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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Semkhet
Saudarkars
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:16:00 -
[1]
I've been playing since Jan. 2005, and due to an infinite sequence of nerfs, have ended flying all races, using all kinds of EW, cloacker and non-cloakers, tanking shield or armor, and using all weapon systems available. I've never blinked in front of changes and adapted, often using unusual setups.
But the proposed NOS nerf is the worst thing I ever saw in EVE. Why ? Because the benefits and drawbacks of NOS apply to every ship without exception. It's only the degree which varies according to your ship, setup , skills and tactical situation.
The bottom line is that NOS is overpowered WHEN you face it without using NOS yourself. If you really liked NOS then you went the Curse/Pilgrim/Bhaalgorn route. Nobody obliged you to do that, nobody prevented you to do that either. Other non-NOS specialized ships performed well also by making use of NOS.
So what are we balancing here ?
The mighty Curse for example ? A Curse cannot beat a player who knows how a Curse works and has its ship prepared to sustain such an encounter. But you don't want to base your ship & setup on a hypothetic precise risk ? It's your legitime choice, you could very well encounter a Huginn after all. The point is that life isn't fair, because there's nothing fair in the IQ we are born with (or lack thereof), or in the money we make (or not) during our life. Nothing is fair and our destiny is almost entirely dependent of the consequences of the choices we make.
But let's forget the details because all this goes way beyond that bunch of bits hidden behind the concept of NOS. I don't know about you, but I do cherish my time and money because both are limited. So I try to be coherent and attempt to make good use of those two finite assets.
And one of the fundamental principles of using my time and money in a pertinent spirit is not to have to start over and over and over again just because some individual I don't even know the name suddenly decided to disrespect the time and money I have invested in a legitime aspect of a commercial game.
You see, CCP is solely in this venue for business. You don't think that they are the Mother Theresa of the MMO's do you ? Since the skill system implemented is based on elapsed real time, and since this real time corresponds to monthly subscriptions, how much money does CCP makes by regularly voiding whole sections of game mechanics and obliging players to find new solutions which often require... additional training, hence time, hence money ?
Well, I'm done. I do plenty of business in RL myself and this has reached the point were I cannot continue to play this game without feeling like an idiot. If these NOS changes migrate from SiSi to TQ, I'll put my subscriptions on hold indefinitely until CCP stops to turn EVE into a spreadsheet for babies laid on a scifi background.
I prefer top follow my dogs philosophy:
If you can't eat it, if you cant s***w it, just p**s on it and go away 
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An Anarchyyt
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:21:00 -
[2]
Wait, what's a "strow"?
Is it like a crow?
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ChimeraRouge
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:21:00 -
[3]
adapt or die... you died.
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Gypsio III
Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:23:00 -
[4]
What an incredible whine.
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Arkios Odymei
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:26:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Semkhet
The bottom line is that NOS is overpowered WHEN you face it without using NOS yourself.
lol you even said it your self!
You gotta admit, wwhen you are forced to fit a certain module or die, it is a bit overpowered...
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Ihar Enda
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:26:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Ihar Enda on 01/08/2007 19:26:12
I tend to agree, the constant nerfing and changes in game mechanics is tiring to say the least, especially if a system being changed has been in place for months and months.
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Trojanman190
Caldari
Murder-Death-Kill
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:26:00 -
[7]
If something is broken you are supposed to fix it... not leave it broken because people are used to it. Nos was borked. I don't like the new changes myself but something needed to be done.
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Gentlewind
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:30:00 -
[8]
The thing is CCP want Eve to become 'mediocrity in space' there is no place for shining stars like the curse or vaga and there is certainly no place for the player who wants to play with a ship that requires 'flair'.
The people who will play no matter what ccp nerf are the compliant sheep who post stuff like 'adapt or die', they are happy in their boring little f1-f8 gangs/fleet.
There is one truely fun solo ship left but I'm not saying a word
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Matroshka
Crimson Squall
Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:30:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Semkhet
The bottom line is that NOS is overpowered WHEN you face it without using NOS yourself.
So whoever has the most nos wins basically. I believe that is one of the reasons why it needed to be nerfed.
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Asestorian
Minmatar
Domination.
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:31:00 -
[10]
You said it yourself, the only counter to NOS was another NOS. And what about ships that can't fit NOS? Why should I ever have to **** over the rest of my set-up to make sure I have at least one of the biggest NOS I can fit?
No. The point of this change is the same as when ECM was changed. At the moment everyone is using it because it's practically required. Now ECM only works properly on a ship designed to use it. This will be the case with NOS now as well.
The Curse and Pilgrim will continue to be perfectly good ships. It's the rest of the NOS-*****s that are going to have to adapt. They can still use NOS, but it isn't the all-powerful module it was before.
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Tarminic
Black Flame Industries
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:31:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Semkhet
The bottom line is that NOS is overpowered WHEN you face it without using NOS yourself.
And yet you use this as a basis for an argument as to why NOS isn't overpowered?
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ULTIMATE LAG SOLUTION | Forum Whiners - Unite! |
Ozzie Asrail
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:32:00 -
[12]
Stop chasing fotm setups then?
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Arkios Odymei
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:33:00 -
[13]
 Ha I beat you all with the quote
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Vitrael
Warriors of the Einherjar
Fimbulwinter
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:35:00 -
[14]
The time of the nos is over...
The time of the frig is upon us. 
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SexxxSlave
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:36:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Semkhet
stuff
Do me a favor, pass me your stuff please.
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Major Stallion
Knights of Chaos
Chaos Incarnate.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:39:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Semkhet
You see, CCP is solely in this venue for business.
errrr....when was the last time someone went into the MMO business for any other purpose? Get with it, adapt to the changes, seriously. NOS is no longer the end all be all of PVP. You now have to think about your setups. Grow up man.
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High Sec PvP |
Semkhet
Saudarkars
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:48:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Asestorian
You said it yourself, the only counter to NOS was another NOS. And what about ships that can't fit NOS? Why should I ever have to **** over the rest of my set-up to make sure I have at least one of the biggest NOS I can fit?
No. The point of this change is the same as when ECM was changed. At the moment everyone is using it because it's practically required. Now ECM only works properly on a ship designed to use it. This will be the case with NOS now as well.
The Curse and Pilgrim will continue to be perfectly good ships. It's the rest of the NOS-*****s that are going to have to adapt. They can still use NOS, but it isn't the all-powerful module it was before.
Utter crap. Is ECM effectivity inversely proportional to the weakness of the targeted ship's sensors ? I've spent enough time on SiSi with multiple accounts to know what I wanted to know. Flying solo, the Curse is manageable, the Pilgrim has become useless.
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Mallikan
Gallente
Subach-Tech
FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:51:00 -
[18]
Yet another unless thread...
(haha, if you don't get it, backtrack on some of the NOS whining posts)
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I Support The NOS Nerf! If anything just to make you mad.
Proud Member of FATAL Alliance
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Human Cattle
Amarr
Eve University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:51:00 -
[19]
I've not played this game for long but I believe the correct reply to this is,
Quote:
I'll put my subscriptions on hold indefinitely until CCP...
can I have your stuff?
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unhappy cogs :((( |
Dred'Pirate Jesus
Amarr
Ministry of War
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:52:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Semkhet
Flying solo, the Curse is manageable, the Pilgrim has become useless.
And here we have the crux of the problem.. Someone lost their solopwnmobile.. Remember kiddies that solopwnmobiles in eve are always eventually nerfed as they were never intended to be that way to begin with.. Enjoy them whilst they last and don't cry when they get taken away..
Originally by: David Hackworth
ò If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly.
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Angellyne
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:56:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Semkhet
Well, I'm done. I do plenty of business in RL myself and this has reached the point were I cannot continue to play this game without feeling like an idiot. If these NOS changes migrate from SiSi to TQ, I'll put my subscriptions on hold indefinitely until CCP stops to turn EVE into a spreadsheet for babies laid on a scifi background.
Whatever business you do in RL obviously doesn't involve spreadsheets or babies. They don't generally go together.
Maybe you're in the really bad metaphor business?
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Semkhet
Saudarkars
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Posted - 2007.08.01 19:59:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Major Stallion
Originally by: Semkhet
You see, CCP is solely in this venue for business.
errrr....when was the last time someone went into the MMO business for any other purpose? Get with it, adapt to the changes, seriously. NOS is no longer the end all be all of PVP. You now have to think about your setups. Grow up man.
You should grow up and get a brain to start with yourself. My favorite ship and setup does not use NOS, and the current change will make it even more uber since it's a pimped Crow.
The whole point is to change the mechanics of a module which had only 3 ships benefiting from specific bonuses. Now last time I checked, not every player and his mother were flying Pilgrims or Curses which on top of a decent recon lvl also require good drone, ew, speed, missiles, speed and shield or armor skills. I'm not even talking about Bhaalgorns which are one of the rarest battleships in game. So IMHO it's just crappola to make money on the player's back. If you fall for it good for you.
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Shadowsword
COLSUP
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:00:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Semkhet
I've been playing since Jan. 2005, and due to an infinite sequence of nerfs, have ended flying all races, using all kinds of EW, cloacker and non-cloakers, tanking shield or armor, and using all weapon systems available. I've never blinked in front of changes and adapted, often using unusual setups.
Translation: I use only FOTM and overpowerd ships/setups, until they get nerfed, then I move on the next one.
Originally by: Semkhet
But the proposed NOS nerf is the worst thing I ever saw in EVE. Why ? Because the benefits and drawbacks of NOS apply to every ship without exception. It's only the degree which varies according to your ship, setup , skills and tactical situation.
It's not overpowered if you use it, too? That's how you recognize for sure that something is way too powerfull...
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What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs. |
Asestorian
Minmatar
Domination.
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:06:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Semkhet
Utter crap. Is ECM effectivity inversely proportional to the weakness of the targeted ship's sensors ? I've spent enough time on SiSi with multiple accounts to know what I wanted to know. Flying solo, the Curse is manageable, the Pilgrim has become useless.
No, what I said has everything to do with this change. The mechanics aren't the same, no, but the situation is. ECM used to be so good that if you had a spare mid-slot there was no other module more valuable than a Multispec. If you had a ship with lots of med slots, then you'd fill as many of them as you could with ECM whilst still retaining all the other stuff a ship needs.
However, this screwed over ships that didn't have those spare med slots.
NOS right now is exactly the same. If people have a spare high slot, the first thing they try to put there is NOS. If they can get away with using all NOS in their high slots, then they will.
This screws over ships that can't do that.
So now NOS is going to be changed so you need to have a ship dedicated to using it (now alongside neutralisers) for it to work well.
To me that seems exactly like the ECM change. It also seems perfectly fair and good.
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tikinish
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:06:00 -
[25]
didnt even read the whine.
fact of the matter. nos was lamely and exstremely overpowered and it was misused for another porpose then it was made for,
now they have remade it so it does what it should.
if your whining about that your too freaking stupid...
i lost 3million sp with the torp nerf, but well i could have told myself TORPS ARE NOT MEAND TO HIT FRIGATES WITH HIGH DMG!
but i tryid to use the change and get something out of it before it was nerfed, but logically it WOULD get nerfed.
just smile and think, damn they found my whole.. but it is a good thing in the overall perspective
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Dapanman1
Amarr
Beets and Gravy Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:09:00 -
[26]
Can I have your stuff?
Beets, you're among friends. |
Malcanis
High4Life
Curse Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:12:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Vitrael
The time of the nos is over...
The time of the frig is upon us.
I feel pretty good about my decision to specialise in small ships ;o)
Of course, would have been better if I hadn't gone Caldari, but the good thing about the elite frigs as that it's only 9 days training to get all the range of another race
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Ki Tarra
Caldari
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:22:00 -
[28]
Originally by: An Anarchyyt
Wait, what's a "strow"?
Is it like a crow?
That and how many "strows" does it take to break a camels back?
Quote:
No misfortune is so bad that whining about it won't make it worse
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Pheonix Kanan
Caldari
Murder-Death-Kill
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:25:00 -
[29]
NOS was broken and needed changing. However, it was kinda late on the change after everyone trained to us it and EVERYONE had gotten used to it being in the game. Perhaps CCP should have spend up the process (I know you guys did your best). But it is a major game change and they are becoming quite common and tiresome (looking at cloak and local now). Maybe people should just play the game as they bought it rather than complaining until they get the game they want to play.
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Suicide ganks leads to anger, anger leads to forum whining, forum whining leads to game changes.
The dark side of the force is strong in here.
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Ryan Darkwolf
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2007.08.01 20:27:00 -
[30]
OMG nerf Blasters and missles...Nerf everything other than lasers because I don't use any of them.....
Semkhet is right...the NOS nerf is a bit too much. Had the change been percentage based, sig radius based, just anything other than the upcoming nerf (well people would still whine) but it would be better.
I'm tired though of posting on this so Imma stop right here.
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New account on EvE-Online...$19.95
100 Day GTC...$49.95
2 Month supply of German beer...$200.00
Having your computer die because of Hello Kitty online...Priceless |
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