thing: That occaisionally the above example is true and can be touted as the fault of the sytem. Of course you fail to mention the crapola missions on the other, yet equal in number, end of the spectrum.
The good thing: It is a lottery. Sometimes you hit and sometimes you don't. You can train up negotiation skill to try to have some influence on it but hey... thems the breaks.
Or are you inclined to have the Tech II release system completely changed on you. And get told after the fact?
It is a lottery. There is some ******* out there who is doing zero r&d agent missions, trained a skill to level 1 and nothing more.
Gee effort/risk vs. reward doesn't get applied
then does it?
As to the BS kill missions. Yeah my anology was a little dramatic.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:23:00 -
[33]
"I will agree that I felt mission rewards were a bit skewed. But after this 2nd adjustment I'm not sure if they decided this time to go as absolutley one direction as opposed to when Castor first came out."
From the discussion in Missions section, it seems the decision to nerf rewards was based on shorter travel times in Castor... what they didn't account for though was, those shorter travel times were result of the jump-in bug.
So, i expect the rewards are going to get another rebalance in few days, hopefully 'tis time they hit the happy middle spot. ^^
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Bhal'rog
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:32:00 -
[34]
Quote:
Anyone who bought T2 components off the market, pls raise your hand. If not STFU. Whining carebears....jeez. How did u lose anything, u lost only potential earnings, your fault for sitting on the things.
Raises hand.
How could I lose? I bought them for less than mineral recycle value.
I still think I am going to make a profit though. I sincerely hope everyone was refining their stuff, just makes my inventory more valuable. I hope.
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DaLeila
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:38:00 -
[35]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
@Bal - yes, i sat on my stuff - waiting to finish refining efficiency 5...
and yes i bought tech2 tools from market for that reason...
and YES i¦m absolutely ****ed by the patch - taking my only chance to get some mega and zyd.... |
Mandara
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:38:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Mandara on 29/01/2004 19:39:20
raises hand
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.01.29 19:50:00 -
[37]
Quote:
So, i expect the rewards are going to get another rebalance in few days, hopefully 'tis time they hit the happy middle spot.
I guess there aren't too many woman working at CCP. Always takes men a couple of tries to hit that... right.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Quanova
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Posted - 2004.01.29 20:11:00 -
[38]
Well, I lost more than 80.000.000 isk worth of minerals due to that change. Needless to say how I feel about it. |
Serenity Justice
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Posted - 2004.01.29 21:10:00 -
[39]
I was making 100M a week doing lvl 3 Navy missions and never even touched the 1000's of t2 parts I have hoarded. I will simply wait until demand rises (it will in time) and get the same or better money from the parts. Either that, or if I'm lucky to get a BP I will be able to make units with T2 parts that now have lower cost and mark them up a bit more and still make my *lost* profit back.
Agent mission rewards were retardedly high (primarily lvl 3 combat corps) and needed to have the rare mins removed to allow the megacyte market and those who truely risk their necks (insurance costs etc) to make decent money mining the stuff. It was throwing off the balance of how the game was supposed to run. Who was going to mine under the threat of instadeath and haul the crap dozens of jumps for less profits? and if not for that use, how many more people would leave 0.0 and come back to Empire space again?
I "lost" at least 200M in mins from the T2 changes and I could care less, it had to be changed and letting everyone know beforehand and cash out would have greatly increased the problem of excess easy money and rare mins. This way it will stabilize quicker and less people get rich for little effort (it's like finding a bug and exploiting it, we all knew it was too good to be true......).
Only thing I would like is that now the T2 items are handed out less, they could up the isk rewards a touch more. I am getting about 50% or less per mission now. I know the amount of parts rewarded is based on the value in isk of the bonus but the frequency of T2 drops alone should reduce supply without having to nuke the payout entirely. |
Turin
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Posted - 2004.01.30 00:43:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Turin on 30/01/2004 00:48:14
There re two kinds of people I noticed in this thread.
The people who already refined all the stuff they had and are going
"HAHAHAHA, I knew this was coming and thought it was needed. Mega / Zyd is gonna go through the roof!!!!! Wanna buy some from me at a highly upmarked price? I have loads and loads of it"
The people who didnt have this stuff before hand, and are now stuck with tiny bank accounts.
The people who did the refines get a double whammy out of this. Not only do they now have tons and tons of mega / Zyd. They now have a very expensive market to sell it to as well.
So, the people who already took advantage of this and are filthy rich, dont care. And are happy cause they will remain filthy rich and able to bleed the poor.
Then the people like me who DIDNT take advantage of this, are stuck mining for the next for a couple weeks to make what you guys were making in a couple days. We of course want the change back the way it was so we can take advantage of un-intended game mechanics and get rich just like the rest of you.
Also, Id like to say, the missions isk reward reduction sucks a big fat one. I should certainly make more than 100k from 4 hours of work from a lvl 1 agent.
Personally, IF I had my way. All the money made from tech 2 refines would be DELETD. with no re-imbusement. And if you didnt have that much cash to pay back what you "made" then you should go into a negative balance. Untill you pay off the debt you owe. :) now THAT would be fair. :)
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Silverlancer
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Posted - 2004.01.30 01:26:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Silverlancer on 30/01/2004 01:27:43
Quote:
I think it's unfair from CCP side to steal from us via introduction of the patch. To be more specific:
as a reword from missions you could receive different Tech2 tools like R.A.M. You could use it, sell it or refine it. It was worth about 50k in minerals (including Megacyte and Zydarine) to refine one RAM. Now it is worth about 28k because you no longer get Mega or Zyd.
My friend had about 60 milion ISK in unrefined Tools. Now he has about 30 milion. Nobody told us that this will change - and it was our hard work and our rewards for often dull and repetitive missions.
I lost just few milions ISK.
If it is a bug - please correct it.
If it is a feature - please inform us about it BEFORE you introduce it - else it is like stealing. It's unfair.
Yes, CCP should tell you... but you should refine things as you get them, not wait... 
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Tirren
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Posted - 2004.01.30 06:04:00 -
[42]
Quote:
Quote:
It's not about moaning and whining, CCP had the full right to fix the value of T2 items, only they SHOULD have informed us about it.
Only problem with that is everyone and their grandmother would have refined all their T2 components prior to the patch.
I think we can safely say CCP didn't want the market influx of mega/ zyd from T2 component recycling, other wise they would have done exactly as you say  .
Seems to me CCP are trying to limit mega/ zyd availability to bring BS ownership back down to the levels they originally planned ...
But you forget about the people with the buy orders for large amounts of isk BASED off what the mineral recycle value is. They spent lots of money to either recyle or stock up. They should have had the opportunity to recycle for their current value and buy more post patch with that income. Andsaying they weren't meant for recycling is like saying .4 space wasn't meant for M0o camping.
"I can only take so much before I'll blow up my own ship. Hey isn't that what insurance is for?"
EVE Agent Info Guide v1.21 |
Qual
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Posted - 2004.01.30 06:38:00 -
[43]
*ChougHwhinersChougH*
Easy money get taken away fast in eve. You all know that. Patch was coming. You all knew that. I have no pitty what so ever for you.
You had every chance to refine the stuff. But in your quest for a higher profit, you forgot that high risk goes with that.
When has the last time been somone was kind enough to inform the stock traders in RL that: "Excuse me but you better seel those high risk stocks. Market is going to crash next week."
If you want to ensure you big profit, do it. Untill then its in the risk zone.
Simple.
Besides, with more Tech II bps coming and the components now beeing much more rare, I predict good times for the people that DID NOT recycle. But thats just a guess...
Head of Xanadu Elite Ships Department |
drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2004.01.30 07:47:00 -
[44]
Quote:
Quote:
So, i expect the rewards are going to get another rebalance in few days, hopefully 'tis time they hit the happy middle spot.
I guess there aren't too many woman working at CCP. Always takes men a couple of tries to hit that... right.
You've obviously never been with a Gallente...
.
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drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2004.01.30 08:03:00 -
[45]
Also, as I think I just wrote in one of the other threads about this topic...
I have thousands of units of techII stuff, almost every item, I think.
I didn't recycle them, I don't care. I believe their value will increase, since, in the last 40 (level 3) agent missions I've had, I've been offered none at all.
Also, yes, you could make a BS per week off agent missions. I did, twice, in the two weeks after castor. I made about 250M from rewards, bounties, and implant/skillbook sales. And since the patch, they are dropping even better implants, worth even more isk.
so people doing agent missions shouldn't really be complaining.
As for the people who bought large amounts of them purely for recycling, that's tough beans. Had you been buying them for making techII stuff with, and their value halved, I would have some sympathy. But I don't.
Also, telling everyone beforehand would be counter productive. They introduced these tools before the blueprints for a reason: People would complain when they got their techII BP that they couldn't source the tools, because everyone would rather recycle them.
Had they told everyone, 50% of the games stock of techII stuff would become armor on some empire-runners battleship.
I'd rather have several thousand techII bits than a pile of megacyte at this point in time.
It will be interesting to see how this whole thing plays out, price-wise.
.
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INkog
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Posted - 2004.01.30 09:29:00 -
[46]
Quote:
*ChougHwhinersChougH*
Easy money get taken away fast in eve. You all know that. Patch was coming. You all knew that. I have no pitty what so ever for you.
You had every chance to refine the stuff. But in your quest for a higher profit, you forgot that high risk goes with that.
When has the last time been somone was kind enough to inform the stock traders in RL that: "Excuse me but you better seel those high risk stocks. Market is going to crash next week."
If you want to ensure you big profit, do it. Untill then its in the risk zone.
Simple.
I was a little ticked about the changes, but you made a damn good point, and set me at ease.
Pretty much end of dissusion IMO.
-Inkog
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Talon SilverHawk
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Posted - 2004.01.30 11:45:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Talon SilverHawk on 30/01/2004 17:10:04
You forgot the third kind.
That are sittng on there stuff waiting for the market to change. As I read in another thread these goods are likely to rise beyond what the value was for refining making those that refined wish they hadn't.
And to be honest as the game has developed there have been loads of instances where changes in the game have made being in the right place at the right time and making the right decision important to making a killing. It will happen again and again, No use complaining or crowing.
Tal
What goes around comes around...
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Talon SilverHawk
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Posted - 2004.01.30 11:56:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Talon SilverHawk on 30/01/2004 14:14:30
Sorry double post.
What goes around comes around...
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Bhal'rog
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Posted - 2004.01.30 15:13:00 -
[49]
Quote:
You forgot the third kind.
Thast are sittng on there stuff waiting fr the market to change. As I read in onther thread these goods are likely to rise beyond what the value was for refining making those that refined wish they hadnt.
Agreed!!
Wish more people had refined, makes my inventory more valuable.
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