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Give us a way to (slowly) change our base stats

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Terra Alnilam Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.04 12:35:00 - [31] Man oh man do I wish they would implement this. See, I am part of the few who happened to think that charisma was a useful attribute. As I cry myself to sleep over unecessarily long training times for the majority of my skill training programme, I constantly beat myself up over just how stupid it was to invest in so much charisma over the other attributes. Please, spare me the "charisma has its uses" dribble. Trading has limited uses. As does leadership. Even worse is the reduced training time you get with the minimal amount of agent-related skills. The majority of this game's skills features skills NOT enhanced by charisma. I rolled an altnerate toon SIMPLY because I was tired of having attributes that favored charisma over most of the other attributes. This alt, created three months after me, has surpassed my skillpoint total by over 1 million and that egde is rising ever so quickly. Both of them have similar skill sets, albeit in different aspects. For example, I have focused more points into gunnery whereas my sexier alt has focused more into missiles. The Learning are a nice way of sayinng "aw, it won't be so bad"... but a character/race/bloodline specific modification option would be nice, considering that players who made characters before RevI didn't easily and readily posses the information they are armed with now inside the character selection screen. Originally by: Gus Preston my boner just broke my zipper
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 12:36:00 - [32] Take the time to train a learning skill one step further if you really care. I have almost all my learnings at level 4, but because I had set my base perception so low, I took the time to train it to level 5. When I buy implants, I always buy a slightly higher perception implant than all the other implants. I do not regret any of these decisions. What I do regret is being an Achura Male. Gender reassignment surgery or Michael Jackson race changing please? --- Grismar.net
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2007.08.04 12:45:00 - [33] Originally by: Malcanis That hyperindustrial should have plenty of ISK; he can buy the combat toon if his choice... This is EVE its not called toon here go back to wow Caldari and proud
Teinyhr Minmatar United Systems Navy	Posted - 2007.08.04 12:53:00 - [34] Edited by: Teinyhr on 04/08/2007 12:53:51 Originally by: Onnawa Even the worst roll-up can be balanced with learning and implants. Sorry but I beg to differ. I can just and just get my willpower to 19 with FULL WP learning skills (yeah the advanced too) AND a +4 implant. So yeah it's quite a bummer since a lot of people seem to have their attribs well over 20 when they just learn the advanced skills. ------------------- Originally by: Smagd Besides, specialization is for insects.
Mooogie	Posted - 2007.08.04 12:55:00 - [35] Originally by: cal nereus What I do regret is being an Achura Male. Gender reassignment surgery or Michael Jackson race changing please? Hey, that's what you get for having what is possibly the best attribute-to-skill ration in the game. Achura males are downright goofy looking and easily likened to the word fugly, even with the 'shades, but achura females aren't that much better in the aesthitics department. I'll be honest. When I was considering an alt to take over my poorly created main, I was looking at an Achura Stargazer as my #1 pick. The fact that I could do something along the lines of 10/10/10/8/3 was so incredibly attractive. But I just... could... not... make... a ... face ... that... excuse me... Okay, I am back. Had to take a trip to the restroom due to flashbacks from that particular character creation episode. Anyway, I couldn't make a face that I could stomach. No matter how much I tried (I didn't bother with achura males... their faces are downright comical), I just couldn't deal with the fact that I'd be flying around with a charcter with a but-her-face... when all I'd see was that very same face. So I made a Sebiestor with similar stats as that of an Achura, but with slightly more balance. I do sometimes wonder just how much more advanced my paper-bag headed Achura would be efficient at skill training, but... the way I just could not change the fugliness factor of that face no matter what still gives me chills to this day.
Eternus8lux8lucis Minmatar FW Inc	Posted - 2007.08.04 13:53:00 - [36] IMO no dont change it. None of the ideas presented are good ones. Like real life yo have to skill into certain things and if mommy and daddy didnt give you the head start, or if you slacked in school well your stuck too in life. Works the same way here. Ive always rolled an even toon as best as I could. I learned and figured on a few things and not on others. Im happy with a very even toon. Gives good learning times no matter what CCP decides to toss out. So just say no to toon rerolling or changing. Sure itd be handy but then youd get someone simply making a 2 attribute heavy character, training EVERYTHING in those two up, and then swapping out the skill tree for the other two and having at it again. Thereby super speeding everything to the top of the skill trees. If anything CCP needs to create a third tier for learning skills or better implants, or even skill section specific implants. Like a gunnery training implant, missile training implant. Seed them rare or NPC sell them for an expensive isk sink. I think thatd be the only way is to do that. If your a new toon, under a year, you have nothign to complain about. Theres a TON of things you can do in Eve with that skill set. Find something you like and get to it, so it takes you longer. Think of those whove been playing with a botched roll for years and STILL have fun. Guess they must be superhuman, cuz they do it and you whine. NO REMORSE. NO REGRET, PLAY ON!! *********************************************** Where do we go from here? When theres no up and no down anymore...onward....ever onward into the vastnes of chaos till you find the light within.
Benco97 Gallente Nova Inc. Pride - Honor - Duty	Posted - 2007.08.04 14:21:00 - [37] Many years ago when the universe was young and the servers just opening their eyes for the first time to the cold harsh light of life I made this character. His stats are all over the place and pretty poor. I don't mind though... because all it affects is the speed at which things train and as I don't consider EVE to be a race against eachother then why the fudge should I care? You're all getting soft with your fancy "learning" skills and then the bloody Advanced learning skills and the implants and the boosters, have you seen how many SP people start with these days? it's insane. If things are going to be switched about then make it fair for everyone, I want someone to calculate how many extra SP i'd have if there were learning skills, implants and boosters right from the start and I want those extra SP added to my character in whatever skills I choose, thanks. "MY GOD KEEP THIS AWAY FROM BENCO97!!!!!" - Constantine Arcanum
Zhett Haukes Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.08.04 14:47:00 - [38] personally I would like this, even if it were a one-time per account change. When I was playing on the trial before I started this character some "genius" told me to max my intelligent, even if I wanted to be a combat character, as it would help me train my learning skills quicker. My base stats are now 13 int and 8 in everything else except charisma. I know that isn't that bad - but I would kill for a few extra points in Perception/Willpower. Implants help somewhat, but there is always that niggle in the back of your mind about the wasted oppurtunity. On the plus side, I do train support skills fast!
Broken Star Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.08.04 14:55:00 - [39] I don't know, not sure about changing base stats, however I was thinking about attribute modification tanks.... So you dock up, get out of your ship, de-pod and in a station, like ones that offer medi-bays you have a service that offers 'stat boosting' this service would cost a lot of money, not like as much as implants but still say 100k isk an hour, you confirm the amount of time you want in the tank, and accept. This gives you a learning bonus, like the learning skill but say x0.65 to all stats, stat tanks can only be used while the player is offline, and you could even have a skill for using them. Maybe they are only offered to people with good standings like jump clones, the idea is to decrease the amount of time it takes to complete a skill, once your learning skills are high and you have a good head of implants. I don't know just an idea. --- I'm an alt, I admit it.
DarkStar251	Posted - 2007.08.04 15:00:00 - [40] Meh... My main (this chr) was created on the 14th May 2003, about 8 days after retail release. I was in the beta, but despite downloading the 500mb client 5 or 6 times (and I was on dial up back then) it was corrupt evey time. Back then, there was nobody to give me advice, and the game manual was very vague. Looking at the stats I came to the decision that "Willpower" couldn't be much use commanding a spaceship, I couldn't see the enemy dropping dead just because I Really Really wanted them to. Hence, with maxxed learnings, and a +4 implant, I have 18 Willpower. On the otherhand, I figured Charisma would let me command fleets and let me buy things cheaply. Hence, with 5/4 learnings and a +4 implant, I have 25 Charisma, which is my highest stat. My chr is now 4 years old and has 50m SP, which is alot, but is rather low given my age. I'm too far in to contemplate starting over. You'd think then, that I would be one of the first to support this idea, as it would allow me to drop quite a number of Charisma points (Not only did I get points from my Ancestry, but I actually allocated 2 or 3 points from the 5 you get to distribute to charisma). However, I'm against this idea. New chrs should learn enough in their first couple of weeks to recreate their chrs if they gimp themselves too much. Old people like me don't really need a boost - our skillpoints do that for us. Of course, if EVE goes on for another 8 years, alot of people will have caught up with me on SP, then I will be sad :(
Xtreem Gallente Scientific Creative Underworld Mafia	Posted - 2007.08.04 15:01:00 - [41] well i based my stats on the original paper manual, that came in the box, so mine are screwed, but iv stuck with them :)
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 15:09:00 - [42] Originally by: Death Kill Originally by: Malcanis That hyperindustrial should have plenty of ISK; he can buy the combat toon if his choice... This is EVE its not called toon here go back to wow My word, you told me to go back to WoW. Oh, you must be so hard-core and L33t. I am such teh Nublar compared to you! You may have all my stuff. You can tell by the way I consistently argue for consensual only PvP Played WoW once, didn't like it. Bored to tears in fact. And hey, I don't really like 'toon' either, but since it's the de facto term used by the majority, I use it. Now that's out of the way, would you care to contribute to the discussion? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 15:10:00 - [43] Originally by: Terra Alnilam Man oh man do I wish they would implement this. See, I am part of the few who happened to think that charisma was a useful attribute. As I cry myself to sleep over unecessarily long training times for the majority of my skill training programme, I constantly beat myself up over just how stupid it was to invest in so much charisma over the other attributes. Please, spare me the "charisma has its uses" dribble. Trading has limited uses. As does leadership. Even worse is the reduced training time you get with the minimal amount of agent-related skills. The majority of this game's skills features skills NOT enhanced by charisma. I rolled an altnerate toon SIMPLY because I was tired of having attributes that favored charisma over most of the other attributes. This alt, created three months after me, has surpassed my skillpoint total by over 1 million and that egde is rising ever so quickly. Both of them have similar skill sets, albeit in different aspects. For example, I have focused more points into gunnery whereas my sexier alt has focused more into missiles. The Learning are a nice way of sayinng "aw, it won't be so bad"... but a character/race/bloodline specific modification option would be nice, considering that players who made characters before RevI didn't easily and readily posses the information they are armed with now inside the character selection screen. Choices -> consequences. Or do you let people go if they say they jumped in to the system by mistake...? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Hexman The Ankou The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.08.04 18:32:00 - [44] Nah But the game should give you a little more guidance when creating your character. I mean, all the role-playing type stuff sounds real nice, but new players don't have a way of how stats really affect their lifestyle. So when you're creating a character, things like "having this attribute really high will help you develop your character faster in x,y direction" or something like that.
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 18:41:00 - [45] There should be no consequences for our actions and choices. And everyone else should be responsible for protecting and shielding me. And I should be able to do whatever I want. I want candy. Let me do candy! --- Grismar.net
Anubis Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2007.08.04 18:45:00 - [46] Originally by: Onnawa Am I the only person here who's heard of Learning Skills and implants? Just a thought. Too be fair, 9 attribute points can make a world of difference if its not in the right place. My base attributes are 6/11/5/11/6, which is about as perfect as they get for a 100% combat char. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp Pride - Honor - Duty	Posted - 2007.08.04 19:38:00 - [47] If we can't have migration of attributes can we have some balance in their usage. For example a large set of combat skills, for example, crew. With charisma as primary. This might be a big kick in the nadgers to all the low charisma characters who "knew" not to bother wasting points on charisma but there are consequences to their choices, yes?
Montague Zooma Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 19:50:00 - [48] CCP's business plan counts on players quitting after 7 months, so by the time you realize you've really screwed yourself over, you're supposed to move on to another game anyway.
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.04 19:53:00 - [49] Actually, CCP did say they were planning on adding more stuff that attributes would effect, and theoretically that would mean balancing charisma so it becomes more important. I think. Don't quote me on that. --- Grismar.net
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp Pride - Honor - Duty	Posted - 2007.08.05 00:58:00 - [50] Originally by: cal nereus Actually, CCP did say they were planning on adding more stuff that attributes would effect, and theoretically that would mean balancing charisma so it becomes more important. I think. Don't quote me on that. That would be excellent... and apologies for quoting.
Tarron Sarek Gallente Endica Enterprises	Posted - 2007.08.05 01:15:00 - [51] Silly me, but these days I always expect to see either a.) an Achura char (powergamer) or b.) an Intaki (someone with an affectation for manga/anime, the obvious '****** look', who made a poor choice. Perhaps just lack of information..) opening a 'change attributes' thread. While I can muster a small bit of sympathy for the latter.. is there even a way to gimp an Achura? I mean, come on.. _________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well.. -
Laura Steel Minmatar Independent Interspace Industiers	Posted - 2007.08.05 01:28:00 - [52] From lowest to highest: per. will. char. int. mem. With perception starting at 4 (just wtf was I thinking?). Anyway I dont regret it, the speed at which I learn the learning skills helps balance it out(a bit). I also have no particular desire to rush into a capital ship(or a battleship for that matter). But I do plan to work on my Battlecruiser <3, Charisma helps a bunch with all the leadership skills I`m doing, and I find the Social skills nice too as I get income from missions. Would it break my heart if this was put into the game? Nope, but I dont plan on spending money or training time to do it, plus I wanna see what impacts they add for having certain attributes first ---- Darn exclamation mark! I have brown hair, green eyes and a nice tan :)
Daelin Blackleaf No Joy Corp Pride - Honor - Duty	Posted - 2007.08.05 12:55:00 - [53] You can get pretty much every int, cha, and mem, skill you will ever need in under a year. That is maxed shields, armor and capacitor skils, maxed social, enough in trade and industry to only be losing around 0.5% on each sale enough leadership for a carrier, etc. After that almost every skill you will train for the rest of your in-game life will have perception or willpower as primary and in most cases secondary as well (the two categories with other secondaries, drones and propulsion don't add up to even a 1/4 of the weaponry and spaceship command skills.) In fact if you set to it you can get trade and social maxed and leadership to the highest you will ever need it, unless running a corp, in a few months... never having to use the attribute again. I know, harsh world etc... but I've seen people quit after spending a full year in-game because they have trained up everything they need in charisma, mem, and int and now face training everything else with extremely low perception and willpower. Some people actually have more than 10 points in charisma... that now do nothing. And the first thing I see many people get new character to do when joining a corp is read off their stats. If they have anything over 8 for int, mem or cha they advise them to re-make their char before they invested too much in it. My base stats are all 8's and a 7. This issue is hardly ruining my game. But for a lot of people it is and it would make the rest of us much happier without negatively impacting anyone else.
cal nereus Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.05 13:34:00 - [54] Edited by: cal nereus on 05/08/2007 13:35:22 There's theoretically no limit to the perception-willpower skills you can train. Often if someone has nothing in particular they feel like training anymore, they just turn on some random perception-willpower skill that might help later. If they're of the PvPin ilk anyways. I think. I created an Achura character with high intelligence and high memory, but low willpower and the base 3 charisma. I was initially planning on being an industrialist with a penchant for PvP, but now my desire has switched, and I want to be a PvPer with a background in industry for support. Thus, I need perception-willpower more than ever. Ironically though, taking a look at the skills I'll be training over the course of the next year, most of them still require intelligence as primary. And willpower is only used in less than half, most of which it is only secondary. So, funnily enough, my industrial character is just fine for PvP training too. I have no regrets where attributes are concerned. My only regret is that I'm ugly. And even if I could stomach paying ten dollars to change my portrait, I'd still only be able to make my ugly character slightly less ugly. --- Grismar.net
Astro Teller Milf Riders	Posted - 2007.08.05 13:41:00 - [55] woot woot i have good stats you lose Astro Teller
Jack Icegaard The Omega Project	Posted - 2007.08.05 15:11:00 - [56] I don't like the idea. When i first came here i knew no one who played EvE. I used my seven days at free trial to ask questions in nub-corp to get an idea of how to create my character. Still i managed to screw up and ad to charisma, making it 7 and my perception at 6. The learning area that i got most SP in (spaceship command) is also the one that the least suits my attributes. So what? Training takes a little longer but it really is not the end of the world. I cant understand the sandboxkiddy-attitude that you should be able to rectify all your mistakes. One thing i like with this game is that bad choices leads to bad consequences. Cause the flip side is that is pays to plan careful and to be circumspect about what direction you choose to go. I never even considered to play Wow when they advertised that their idea for the game was that mishaps would not necessarily lead to any hampering consequences. "You die you simply go back to...blah blah" I do regret some of my attribute choices, yet, i don't want the opportunity to change it. I like the dark, harsh EvE world where pain is lurking around every corner. If EvE start to grow soft i will lose interest fast. "Oh, so you trained for mining but you rather want to be a ceptor pilot? Of course, no problemo. We are replacing your SP as we speak." I mean, that would be alright in a kids game but not in EvE. In my very humble opinion
Anubis Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2007.08.05 16:03:00 - [57] Khanid get the best PvPer stats. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2007.08.06 09:20:00 - [58] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Death Kill Originally by: Malcanis That hyperindustrial should have plenty of ISK; he can buy the combat toon if his choice... This is EVE its not called toon here go back to wow My word, you told me to go back to WoW. Oh, you must be so hard-core and L33t. I am such teh Nublar compared to you! You may have all my stuff. You can tell by the way I consistently argue for consensual only PvP Played WoW once, didn't like it. Bored to tears in fact. And hey, I don't really like 'toon' either, but since it's the de facto term used by the majority, I use it. Now that's out of the way, would you care to contribute to the discussion? You are correct, I am very l33t and you are teh n00b. Caldari and proud
Eternus8lux8lucis Minmatar FW Inc	Posted - 2007.08.06 11:07:00 - [59] Originally by: Tarron Sarek Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 05/08/2007 01:30:23 Silly me, but these days I always expect to see either a.) an Achura char (supposedly powergamer) or b.) an Intaki (someone with an affectation for manga/anime, the obvious 'skinny drug addict look' (think about Kurt Cobain), who made a poor choice. Or perhaps just lack of information..) opening a 'change attributes' thread. While I can muster a small bit of sympathy for the latter.. is there even a way to gimp an Achura? I mean, come on.. Oh and yes: Choices -> Consequences Otherwise stop all that 'EVE is a harsh place..' talk. @Mooogie: I totally agree. Achura (males) are so fugly, I could never create one without regretting it later. And the females.. well they kinda don't fit the Charisma value of 3, plus they look totally generic and like all the other faceless achura chars out there. Before anyone asks - yes I don't like the Achura bloodline. Because it's broken. It has nothing to do with the person behind the char. Ah well, apart from my lack of sympathy for people who value stats over looks, but meh.. Tbh other than some of the female faces all the faces have turned ugly to me and Id never create a female character seeing as Im a guy. Just think thats pretty lame. I dont create a character because they look good to me, I could care less about the looks of characters, or ships. What I do care about is stats and how they reflect my ability to play the game. So creating something that looks fugly but plays well is something Id do in a heartbeat. So Im completely on the other side of the fence. Besides with the generic amount of faces and the backgrounds in this game everyone looks like everyone else in the end, the only difference is your name really. So enjoy bringing your aesthetic viewpoints into an area so aesthetically narrow its laughable that you would bother looking at it that way. Nevermind the fact that its not "real" at the end of the day anyways. Hmmm...maybe I should post this with my achura alt so you have to stare at the fugly avatar a bit more. LMFAO *********************************************** Where do we go from here? When theres no up and no down anymore...onward....ever onward into the vastnes of chaos till you find the light within.
Geli Tetro Vanquish Inc	Posted - 2007.08.06 12:33:00 - [60] I would pay big to move 3 points from both memory and charisma to Perception and willpower.

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