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Evelgrivion
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:34:00 -
[1]
The solution is simple. After you are suicided, pause. Analyze what you did wrong to get yourself into such a situation, suck it up, and take it all in stride. Piracy a vital force in the wheels of this game's economy; the destruction of multiple billions of ISK in assets stokes the fires of both miners and manufacturers as demand for new product is created.
Money has to be destroyed somewhere for it to be made elsewhere in the empire economy; sit back, relax, and take it all in stride. After all, it is an internet spaceship game and economic simulator. Where would the realism be without the hardship?
Summed up: Suicide Ganking is fine as it is. Stop whining on the forums with suggestions for so-called improvement that were undoubtedly conceived 30 seconds after you were shaken from your flawed thinking that anywhere in EVE was supposed to be safe. It's all been said, thought of, and discussed to death before.
This isn't the signature you're looking for.
Can you tell me where to find the one I am looking for? -Kaemonn |
Stitcher
Caldari
legion of qui
Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:39:00 -
[2]
/me cheers loudly, claps, and yells "here here!!"
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The game is not the problem.
The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
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Fswd
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:41:00 -
[3]
/signed * oo (= infinity)
---
Free exotic dancers for mods that mod my sig
*Snip* Please do not discuss moderation in your signature. -Yipsilanti ([email protected]) <-- freebie for you |
Ms Sepia
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:41:00 -
[4]
I guess thats why they call this General Discussion, lulz
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Voltas Stormtide
Pyrrhus Sicarii
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:42:00 -
[5]
So expoilts are fine by you eh? Hmm let me titan bowl your nearest POS. Let me exploit your escrow.
Is this the eve you want? No skilled, non-inovative losers making the most of a bad situation?
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Willow Whisp
Sadist Faction
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:43:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Voltas Stormtide
So expoilts are fine by you eh? Hmm let me titan bowl your nearest POS. Let me exploit your escrow.
Is this the eve you want? No skilled, non-inovative losers making the most of a bad situation?
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
Typed it slow for ya.
...
Sadist Faction is recruiting |
Nocturnal Avenger
The Ankou
The Reckoning.
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:48:00 -
[7]
But POS bowling is :D
Besides - the no skilled, non-inovative losers... Well - it is you that is being hurt right?
- Carebear Pirate - |
Evelgrivion
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:49:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Voltas Stormtide
So expoilts are fine by you eh? Hmm let me titan bowl your nearest POS. Let me exploit your escrow.
Is this the eve you want? No skilled, non-inovative losers making the most of a bad situation?
If the act of destroying someone's vessel under concord's nose is the no skilled, non-innovative act of losers, it boggles the mind to figure out where hauling your valuables in an unguarded, unarmed, and untanked hauler falls on the scales 
This isn't the signature you're looking for.
Can you tell me where to find the one I am looking for? -Kaemonn |
Voltas Stormtide
Pyrrhus Sicarii
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:54:00 -
[9]
Right. Seems one can't say a thing on this forum without people; a) making assumptions and b) insulting you based on faulty assumptions.
So let me make something clear.
I have never been suicide ganked, nor intend on being so. However, the nature of warping in an industrial, T2, or nay, means you are suseptible to suicidal people.
Now, my gripe is not with those who wish to kill people in high sec and pay the penance.
My problem is with those who make a new alt every time their sec status precludes them from entering high sec and that CCP, nor players, have a reliable way of detecting such action and enforcing a suitable punishment. The consequence of this realisiation was the creation of a parallel thread that suggested a credible alternative.
Now, if you wish to continue making gross oversimplifications, insult my intelligence or generally make an ass of yourself, please bear this information in mind.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:54:00 -
[10]
Suicide ganks leads to anger, anger leads to forum whining, forum whining leads to game changes. 
The dark side of the force is strong in here.
---
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
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Petrothian Tong
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.07.28 21:58:00 -
[11]
dont get me wrong.. sucide ganking is fine the way it is..you want someone dead, fine. get him. you lose your ship too.
but yeah, the whole "is the way thing is" leaves a lot of questions unanswered, and yeah will bring people to complain more.(when theres N+28 threads on the forum whining on both sides about it.. it is a problem.)
-to people who gank: be graceful about it. and dont blame the guy you just ganked. you pirated, end of story, blaming him is an invitation for a flamefest, and we all know how those end up, just ignore the whine when he complains about lost stuff, dont add fuel to the fire...
maybe point him to how to protect himself in the future to shut him up.
(in other words, after tossing the match...RUN!!!!)
-to people who carry valuable stuff: put 5 medium shield extenders on your iteron 5.... it would have 4k shield hp... it takes more than 1 crusier to take you down at that point in high sec.
and if its small volume: use a covet ops or any inconspicuous ships: IE: thorax with extenders and I-stab...
if its large volume, get a deep space transport if you can.
and NEVER haul afk, use warp to zero even in high sec if you think your cargo is worth ganking.
as for freighters, dont load over 300 mill of stuff in it. if its over 300 mill, is a very tempting target.
if you are transporting something like an carrier bpo. use a BS/Navy BS thats fully plated/hardened...
a navy mega can have more amount of shield and amour than a freighter (not hull though..) when fitted purely for defence. (aligns faster too.)
-----------
but yeah, instead of saying "is the way thing is" .. teach people how to protect themselves..
you will see a whole less of whining about ganking =P
-Siggi-
""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur |
Angus Wango
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:00:00 -
[12]
Suicide? Do you mean someone hits the self-destruct button, or what?
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Voltas Stormtide
Pyrrhus Sicarii
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:03:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Angus Wango
Suicide? Do you mean someone hits the self-destruct button, or what?
Concord will kill you if you attack an unflagged player in high-sec. You just hope you can kill them first and an accomplice can scoop their loot which will hopefully pay for your ship and more.
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Sgt Blade
Dark Entropy
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:09:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Voltas Stormtide
Right. Seems one can't say a thing on this forum without people; a) making assumptions and b) insulting you based on faulty assumptions.
So let me make something clear.
I have never been suicide ganked, nor intend on being so. However, the nature of warping in an industrial, T2, or nay, means you are suseptible to suicidal people.
Now, my gripe is not with those who wish to kill people in high sec and pay the penance.
My problem is with those who make a new alt every time their sec status precludes them from entering high sec and that CCP, nor players, have a reliable way of detecting such action and enforcing a suitable punishment. The consequence of this realisiation was the creation of a parallel thread that suggested a credible alternative.
Now, if you wish to continue making gross oversimplifications, insult my intelligence or generally make an ass of yourself, please bear this information in mind.
techinally these people who make a alt just to suicide gank woundlt have anything to shoot at if you had any form of defence or security in your cargo. easyest way to fix a problem is to prevent it. flying around in hundreds of millions of isk in your cargo in a t1 hauler will make these people think wow i can make easy money just by suiciding an alt.
instead if people just fly with secure containers, and to fly with a friend in a t2 hauler if you have LOTS to haul then these people will just simply not even attempt. and if they do they will surely die if you ahve the correct preperation.
before hauling anything in your haulers take a step back and think.... if you were to suicide on yourself how much are you prepared to lose to get whatever you have inside your hauler and take that as your most worse situation.
Hypnotic Pelvic Thrusting Level 5 |
Voltas Stormtide
Pyrrhus Sicarii
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:20:00 -
[15]
Quote:
if people just fly with secure containers
Secure containers just mean everything survives, or everthing blows up. Not really a solution.
Seriously, I do believe that anytime you are killed in eve that it is ALL your own fault. Every time I have lost a ship a I have learnt a lesson more valuable than the ship loss. Scouts, fleet support, ship-for-purpose; all tools that will save your life and loot. However, the point still remains, the current system is a little broken - and my sugestion (you cannot terminate a character with a negative sec rating) is a viable soultion.
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Asestorian
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:23:00 -
[16]
They can only make so many alts, and it is technically an exploit to "recycle" alts by deleting one just because it got to a negative security status.
Overall I don't think anything needs to change.
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Petrothian Tong
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:26:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Asestorian
They can only make so many alts, and it is technically an exploit to "recycle" alts by deleting one just because it got to a negative security status.
Overall I don't think anything needs to change.
yeah, this is a murky area... since... well, the gankers pick their targets carefully. and if they recycle one every month or so... is not noticable...
GM couldnt do anything about it, thats for sure. since is not frequent enough to warrant attention.
(yes, If you are reading this, I am watching you.. you know who you are...)
-Siggi-
""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur |
Webster Belken
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Posted - 2007.07.28 22:29:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Asestorian
They can only make so many alts, and it is technically an exploit to "recycle" alts by deleting one just because it got to a negative security status.
Overall I don't think anything needs to change.
Great, something is already in place. NOW ENFORCE IT.
Make it an automatic account review if someone tries to delete a char with negative standing - I don't think thats going on right now. I might be why we have all the threads dealing with this growing problem.
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Willow Whisp
Sadist Faction
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:08:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Webster Belken
It might be why we have all the threads dealing with this growing problem.
It's not really a growing problem, it's just the Forum "Whine of the Month" Never mind that CONCORD now jam drones, or that the mechanics of suiciding in highsec got harder because of that. The fact is, that people continue to fly millions of isk in paperthin ships, and get upset when someone pops them.
...
Sadist Faction is recruiting |
Cipher7
OldBastardsPub
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:10:00 -
[20]
Problem? What problem?
Highsec piracy is a valid profession.
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Elmicker
The Phoenix Rising
FreeFall Securities
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:14:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
However, being able to abuse the overgenerous insurance mechanics to suicide gank for what is essentially nothing, is very unbalanced.
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Lucifer Fellblade
Ore Mongers
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:21:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Elmicker
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
However, being able to abuse the overgenerous insurance mechanics to suicide gank for what is essentially nothing, is very unbalanced.
Or to rephrase,
THINKING IS AN EXPLOIT! YOUR NOT ALLOWED TO USE INTELLIGENCE IT'S UNFAIR!
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Stitcher
Caldari
legion of qui
Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:23:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Stitcher on 28/07/2007 23:24:08
EVE is not supposed to be nice.
EVE is supposed to be a game where you should be wary and paranoid from the moment you undock to the moment you scuttle back inside.
EVE is a gigantic free-for-all deathmatch, with individual players ganging together for mutual protection and to increase their killing power.
EVE is a universe where you survive on your wits and intelligence, not by relying on the world to be nice to you.
EVE is, in short, unfair.
Get used to it, eh?
-
The game is not the problem.
The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
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Cipher7
OldBastardsPub
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:36:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Elmicker
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
However, being able to abuse the overgenerous insurance mechanics to suicide gank for what is essentially nothing, is very unbalanced.
The risk in highsec piracy is not ships.
It is time vs return.
If you spend 3 hours at a gate and fail to find a worthwhile target, thats like mining omber for 3 hours and having it robbed.
Without insurance that raises the bar higher, waiting longer for a worthwhile target.
Highsec piracy is a valid profession, and it should be viable and fun just like every other profession is.
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Petrothian Tong
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:38:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Petrothian Tong on 28/07/2007 23:39:22
Well, to be fair..(ha..)
insurance pay outs from concord from suicide ganking are alittle ridiculous...conceptually.
and so is the risk vs reward bit..(HA!!!)
I mean, yeah, in my... friend's 4 incident of suicide ganks over 2 weekends.
he got around 1.7 bill of loot (the stuff that didnt blow up) and it only cost him 150 mill in insurance and fittings...
and his sec hit well, is back to positive in a week, =P
so yeah.. is TOO profitable for no risk... wheres the risk vs reward in this? hehehe.
and killrights are useless when only the indy pilot can fight ya... I mean, whats he gonna do? ram me with his 150 m/s industrial?
but then again, removing insurance from concord wouldnt really dent my friend's profit... since he just ganks whats profitable, not everybody.
so yeah, dunno what to say, other then theres not much risk for major profits when the "right" target comes along...
but how do you calculate risk that comes from other players anyways... it can go from harmless to extreme base on situation...
and the mark can be as stupid as someone who fits an iteron v with nothing but cargo expanders or a shuttle to someone who are in a Plated BS...
but yeah, it is alittle messed up thats for sure, let CCP figure that out.
(once again: hey, for the ppl who says it isnt fair, get used to it... use a different line... that line doesnt work, that only incite flaming and makes you look as cool as Charlie Brown.)
side note: is always entertaining to see a victim learn from his mistakes though...
is good for my deepspace transport sales =P
edit: Originally by: Cipher7
Originally by: Elmicker
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
However, being able to abuse the overgenerous insurance mechanics to suicide gank for what is essentially nothing, is very unbalanced.
The risk in highsec piracy is not ships.
It is time vs return.
If you spend 3 hours at a gate and fail to find a worthwhile target, thats like mining omber for 3 hours and having it robbed.
Without insurance that raises the bar higher, waiting longer for a worthwhile target.
Highsec piracy is a valid profession, and it should be viable and fun just like every other profession is.
yeah.... mining should be profitable and fun too... hehehe =P
-Siggi-
""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur |
Jiggs Casey
Minmatar
Asguard Security Service
Angels Of Discord
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:44:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Originally by: Voltas Stormtide
So expoilts are fine by you eh? Hmm let me titan bowl your nearest POS. Let me exploit your escrow.
Is this the eve you want? No skilled, non-inovative losers making the most of a bad situation?
Suicide. Ganking. Is. Not. An. Exploit.
Typed it slow for ya.
QFT
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Crazy Tasty
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:47:00 -
[27]
/signed!
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fire 59
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.07.28 23:53:00 -
[28]
Edited by: fire 59 on 28/07/2007 23:53:06
Originally by: Voltas Stormtide
So expoilts are fine by you eh? Hmm let me titan bowl your nearest POS. Let me exploit your escrow.
Is this the eve you want? No skilled, non-inovative losers making the most of a bad situation?
It's not an exploit in any way/ shape or form. If you get killed, learn from it and do your best to avoid it in future.
Don't fly fat and slow t1 haulers packed with billions in loot through gank zones and then cry coz you died. Use a scout, split up the loads, use t2 haulers or freighter with split loads etc.
Theres loads of ways to avoid death but some seem incapable of learning and deserve death ( Darwin? )
GOONIES = OMNIPOTENCE INCARNATE |
Tarkan Kador
Amarr
PanTarkan Kador Holdings
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Posted - 2007.07.29 00:22:00 -
[29]
It seems to me that the most simple and elegant solution is not to buy freighters and industrials, and do missions instead.
Hauling was a thankless and worthless job before the suicide ganking, never mind now.
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Hotice
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Posted - 2007.07.29 00:46:00 -
[30]
Simple solution is no insurrance payout for any ship killed by concord,Or Make using a cargo scanner an offensive action on none war target. High sec suicide ganking at it's current form is just silly. It is just too much reward for little risk. Insurrance payout means attacker lose much less than the victim. Risk vs. reward is borked.
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